WA Power Rankings: August 2014 Update

[Ebay]

In preparation for the new PR update I've compiled the information from the past 3 months for everyone to view in this google doc, I'm pretty sure I noted the most notable results (usually the results for the lower ranked players since the top 6 have been pretty concrete lately) but of course I may have missed something important so please let me know if I did.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...RKRWlKcU5TX1BMQ3hmV1p5MWc&usp=drive_web#gid=0

Also I think we're going to disregard all the results from the SSGs down in Tacoma, if we do then don't mind the ones I've noted in the spreadsheet

If you scroll to the bottom you'll see that I listed some of the players results with out of state players


Sources:

Dair to be Great (8/9/14)

http://challonge.com/dairtobegreatmelee

(August GC)

http://battlefy.com/gameclucks/supe...71a8ea/stage/53dd5fa88ed188dc0971a8e9/bracket


(July GC)

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByIybAVkraS-UWZleElUNWJOaWM/edit


Another Castle

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByIybAVkraS-Ukw5WFlROVE4Y2s/edit


(June GC)

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByIybAVkraS-YWt3NTN5MDJKLV81Q3J6T3JXbEZ5NXM5U01z/edit


I know both June and July GC brackets were cutoff because I had to leave early, again if there was anything important I missed let me know!

 

[nDie]

Thanks for compiling all this.
But yeah I wouldn't count SSG, or any brackets we don't put money on, they are just for fun.

 

[Purpletuce]

Who is Dimeq?

 

[nDie]

Neil D, he beat him so hard he stole his identity (They (Neil) ****ed up the bracket).

 

[Watofu]

Yeah that bracket software seemed to mess up the results a lot... I hope we don't use it in the future. Could make it a pain to look at past results.

Also SSG should definitely not be counted.

 

[Ebay]

Alright i cleared out all ssg results from the spreadsheet.

 

[Krynxe]

I'll try to show up to gameclucks more often then to see where I stand, since I only normally go to SSG. I'm just usually met with the unfortunate fate of being sent to losers first or second round by otto, it's happened to me at least half the times I went to gameclucks lol

I usually go about even with trenton's falco, though he does beat me more often than not. I'd definitely like to get some PR sets sometime soon against the people contending for that 10th spot - I don't think I'm PR yet, but I've definitely improved quite a bit since the last time most of you have seen me

 

[OutTheCuts]

Even though the PR won't be updated until next week's Dair to be Great, here's what I have so far. The changes to last period's PR below the 6th slot are pretty significant.

1) SilentWolf
2) Bladewise
3) Vish
4) Iceman
5) The Prime
6) Oreo

Nothing new in the top 6 other than Chip not being on there. He wasn't able to make it to GC this period and said he didn't care about the PR so I left him out. If we ignore that, he would certainly deserve a spot somewhere in there, but I have no idea where since there isn't much information to work with.

(7/8) Neil D. / Alien
(9/10) DJ Combo/Ebay

It may seem a bit ridiculous for me to cut 2 people from the current list and put myself at 7/8 but here's the information I'm working with. I went through the brackets that Ebay provided and recorded any significant wins/losses for everyone I thought had a good case at being on the PR. I included wins and losses against Oregon players since they were at most of these tournaments and omitted losses from anyone in the top 6 to make things easier to read. It's hard for me to go through all of those brackets accurately, and some of the brackets are incomplete, so please tell me if any of this information is incorrect and I'll update it and possibly even change my list.

Alien (Attendance 2)
Wins: DJ Combo, Big Pookie
Losses: Ebay, Space, Chip

Neil D. (Attendance 4)
Wins: Oreo, DJ Combo, Fat Goku, Space, Ratking
Ties: nDie (1 tournament win, 1 PR set loss), WATofu (1 and 1 in tournament)
Losses: Vincessently, Wasabi, Kaostar

