Un-Echo your Echo Fighter

[Ardisan]

I want to see how you guys take away the echo side of the echo fighters released in Smash Ultimate so far and make them into a character that is more different than what they are a Echo of. They don't have to be too different but different enough. Like Ness and Lucas or Mario and Dr. Mario for example.

Here is my attempt at one.

:

Movement
Has one extra jump than Pits

Specials

Neutral B: Uncharged to shoot short ranged multi hit projectiles, charged to shoot a far ranged powerful projectile. Can be shot in all directions except directly below him but the you cant adjust the arrow like Pit's.
Up B: Pits Up-B in Brawl but doesnt go as high (Maybe he can shoot projectiles while flying in this Up-B?)
Down B: Reflects only on one side and cant be held. With a Falco/Mario esque damage multiplier.

Aerials

Up-A: Slash quickly upward
F-Air: Brawl Pit F-Air

Everything else is pretty much the same with stat differences.

PS: I don't main Dark Pit so idk if this is even that good.

 

[BronzeGreekGod]

Pit or dark pit - I'd just give one of them pits original moveset from brawl. I'd actually also change both of their side b's to anything else cause that weapon looks so damn stupid (especially dark pits). Whoever designed those things is an idiot. Alternatively I'd love to see project m's pit moveset incorporated, but that's doubtful.

Dark samus - I'd just change her smash attacks to phazon attacks. I'd be fine with that. F smash and up smash could look the same, except she fires out a phazon scatter shot, and down smash would be that phazon tenticle attack where she punches the ground and phazon tenticles come out around her. Alternatively I'd give her similar phazon attacks but as down and side b. And up b could be boost ball instead of screw attack.

Lucina - I'd make her have a completely different moveset lol. I don't know what I'd make her moveset, but she could easily have her own thing going.

I think that's it for echos. I have clones I want decloned (ganondorf and young link for example) but for echos I'm good cause I mostly don't care about them that much.

 

[Arthur97]

Make Lucina's forward smash her critical animation from Awakening. Make her side special a set bow shot (give Chrom a javelin with similar functionality). Make her up special like Aether except with a horizontal descent (better recovery, worse offense). Make her dash attack like her dash stabbing animation from Awakening (good range, slowish start up). Make her neutral air spinning animation like Meta Knight's (something similar with Chrom). Alternatively, make the bow her neutral special and her side special the spinning attack similar to one of the Mii Swordfighter specials. Give her Chrom's Final Smash. And, seriously, give her her idle animation.

Other miscellaneous changes or ones I didn't think of could also be made.

Edit: As for attributes, give her her own damage and not just the average of Marth's. Also give her somewhat faster dash speed and better jumps (have you seen her in Awakening cutscenes). Maybe slow down the walk speed.

 

[Kevandre]

They should have completely different movesets from Marth/Roy. Awakening always has them as more kind of acrobatic and more fencer-based, and Lucina specifically says that she learned her style from her father (Owain also utilizes sword skills that Chrom recognizes as being Ylissian Royalty). I recognize that these characters are only in the game to begin with because it takes less time to implement them, but I think there's a lot of potential there. To be honest, Ike's moveset always made more sense for them than Marth's did. I think she was only Marth'd because she impersonated him in the game (Kind of) and has a more similar build/sword shape.

Chrom combining Ike's with Roys works a lot better, but I think there's a lot more potential here than that.



Should honestly just use the other weapons from Uprising. Pit only uses a few of them and there's just a HUGE amount of variety to choose from, even within weapon subsections. I understood it in Smash 4, but I'd kind of hoped that in the next game he'd be a little more unique. Ah well, can't really complain.


Honestly, I'm mostly fine with the rest of these Echoes. Though if Dixie is confirmed as an Echo, I'll have different things to say...

