Official v2.0.0 Patch Discussion Thread

shrooby

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#1
Welcome to the 'official' discussion thread for the 2.0.0 patch.

Here is the the Patch Notes Thread: https://smashboards.com/threads/v2-0-0-patch-notes.474149/
That Patch Notes Thread is locked to the public. We will move confirmed posts into it from this thread as they come!

We will hand out large infractions and/or temporary bans to those who stifle this process of patch exploration
Some examples include
1. Posting false changes, good intentions or not.
2. Asking if anything has changed when the patch notes are there for you to read.
3. Immature behavior and complaining over the patch changes.

When checking changes, remember that Ultimate has many different damage multipliers.

  • Percent values taken from proper matches (non-training mode) have scaling adjustments based on it's current freshness; a 1% difference seen in a match may not be a real patch change and should be double checked before being posted.
  • For aerials remember that aerials performed during a short hop have a x0.85 damage multiplier.
  • Moves deal less damage in matches with more than two people than in 1v1s. This multiplier also applies to Training Mode.
~~~~~~~~~
 

Liberation

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#2
https://en-americas-support.nintendo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/43317

Nintendo has finally leveled up and given us some fairly specific notes, but they're not exact numeric changes; thus, you can probably guess what our objective is this go-around.

These changes may be direct balance adjustments to moves, or may be bugfixes. Keep this in mind if you are testing changes.
 
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shrooby

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#3
The following characters are unchanged: Captain Falcon, Fox, Zelda, Falco, Dr. Mario, Marth, Lucina, Meta Knight, Young Link, Squirtle, Ivysaur, Olimar, Wolf, Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, Mii Sword, Dark Pit, Bowser Jr., Simon, and Richter.
 
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X1rom

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#6
You should include the new shorthopping mechanic in the thread under global Changes. Also the website says that Shulk's Fair has less landing lag but it's still 10 Frames.
 

0danmaster0

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#7
PSA: "Shortened the landing time after using the move." does NOT refer to landing lag, "Reduced vulnerability when landing." does.

I think the former refers to autocancel windows. "Vulnerabilty" is a nintendo codeword for faf in general I'm pretty sure.
 

X1rom

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#8
Alright then. Here's something I found: Inklings Bury time went from 216 Frames down to 146 Frames.
 

Lifewaker

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#10
From the DK Discord: DK has the same aerial IASA, active frames, and landing lag on his forward air. It also still never autocancels. Cannot tell what the patch did to him.
 

Amazing Ampharos

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#11
From the DK Discord: DK has the same aerial IASA, active frames, and landing lag on his forward air. It also still never autocancels. Cannot tell what the patch did to him.
In past Smash games, DK's fair had a bug wherein for the auto-cancel window it used a synchronous timer instead of an asynchronous timer. In layman's terms, this means it measured the frames from the time the move hit whereas the number of frames they used seemed intended to be from the start of the animation which resulted in the auto-cancel window being put after the end of the animation which means it didn't do anything. I would not be surprised if they reduced the frame counter on this timer but did not correct the timer type, resulting in a shorter auto-cancel window that doesn't do anything in-game because it's still after the move's animation ends.

That's just speculation for what might be going on, but DK fair (and Ganondorf fair which in past games was similar) are worth extra scrutiny and extra skepticism due to their history of having this timer bug.
 

Methacrylate

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#12
shrooby shrooby The Corrincord has done frame by frame analysis of the changes to Nair and Uair, thanks to the help of the lab team and Promaelia.

Nair AC is now 46 down from 50
Uair AC is now 37 down from 40
 

LGameTales

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#13
Here are the Japanese patch notes:
https://www.nintendo.co.jp/support/switch/software_support/aaab/detail/200_fighter.html

For "Shortened the landing time," the Japanese uses, 専用の着地になる時間を短くしました, which means, "Shortened the time to go into exclusive landing lag."

I think this means to say the auto-cancel window is sooner (which shortens the amount of time it's possible to go into the aerial's landing lag).