DJ Combo (Attendance 2)
Wins: Hyphen (x2), Ebay, Kaostar
Losses: Neil D, Alien

Ebay (Attendance 3)
Wins: Hyphen, Alien
Losses: DJ Combo, Bird, Epidemique

Hyphen (Attendance 3)
Wins:
Ties:
Losses: Shiny, Vincessently, Ebay, DJ Combo (x2)

nDie (Attendance 2)
Wins: Wasabi (1 and 1 in tournament, 1 PR set win)
Ties: Neil D (1 PR set win, 1 tournament loss)
Losses: Ratking, Jizzard

Wasabi (Attendance 4)
Wins: Neil D, Vincessently (x3)
Losses: Jizzard, nDie (1-1 in tournament sets, 1 PR set loss)

Vincessently (Attendance 4)
Wins: Neil D, Hyphen, Epidemique
Ties: Epidemique (1 and 1 in tournament)
Losses: Wasabi (x3), Ratking, Mike Lau, Space

I took Hyphen and nDie off because they had very few wins against people in contention for the PR or against players from other regions of similar skill level (at least in the brackets above and PR sets I know about). They also had notable losses against PR contenders. It's worth mentioning that both Hyphen and nDie didn't have high attendance this period, but I don't think that being on the last PR with low attendance should guarantee their spots over people with notable wins. Wasabi and Vincessently are strong contenders and have beaten me in tournament, but I think Ebay's wins over Hyphen and Alien are stronger than beating me and Hyphen. DJ Combo's wins over Hyphen, Ebay, and Kaostar are also more notable.

I should also mention that a large majority of my wins happened at this last GC, and I think consistency should be taken into account in making a ranking list. Unfortunately I couldn't really find a good way to value consistency given the results from this last ranking period. Let me know if there's anything I missed and I'll edit the information above.

 

[Silent Wolf]

My top 8:

1) SilentWolf
2) Bladewise
3) Vish
4) Iceman
5) The Prime
6) Oreo
7) Neil Out Da Cutz
8) Alien

9/10 are a toss up between Ebay, Wasabi, Vincent and DJ Combo, but I agree with what Neil said in that Ebay and DJ Combo stand out a bit more. We don't rank fresh, but nDie barely made it on last time, so there isn't really a significant carry-over from last period to assist him imo.

So after canceling out like victories over Hyphen we have:

Ebay (Attendance 3)
Wins: Alien
Losses: DJ Combo, Bird, Epidemique

DJ Combo (Attendance 2)
Wins: Ebay, Kaostar
Losses: Neil D, Alien

Losing to Bird should not count against Ebay very much at all, as he beat Allen and Iceman last week in Oregon and has been doing great lately in general (he even beat Toph at NWM VI). I would say a win vs Alien is more impressive than a win against Kaostar (even tho Kline beat Neil in July), but DJ Combo did beat Ebay in the head-to-head. Also, at this point I believe Ebay's loss vs Epidemique is less respectable than the other losses from each player. So overall I think I'm gonna give 9 to DJ Combo and 10 to Ebay. Thoughts?

 

[Ebay]

Going off of Neil's post my list would probably be

1) SilentWolf
2) Bladewise
3) Vish
4) Iceman
5) The Prime
6) Oreo
7) Neil
8) Alien
9) Ebay
10) DJ Combo

Unfortunately with the absence of chip weird things are bound to happen, I think Neil deserves the spot over Alien this period due to his run yesterday (beating space who beat alien this period helps), although in the spirit of remaining more gradual and consistent I can see them switching.

As for me, I believe I deserve the 9 spot this period. In the past 4 months I've beaten the bottom 3 on our PR (I beat Ndie right before the last update at NWM, I think that sets up a decent foundation), while at the same time avenging past losses against both hyphen and alien.

My two losses other than Teddyx2 were Epidemique in June and Bird in July. Since losing to Seb I've improved my peach matchup strongly and I think it showed at GC. My set with Bird was a big heartbreaker (last game last stock high percent) and it could have easily gone the other way.

DJ Combo did beat me the other day (last game last stock), however I have the solid win against Alien who solidly beat DJ the other month.

I think my main point is that we have seen a lot more of my personal improvement and progression, whereas DJ just came back 2 months ago and we don't have too much data from him to go off.