 

[FirestormNeos]

Neutrals: She now duel-wields two elemental swords that she uses in tandem with acrobatics. Don't ask me why.
Specials: Neutral-B has her rotate between Ice Swords (high knockback, low stun, smash attacks freeze enemies), Fire Swords (high damage, low knockback, smash attacks set enemies on fire), and Lightning Swords (high stun, low damage, smash attacks electrocute enemies). Side-B has Lucina throw an elemental projectile depending on what element she's currently using. Holding Down-B summons Palutena in front of Lucina who blocks all attacks while the button is held (Lucina can't move until you let go). Up-B is a lunge attack that becomes a command grab if it connects with an enemy (think but it can go in any direction).

Yes, it has nothing to do with Fire Emblem. Yes, it doesn't make any sense. I like this moveset anyway.


Appearance: Her dress and Mario Kart outfit are alternate costume, with her base outfit being from Mario Tennis.
Neutrals: Focused around hitting people with a Tennis Racket/Golf Club. Might need to borrow a few moves from , , and .
Smash Attacks: The most I can think of atm is acrobatics. I'll edit this latter when I have something more creative.
Grab: Toad is completely absent. Her pummel is a swift punch in the face (the best reference I can think of is that one clip they kept using in the trailers of that live action Ghost in the Shell movie) rather then Peach's "kick people in the shins" tactic.
Specials: Her Neutral-B now has her kick a soccer ball at people. Her Down-B is replaced with a dice-block that has random effects depending on the number it lands on. Her Up-B is the F.L.U.D.D. sprayed downward, rocketing her in the opposite direction (See also: ).
Final Smash: Chance Time from Mario Party. Guarenteed to screw over the other players in inventive new ways.
Note: Her Side-B, D-air, Throws, and Dash Attack are the only moves that she keeps from Peach.


Neutrals: Uses the claws from Kid Icarus Uprising instead of the bow/blade thingy he and Pit use in Brawl/Smash 4/Ultimate. As a result, Dark Pit's neutrals are changed to be faster, shorter-ranged and more vicious looking then Pit's. His Down-A is changed to a spike where Dark Pit fires his gun downwards.
Smash Attacks: Dark Pit uses the gunstaff from Kid Icarus Uprising. His F-Smash is a shotgun blast in front of him, his D-Smash is him firing at the ground like , and his U-smash is him swinging the staff above him like .
Grabs: Since he now uses the claws, he's going to be using both arms to grab people, with his pummel maybe being a headbutt attack?
Specials: Retains all of his specials except for Neutral-B, whereas gets his Brawl specials back. Dark Pit's Neutral-B is replaced with a special that activates a buff which allows Dark Pit to attack faster for a short period of time.


Movement: Unlike any other fighter in smash, Dark Samus retains its momentum when you jump or stop moving them, similar to how a puck on an air hockey table moves. is given a multi-jump.
Neutrals: limbs rematerialize into giant Phazon weapons that slash and smash at enemies. like an F-air that turns her arm into a giant phazon axe that she swipes at people, or a B-air that turns one of her legs into a phazon hammer that she slams into the enemy behind her.
Grabs: Rather then using a grapple hook, the arm cannon turns into a phazon tentacle with a grabby arm at the end of it.
Specials: Based on her assist trophy moves.

 

[Crystanium]

Without going into all the details . . .


Neutral
Phazon Punch (A, A)
This behaves like a one-two punch, which is different from Samus' left punch to swinging arm cannon.

Dash
Speed Boost (Dash+A)
Dark Samus' dash attack has the same animation as that of Samus' dash. When Dark Samus performs this attack, her body will glow in a manner that indicates she has heavy armor for that duration. This attack is a combo set-up.

Tilts
Aú sem Mão (Up+A)
Dark Samus will do a flip, bringing her left or right leg to an arc depending on the direction she's facing, following up with her other leg to bring a full swing against her opponent. With the recent victory screen of Dark Samus in her trailer, people might recognize this animation.

Side Kick (Forward+A)
Dark Samus' side tilt is a kick like Samus', except Dark Samus delivers a kick sideways relative to her. In doing so, she leans toward her opponent before returning to her original position. This allows for her to maintain a safe distance from her opponent.

