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Why Brawl's Roster Sucks: An Ultimatum

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Thinkaman

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Super Smash Bros. Brawl is the ultimate result of the largest and most ambitious project ever in video game history, spanning several companies, dozens of game designers, and hundreds of artists ranging from animators to composers. The amount of content in Brawl eclipses that of any other game ever made, ever.

The original game had a roster of 8 starting characters, 12 total, and a virtual non-existent single player game. Melee had 26, 20 if clones are discounted; it also added a bare-bones adventure mode, simple though detailed trophy collection, and a handful of side events. Brawl has 41 playable characters. Brawl has a single player campaign that is larger than many entire games. Brawl has more side events, that can be played co-op, even online. The combat has been expanded in every dimension, from things as major as the revamped and vastly superior air dodge system and detailed final smashes to things as petty as multiple taunts. The entire multiplayer experience is online.

The notion that any fan of Super Smash Bros. could possibly be unhappy with this game is not ridiculous, it is completely absurd. It is fundamentally a logical impossibility.

Brawl's roster sucks because you think it sucks.

You have brought this upon yourself, with your irrational hype, deeply unrealistic expectations, and revolting sense of entitlement. Your total ignorance of the game design process is matched only by your absolute lack of respect for the people involved. The self-sacrifice of those individuals, in particular Masahiro Sarukai, continues to be completely ignored in favor of asinine "demands" for arbitrary characters to be put in the game. The self-imposed misery you wallow in is not ironic, but just: it is the immediate result of your hypocrisy.

Masahiro Sakurai is in contention for greatest game designer of all time, and the staff assisting him with this game is incredibly talented and dedicated. Their passion for this game will never be known or fully understood by you. As long as you continue to cling to the childish and egotistical illusion that you could somehow make a Super Smash Bros. game better than those who have defined--and then redefined--what that is to begin with, you will lack the respect that is required to appreciate the game.

Nothing I say will cause these bitter bystanders to change their flawed perspective. The purpose of this is to simple explain to them why they are unhappy, so that they may not be confused when their own anger and sadness contrasts with the emotions of those who are about to play this game for several upcoming years, thousands of hours each. I myself will play with unaltered bliss.

So may you all.
 

DMAJohnson

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Only one of the characters I waited for six years to play as are playable (Olimar), so of course I'm going to be disappointed, especially since this is looking very much like the last real Smash Bros game that they're going to do. No offense, but please don't tell me what I should and should not like. I don't like Brawl's roster and didn't particuarly care for Melee's, that's all there is to it. Yelling at me over won't change that fact.
 

BACH

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I was just skimming through the complete trash that people are saying about ROB. a New freaking character, added into the already brimming heap of awesome.

They are throwing an absolute fit. What if ROB is freaking awesome? They just...i can't even find the words...

I Agree that people are getting themselves worked up into a frenzy of hype and aren't meeting their own out of the park expectations.

I don't know about you - but they keep surpassing my own - and i like it that way. I'll be playing Brawl for just as long, or longer than i played Melee (and i'm still playing Melee)
 

Wight

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Super Smash Bros. Brawl is the ultimate result of the largest and most ambitious project ever in video game history, spanning several companies, dozens of game designers, and hundreds of artists ranging from animators to composers. The amount of content in Brawl eclipses that of any other game ever made, ever.

Brawl's roster sucks because you think it sucks.

You have brought this upon yourself, with your irrational hype, deeply unrealistic expectations, and revolting sense of entitlement. Your total ignorance of the game design process is matched only by your absolute lack of respect for the people involved. The self-sacrifice of those individuals, in particular Masahiro Sarukai, continues to be completely ignored in favor of asinine "demands" for arbitrary characters to be put in the game. The self-imposed misery you wallow in is not ironic, but just: it is the immediate result of your hypocrisy.
Contradiction!

The Brawl roster sucks because it has worthless characters like ROB who could've been replaced by someone better.

Our expectations you called irrational were rational on the basis of your first paragraph. They were realistic on the basis of your first paragraph.

The roster sucks because it contradicts with what Sakurai wanted. He wanted more villains and more female characters. We got 0 new female characters and 0 new villains (wolf doesnt count because he is more of an anti-hero)

The roster doesnt suck because we 'made' it suck. The roster sucks because of people like you.

:)
 

Kizzu-kun

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I just miss Roy, but I really liked the roster \o\
(oh man, wheres Sheeda? XD~)

Actually if the 35 roster is true; I'll be happy (okay, if theres more I'll be MORE happy too!), because this is a reason to keep playing Melee. XD~

Sorry my English
 

MookieRah

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Holy crap... it's BACH! Where have you been the past... say 2 years?
Were you one of the people that were saying Brawl's roster was already perfect because of Sonic?
LOL, I kinda still feel that way to be truly honest. I was hoping for some Megaman action too, but that is a minor thing cause the cast is already great.
 
D

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I'd like to take this moment to thank everyone who supported my Ralph, Sylux, Ephraim and Hector threads. (All five of you :p)

I've championed a bunch of bizarre characters, most of whom people had no freaking idea existed. They may not have been popular, but I hope they're at least remembered by some for their uniqueness and quirky nature.