 
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Krysco

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#14
This site https://en-americas-support.nintend...3QXZRVEdRalN1aXJWdFM3VVNqMFROU2hZRjBRJTIxJTIx mentions these changes to Mewtwo:
Mewtwo Dash Attack Shortened the downtime from shielding. Mewtwo Side Tilt Attack This move will now always launch forward. Mewtwo Up Special Made it easier to grab edges.
Yet this thread and the one with confirmed changes mention no changes to Mewtwo. Are the changes false or just not confirmed in-game yet? I'm curious what exactly the dash attack change means. More safety on shield? Or perhaps less if it refers to less downtime for the one shielding?
 

A10theHero

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#15
Pikachu's pummel is two frames faster now. Pre-patch, it had a FAF of 19. Now, it has a FAF of 17.

As Ruben mentioned beforehand, the patch notes may be referring to hitlag whenever they say hitstun. So, by "shortened hitstun time", I assume that the hitlag of Pikachu's pummel was modified. I don't know the specifics of that, unfortunately.
 

DJTHED

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#16
The only thing that changed that's been found so far for Pichu is a very slight buff to Pichu's pummel FAF. Before the pummel FAF was 20, now it's 19, just a 1 frame buff.
 
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#17
Some other changes I noticed from the Nintendo's balance notes that isn't in the thread list:

:ultbowser:
+ Final Smash and FS Meter will now deal the same knockback to couching opponents the same as standing opponents.
:ultincineroar:
+ Up air ledge lockout time reduced.
:ultjigglypuff:
+ Back air has increased attack speed.
0 Forward throw launch angle adjusted.
:ultkirby:
+ Forward tilt has less endlag (28 -> 24).
+ Stone (aerial) now has super armor starting on frame 19 (the actual move itself still comes out on frame 28).
:ultlittlemac:
+ Up air ledge lockout time reduced.
:ultlucario:
+ FS Meter has increased power.
:ultlucas:
0 Pummel also has electric properties.
:ultluigi:
+ Up smash improved knockback.
:ultbrawler:
+ N-air seems to have less landing lag.
:ultness:
+ Up air autocancel seems to have been adjusted.
+ Down air has been buffed in some way. Maybe damage or knockback?
:ultpacman:
+ Adjusted f-air autocancel, and ledge lockout time reduced.
+ Adjusted d-air autocancel.
+ Neutral special has been changed, but I am personally not sure what changed about it.
:ultpalutena:
- Shortened hitstun time on n-air.
+ Warp grabs ledges easier.
:ultpikachu::ultpichu:
+ Both pummels has slightly less hitstun time.
:ultpit:
+ Final Smash and FS Meter will now deal the same knockback to couching opponents the same as standing opponents.
:ultdarkpit:
Unchanged in this update.
:ultridley:
+ Increased power to FS Meter.
:ultdarksamus:
Thanks for clarifying on the missing DSamus missile change. Was confused why Samus was the only one listed with the change.
 

Untouch

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#18
When Nintendo says they've "shortened landing time" which apparently means AC window, does that mean the AC window is reduced? Wouldn't that be a nerf?
 
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#19
A tweak for the patch notes topic:

Ike's Aethercide still happens... sometimes. Seems to be stage dependant/depends on how far both characters have to fall, possibly character weight/gravity dependant as well. Sometimes we die first sometimes we die second, but its not completely gone. This was tested in the Ike Discord.
 

Nobie

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#20
I tested doing a Marth dash grab against a shielding ROB, and it seems to work now. I don't have an old version to compare against, but I had Marth literally rubbing up against the shield and the dash grab went through. If anyone else wants to test and verify this, please feel free.
 

LGameTales

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#21
When Nintendo says they've "shortened landing time" which apparently means AC window, does that mean the AC window is reduced? Wouldn't that be a nerf?
"Landing time" doesn't mean AC window. It means the time you would land with landing lag. Shortening that "landing time" would mean the AC window is larger.
