Uzi's Fox 101 ~ A Fox Guide

[Uzima (Uzi)]

Okay I've compressed the OP. You can go over it Uzi and just fix up any areas / update them with the revelant information.

awesome!
thanks a million

 

[Conviction]

Yea remember when I said I knew about the JJC since '08 (actually early '09) but no one wanted to help explore with it then when Rookie said it everyone jumped for it?

Well I finally found my proof of me knowing about it.

"I see Fox's jab can be used as a frametrapper (let me finish Zhamy ) I have been messing around and I noticed that most people can't react fast enough or it's a frametrap. Well we already know that Dair to Jab is a true combo. Nair isn't a true combo but works just as well...... Plus most moves don't come out faster than 4 frames so.... Jab(x2)>Shine is a good frametrap. I'm starting to think that the Jab can become a good part of his Metagame. Jabx2 is reconmended if you think they're to far away.

(As what I think are Frametraps)
Frame Trap Combos I have used:

SH Nair FF>Jab(x2)>Shine

SH Dair FF> Jab(x2)>Shine

Jab(x2)>Shine

Jab(x2)>Grab (should be known)

SH Dair FF>Jab(x2)>Grab>Dthrow>FH Fair

SH Dair FF>Jab(x2)>Grab>Fthrow

SH Nair FF>Jab(x2)>Grab>Dthrow>FH Fair

SH Nair FF>Jab(x2)>Grab>Fthrow

Jab(x2)>Dsmash (underrated)

All the Dsmash strings are the same as the jab>grab minus the grabs and throws

Tell me what you guys think and if any of things work for you or if some one could make sure my frame data skill (which are really questionable) is correct." http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=6457398#post6457398

 

[Zhamy]

Okay Iblis you are legit.

 

[Uzima (Uzi)]

alrighties,

I'll add it to the OP, and credit you for it.

 

[chaos_Leader]

A Training Guide for Fox

When looking at ways for a player to improve their Fox technique, I've seen a lot of "learn the character" and "go to training mode" and "master the moves" sort of guff flying around the boards, but I haven't seen many (if any) practical methods for someone to go about approaching these things. For the most part it's either been helplessly vague, or so tangled up in minute technical details that execution gets lost.

What I feel this thread, or even this board as a whole could do well with is a practical and comprehensive "Training Guide" that Fox players can use to better their technical game, and so improve their overall game.

One aspect in particular that may come in very handy is a set of drills and exercises that a Fox player can use in training mode or similar settings. I've recently started a sort of daily drilling and exercise regimen for myself, and it's been nothing but helpful to my game. The drills/exercises don't necessarily need to be tactically viable in a match, but they should condition the fingers, mind and muscle-memory for the lighting-fast moves, quick thinking and pinpoint precision that's all but required for a solid and well-rounded Fox game.

Some examples of drills/exercises may include:
- Dash-Dancing (Simple, but I find it's a good starter for my personal training sessions).
- SH-2X laser, regular SH laser in some cases, and SH-3X laser if you have the fingers/button setup, plus a variety of lead-ins and follow-ups.
- SH-Uair strings, autocanceled (moving across the stage while doing this is helpful).
- RAR-Bair strings, with/without fastfalling (I find performing back-and-forth strings of this helpful for conditioning)
- Various Shine maneuvers. The list for this would be very long, but to name a couple I find helpful:
- - - quick dash to jump-canceled Shine.
- - - ledgehop to shine, returning to the stage very quickly.
- - - many many more
- Illusion canceling, and incorporating it into a variety of circumstances.
- Jump-canceled moves from a shield (Usmash/Shine/others)
- Glide-tossing and item familiarity (you're going to have to fight against a Diddy Kong/Peach/ROB/Toon Link/or others sooner or later, so it'll be helpful to be comfortable wielding items, plus it's good finger conditioning)
- Crossing under the stage (as far as I know, it's only possible for Fox to do this unassisted on Smashvile, and it forces the player to think very carefully about Fox's airborne mechanics and recovery options).
- wall-jump of the stage's edge to recovery, probably some form of Illusion (especially challenging on stages with thin edges like Lylat or FD).
- Some way to practice teching off walls/ceilings (I haven't yet found any that can be feasibly done solo, so this'd be a good spot to have one if possible).
- I'm sure there are many more that could be done.

