Q&A U WOT M8 - Shulk Q&A (READ THIS MESSAGE: PLEASE READ BEFORE MAKING A THREAD)

[Hokori]

Can't figure out the secrets of the Monado's power? Need a new prescription to get your Visions right? Winning doesn't seem like a piece of cake? This just might be the place for you! If you have any questions about Shulk in Smash 4, feel free to ask them here, and fellow Shulk players will be around to assist you.

---

Q: Buster's knockback reduction makes it easier to combo, right?
A: No. The knockback reduction also affects the hitsun which kind of hinders Shulk's combo potential in buster art. This might not be a problem if you're fighting a lightweight or if the opponent's health is at ~50%+

Q: Does Monado speed also increase your attack speed?
A: No. Monado Speed increases ground speed, air speed & traction. It also decreases jump height & his damage by 20%

Q: Does Monado jump increase your recovery, air speed and falling speed?
A: Yes. Shulk's overall recovery improves immensely. W/o customs, Jump Shulk's short hop & full hop jump the highest & his doublejump rivals Mewtwo's & Yoshi's doublejump. His air speed becomes the fastest in the game w/o customs. His fall speed is also significantly increased to match around Falco's fall speed, & the vertical height to both hits of Air Slash are greatly improved too.

Q: Does Vision countering get harder each time you use it?
A: The counter frame window shortens after each successive use. Otherwise, your Vision refreshes after dying.

Q: Can you quickly switch out of a currently used Monado Art
A: Yes, you can even switch Arts even during hitstun, but once you deactivate that Art it'll go on cooldown

Q: How long is the duration & cooldown for Monado arts, Decisive arts, & Hyper arts?
A: Monado arts last for exactly 16 seconds (960 frames) & about 10 seconds of cooldown
Decisive arts last for exactly 20 seconds (1200 frames) & about 5 seconds of cooldown
Hyper arts last for exactly 6 seconds (360 frames) & about 15 seconds of cooldown

Q: Is back slash actually useful for something?
A: Actually. . .yes, yes it is. The recent 1.1.0 patch buffed Back Slash, so now the move's startup being Frame 22 instead of the old Frame 31 allows it to be a better mix-up punish option especially used for ledge reads & cross-ups.

Q: Where is the monado's sweetspot?
A: It's kinda complicated but for the most part, the Blade is Shulk's dominant sweetspot in the majority of his attacks, though there are a few exceptions to this. The Blade as a term itself is used to describe the red monado sword Shulk swings around. If you want to find out more about Shulk's sweetspots, check the info in this original post

Q: Can Shulk perform combos
A: It's possible but he's not primarily a combo character. He's more of a mid-range character. With jump, speed, and buster art, he can perform combos

Q: Does timing your counter affect the variation used?
A: No. You can use the second variation (aka: the stronger one) by simply moving the circle pad forward

Q: Does Shulk's counter scale with the countered attack's damage?
A: Yes. Something important to note is when countering a move that deals high enough damage to become Vision's damage, the damage won't change if you use the Forwarded variation. Though, the Forwarded variation definitely deals more knockback growth.

Q: How do you deactivate an art?
A: Press the special button 3 consecutive times or hold the special button for 1 second. However, deactivating the art by holding it means you must only hold that button & perform nothing else. This makes you very limited & so it's best to just press 3 times.

Q: How do you perform the stronger variation of Vision counter?
A: Hold your direction towards the direction Shulk is facing during the counter window.

Q: What are some good moves to use for starting the buffered art's deactivation?
A: Generally you cannot deactivate an art during a lot of things seen here, but good moves include:

• Dtilt
• Throw preferably Dthrow
• Ledgejump
• shield drop

Q: How do you use Monado arts?
A: Go to this thread

Q: I need help with the match ups.... Any tips?
A: Go to this thread

Q: Can Little Mac's KO punch be countered?
A: No. The aerial version can be countered but not the grounded version

Q: Does Monado Jump affect your weight?
A: No. The Jump arts do not affect Shulk's weight. On one hand, the Jump arts add extra knockback taken due to the increased damage received. On the other hand, the Jump arts also increase Shulk's fall speed which helps resist against vertical knockback, but this also causes Shulk to be prone to being juggled in the air by aerial combos

