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Why are people against giving the death penalty to aggressive panhandlers?

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Crazy Hand 2001

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I’m not a fan of this route and really don’t want to go down this path but most panhandlers who get hit with fines refuse or are unable to pay them so they get sent to jail, get out of jail then panhandle aggressively again. Most would want mental help and support if you offered it to them so this topic isn’t about them, but others like this guy want to make a living off this and refuse every kind of support they are offered. They seem like a huge threat to everyone’s safety and I see murdering them as the only way to protect everyone else from them.

You could say “don’t give money in the first place” but some people still do so anyways either because they want to, or they are scared/uncomfortable and give away money to make the panhandler shut up and I know this from experience. You could say those people should call the cops, but most do not contact the police afterwards or the cops can’t really do much.
 

Sucumbio

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The death penalty is the most severe punishment a court of law can hand down. Unless a homeless panhandler went on a killing spree in a state where the death penalty is legal there'd be no justification for it. The man in the article you linked would get charged with assault maybe attempted murder both of which come with fines and jail time. There's no way he could receive a death sentence and no one would suggest changing our laws to make that possible.
 

Crazy Hand 2001

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maybe attempted murder both of which come with fines and jail time
in which the person probably can’t pay the fine, and either doesn’t want help and wants to continue being aggressive or no matter how much you help him, he wiill demand for more

the article said he had already been arrested multiple times. Maybe he is on an addiction and is getting/got help but it seems to me like they offered help and he refused or he is taking advantage of everyone’s generosity
 
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Sucumbio

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in which the person probably can’t pay the fine, and either doesn’t want help and wants to continue being aggressive or no matter how much you help him, he wiill demand for more

the article said he had already been arrested multiple times. Maybe he is on an addiction and is getting/got help but it seems to me like they offered help and he refused or he is taking advantage of everyone’s generosity
Well yeah I mean eventually when you keep breaking the law you end up in jail for a long time. I wouldn't be surprised if this guy gets 25 to life in a mental hospital or regular prison if this happens again. I worked in the convenience store business for almost a decade and one thjng was always certain... Homeless people and panhandlers. The cops tend to just drive them to the edge of town and shoe them off into the next jurisdiction but ultimately should their behavior persist they will end up in jail and for progressively longer amounts of time. It's not a great system but it is too extreme to suggest the death penalty lol. They're not serial killers or child rapists.
 

Sucumbio

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Wouldn’t it cost money to keep people in jail? which is why I’m not the biggest fan of that either
Yes, it does cost the taxpayer a LOT to incarcerate people. For any reason, mind you. Another thing is to consider how other countries deal with the same crime:


CrimeSwitzerlandGermanyFranceSpainItalyRussiaChina
Premeditated murder10 years to lifelife sentencelife sentence15 to 25 years or life sentenceMinimum 21 years20 years, life in prison or death penaltyMinimum 10 years, life in prison or death penalty
Manslaughter*Minimum 5 yearsMinimum 5 years30 years10 to 15 yearsMinimum 21 years6-15 yearsMinimum 10 years, life in prison or death penalty.
Totschlag (homicide) **1 to 10 years1 to 10 years------------3-10 years
Serious physical injurySix months to 10 yearsSix months to 10 years10 years and €150,000 fine6 to 12 years3 to 7 years9 months to 4 years3-10 years; minimum 10 years, life in prison or death penalty for serious cases.
****1 to 10 years1 to 5 years15 years6 to 12 years5-10 years; 6-12 years for serious cases3-6 years3-10 years; minimum 10 years, life in prison or death penalty for serious cases

Look at China!

But then we must also remember that the Death Penalty -at least in the US- is not "cheap" or even "cheaper" by comparison to lengthy prison terms as evidenced here:

The death penalty is far more expensive than a system utilizing life-without-parole sentences as an alternative punishment.

Basically, I get the ... need for society to deal with homeless populations and panhandlers. And I will agree some of these people can be violent. But killing them, either through vigilantism or by state sanction, is not going to work. The best alternative I can think of is some sort of generalized housing option that includes social programs for job finding, drug rehabilitation, mental and physical health programs, etc. Especially considering a large portion of homeless are children, teens and young adults, veterans, elderly, etc.
 

Momotsuki

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A great start would be, y'know, not leaving people in such a situation where aggressive begging is necessary. Getting them off of the streets, and all.
The "Housing First" approach has been demonstrably effective in dramatically reducing homelessness, almost eradicating it in countries like Finland. There's no bogus meritocracy, just getting you off the streets and into housing.

The example you provided was in the United States - where it's much harder to simply stop being homeless or - since I'm not sure if this person was indeed homeless - otherwise in need. People don't resort to things like this as a plan A.
Now granted, the person you mentioned was indeed violent. Such crimes should indeed be evaluated and responded to, albeit separately from the "crime" of being poor.

But... the fact that you see the death penalty of all things as an appropriate solution is frankly disturbing.
 
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Crazy Hand 2001

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The best alternative I can think of is some sort of generalized housing option that includes social programs for job finding, drug rehabilitation, mental and physical health programs, etc.
I'm all for that but I thought there are malicious people would not be interested, they just want to be aggressive panhandlers for a living.

I don't think the death penalty is cheap, but it's at least a one time payment.

The example you provided was in the United States - where it's much harder to simply stop being homeless or otherwise in need.
That you see the death penalty of all things as an appropriate solution is frankly disturbing.
I don't see the death penalty for aggressive panhandling as appropriate whatsoever, but I thought some people exist to be malicious enough that jailing them isn't accomplishing anything and these people like doing that for a living so they refuse to stop or get help. I'd rather not go down this path but it seems like it's the only way to get rid of the aggressiveness
 
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Sucumbio

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I don't think the death penalty is cheap, but it's at least a one time payment.
Well... No. The only difference between regular incarcerated inmates and death row inmates is that one gets to leave eventually unless they're in for life without parole! They both require the same 3 meals a day, security detail, medical costs etc. And on top of that death row inmates are always trying to get off death row which costs a lot for lawyers etc. It's definitely not a once n done scenario. The only way that would be true is if the arresting officer just went ahead and shot them dead lol. Which forgoes actual justice in the name of vigilantism which isn't doable.
 

Crazy Hand 2001

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They both require the same 3 meals a day,
i thought that you could leave them in jail until they starve to death as a non-violent form of a death penalty, but if I had to issue someone the death penalty I’d rather violently kill them than watch them starve.
 

Dannish

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If one is sentenced to death the correct way would be to carry out the execution swiftly.
 

Strong Badam

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I think this thread has run its course, which is impressive because it's only been a few hours. You know it's time to close a thread when folks start considering whether immediate murder or forcing someone to starve to death is the preferred course of action.
 
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