 
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#22
I've got the game unpatched and I'm just going to post numbers for these moves in order to have something to compare to. Assuming somebody can get the corresponding post patch numbers. This is going to take me a while to get through so I'll just update this post as I go. All damage values are with the 1v1 modifier, and aerials are full hopped. And when I say total frames I do mean the duration of the move - in other words FAF minus one frame since I don't know what term the patch notes are going to use.

:ultmario:Dash Attack angle ~55 degrees when observing blue launch trajectory on Mario Probably still 60 degrees in game's code from Smash 4
:ultlink:
  • Uair auto cancel was 47 onward. In other words, could only auto cancel if input on frame 5 of a full hop, no later. It was frame perfect in 1.2. Definitely doesn't autocancel on frame 46.
  • Regardless of charge, Arrow travel time lasts for exactly 40 seconds including first hit frame.
  • When stuck in the ground, arrow lasts for 180 frames
:ultsamus:
  • Homing missiles travel for ~118 frames and reaches about 80% of the length of battlefield.
  • Either type of missile is 59 total frames when used in the air.
  • Bomb total frames was 53, or 44 if the player was holding down at that moment (it's a holdover trick/bug from Smash 4), and 48 total frames when used in the air.
:ultyoshi:Can grab ledges beginning on frame 71 of F-air animation.
:ultkirby:
  • Dash attack travels about half the length of battlefield. Damage is 12.0/8.4/6.2
  • Stone armor begins on frame 11 on the ground and frame 29 in the air.
  • F-tilt total frames is 27.
:ultpikachu:Pummel hitlag is 14 frames
:ultness:
  • U-air autocancel is 39 onward. But definitely not 38.
  • D-air damage is 14.4 and 12.0 on late hitbox
:ultjigglypuff:
  • Usmash damage is 18.0 and 15.6 on sourspot
  • F-tilt total frames is 27
  • B-air is 12 startup with 39 total frames and 11 landing lag
  • Forward Throw angle ~50 degrees when observing blue launch angle on Mario. Probably still 55 degrees in game's code from Smash 4
:ultsheik:
  • Can grab ledges beginning on frame 88 on F-air animation
  • Burst Grenade endlag on release is 39.
  • U-air autocancel window is frame 47 onward. It only autocanceled on full hop when frame perfectly input on frame 5 of full hop. Definitely didn't autocancel on 46.
:ultpichu:Pummel hitlag is 15 frames
:ultmarth::ultlucina:Cannot dash grab a shielding R.O.B.

:ultganondorf:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 63 of U-air
  • F-air autocancel window is frame 55 onward
:ultmewtwo:
  • I take the dash attack blurb to refer to shieldlag or shieldstun. In Ultimate, Dash attacks have enormously higher shieldstun compared to other grounded moves, so perhaps they found this one to be problematic. In 1.21 it's 11 shieldlag and 20 shieldstun on the early hit and 8 shieldlag and 11 shieldstun for the late hit that does 7.2 damage
:ultroy::ultchrom: D-air autocancel window is definitely frame 55 onward
:ultgnw:
  • F-air's bomb leaves his hands on frame 14, and explodes on frame 44, assuming it doesn't touch ground first. It explodes the frame it makes contact with the ground. It does NOT explode on contact with characters, however.
  • D-air autocancel window is frame 53 onward. Possibly 52, definitely not 51
:ultzss:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 73 of F-air animation
  • Can grab ledges on frame 75 of U-air animation
  • And here's a good source of comparison for bury duration
:ultwario: Can grab ledges on frame 76 of his D-air animation
:ultsnake:Gonna take that blurb to mean the early hit takes up more than two of the active hit frames. I can confirm Kurogane's numbers in that the late hit begins on frame 8 and at that point Snake's leg is fully extended upward, while frames 6 and 7 don't have a hitbox reaching quite as high.
:ultcharizard:Dash attack damage is 13.2 and 9.6 for late hit. Same base damage as in Smash 4.
:ultdiddy:N-air autocancel window is frame 51 onward. Definitely not 50.
:ultlucas:
  • Utilt is interesting, it has the electric visual effect yet I was able to kill a yellow pikmin with it. Perhaps the game considers this move a magic effect?