Q: Is Monado Speed's damage output really severe?
A: No. It sounds bad at first. 20% damage decrease seems to be horrible, but with all the mobility you get, it's not that bad. Also, the damage decrease isn't that bad because the damage output is comparable to pre 1.04 Vanilla Shulk. Although that isn't saying much about its damage output

Q: Is Monado Buster risky?
A: No. Increased damage output means that your attacks have much more shield pressure. In addition to that, the lowered knockback allows you to apply more pressure on the opponent. The damage increase of buster is amazing (+40%) while its defense reduction (-13%) is nothing compared to the potential reward you can gain from using the art

Q: How risky is Monado Smash?
A: Yes. Using Smash at neutral is almost impossible and not advisable due to your decreased damage output. Your attacks are extremely unsafe on shield. Smash art is an extremely situational art only used for KO'ing if you can. You need to put the opponent at a positional disadvantage or you need to switch to Smash precisely once you string into an f-tilt or f-smash to actually utilize Smash art safely

Q: Does the Decisive arts have the same drawbacks like the Monado arts?
A: Mostly yes
Decisive Jump & Monado Jump take the same amount of knockback.
Decisive Speed & Monado Speed deal the same damage.
Decisive Shield & Monado Shield deal the same damage, jump height, ground speed, & air speed.
Decisive Buster & Monado Buster take the same amount of knockback & deal the same amount of knockback.
Decisive Smash & Monado Smash deal the same damage & take the same amount of knockback.
However, Decisive Speed does have a lower jump height stat than Monado Speed

Q: What part of the tier list is Shulk in?
A: No

Q: Does n-air auto-cancel
A: No

Q: Does Shulk have any aerials that auto-cancel from SH?
A: Lol no

Q: Is this the Q&A thread?
A: nope

 

[Berserker.]

Dat thread title

Anyway, for any Monado art related questions, all data can be found here: http://smashboards.com/threads/shulk-monado-data-thread.368429/

 

[Masonomace]

Oh hey it's a new Q&A~ I haven't seen much usage of 's Vision counter in any matches but:

Question: What're the improvements & setbacks of Vision during the Jump Art, Speed Art, & Shield Art?

I was aware of his Vision counter's result when using the Buster Art & Smash Art thanks to any past questions I had, that @ Berserker. answered for me.

 

[Berserker.]

Oh hey it's a new Q&A~ I haven't seen much usage of 's Vision counter in any matches but:

Question: What're the improvements & setbacks of Vision during the Jump Art, Speed Art, & Shield Art?

I was aware of his Vision counter's result when using the Buster Art & Smash Art thanks to any past questions I had, that @ Berserker. answered for me.

Refer to the post below

Also, I don't think it gets any improvements with Jump. Jump doesn't increase knockback or damage

Basically...

翔 (Jump)
+/- No knockback boost
+/- No damage boost

疾 (Speed) and 盾 (Shield)
+/- No knockback boost (Maybe a negligible reduction but barely any difference)
- Damage reduced

斬 (Buster)
+ Damage boost
- Knockback reduced

撃 (Smash)
+ Knockback boost
- Damage reduced

Edit: I don't think counter is something to be spammed but that's really obvious, yet again. It's best used when you're being edgeguarded or when someone throws out a projectile and you're reasonably close enough to the opponent

Refer to this post

 

[KuroganeHammer]

HELLO. This sounds like something for meeeeeeee!

Basically counter works like this (theory! But I'm pretty sure it's right!):

>Use Counter (which has intangibility frames btw!)
>Countered attack damage multiplied by 1.3x
>If the multiplied damage is less than the base damage of the hitbox, deal base damage instead (7%/10%, 13% on forward counter)
>Multiply this damage by the damage multiplier of the monado art you're using

IT'S IMPORTANT TO NOTE, I don't think the damage increase to Shulk multipliers affect this.

 

[Masonomace]

Additionally, I think Vision counter's knockback (Not damage, I'm not too sure about damage) scales with the countered attack's damage

Also, I don't think it gets any improvements with Jump. Jump doesn't increase knockback or damage

Basically...