Phazon Tentacles (Down+A)
Phazon Tentacles is an ability Dark Samus had in Metroid Prime 2: Echoes, but it appeared as a clear, cylindrical barrier with Phazon energy in MP2:E . In Metroid Prime 3: Corruption (MP3:C), this attack ended up appearing as seen in the .gif. This attack allows Dark Samus to push enemies away if they get too close. It covers a lot of range on both sides, so this is also effective against those who roll a lot.

Smashes
Phazon Spheres (Up+A)
This attack may seem familiar to those who have seen the Dark Samus assist trophy where she releases giant, blue spheres, and that's probably because the attack seen from the assist trophy is based on this particular attack in MP3:C. The animation would appear as it does in MP3:C and be smaller in size. It would retain its homing effect.

Plasma Beam (Forward+A)
Similar to Mega Man's Charge Shot, but with a bit more range, Plasma Beam is a strong smash attack capable of killing. It can be angled diagonally up or down.

Boost Ball (Down+A)
Similar to Sonic's down smash in Super Smash Bros. Brawl and nothing like Jigglypuff's Rollout or Yoshi's Egg Roll, Dark Samus transforms into her morph ball form and dashes back and forth between a short distance. This attack can kill.

Aerials
Radioactive Burst (A)
Dark Samus generates a burst of energy, knocking away any opponent nearby. The hitbox surrounds Dark Samus and is a useful tool for breaking free from combos. It's capable of killing, just like Samus' n-air.

Drill Kick (Up+A)
This attack is the same as Samus' u-air.

Helicopter Kick (Forward+A)
This is a multi-hit attack, which covers a lot of range in the air.

Back Kick (Back+A)
This is pretty much the same as Samus' b-air.

Phazon Burst (Down+A)
Somewhat similar to Samus' d-air, except when Dark Samus uses this attack, she'll fire a burst of Phazon energy, which will propel her upward while spiking her opponent with a meteor smash.

Specials
Neutral
Scatter Shot (B)
Dark Samus fires Phazon bullets, with each bullet producing 1% damage. Uncharged Scatter Shot deals 3% damage, and a fully charged Scatter Shot deals 21% damage. This is consistent with the Dark Samus assist trophy.

Kinetic Phazon Cannon (Up+B)
Dark Samus never showed the ability to use Screw Attack. This is the next best option for her recovery. During this time, Dark Samus would have super armor. If she hits the side of the stage, she would be able to wall-bounce, just like Ness or Lucas. This attack would have the option of being fired in any direction, just like Sheik's Vanish. And if Dark Samus were to use it and hit the ground, she'd create a shock wave.

Super/Phazon Missile (Forward+B)
Dark Samus will shoot a super missile, and when treated as a smash, she'll fire a Phazon missiles. Phazon missiles would freeze the opponent in place.

? (Down+B)
I'm still not certain what I'd make this. Bombs would be nice as a recovery option, but Dark Samus never uses bombs. I thought about having this work as a dark echo, but I'm still not sure about that, either.

Grab
Grab (Z or L/R+A)
Dark Samus wouldn't have a tether grab.

 

[Ardisan]

Should honestly just use the other weapons from Uprising. Pit only uses a few of them and there's just a HUGE amount of variety to choose from, even within weapon subsections. I understood it in Smash 4, but I'd kind of hoped that in the next game he'd be a little more unique. Ah well, can't really complain.

His Dark Pit Staff would obviously be a great weapon for him. I never got why its in his portrait and only his Final Smash since it isn't very final smash like when you use it in Uprising. In uprising the staff has high damage output at long range and quick projectiles but it has weak melee capabilities. In Smash they give him only the Silver Bow and Electroshock but in Kid Icarus Uprising he used a variety of weapons such as the First Blade, EZ Cannon, Violet Palm, Ogre Club, Silver Bow (Which he uses for his moveset instead of Pit's Palutena Bow), and his signature Dark Pit Staff weapon.