A list like this would be even more beneficial when there is a brief explanation to accompany each drill/exercise, along with tips and helpful hints for executing them, like a personal trainer for conventional workouts.

From what I can tell, there seems to be a stark disconnect here among Fox players who know all about these tech-skill goodies, and those who aren't so familiar with them. With a Training Guide like what I'm suggesting, maybe this gap can be bridged, and Fox users can raise their level of play with more confidence, more assurance, and more solidity than without one.

 

[Uzima (Uzi)]

When looking at ways for a player to improve their Fox technique, I've seen a lot of "learn the character" and "go to training mode" and "master the moves" sort of guff flying around the boards, but I haven't seen many (if any) practical methods for someone to go about approaching these things. For the most part it's either been helplessly vague, or so tangled up in minute technical details that execution gets lost.

What I feel this thread, or even this board as a whole could do well with is a practical and comprehensive "Training Guide" that Fox players can use to better their technical game, and so improve their overall game.

One aspect in particular that may come in very handy is a set of drills and exercises that a Fox player can use in training mode or similar settings. I've recently started a sort of daily drilling and exercise regimen for myself, and it's been nothing but helpful to my game. The drills/exercises don't necessarily need to be tactically viable in a match, but they should condition the fingers, mind and muscle-memory for the lighting-fast moves, quick thinking and pinpoint precision that's all but required for a solid and well-rounded Fox game.

Some examples of drills/exercises may include:
- Dash-Dancing (Simple, but I find it's a good starter for my personal training sessions).
- SH-2X laser, regular SH laser in some cases, and SH-3X laser if you have the fingers/button setup, plus a variety of lead-ins and follow-ups.
- SH-Uair strings, autocanceled (moving across the stage while doing this is helpful).
- RAR-Bair strings, with/without fastfalling (I find performing back-and-forth strings of this helpful for conditioning)
- Various Shine maneuvers. The list for this would be very long, but to name a couple I find helpful:
- - - quick dash to jump-canceled Shine.
- - - ledgehop to shine, returning to the stage very quickly.
- - - many many more
- Illusion canceling, and incorporating it into a variety of circumstances.
- Jump-canceled moves from a shield (Usmash/Shine/others)
- Glide-tossing and item familiarity (you're going to have to fight against a Diddy Kong/Peach/ROB/Toon Link/or others sooner or later, so it'll be helpful to be comfortable wielding items, plus it's good finger conditioning)
- Crossing under the stage (as far as I know, it's only possible for Fox to do this unassisted on Smashvile, and it forces the player to think very carefully about Fox's airborne mechanics and recovery options).
- wall-jump of the stage's edge to recovery, probably some form of Illusion (especially challenging on stages with thin edges like Lylat or FD).
- Some way to practice teching off walls/ceilings (I haven't yet found any that can be feasibly done solo, so this'd be a good spot to have one if possible).
- I'm sure there are many more that could be done.

A list like this would be even more beneficial when there is a brief explanation to accompany each drill/exercise, along with tips and helpful hints for executing them, like a personal trainer for conventional workouts.

From what I can tell, there seems to be a stark disconnect here among Fox players who know all about these tech-skill goodies, and those who aren't so familiar with them. With a Training Guide like what I'm suggesting, maybe this gap can be bridged, and Fox users can raise their level of play with more confidence, more assurance, and more solidity than without one.

hmmm, good idea, Maybe a short video of good strats to practice accross certain stages and such. with the full list of moves through out, like a martial arts kata.

 

[chaos_Leader]

hmmm, good idea, Maybe a short video of good strats to practice accross certain stages and such. with the full list of moves through out, like a martial arts kata.

Demonstration videos could be handy, but it would need to be more than just an impressive show-off video. It'd also need specific inputs, step-by-step breakdown, and practical methods of execution/practice.
As an example, for a while I could never for the life of me figure out how to Illusion-Cancel with any consistency, until I slowed down to 1/4 speed in training mode and finally saw the insanely short animation I was supposed to interrupt.

 

[Uzima (Uzi)]

Demonstration videos could be handy, but it would need to be more than just an impressive show-off video. It'd also need specific inputs, step-by-step breakdown, and practical methods of execution/practice.
As an example, for a while I could never for the life of me figure out how to Illusion-Cancel with any consistency, until I slowed down to 1/4 speed in training mode and finally saw the insanely short animation I was supposed to interrupt.

hmm, i train a very odd way, just sit for hours till i get it, no real plan about it.
Like for illusion cancel i just went back and forth accross smashville for hours till i got it,
now i still got it after months of not playing,

I may have to leave this idea mostly to you..