  • Can grab ledges on frame 73 of N-air animation
:ultsonic:
  • B-air landing lag is 18 frames
  • F-air hitlag on multihits is 6 frames while the final hit is 11 frames.
:ultlucario:
  • At no aura, the full charge is 13 frames of hitlag while no charge delivers 9 frames.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 64 of the F-air animation
:ulttoonlink:
  • F-air autocancels on frame 51, definitely not 50.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 68 of B-air animation
:ultrosalina:
  • Up B Ledge snaps as early as frame 23.
  • can grab ledges as early as frame 69 of N-air animation. Not sure what "hit detection" is referring to.
  • Like Smash 4, the meteor hitbox begins on 18 so I don't know how you can shorten one frame of animation.
  • My frame data charts have what we need for Luma Shot and Luma Recall, it's a lot of numbers that they potentially could be referring to and the move is already faster in several regards compared to Smash 4.
:ultlittlemac:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 46 of N-air animation. Landing lag is 10 frames
  • Can grab ledges on frame 73 of U-air animation.
:ultbrawler:
  • USmash late hit begins on frame 12.
  • N-air has 8 landing lag
  • B-air has 14 landing lag
  • U-air deals 9.6 damage.
  • Up B 1 can ledge snap as early as frame 15 from the front. And the followup kick can ledge snap pretty much the moment you begin descending. Cannot grab the ledge behind him until he enters special fall.
  • Neutral B 2 is 18.9 total damage. 0.3 on each multihit and 11.4 on the final hit
  • Neutral B 3 is 50/52 startup with 89/91 total frames
  • Side B 1 is 19.2 total damage on the ground and in the air.
  • Side B 2 is 21.6 total damage and travels just shy of the length of a battlefield side platform.
  • Down B 1 appears to deal no bonus shield damage
:ultgunner: F-air autocancels on frame 49 onward, definitely not 48
:ultpalutena:N-air multihit hitlag is 6 frames, final hit is 15 frames.
:ultpacman:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 51 of F-air animation and can autocancel after frame 43, definitely not 42.
  • D-air autocancels on frame 56 onward. Definitely not 55.
  • Bonus Fruit (not counting hitlag frames the fruit experiences before bouncing off): Cherry disappears immediately. Strawberry, orange, apple, and melon disappear after 30 frames after hitting something
:ultrobin:Can grab ledges behind him on frame 52 of Elwind (double shot version)
:ultshulk:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 71 of F-air animation. F-air autocancels on frame 48 onward, definitely not on 47.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 80 of U-air animation.
:ultduckhunt:
  • Trick shot is 45 total frames
  • Clay shooting is 60 total frames. Hitlag is 14 frames on initial disc hit. Can't reliably count the hitlag on the followup hits
:ultryu:
  • N-air autocancels on frame 34 onward...but I didn't notice the patch notes were talking about Ken. Whoops.
  • F-air autocancels on frame 41 onward. Definitely not 40.
:ultcloud:
  • On the ground, finishing touch is about the same range as jab 1 (but the windbox will reach farther)
  • Can grab ledges on frame 71 of F-air animation
:ultcorrin:
  • N-air autocancels on frame 50 onward. Definitely not 48, can't test 49.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 62 of f-air animation
  • U-air autocancels on frame 40. Definitely not 39
:ultbayonetta:Can grab ledges on frame 59 of N-air animation (not extended)
:ultinkling:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 60 of N-air animation
  • Couldn't think of a good test but I notice the roller will very occasionally trade with Duck Hunt's rapid jab. Happening maybe once out of every ten tries. Normally it loses outright to any rapid jab I tested.
:ultridley:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 65 of N-air animation
  • Can grab ledges on frame 67 of F-air animation
  • Even with a bunnyhood I can't figure out the number for D-air. Somewhere past 75.
:ultkrool:Can hold vacuum for about 5 and a half seconds
:ultisabelle:Can grab ledges on frame 60 of N-air animation and autocancels on frame 38 onward, definitely not 37.
:ultincineroar:
  • D-air autocancels on frame 59 onward, definitely not 58.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 58 of U-air animation.

