Villager Moveset and Analysis Thread (:

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#81
I remember Dtilt being really useful when playing the demo. At low-mid percents, it pops enemies up above Villager. I was able to land Usmash after connecting Dtilt. I think it may be one of Villager's bread-and-butter combo starters (not unusual for a Dtilt).
 

Hong

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#82
I remember Dtilt being really useful when playing the demo. At low-mid percents, it pops enemies up above Villager. I was able to land Usmash after connecting Dtilt. I think it may be one of Villager's bread-and-butter combo starters (not unusual for a Dtilt).
But why do that when you can dsmash? You can still follow up with a dtilt straight after, even sub 50%. Both moves have lengthy recovery, but dsmash has more reach and the initial jab into the ground is just as fast.
 
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#83
But why do that when you can dsmash? You can still follow up with a dtilt straight after, even sub 50%. Both moves have lengthy recovery, but dsmash has more reach and the initial jab into the ground is just as fast.
I wasn't arguing against the use of Dsmash, but simply giving my two cents on the Dtilt as its own move. It looks like it can start things in the air, which is good. I'm sure that something like Dsmash -> Dtilt -> Usmash may be plausible. I'm not sure if it's possible to hit foes out of the pitfall status with weaker moves like Dtilt, though. If that's not possible, then I suppose Villager could always wait until the end of the pitfall status, then Dtilt and follow-up, but realistically, charging an Fsmash would be the preferred option most of the time, especially since the enemy won't be pitfalled for very long at percentages in which Dtilt would even be useful.

Hmm...does Dsmash have a non-pitfalling hitbox? I wasn't able to notice it if it does.
 
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#85
Well, it spikes at the ledge, so I assume non-grounded enemies are simply grounded.
I just assumed that was a given. I suppose what I should've asked is "Does the Dsmash have a hitbox that deals traditional knockback to players on the ground?".

I forgot that the shovel spiked aerial enemies, though. It seems Villager is going to be the anti-Ice Climbers, and absolutely adore being above the opponent.
 

Player-1

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#87
Dtilt is villager's best move IMO, it's fast and has a good disjoint hitbox, with great damage output and puts opponents in a good position to follow up on.
 
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#88
I remember Dtilt being really useful when playing the demo. At low-mid percents, it pops enemies up above Villager. I was able to land Usmash after connecting Dtilt. I think it may be one of Villager's bread-and-butter combo starters (not unusual for a Dtilt).
What is Villager's Dtilt exactly?
 

Veggi

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#93
According to what Hong has said, it does exactly what you had as your first guess. Imagine firing a fully charged Samus Charge Shot, but instead of just going through most things it goes through everything. When he's riding it, I'd imagine Lloid just keeps going while you get knocked off. Not sure though.
 

Hong

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#94
How does Villager's regular side B interact with projectiles?? Does it overpriortize them, making them vanish? Does it clank with any and dissapear? What about when he's riding it??
They just "hit" the Lloid like they would hit a shield or crate. So rockets explode, thrown beam swords bounce off, etc.

If the Villager is riding it, same applies. That said, if the Villager herself is hit, she will fall off of the Lloid and it will keep going. You can see this at the end of Robin's trailer. This is only likely to happen with attacks from above or attacks that persist, such as PK Fire, since the Lloid blocks mostly anything coming from the front.
 
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#95
Lloid has been confirmed to go through the sender's trees, atleast in the SDCC Wii U build.
Huzzah.
 

Veggi

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#96
With the ability to stand behind a tree and fire rockets, I don't think Villager is going to have a problem with campy characters. Also, I just watched Villager pocket a projectile a bit ago; it looks like he gains invincibility for almost half a second after using Pocket. That should make it a lot safer to use Pocket against a storm of projectiles or close range follow-ups like Falco's laser into up smash/grab.
 
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#98
@ Veggi Veggi Gah, why do all Shantae GIFs just make me distracted I and just stare at them? I play too much Shantae for my own good -////-
In other news, yeah, Villager's gonna be pretty good if he can shoot Lloids through his trees in the final build. Can definitely give an advantage over the ones who can't easily get around the Lloids/Tree.
 