 

[nDie]

I took Hyphen and nDie off because they had very few wins against people in contention for the PR or against players from other regions of similar skill level (at least in the brackets above and PR sets I know about). They also had notable losses against PR contenders.

I have the same number of "notable" wins as eBay and Alien (Neil/Wasabi vs Alien/Hyphen vs DJ Combo/BigPookie)
My notable losses were again Neil and Wasabi (A step up from Epidemique and Space imo). I Agree Neil and DJ should be put on the list but, really what did Alien do to move up and ebay do to knock me off that I didnt do? 7th at this GC and not even considered for PR, you guys hurt my feelings.

 

[OutTheCuts]

I definitely did consider you. Here's what the comparison looks like when I split the ties up, I also removed chip from Alien's list because he probably counts at top 6. I do agree that moving Alien up is a little weird. Wins over Blake and DJ combo probably shouldn't move him up, and he did lose to Ebay and Space. I don't think it's fair to count Space as a notable loss and not mention you losing to Ratking though, both of them are Oregon PR contenders that have done significant things here, Ratking went on a tear this GC and Space beat The Prime in June. Overall that makes me give the edge to Allen with a notable win/loss ratio of 2:2 compared to 2:3. After that I put him over Ebay and DJ because there's an inconvenient triangle (Alien>DJ Combo>Ebay>Alien), so Alien gets the edge as he was previously ranked. I'm honestly not a fan Alien's record moving him up, but I don't see a good alternative.

Ebay (Attendance 3)
Wins: Hyphen, Alien
Losses: DJ Combo, Bird, Epidemique

nDie (Attendance 2)
Wins: Wasabi (1 PR set win, 1 Tournament), Neil D (PR set)
Losses: Neil D, Wasabi, Ratking, ****ard

Alien (Attendance 2)
Wins: DJ Combo, Big Pookie
Losses: Ebay, Space

Then it comes down to you vs Ebay. I gave him the edge because he beat 2 people on the current PR, while your wins were against 2 PR contenders. Additionally your wins were offset by losses to the same people and we're supposed to value PR sets lower than we value tournament sets. If you cancel out your loss to Jizzard, I think you also have to cancel out Ebay's loss to Bird. That leaves us with notable win/loss ratios of 2:3 and 2:2 for you and Ebay respectively with your 2 wins coming from PR sets. I understand if you disagree with what I ended up with, but please don't think I didn't consider you very seriously for this list, I spent some real time thinking about it.

 

[nDie]

I don't think using win loss ratios is viable when you are skewing the stats taking the top 6 out of the equation (Especially since I wouldn't put trent that much above the rest of the lower PR, and ebay did lose to him as well). Doing that makes peoples look better for no reason(2:2 vs 2:4)
PR sets being valued lower is fine, I did not know that however. But my wins not being worth as much because you are a PR "Contender" still doesn't make sense to me because you are probably going to be 7th, and Hyphen is going to be off the list, so that would still be 1PR guy and one contender. Also I beat Jumpfreak who is super rusty but beat epidemique 2-0 and used to be hella good, so I don't know if he counts.
Just feels like nobody in 8-10 has done enough just justify all the changes, but alien gets moved up, and I get shafted. I'd prefer 1 more GC to get some more numbers before an update, but I know you guys want to do it now so whatever.

 

[Silent Wolf]

For the record, it's a bit misleading to say that Allen is "moving up." He's not individually going above anyone else below the top 6 due to wins, it's just that Chip is no longer on so everyone were arguing about "moved up."

I also don't believe it skews the stats to remove the top 6 from the equation when discussing the fate of those below on the next tier down. Losses against the top 6 are 'to be expected' and wins would surely be mentioned.

 

[nDie]

It skews numbers only when you are using w/l ratios, which isn't a great measurement anyway because not all wins and loses are equal and some just don't count. I dunno, the system doesn't make sense to me. I'd go with Otto list then.

 

[Silent Wolf]

The last few spots are pretty loose, If I were you guys, I would try to make it out to the Redmond tournament this Saturday and get some extra points. If not, then it's just another 3 months before we update again anyways.