 

[luke_atyeo]

back when I was playing more I used to do 'drills' aswell.

some others to add to your list would be...

- practicing the run off quatercircle quicksnap edgehog thing (really just cant remember what its called)

- what I like to call the fox dance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AVIjWu_2No) props to uzi.

- doublejab cancel, drill to doublejab cancel, etc (stuff like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmaY-lMAcSc&fmt=18)

 

[chaos_Leader]

back when I was playing more I used to do 'drills' aswell.

some others to add to your list would be...

- practicing the run off quatercircle quicksnap edgehog thing (really just cant remember what its called)
- what I like to call the fox dance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AVIjWu_2No) props to uzi.
- doublejab cancel, drill to doublejab cancel, etc (stuff like this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmaY-lMAcSc&fmt=18)

1st: I never really found doing that difficult or challenging, but then again I can only speak for myself.

2nd: That's like a culmination a whole bunch of other things, once a player has their fingers up to speed.

3rd: Definitely. I'm actually working that into my routine now.

hmm, i train a very odd way, just sit for hours till i get it, no real plan about it.
Like for illusion cancel i just went back and forth accross smashville for hours till i got it,
now i still got it after months of not playing,

Repetition does help, a lot. That's kind of the point of drills and exercises.

I may have to leave this idea mostly to you..

I've thought about making a video like this; I have the equipment and software, but I've been hesitant to go through with it. Though I can perform all the above maneuvers, plus a few more, my moves are far from perfect. I don't know if my Fox technique would be able to carry the clout for something like this as it is.

But if the boards here will benefit from it, then I'd be happy to write something up, and post corresponding videos to go with it. It seems like something that could almost be sticky-worthy if it's good enough.

 

[luke_atyeo]

the ledge hog thing is easy, even though foxs is one of the harder ones to do, but I've seen matches lost (and myself lost matches) due to missing it just that one single time when its critical, due to pressure and whatnot.
a minute or 2 of it a day and you should be able to do it in an instant without fail if the opening presents itself

 

[Rizk18]

just thought this AT would help,im pretty sure ive discovered it,and i checked everywhere for it so since i cant find the person who supposedly made it,im claiming it as my own
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PC-JECSWUxI

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Yeah it's known.
Not bad that you found it again by yourself though.

 

[chaos_Leader]

If we're going to talk about unknown/little known techniques, then I'll put this one forward. I'm pretty sure I've seen a vid of this before, but I haven't seen a whole lot else since then.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-W99P6zz3Sw

And before you say it's not anything, take a closer look. Fox is actually descending during the Illusion Dash's warm-up animation (and I did screw one of them up a little).

On another note, I've uploaded a detailed breakdown/tutorial for the Illusion Cancel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoOzpbaIlhQ

 

[Conviction]

I like the tutorial.

 

[Uzima (Uzi)]

If we're going to talk about unknown/little known techniques, then I'll put this one forward. I'm pretty sure I've seen a vid of this before, but I haven't seen a whole lot else since then.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-W99P6zz3Sw

And before you say it's not anything, take a closer look. Fox is actually descending during the Illusion Dash's warm-up animation (and I did screw one of them up a little).

On another note, I've uploaded a detailed breakdown/tutorial for the Illusion Cancel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoOzpbaIlhQ

mind if i add the tutorial to the op?
full credit to you obviously

 

[chaos_Leader]

mind if i add the tutorial to the op?
full credit to you obviously

Go right ahead, that's what it's there for.