Thanks from a very happy Metaknight/Marth user,

WindGuru

(At least Smash has fufilled my lifelong dream of a bazooka-using character!)
 

SinisterLizard

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Were you one of the people that were saying Brawl's roster was already perfect because of Sonic?
Uh...heck no. I hate Sonic. I especially hate the fact that we have crappy 3rd party characters in, but important Nintendo characters got the shaft.
 

MikeMan445

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Contradiction!

The Brawl roster sucks because it has worthless characters like ROB who could've been replaced by someone better.

Our expectations you called irrational were rational on the basis of your first paragraph. They were realistic on the basis of your first paragraph.

The roster sucks because it contradicts with what Sakurai wanted. He wanted more villains and more female characters. We got 0 new female characters and 0 new villains (wolf doesnt count because he is more of an anti-hero)
Is this a joke? Find me where he said that.

You're a spoiled little brat, you know that?
 

SinisterLizard

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P.S. - Several of Brawl's characters are confirmed to be clones or at least semi-clones. So...throw your optimistic spin on that...
 

El HP

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Lots of **** like snake, sonic, PT, R.O.B. and no Ridley, Black Shadow, Black Knight, Isaac or Felix, Dark Samus, Rick Wheeler, Advance Wars characters, Little Mac and many other deserving characters brawl's roster is a complete disappointment.
 

Barstool

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I think the "problem" with the roster is that most of the New Characters are there by default.
Now that people are focusing on the unlockables, they're mostly seeing old characters.
IF the 35 theory is correct, there are FOURTEEN new characters, of which only four are unlockable.
 

Hitzel

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P.S. - Several of Brawl's characters are confirmed to be clones or at least semi-clones. So...throw your optimistic spin on that...
We could just... ya know, not have those characters in the game to begin with. Is that what you want?

Or Sakurai could add new characters all day that very few people actually care about. So that leaves us with Brawl in 2K9 or an imbalanced game...

Brilliant minds in this thread, really..
 

~N9NE~

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Will we all buy it? Yes.

Will we all love it? Yes.

Could the roster have been improved upon? Vastly.

Despite this, Brawl is an incredible game even with the 35 roster.
 

Rakath

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See, here's the thing, every time Sakurai spoke, it was about how 'over the top' he was in some aspect of the game. And so long as this aspect did some help to the gameplay of the game, its fine.

But I, like many, would of traded half (some would trade all, but not I, I'd trad half) the collectable Trophies in Melee for the Six clones to be less clone like. Brawl has 30 games worth of music, I'd trade 10 games worth of music and Wolf for 5 more characters (and Ness/Falco/Ganon to not be clones).

Everywhere it was Sakurai spoke of how far he went, and what he added, and how much he added. It doesn't matter how much glamour and shine and sparkle you put on car. It won't drive if you don't have tires and an engine. The Game's engine is fine, but the cast being on the lower end of a large number. 4 more characters and 1 different character, all they needed: Krystal instead of Wolf or Falco, Micaiah, Ridley, Isaac, and Sukapon (or Takamaru, he fits there too). This means Metroid doesn't look shafted, we actually ADD FEMALE CAST, FE is no longer just swords, we add two new series reps and one of them is a bit silly.

That's it, 39 instead of 35 10 by 4 instead of 9 by 4. They have room on the select screen for it. At every point Sakurai speaks of how he designs a game like it would be the last of the series, giving his all, this all is lacking. And I'm allowed to think that while 30 games worth of music is nice, having 1 games worth of characters is way more important.
 

SinisterLizard

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You people are moronic. Yeah, Sakurai added character people felt good about...NOT! He added second rate characters and put no thought into who got in. Not only did he put in clones instead of original characters, he put in mediocre, unimportant characters over important ones. Crap...like someone else said a while back, make Ridley a Charizard clone of nothing else. It's clear he's already put in clones in in some form...may as well include other deserving characters. It's sill in question as to whether GANONDORF was de-cloned or not...
 

kin3tic-c4jun-3

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Some of these posts make me sick. Here's something people forget to consider:

SOME NINTENDO CHARACTERS ARE STUPID. SOME WON'T MAKE IT. GET OVER IT.

lol @ little kids.
 

flyinfilipino

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There's no right or wrong way to look at it. In the end, we got what we got, and we're going to love it anyway. Soon, all this disappointment and stuffs will just be old and forgotten.
 

kin3tic-c4jun-3

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How can people say that premium characters like SNake and Sonic have no place in the greatest fighter of all time? It just boggles my mind.

No, we're not getting some characters we were hoping for, but in the grand scheme, does it matter? Explain to me why a simple boss character like RIdley deserves placement OVER a character who's defined gaming and gamers alike such as Sonic. It's more than just you want, it's about who EVERYONE is going to want. Everyone knows Sonic. Few know Ridley. It's that simple.

Not to say I don't like Ridley, I love him, but I respect other character's inclusions.

And you know what? Shut up about clones. Clones are fine. Would you want an extra clone character, or no extra character? And here's anohter thing: the clones offered diversity. Ganon played FAR differently than C. Falcon.