EDIT: Also, it's cool to see more people caring enough about PR to generate a serious discussion, good stuff guys.

 

[Little Nemo]

If you include the top 6 I think Alien's position only looks better. Correct me if I'm wrong, but Alien seems to always have very close sets that could really go either way when he fights most of the top 6. I seem to remember June GC he had a very close match with Vish.

 

[Hawt Salsa]

EDITED LIST
If DJ Combo is coming back to melee, I'd definitely put him on the list.

I'm an observant player, and I tend to look at a lot of matches going down. Along with recent results, I'll put this as my PR. I'll answer any questions you have on it, just don't doubt me because of my skill.

1. the quietest of wolves
2. the wisests of blades
3. the vishest of vishes
4. the coldest of men
5. the primest of prime
6. the sweetest of cookies
7. the farthest out of cutz
8. the only dude on the pr not in the westest of washington
9. ebay/dj combo
10. ebay/dj combo

The list is almost the same as Ebay's above a few posts, but with the openness to argue DJ Combo and Ebay's spots. I'd be more inclined to put DJ in 10 IMO.

 

[nDie]

The last few spots are pretty loose, If I were you guys, I would try to make it out to the Redmond tournament this Saturday and get some extra points. If not, then it's just another 3 months before we update again anyways.

EDIT: Also, it's cool to see more people caring enough about PR to generate a serious discussion, good stuff guys.

Yeah it's really hard for me to get saturdays off though so I can't go to pretty much anything but GC when I can request it off. I'm not mad about being taken off PR though, just so you guys know, I just disagree lol. I'll try to at least make all the next GCs next period though, now that the USF4 hype has died down I'm gonna refocus on melee.

But Yeah, I'd still give DJ C #9 for the head to head win over Ebay and not losing to epidemique.

 

[Ebay]

If DJ Combo is coming back to melee, I'd definitely put him on the list.

I'm an observant player, and I tend to look at a lot of matches going down. Along with recent results, I'll put this as my PR. I'll answer any questions you have on it, just don't doubt me because of my skill.

1. Silent Wolf
2. Bladewise
   
3. Vish
4. Iceman
   
5. Oreo
6. The Prime (Only because he hasn't shown any will to improve or even shown UP lately)
7. Neil D.
   
8. Alien
9. Ebay/DJ Combo
10. Ebay/DJ Combo

Andy has attended June and July GC, he's been active enough. (I don't think you should move him down considering BOTH he and Oreo have taken significant losses this period, Andy lost to space and trent lost to Neil.)

 

[Hawt Salsa]

Andy has attended June and July GC, he's been active enough. (I don't think you should move him down considering BOTH he and Oreo have taken significant losses this period, Andy lost to space and trent lost to Neil.)

Ahh, thank you. I had a feeling he had attended July, but I wasn't present. Good points all around, I'll think and revise my list tomorrow.

 

[pandacheck]

ya'll new ****** can't **** with DJ COMBO he's rusty give him time he will be tapping asses left and right.

 

[pandacheck]

drunk ***** posts are the best, i miss WA SMASH

 

[AlienAllen]

I agree with Ebay's list (but I would be ok if I was above Neil). I would put nDie or Wasabi above DJ Combo but it's close. Good lists and discussion. I think the period after this update is going to be intense.

 

[Hawt Salsa]

I agree with Ebay's list (but I would be ok if I was above Neil). I would put nDie or Wasabi above DJ Combo but it's close. Good lists and discussion. I think the period after this update is going to be intense.

I agree, but in my opinion I would want to see a little bit of work from either of those two before putting them on. I know Wasabi was on the PR this time last year, but the talent has increased a ton since. As well as DJ Combo came back and just rekt kinda out of nowhere iirc.

I also agree that this **** is going to be insane, everyone is going to want a shot at the bottom spots when this is released.

 

[AlienAllen]

I agree, but in my opinion I would want to see a little bit of work from either of those two before putting them on. I know Wasabi was on the PR this time last year, but the talent has increased a ton since. As well as DJ Combo came back and just rekt kinda out of nowhere iirc.