And here's a space I'm using to dump numbers for post-patch. I will make a new post with a comprehensive list based on what isn't already in the patch notes thread.

:ultlink:
  • Arrows travel for 46 frames before disappearing regardless of charge. 6 frames longer than pre patch.
  • U-air autocancels from frame 43 onward. Used to be 47.
:ultsamus:
  • Super Missile in the air now 61 total frames. 2 frames more than pre patch unless I missed something
  • Homing Missiles last for the same duration and travel the same distance. And I don't have a point of comparison for super missiles.
  • Bomb's total frames on the ground is 47. In the air is still 48. The 44 total frames you get from holding down is still in the game.
:ultyoshi: Can now grab ledges on frame 68 of F-air animation. A three frame improvement.
:ultkirby:
  • Dash attack damage increased. Now 14.4/10.8/7.2 from 12.0/8.4/6.0
  • F-tilt total frames is 23.
  • Stone armor in the air begins on frame 19 rather than 29. Still starts on frame 11 on the ground.
:ultpikachu:Pummel hitlag is now 12. A two frames improvement.
:ultness:
  • U-air autocancels on frame 34 onward. A four frames improvement.
  • D-air damage now 16.8 on early hit and 14.4 on late hit.
:ultjigglypuff:
  • Usmash now deals 18.0 on sourspot. There effectively isn't a sourspot anymore in terms of damage.
  • B-air startup is now 10. Total frames now 37.
  • F-tilt total frames now 24
:ultsheik:
  • Can now grab ledges on frame 59 of F-air animation. A 29 frame improvement.
  • U-air autocancels on frame 44 onward.
  • Endlag on release now 37. A two frame improvement.
:ultpichu:Pummel is 14 frames. A one frame improvement.
:ultganondorf:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 58 of U-air animation. A five frames improvement.
  • F-air autocancels on frame 45 onward. A 10 frames improvment.
:ultroy::ultchrom: D-air autocancels on frame 52 onward. A three frame improvement
:ultgnw:D-air autocancels on frame 50 onward. A three frame improvement.
:ultzss:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 71 of F-air animation. A two frame improvement.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 59 of U-air animation. A sixteen frame improvement
:ultwario:Can grab ledges on frame 72 of D-air animation. A four frame improvement.
:ultsnake:Early hit now lasts until frame 8 when the leg is fully extended.
:ultcharizard:15.6 damage on dash attack. 12.0 on late hit.
:ultdiddy:N-air autocancels on frame 27 onward. A twenty-three frame improvement.
:ultlucas:Can grab ledges on frame 69 of N-air animation. A four frame improvement.
:ultsonic:
  • B-air landing lag now 15. A three frame improvement.
  • F-air multihit hitlag is 4 frames. Final hit is 11 frames.
:ultlucario:Can grab ledges on frame 52 of F-air. A twelve frame improvement.
:ulttoonlink:
  • F-air autocancels on frame 39 onward. A twelve frame improvement
  • Can grab ledges on frame 60 of B-air animation. An eight frame improvement.
:ultrosalina:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 68 of N-air animation. A one frame improvement.
  • Luma N-air now has 7/13 startup instead of 8/13
  • D-air meteors on frame 17 now. The old 17 hitbox that sent opponents aways appears to be removed.
  • Luma Shot now has 5 frames less endlag at any charge.
  • Luma Recall is now 21 total frames. A four frame improvement.
:ultlittlemac:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 40 of n-air animation. A six frame improvement.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 66 of U-air animation. A seven frame improvement.
:ultbrawler:
  • Usmash late hit begins on frame 13 instead of 12.
  • N-air landing lag now 6. A two frame improvement.
  • B-air landing lag now 11. A three frame improvement.
  • Neutral B 2 is 21.4 total damage from 18.9.
  • Neutral B 3 is 79 total frames and 81 total frames when reversed. A ten frame improvement.
  • Up B 1 can now grab ledges from behind where as It couldn't before until the move entered special fall. Ledge snap window begins on 15 just like in front. Followup kick still won't grab a ledge behind him.
  • Side B 1 does the same amount of damage.