 

[RPK]

I think the best things to practice for Fox specifically are
-Fox Trotting and using the dash dance to quickly change directions. And by dash dance I mean using the small amount of frames that you have during the initial dashing frames to change direction
-SHTL just because its nice to have two at the top and one silent. Also when theyre on platforms so they have two lasers coming at them :V
-Advancing SHTL (Doing this forces you to learn to buffer your dash, but doing this makes advancing SHTL SOOOO much easier because after inputting the SHTL and buffering the dash you have like...half a second of chilling time before you go and input the stuff again.)
-Retreating SHTL (This one is like the one on top except that you gotta wait for the dash to come out, SH, press the other direction and triple laser. This also teaches you the timing, and not to just mash. Doing it consistently is tough but it's worth it.)
-Not to let SHTL cloud your overall laser game
-SHDL
-SH silent Single Laser
-Boost Pivot Grab. (The instant one which is Dash+Down C>Other Direction>Z IMO, this is the best way to input it.)
-Standing Pivot Grab. I personally prefer this one because it seems like this extends Fox's grab range a **** ton, and it's like he's doing a standing grab.
-Boost Pivot Grab behind you from a Fox Trot. Input is as follows if you wanna do it quickly
Fox Trot Forward, Fox Trot Forward and immediately Fox Trot in the other direction. When inputting the other way press down on the C-stick, and the rest should come naturally...I just find this one hard cause like...3 directional inputs hella fast D:
-SH Autocancel'd Uair. Doing this OoS is a ***** lemme tell you...Especially the way I do it lol. It does allow me to aim it very well though.
-Buffered Dash from Drop Shield in front of you/behind you to Upsmash/Dash Attack and just buffering a dash in general. Practicing buffering his dash helps to get the timing down for it I suppose...And this can be done at any edge. Just dash attack into the edge, and then continue doing a dash attack without moving back. Just dash forward and dash attack each time. If you do it right, you wont fall off and just keep doing the dash attack animation. This teaches you how to buffer the dash or how it should feel I suppose. Then try it from other things such as Nair, SHAD ect. Everything in this game can be buffered so when learning this game you should buffer...EVERYTHING!! Also Buffer Dash Upsmash from Drop Shield is his best punish because jesus christ there are a billion things you can upsmash from a Drop Shield
-Illusion Canceling
-Reverse Uptilt
-RAR Bair
-Doing all of the above from a walk (Because walking is OP in this game)
-Play Wifi. It aint good for your technical skill but it prevents you from being dumb and making terrible decisions. You can also practice by looking for people's habits in terms of reacting to what you do, and looking for their overall patterns. Also learning the options that you have at EVERY SINGLE moment. Learning what is going to happen if you do X and what your opponent can do when you do X. In addition learning that when you do X theyre either going to do A,B,C,D, ect and that after doing X in reaction to their letter you do A,B,C,D ect. It's a long process that can only be learned by playing friendlies. Play to learn is what friendlies are for :V While Wifi is definitely a viable tool, it brings a great number of giants such as Ally, ADHD, Trevonte, ect.

-Watch Fox videos of other players, and try to point out their mistakes, or why they decided to do that action in that situation and learn from it. From there decide if there were any better options that they could have taken. There are a large number, but learning them is good.

-Besides watching other players, watch replays/recordings of yourself and critique it like it was just another player. At moments where you get punished or get put into a bad situation, think of how you got there, and what you could have done to make sure that doesnt happen again, and what other things you could have done instead that would have lead to a better situation depending on the character.

On that off note of boost pivot grabs, I remembered when I used to be able to practice. I was practicing my boost pivot grabs one day when I kept accidentally doing a downsmash instead of a boost pivot grab. However...It moved a few inches like a stutter stepped forward smash or whatever its called...-hasnt played in over a year- And I was facing the other direction. I found myself able to do it a few more times on accident and it definitely moved forward. I was able to stutter step downsmash, D-tilt, f-tilt and upsmash but ended up facing the other direction. So kinda like a standing pivot grab, but with basically his entire moveset. Anyways...Just something to think about...

Also Fox can go under battle field unassisted, Frigate, and a bunch of other stages actually. His recovery is pretty damn good. You can also practice teching through custom stages by using spikes and a low ceiling.You also dont wanna learn to glide toss with Fox. His glide toss sucks. His JC'd throw is where it's at.

 

[Hanzhou]

I can't punish jack crap on wifi and i need SHTL in some mus which i cant do on wifi either lol.

Fox's DACIT is good for items too imo better.

 

[Jar.]

I'm kind of new to smash, and this guide REALLY helped me. A lot. Thanks Uzi!

 

[Uzima (Uzi)]

wow....
been over a year since any one commented here...
seems the guide has for the most part stopped being helpful..

well, glad i could help the community when i did.

 

[Sarix]

I find your guide useful still for improving my Fox.