I also agree that this **** is going to be insane, everyone is going to want a shot at the bottom spots when this is released.

I'm going for the top spots. Bottom spots are old news.

 

[Ebay]

Alright lets get this list finalized now that the Dair to be Great tourney has passed, Neil already updated the results in his post so you guys might want to look at it one more time and post your list / final list. For my list I'll keep the one I posted earlier.

 

[Hawt Salsa]

My list (this is taking into account the August GC matches i'm currently seperating and DTBG) is almost the same as Ebay's list.

1) SilentWolf
2) Bladewise
3) Vish
4) Iceman
5) The Prime
6) Oreo
7) Neil
8) Alien
9) Ebay
10) Wasabi

When I first came into the scene about a year ago Hot Wasabi was on the PR. I've seen him do really well lately, and I don't know exactly how he stands against you Ebay but I think he should be on this update. Especially with his recent preformances.

As for putting him over DJ Combo, DJ (fresh back in the scene) has dropped frequent games to lower/mid level players. Though his skill is still high I'd put Wasabi over him. I don't think DJ is ready for the PR at this time just warming back up.

I'm open to any feedback here, this is my first time being confident enough to join in on the PR discussion.

 

[Silent Wolf]

My list (this is taking into account the August GC matches i'm currently seperating and DTBG) is almost the same as Ebay's list.

1) SilentWolf
2) Bladewise
3) Vish
4) Iceman
5) The Prime
6) Oreo
7) Neil
8) Alien
9) Ebay
10) Wasabi

When I first came into the scene about a year ago Hot Wasabi was on the PR. I've seen him do really well lately, and I don't know exactly how he stands against you Ebay but I think he should be on this update. Especially with his recent preformances.

As for putting him over DJ Combo, DJ (fresh back in the scene) has dropped frequent games to lower/mid level players. Though his skill is still high I'd put Wasabi over him. I don't think DJ is ready for the PR at this time just warming back up.

I'm open to any feedback here, this is my first time being confident enough to join in on the PR discussion.

What evidence is there that suggests that Wasabi should be above nDie tho? I'd say the results point towards the other way around. I'm not saying nDie should be on or not, I'm just saying your provisions are vague.

I'm still not sure what my list is honestly. I'll have to think about it. Right now I think I'm leaning towards Ebay's list.

 

[Hawt Salsa]

What evidence is there that suggests that Wasabi should be above nDie tho? I'd say the results point towards the other way around. I'm not saying nDie should be on or not, I'm just saying your provisions are vague.

I'm still not sure what my list is honestly. I'll have to think about it. Right now I think I'm leaning towards Ebay's list.

****, that's a good point. I didn't even take that into account to be honest, forgot about cody. In that case, I'd probably make the 10th spot blank. Getting to the lower part of the list is hard for me, and I'll probably keep some notes for this PR Period to make better calls/provisions next time.

IMO I think Ebay has the most balanced list right now.

 

[Ganobrator]

honestly tho allen is the best and he'll bop all of you in like 6 months

 

[AlienAllen]

I just like the idea of 4 Falcons on the PR.

 

[Krynxe]

enjoy it while it lasts cause it won't last long

 

[Silent Wolf]

Anyone got any last opinions on this list then?

1) SilentWolf
2) Bladewise
3) Vish
4) Iceman
5) The Prime
6) Oreo
7) Neil Out Da Cutz
8) Alien
9) Ebay
10) DJ Combo

The last few spots are always gonna be kind of a toss-up.

 

[OutTheCuts]

looks good to me. I don't think there's much else to discuss that hasn't been talked about already.

 

[Hawt Salsa]

Yeah, that's Essentially Ebay's list right? Looks like we have a PR.

 

[BladeWise]

I like Otto's list. If nDie did, like, one more thing, I'd have put him 10, though.

 

[Ebay]

Looks like the list is finalized, lets update that graphic!

 

[Silent Wolf]

someone summon jeremy. neal, what do you want you tag as on the pr?

 

[Ebay]

someone summon jeremy. neal, what do you want you tag as on the pr?

I'll let Jeremy know.