Why are people being taught to love socialism and communism?

Scoutmain06

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#1
With the rise of communist socialist extremists like bernie sanders and alexandria cortrez, why are people being told that socialism is a good thing. Have these people ever seen venezuala or cuba? Nothing can be free, or else it will be another one of those. So lets take all of these new communists brainwashed by the people mentioned above to those countries and see how much they enjoy socialism.
 
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#2
Socialism and communism naturally arise wherever success is vilified, envy is normalized, and property is misunderstood. They are especially common in societies that make heavy use of democracy, because they allow politicians to buy votes with other people's money. This is made all the worse when the government controls the schools, because the government can and will teach young people to love whatever gives the government more power.
 

Scoutmain06

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#3
Socialism and communism naturally arise wherever success is vilified, envy is normalized, and property is misunderstood. They are especially common in societies that make heavy use of democracy, because they allow politicians to buy votes with other people's money. This is made all the worse when the government controls the schools, because the government can and will teach young people to love whatever gives the government more power.
Thanks for agreeing with me and not brainwashed like all these liberals who want to make everything free
 
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#4
So uh, how is implementing some socialist policies make them them communists? I mean, there's already so many socialist policies that you should obviously be aware of. Public schools, public roads, libraries, police, firefighters etc. Neither of the politicians you've mentioned advocate for overthrowing capitalism, but rather implement more socialist policies in our already mixed market economy. Some policies that other first world countries already have.
 

Scoutmain06

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#6
So uh, how is implementing some socialist policies make them them communists? I mean, there's already so many socialist policies that you should obviously be aware of. Public schools, public roads, libraries, police, firefighters etc. Neither of the politicians you've mentioned advocate for overthrowing capitalism, but rather implement more socialist policies in our already mixed market economy. Some policies that other first world countries already have.
Implementing socialist policies makes you a socialist. Sanders and O-communist cortez have even themselves called themselves radical socialists. And yeah other countries have enacted those policies. You wanna know which ones? Venezuala and Cuba
 
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#7
Implementing socialist policies makes you a socialist. Sanders and O-communist cortez have even themselves called themselves radical socialists. And yeah other countries have enacted those policies. You wanna know which ones? Venezuala and Cuba
No they haven't called themselves radical socialists. Their policies fit within capitalism. You don't think public libraries and unions are socialist extremes do you?
 

Nixon Corral

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#8
Implementing socialist policies makes you a socialist. Sanders and O-communist cortez have even themselves called themselves radical socialists. And yeah other countries have enacted those policies. You wanna know which ones? Venezuala and Cuba
Ocasio-Cortez is proposing a 70% top marginal tax rate. That is absolutely wildly socialist! No country has ever successfully done something so insanely leftist!

Except, y'know, the United States of America under Eisenhower (when it was, in fact, 91%).
 
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InfiniteRE

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#9
People need to realize the difference between socialism and democratic socialism. Democratic socialists, unlike regular socialists, also believe in democracy and democratic principles. They are by no means proponents of authoritarian government systems many of people associate socialism with. Its a system that increases the power of working people and lowers the power of corporations. Anti-capitalism would be a more politically correct term, using the soviet union or Venezuela is a horrible example.
 
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Mic_128

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#10
Implementing socialist policies makes you a socialist. Sanders and O-communist cortez have even themselves called themselves radical socialists. And yeah other countries have enacted those policies. You wanna know which ones? Venezuala and Cuba
Also Canada, England, Australia, Italy, Germany, Japan and many others.

Also, you really hurt your argument using childish insults like "O-communist cortez" Just say their name like a normal person.
 

Scoutmain06

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#11
Alright then. Enjoy your bernie sanders pie in the sky world where everything is free and there's no need for jobs since everything's free. Oh wait, then how will things be made? You're setting yourselves up for disaster
 
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#13
Alright then. Enjoy your bernie sanders pie in the sky world where everything is free and there's no need for jobs since everything's free. Oh wait, then how will things be made? You're setting yourselves up for disaster
You know that Bernie Sanders is in favor of creating jobs, right? Particularly American jobs. Labor jobs such as a long shoreman(my Dad's job) benefit from strong unions. Socialist like Bernie Sanders are in favor of giving more power to workers. Not to just give out random free stuff. That's the whole point of going to university, to get an education and then a job. Otherwise there's no point in going to school. That's why Bernie advocates to make public colleges free in the same way public grade school is free.
 
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Buddhahobo

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#14
Mostly from people who, as per typical, like pretending eastern Europe doesn't exist and as such feel perfectly comfortable whitewashing or outright ignoring the atrocities of the Soviet Union and Maoist China.

Or, as already shown by a previous poster:

I gotta really love this thread's lack of self-awareness
View attachment 189641
Calling the kettle black much, don't you think?

You know that Bernie Sanders is in favor of creating jobs, right?
Sanders has spent his entire career getting elected on socialist buzzwords to sneer down at the politicians actually accomplishing something.

I mean, we've already got complete lack of self-awareness of every failed communist state (which is, you know, every communist state to have been attempted), might as well add Sanders supporters who never bothered to look at his voting record to the list.