Sometimes characters don't make it in. But look at what we have now. It's great, I could barely ask for more, personally.

There is nothing worse than listening to kids whine about how their favourite ******** character didn't get in, and then spew garbage like "Sonic or Snake" have no place.

3rd party inclusion represents a rethinking of the entire industry. Adding more and more of what we've already got is one-way thinking that gets us no where.
 

kin3tic-c4jun-3

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How can people say that premium characters like Snake and Sonic have no place in the greatest fighter of all time? It just boggles my mind.

No, we're not getting some characters we were hoping for, but in the grand scheme, does it matter? Explain to me why a simple boss character like Ridley deserves placement OVER a character who's defined gaming and gamers alike such as Sonic. It's more than just what you want, it's about who EVERYONE is going to want. Everyone knows Sonic. Few know Ridley. It's that simple.

Not to say I don't like Ridley, I love him, but I respect other character's inclusions.

And you know what? Shut up about clones. Clones are fine. Would you want an extra clone character, or no extra character? And here's anohter thing: the clones offered diversity. Ganon played FAR differently than C. Falcon.

Sometimes characters don't make it in. But look at what we have now. It's great, I could barely ask for more, personally.

There is nothing worse than listening to kids whine about how their favourite ******** character didn't get in, and then spew garbage like "Sonic or Snake" have no place.

3rd party inclusion represents a rethinking of the entire industry. Adding more and more of what we've already got is one-way thinking that gets us no where.
 

drengist

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I have to admit that if I could choose, I would buy the game with 45 characters but without SSE and stage builder than the game we have now. But maybe I'll have a change of heart in the future.
 

Pluvia's other account

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Sakurai could've impressed a lot of people.

Sadly, he made a half arsed job of it all. He could've just added 4 more Characters, just to please everyone.

But for some reason, he thought ROB was more worthy than other Characters..
 

Keitaro

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I'm pretty happy with the roster but I only know 35 as of now. Where did this guy get the number 41 from?
 

SweetSoulBrother

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I'm just happy to have a new game. We should all be happy to have gotten 14 brand new characters. Although we have 10 of them playable from the get go, we still got a ton of new characters to play. Granted I'm not exactly jumping out of my chair about ROB and Game & Watch returning, and I know that characters like Little Mac, Saki, Lyn and various other characters would of made better playable characters, I would have loved to play as Little Mac, but still. Be happy they even MADE BRAWL. We've got a lot in store for us come march and it's going to be a great game. we're all going to go buy it and play it forever. I just want to get my hands on it.
 

Octillus

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The only thing that I find that may of had us disappointed was how spoiled we were by the Dojo in terms of characters. Imagine if we were just now learning about Pokemon Trainer and Olimar, I'm pretty sure we'd be stoked!
 

Fawriel

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It sucks because it HAD such a great team and THEN failed to deliver after willfully getting our hopes up. Those hopes didn't come from nowhere! They told us it'd be awesome over and over again, and then they fail to live up to the expectations because they filled the game with FLUFF that NOBODY CARED FOR.

You tell me to stop insulting Sakurai, I tell you to stop treating him like a saint. The guy was doing his job. He got money for it. That's why people do their jobs, because they get money for it. We're the customers, we pay for the guy. He indirectly WORKS for us.
Note that I'm saying "us", not me.
Did you notice that like 2 people like this roster? Why SHOULD we be thankful if he fails to please even a SMALL majority of the fandom? Why?
This roster that we have now, you could make two or three tiny little alterations, you wouldn't even need to add any characters, and you'd have a bunch of happy people frolicking and dancing, but right after making it look like it's a fan's game, he turns around and makes the dumbest decisions possible.

All I wanted was a colorful roster. All I wanted was a roster with characters who have life and personality.
And then I get clones, even more clones and a **** robot toy.

It's good that you can manage to deal with this. But if those minimal expectations I had couldn't be met by a team with more than enough time and hands available, I have every god**** right to complain.


I'm sorry for my language. Please try to understand my position.
 

Tenkai

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Hey guys, stop complaining, you're acting like spoiled brats.

This roster is great.

It could have been better yes, but just think a second, Ridley was too big, everyone said it, and he is indeed really big in the SSE.

It's not easy to find another reps for Metroid.
The Metroid's concept is to play alone in a big planetscale labyrinth! The only way to add a reps was Armorless Samus. And they did.
The rest of emblematic character are too big: Kraid, Ridley, Mother Brain...

Same thing for Geno. He is great in Mario RPG, but he is not enough used in other games! He only has a little cameo in Mario&Luigi Superstar, not enough to gain a spot in a Smash roster.

Well, the only understandable flaw in this roster is no Mewtwo.
Otherwise, it's great:
Pit, Sonic, Snake, Dedede, Metaknight, Cell shaded Link, hey guys! They are great characters too, and we have them! Don't ask too much 'cause when you complain like that, after all the work made by Sakurai and his crew, it's really disgusting and disrespectful.

Oh by the way, you're complainin', but you do not have played the game yet.
I'm pretty sure that ROB will be a badass character ;)

Hey guys cheers ups! The game is almost here!
 
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