Dark Pits default weapon should be his staff which he can also use with his neutral-b as a projectile
secondary for side-b should be Ogre Club (would have picked EZ Cannon but a lot of characters have cannons already)
and his tertiary weapon for his down-b is hard since the weapons above don't fit down-b unless you get really creative so I'd just give him a offensive orbitar like the Gemini Orbitars.
His up-b should remain the same or something like I proposed in my last post.

 

[scoobymcsnack]

Movement
In order to try and capture her athleticism, she would be faster and stronger than Peach. This would be balanced with a faster fall speed and being somewhat lighter.

Specials
Neutral B: "Petal Power" - Instead of pulling out a Toad, Daisy creates a giant daisy that releases pollen rather than spores.
Side B: "Homerun" - Daisy throws a baseball in the air and hits it with incredible force. It would not do much knockback, but would do good damage. The damage would be higher the closer the person is, and the highest damage would be delt by directly hitting someone with the bat.
Up B: "Serve" - Daisy would jump high in the air, and then swing her tennis racket. This would do great knockback with minor damage.
Down B: Keep it somewhat the same, but instead she pulls different balls out of a bag. A basket ball goes far and bounces high, but doesn't do much damage or knock back. A bowling ball barely goes anywhere but does lots of knockback. A golf ball goes far and does decent damage, but does no knock back.

Everything else would be the same as Peach with some different animations to better fit Daisy's personality.

 

[smashingDoug]

He goes back to the fun style brawl Pit. Good enough? Yep good enough no more Dark pit talk

 

[FirestormNeos]

He goes back to the fun style brawl Pit. Good enough? Yep good enough no more Dark pit talk

okay cool but can regular Pit have his Side-B, then?

 

[smashingDoug]

okay cool but can regular Pit have his Side-B, then?

electroshock just like Flare Blitz should go away and never be seen again

 

[Golden Icarus]

I would’ve loved to see Dark Samus have Phazon attacks for her special moves. Similar to what she used as an assist trophy. Aside from that, her normals being the same as Samus is good.

Chrom using a lance somewhere would be cool. Either as a forward smash, a grab, a throw, something. Maybe do the same with Lucina, too.

I wish Daisy just had a different neutral B and grab. Like just remove all of the Toad stuff, and replace it with something unique. I just feel like her using Toad in her attacks doesn’t quite fit.

Honestly, the echo concept is probably my least favorite part of Ultimate so far. Like I’m cool with shoving clones into the game to make fans happy and expand the roster. I’ve always been down for some clones, whether they’re re as similar as Dr. Mario, or as fleshed out as Wolf. I just don’t like the echo fighter brand. It makes things confusing, and makes the echo fighters we have sort of feel like discount characters. That’s just me though.

 

[smashingDoug]

Golden Icarus Give Chrom, Corrin’s side B and make it a Lance.

Someone should try and mod this in the game

 

[PeridotGX]

I'm gonna do Octoling because I don't care much about the current echoes.

Neutral B: Splat Dualies. It's simmilar to the Inkling's Splattershot, except you can do rolls out of it to move. To counter the added movement options, the attack power is lessened.

Side B: Splat Brella. Instead of walking forward with a Splat Roller, the Octoling shoots a Brella forward. It's a Multi-Hit attack, but doesn't bury like the Inkling's Roller. Good edge guarding tool.

Down B: Curling Bomb. The Octoling throws forward a Curling Bomb. It moves forwards at a constant speed and doesn't explode until it hits an opponent, but it has a smaller blast radius.

FS: Sting Ray. It's like the Inkling's FS, but it swaps out a larger blast radius for more damage and the ability to angle it.

 

[Deleted member]

I'd just make Richter's Holy Water flame move forward like it does in his playable appearances throughout the Castlevania series.

 

[Sabertooth]

I'd like to get Funky Kong as an echo and then replace all of DK's moves with surfboard stuff. His final smash has him teaming up with Alolan Raichu and bringing down a tsunami.