So uh, how is implementing some socialist policies make them them communists? I mean, there's already so many socialist policies that you should obviously be aware of. Public schools, public roads, libraries, police, firefighters etc. Neither of the politicians you've mentioned advocate for overthrowing capitalism, but rather implement more socialist policies in our already mixed market economy. Some policies that other first world countries already have.
Attempting to differentiate socialism and communism is already halfway to debating in bad faith.
Attempting to redefine socialism to mean "governments exist and utilize taxation for public works" is just being actively dishonest.
 
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#15
Mostly from people who, as per typical, like pretending eastern Europe doesn't exist and as such feel perfectly comfortable whitewashing or outright ignoring the atrocities of the Soviet Union and Maoist China.
Because we’re not talking the same level of socialism. Again, most countries on the planet are mixed market economies. It’s not a matter of emulating those failed countries, it’s a matter of fixing issues found in the United States.

Calling the kettle black much, don't you think?
Kind of the point of his post as you guys keep resorting to false equivalences.

I mean, we've already got complete lack of self-awareness of every failed communist state (which is, you know, every communist state to have been attempted), might as well add Sanders supporters who never bothered to look at his voting record to the list.
I’m aware of the failures of communism. But that has nothing to do with some social policies in a capatilist system.

Attempting to differentiate socialism and communism is already halfway to debating in bad faith.
Attempting to redefine socialism to mean "governments exist and utilize taxation for public works" is just being actively dishonest.
Because there’s different levels of socialism? Yet alone getting to the point of communism. In Sanders case it’s about empowering the lower class and weakening the upper class, which is indeed apart of socialism. As are public services that you pay through via taxes. Again, most countries on the planet including the United States already do these things to some extent.

You seem to be thinking in absolutes.
 

remilia

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#16
With the rise of communist socialist extremists like bernie sanders and alexandria cortrez, why are people being told that socialism is a good thing. Have these people ever seen venezuala or cuba? Nothing can be free, or else it will be another one of those. So lets take all of these new communists brainwashed by the people mentioned above to those countries and see how much they enjoy socialism.
I see the claim of people "being taught" to love socialism and communism a lot. Can you clarify where and how people are being "taught" to love these ideologies on a wide scale?

I have been through the American school system. 1 elementary school, 1 middle school, 2 high schools, community college, and university. Not once have I ever been taught anything remotely similar to "socialism and communism are good." After schooling, I also went on to work as a teacher in two separate schools and as a private tutor. Again, when reviewing history material for students in several different schools I didn't see one instance of "socialism and communism are good." In fact, I never even saw an instance of socialism and communism even being explained correctly, which is probably why the general public seems to be foggy on what these ideologies actually are.

Now, what I stated above is of course from my personal experience and in speaking with others who have been through the school system in some way. It's definitely not all-inclusive. If you could provide some examples of people actually being taught that socialism and communism are good, I'd love to see them. Otherwise, from what you posted it seems like your question is more along the lines of "Why are left leaning political figures rising in prominence and why is general sentiment favoring communism/socialism on the rise?"

And well, you'd be correct in observing that general sentiment toward socialism is in fact on the rise. Without much digging I found a gallup poll that shows that younger Americans especially are viewing socialism more favorably and capitalism less favorably than they did 9 years ago. This is most likely a factor in why figures like Ocasio-Cortez and Sanders have good support.

So to go back to "why is sentiment favoring socialism/communism on the rise?" Well, I believe this could be indicative of a problem in the current state of things here in the US. Here are just a few examples:

- Privatization and rising costs of universities has resulted in a 1.56 TRILLION total of student loan debt in the US (as of September 2018), a rise of over 400 billion in just 5 years!
- Federal minimum wage is 7.25$. Yet, the cost of living is rising at a faster pace than minimum wage can keep up. I will cite an example for Miami (8.46$ minimum wage) because that is where I've lived most of my life. The average cost for a cheap studio apartment is about 1,125 a month. With a full time job at minimum wage, a worker in Miami will receive 1,353 a month. This is not including taxes. With that compensation, there is simply not enough money to spend on food, utilities, transportation, and other expenses after rent.
- Healthcare costs are causing families to live without healthcare because they simply cannot afford it.

A shift from a capitalist model to a socialist model or communist model, in its simplest form, involves changing private ownerships to public/collective ownerships. I believe more people are starting to favor this because privately owned institutions are often charging more than what people can afford. This is especially true for institutions such as healthcare, which is believed by many people and several organizations (WHO, UN, etc) to be a natural human right.

Now, to address where you say "have these people ever seen Venezuela or Cuba?"
I would like to ask... Have YOU ever seen Venezuela or Cuba? These countries do not simply exist to be pointed at and branded as verifiable proof that communism and socialism are unsuccessful by people who haven't experienced or studied them extensively. There are MANY factors that go into the problems that these countries have faced. I am speaking as a Cuban-American with a family who has lived through the Castro regime and as someone with a knowledge of Cuba and US relations and history. At the end of the day, systems will always sound one way on paper but differ in practice. The execution of these systems will always be subject to different variables.

Regardless, I think it is good to ask the question "why?" to the rise of socialist and communist sentiment gaining traction in the US. If we could analyze what is causing people frustration with the current system, we could work towards a solution, regardless of what political ideology that solution fits under. You don't have to be a communist to want to make healthcare more accessible to people, for example.
 
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