  • Down B 1 does bonus shield damage, almost enough to break a full shield when all three hits connect.
:ultgunner:F-air autocancels on frame 44. A five frame improvement.
:ultpalutena:N-air multhit hitlag is 3 frames instead of 6. Final hit is 13 frames instead of 15.
:ultpacman:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 50 of F-air animation. A one frame improvement.
  • F-air autocancels on frame 26 onward. A seventeen frame improvement.
  • D-air autocancels on frame 50 onward. A six frame improvement.
  • Bonus Fruit (not counting hitlag): Strawberry now lasts for 32 frames rather than disappearing immediately. Strawberry, apple, orange, and melon are 32 which is two frames longer.
:ultrobin:On the double shot version of Up B, can grab ledges behind him on frame 39. A thirteen frame improvement.
:ultshulk:
  • F-air autocancels on 42 onward. A six frame improvement.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 66 of F-air animation. A five frame improvement.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 79 of U-air animaation. A one frame improvement.
:ultduckhunt:
  • Trick Shot is now 41 total frames. A four frames improvement.
  • Clay Shooting is now 64 total frames. A four frames nerf.
:ultryu::ultken:F-air autocancels on 38 onward. A three frames improvement.
:ultcorrin:
  • N-air autocancels on frame 47 onward. A three frames improvement.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 60 of F-air
  • U-air autocancels on frame 38 onward. A two frame improvement.
:ultbayonetta:Can grab ledges on frame 57 of N-air animation. A two frame improvement.
:ultinkling:Can grab ledges on frame 56 of N-air animation. A four frames improvement.
:ultridley:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 64 if N-air animation. A one frame improvement.
  • Can grab ledges on frame 66 of F-air animation. A one frame improvement.
:ultisabelle:Can grab ledges on frame 58 of N-air animation. A two frame improvement.
:ultincineroar:
  • Can grab ledges on frame 56 of N-air animation. A two frame improvement
  • D-air autocancels on frame 45 onward. A thirteen frame improvement.
 
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Vipermoon

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#23
shrooby shrooby

Kirby Ftilt "Extended undamaged launch distance" means more base knockback.

Peach/Daisy Parasol "Shortened launch distance of repeated attacks" should mean the multi-hit has reduced knockback, right? You currently have it as the finisher does reduced knockback.

Who knows what this means? PAC-MAN Neutral Special "Extended the time until you disappear after landing the attack"
I'm thinking it's a translation error (the "you", specifically) and that maybe the fruit stays out longer after it hits/bounces off.
 
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Almand

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#25
:ultpacman:'s Fair autocancels out of shorthop (which I'm pretty sure it already did...), Dair autocancels out of fullhop (which it already did... Can't autocancel out of shorthop, which would've actually been a good buff), and Fair can grab the ledge a bit sooner (I never really had a problem with this to begin with, so I dunno how much it's changed by).

As for his Neutral B, Fruit will last longer after bouncing off a hurtbox. For example, if a Melon hit a shield, it would bounce up, then disappear almost immediately. Now it lasts a bit more time, so the opponent can jump and grab it, or you can rush forward and grab it. Kinda feels like they just slapped the notes into Google Translate on this one; I don't understand how they could've consciously written "Extended the time until you disappear after landing the attack"
 
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Ffamran

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#26
Is there a separate page from Nintendo detailing bug fixes and such? I figured for character specific bugs that they might be on the fighters adjustment page since as far as this person has checked, Lucina can dash grab a shielding ROB which is not mentioned at all for her as she isn't on the list and the only thing for ROB is the Side Special change. If she can, then Chrom, Marth, and Roy probably can too since they couldn't before.
 
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lordvaati

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#27
So on cosmetic side of things 2 infamous in game issues(Olimar's broken damage scaling with certain spirits and the Isabelle infinite item Glitch) have been said to be fixed as well.
 

Moobussir

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Ontario, Canada
#28
The Toon Link Fair change is accurate and everything, but it may be worth mentioning that it can now autocancel out of a Short Hop. Not necessary but it's a relevant detail.