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Veggi

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#99
I'm in love with the Risky Boots gif because of where it comes from. She just casually hangs upside down off the side of a fighting pirate ship. She could fall off and die. I guess that's why they call her Risky. But yeah, I feel you. I feel like such a loser for making a Shantae moveset to put in the thread.

/

Lloid = Unstoppable Force

Tree = Immovable Object
 
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I'm in love with the Risky Boots gif because of where it comes from. She just casually hangs upside down off the side of a fighting pirate ship. She could fall off and die. I guess that's why they call her Risky. But yeah, I feel you. I feel like such a loser for making a Shantae moveset to put in the thread.

/

Lloid = Unstoppable Force

Tree = Immovable Object
Can't help it. The Shantae series just gets to you. ItAlsoInfatuatesYou

In other news, yeah. Villager's certainly being in the Mid-High/High tiers unless he has a major flaw, with his amazing recovery both Vertical AND Horizontal, having a defensive option which not only you can shoot a few projectiles through, but also gives him a strong risk/reward attack while using the tree (in the Axe), his DSmash>FSmash Semi-Combo, his Pocket abilities, plus his small Hitbox, he's gonna be pretty powerful.
 

Hong

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Being pretty slow and having short range on all but two of her normals would be major flaws, I'd say. Not crippling flaws by any means, since the character has so much tempo control, though it does present limitations.
 

Veggi

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As soon as I was done marveling at that animation when I first saw it, I immediately reblogged it on Tumblr. So many frames.

I don't like saying that a character is going to be good because the Brawl tier list got thrown around a whole lot, but Villager is definitely looking really good. He might suffer from not having an option to get out of pressure.
 

Hong

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As soon as I was done marveling at that animation when I first saw it, I immediately reblogged it on Tumblr. So many frames.

I don't like saying that a character is going to be good because the Brawl tier list got thrown around a whole lot, but Villager is definitely looking really good. He might suffer from not having an option to get out of pressure.
Hmm. Good point. No good OOS options. Jab looks like the only thing you got when they are already on-top of you.
 

Aunt Jemima

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While Villager seems to be good competitively, he's sure to one of the best casual characters. His Pocket and Lloid Rocket are going to destroy people, and when you play FFA's the tree's will be hilarious.

Also, I'm assuming no, but... can you pocket Smash Balls? This would be so funny, haha. Also, can you pocket Rolling Crates or Rolling Barrels?
 

Hong

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Also, I'm assuming no, but... can you pocket Smash Balls? This would be so funny, haha. Also, can you pocket Rolling Crates or Rolling Barrels?
Haven't tried pocketing them while they are in motion, but you can pocket them while they are still.
 

Kawaiiderpz

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Have you guys heard of the turnaround cancel in the smash4 demo?
It's gonna be real fun pivot down smashing people then f smashing them lel.

Also Villager seems like a really campy character. Matches will consist of seeing who camps better. OR hopefully SHFF Fair then grab will become a thing lel
Remember R.O.B used to be at the top of early brawl tier lists and he's campy
 
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So i was thinking about combos and can u possibly use the watering can to push enemies to the sprout and the water from the can makes the sprout grow hence knocking enemies up and then following up with a few uairs.

Just saying :p
After looking at how fast the sprout>tree animation is, this probably is the case. If so I wonder how big the hitbox will be, either way it definitely would be great for combos and controlling platforms.
 
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The more and more I look at Villager, the more I think he will be the edgeguarding champ. Not only is the tree decent (albeit very situational), but his dash attack will find some great uses, and his water pail will be helpful to keep those opponents away. And although his Fair and Bair aren't kill moves, they will help keep opponents from getting on stage. All in all, I have a feeling the Villager will be a threat off the edge of a stage.

EDIT: Forgot about his FSmash.
 
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Playing the demo right now and Villager is...puzzling.

The Bad news:

He has only two moves that have any decent KO potential and that's his F-Smash Bowling Ball and the Falling Tree. The Bowling Ball has bad reach and the tree takes time to set up.

His Down Smash is almost entirely worthless as characters can jump out of the pit almost instantly even when over 100% damage.

His F-Air and B-Air Slingshot can be fired twice out of a full hop but only once in a short hop and their range are both very lacking, not even traveling half-way across Battlefield (FD) without vanishing. Their damage and knockback is based on how close you are to your target. Has little knockback at a distance but decent knockback up close.

Jab has cooldown frames and if you tab jab during those frames you'll just jab again. Has very little knockback too so this move is SUPER unsafe. Basically imagine if Pikachu's Jab had more ending lag and that's Villager's Jab. Very bad.

F-Tilt has garbage range. Like, it's the same range as Villager's Jab. I checked.

Good news:

Growing and Chopping down a tree will sometime produce a log that Villager can abuse as a decent projectile. It only does 3% but it can lead to some combos. It can be Pocketed but there can only be one log out at a time; this means that if you take out your pocketed log (lewd) while another log is on the field, the one of the field will vanish.

If you choose not to chop the tree, Villager will retain the Axe as his Down-B move with some decent knockback to it and it can be used in the air. The tree only stays alive for about 12 seconds so the Axe is a shortlived but effective weapon at high percents. It KOs Link at about 110%

Pocket is really good and probably a little OP in items on FFAs (Pocketing a Maxim Tomato for instance). It doesn't just continue a pocketed move like a reflect but it acts as if Villager himself has preformed the move. For example if you pocket Link's Boomerang after it loses its hitbox for a windbox, Villiager will throw the hitbox version of the Boomerang. Pocket also resets bomb fuses.

D-Tilt is a decent combo starter if you can land it and has different hitboxes depending on how far away the opponent is.

Up-Tilt is surprisingly good and lingers a while. Decent anti-air and a very nice combo starter.

F-Air and B-Air are both decent edge-guarding tools.

N-Air has practically no ending lag so you can N-Air > Double Jump > Aerial for a two-hit combo. You can also short hop it and jump out before you hit the ground or follow the opponent for another N-Air.

He can abuse Lyoid Rocket's start-up time to set up some combos like Lyoid Rocket > F-Air > Lyoid Hits Them > N-Air

He can attack right after he fires Lyoid which means Villager can F-Air instantly to apply pressure while Lyoid fires toward the opponent as well. Kind of a mini projectile wall in a way.


I'm having a lot of fun with Villager but I can tell that this character is gonna have a very high learning curve.
 
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Villager's recovery is also completely insane, but that's probably old news by now. I did see him spike with dair, but it may be tied to the number of turnips he pulls out, which is random.
 

Mr. Pants

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I like the way the F air slingshot is looking. Short hop slingshot around the stage? Oh and lots of lloid rockets. Looks like he has a good edge game too. Just how am I gonna get that tree smash attack to work?! And... That recovery!
 
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From what I've seen in the different clips of the Villager, I think that it takes two or three swings of the axe to get the tree to fall which will means that this edgeguard will take some setting up and serious mind games. I like that. I'm also wondering if he can use his balloon trip after riding the Lloid Rocket...
This may have been answered already, but...

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20..._some_skulls_in_the_3ds_super_smash_bros_demo

In the match played on the Japanese demo, it seems that Villager can use Balloon Trip after IF and only if he
hits someone while riding. Otherwise he becomes helpless.

While Villager seems to be good competitively, he's sure to one of the best casual characters. His Pocket and Lloid Rocket are going to destroy people, and when you play FFA's the tree's will be hilarious.
Somewhat irrelevant, but if Villager is maddening in FFA casual play, Default Palutena is maddening in casual 1V1
with all her anti-spam moves. Even made a forum in Palutena section about it.
 
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His Down Smash is almost entirely worthless as characters can jump out of the pit almost instantly even when over 100% damage.
Depending on how much time the Villager has, you can probably use that to your advantage as a mindgame.
 
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His Down Smash is almost entirely worthless as characters can jump out of the pit almost instantly even when over 100% damage.

.[/quote]

Well, the bury time kinda HAS to be short for a regular attack, otherwise it'd be a bit broken.

It's a move that works better as a surprise, use it too much and people will be ready to mash out.
 
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Mr. Pants

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Styles and I put together this combo video for Villager based on the demo. Hopefully, this will give you guys a good idea of how he works in-game.

Towards the end of the video (at about 2:05): The tree does damage and has knock back when it grows! Did not realize that...
 
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Roger you picked the absolute BEST fan mashup I've ever heard for the AC series, props to you on that.

I'm really glad and oddly surprised that Villager is so beastly, my planned main keeps on getting better and better.
 
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