EDIT: If you need the frame data, the autocancel window went from 51 > 39
 
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Capt. Tin

Smash Apprentice
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Jul 25, 2014
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Chicago, IL
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Capt.Tin
#29
Just did a few of the damage changes. These are all without the 1v1 multiplier.

Mii Brawler:

Up Air: 8% -> 9%

Neutral Special 2 (If All Hits Connect): 15.8% -> 17.9%

Ness:

Down Air: 12% (Clean) / 10% (Late) -> (14%/12%)


On Mii Brawler, these seem to be just raw damage buffs. Ness's down air is noted as "increased attack power and maintained launch distance." which leads me to believe that it does more damage, but had it's knockback compensated.
 
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shrooby

Let me know when I'm supposed to laugh, okay?
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#30
shrooby shrooby

Kirby Ftilt "Extended undamaged launch distance" means more base knockback.

Peach/Daisy Parasol "Shortened launch distance of repeated attacks" should mean the multi-hit has reduced knockback, right? You currently have it as the finisher does reduced knockback.

Who knows what this means? PAC-MAN Neutral Special "Extended the time until you disappear after landing the attack"
I'm thinking it's a translation error (the "you", specifically) and that maybe the fruit stays out longer after it hits/bounces off.
Thanks for the clarification!

Yeah I wasn't sure how to phrase the Peach change. I know it applied to multiple hits of the move, I just wasn't sure if it was actually all of them, so I left it vague. But I guess the way I phrased it implies it's just the last hit.

And yeah, if anyone knows what the Pac Man change means, that would be helpful!
 
Joined
Apr 13, 2014
Messages
1,655
Location
Santa Ana, CA
#32
C-stick works properly in frame-by-frame training mode now.
Ooh, can't wait to update then. That's definitely been bugging me.

Can anybody clarify for me what the change to Mega Man is?

Also shrooby shrooby there is no change to the damage of Mii Brawler's Side B 1. It deals 19.2% total damage on the ground and in the air in patch 1.2
 
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Tizio Random

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#34
:ultrosalina:

I found an unlisted change: Luma nair is now frame 7 instead of 8 EDIT: Rosa nair is now frame 9 from 10 too

Also for the other changes:

Neutral B FAF:

Uncharged 39>35
Fully charged 33>29
Grounded Recall 25>22
Aerial Recall 27>24

Down air doesn't have a sourspot anymore on the clean hit (I think it's 17-22 but needs further testing)

EDIT: dair doesn't have a sourspot only on frame 17
 
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webbedspace

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 6, 2015
Messages
301
#35
I found an unlisted change:

Hazardless Pokémon Stadium 2 has been altered - the jumbotron in the background now displays images again instead of going dark for almost the whole match. (Compare footage of basically any set prior to today, such as this, with what the stage looks like now). Previously this was a clue that the hazards switch had accidentally been left on, so the mixed-hazards crowd has lost something.

(By the way, anyone checking out whether Fountain Of Dreams's framedrops are fixed?)
 
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Byzantium97

Smash Rookie
Joined
May 17, 2016
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6
Location
Netherlands
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EpicFireFlash77
#37
Shulk changes (CONFIRMED with video evidence):

Fair autocancelwindow is now 1-4, 42>, it was 1-4, 45> previously.
Fair ledgelock time: 1-70 -> 1-65
Uair ledgelock time: 1-80 -> 1-78
 

Guybrush20X6

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Guybrush20X6
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#38
Can someone clarify which of Mii Brawlers specials have been given which improvements.

Specifically, is it Suplex or Onslaught that got the speed and distance buff?

Edit: Found it, thanks Yikarur Yikarur
Kinda feel like Sluplex was more in need of the change but that's the problem with kamikaze grabs.
 
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Mit

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 20, 2008
Messages
947
Location
Southeast Michigan
#39
Why is it stated that Mewtwo is unchanged here when there are several changes noted in the Nintendo patch notes?

Also I hear you don't have to wait as long between online matchmaking rematches anymore.
 
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