翔 (Jump)
+/- No knockback boost
+/- No damage boost

疾 (Speed) and 盾 (Shield)
+/- No knockback boost
- Damage reduced

斬 (Buster)
+ Damage boost
- Knockback reduced

撃 (Smash)
+ Knockback boost
- Damage reduced

Edit: I don't think counter is something to be spammed but that's really obvious, yet again. It's best used when you're being edgeguarded or when someone throws out a projectile and you're reasonably close enough to the opponent

Yeah I think so too. Perhaps there is a hidden improvement an Art does for Vision, not necessarily it being only Knock-back or damage, but maybe the trajectory / direction? Why I say that, is because out of all the Visions I've seen countering attacks, I've never seen Vision send someone flying this way: http://youtu.be/P1-JepaBdzg?t=28m36s
Bowser throws a Fair, & Shulk currently on the Jump Art, he counters & launches him in a very high trajectory, much more than the others down below. What I think is the case for Jump's Vision proc, is it sends them in that trajectory for the sole reason to follow up only the Jump Art can do, if you chose to do so. Jump Art grants better Jumping capabilities & more smooth mobility, so perhaps it would be wise to follow up the counter & be aggressive.

http://youtu.be/P1-JepaBdzg?t=5m14s = Shoutouts to 26% punish damage. You rock Buster Art, & because Knock-back is reduced yet countering a huge powerful attack like Timber, the knock-back was just enough to prevent a punish, and enough damage % from Buster's boost improvement.

http://youtu.be/P1-JepaBdzg?t=10m21 = Meh 8% damage here, didn't really notice anything out of the ordinary for Shulk, other than maybe the freeze frame moment affecting the other Shulk, but that seems to be a shared mechanic by Vision in general.

I haven't seen a Speed Art Vision counter proc yet, but I'm hoping it miraculously launches them quickly doing little damage, basically a quick punish counter that would make sense with the Art's setback of reduced damage.

Finishing up with more Questions:
Which Art was Shulk using during his first Vision counter in the trailer? http://youtu.be/ZUTU4OZrjzY?t=1m34s
Which Art was Shulk using during his second Vision counter in the trailer? http://youtu.be/ZUTU4OZrjzY?t=1m38s

Edit: Counters should not be spammed, but imo I feel they should be utilized more this time around for Smash. Shield-breaking moves are occurring much more, & the unnecessary broken shields can be avoided with a good used Vision. Using Vision off-stage during edgeguarding is a decent option but mis-timed, unless Shulk has Jump Art on, & retained his Double Jump, will never make it back. Hoping that's not the case.

 

[Berserker.]

HELLO. This sounds like something for meeeeeeee!

Basically counter works like this (theory! But I'm pretty sure it's right!):

>Use Counter (which has intangibility frames btw!)
>Countered attack damage multiplied by 1.3x
>If the multiplied damage is less than the base damage of the hitbox, deal base damage instead (7%/10%, 13% on forward counter)
>Multiply this damage by the damage multiplier of the monado art you're using

IT'S IMPORTANT TO NOTE, I don't think the damage increase to Shulk multipliers affect this.

Whelp. My guess was wrong. Hm.... Weird... Were there any changes with knockback or anything? Thanks though again for the explanation

Yeah I think so too. Perhaps there is a hidden improvement an Art does for Vision, not necessarily it being only Knock-back or damage, but maybe the trajectory / direction? Why I say that, is because out of all the Visions I've seen countering attacks, I've never seen Vision send someone flying this way: http://youtu.be/P1-JepaBdzg?t=28m36s
Bowser throws a Fair, & Shulk currently on the Jump Art, he counters & launches him in a very high trajectory, much more than the others down below. What I think is the case for Jump's Vision proc, is it sends them in that trajectory for the sole reason to follow up only the Jump Art can do, if you chose to do so. Jump Art grants better Jumping capabilities & more smooth mobility, so perhaps it would be wise to follow up the counter & be aggressive.

http://youtu.be/P1-JepaBdzg?t=5m14s = Shoutouts to 26% punish damage. You rock Buster Art, & because Knock-back is reduced yet countering a huge powerful attack like Timber, the knock-back was just enough to prevent a punish, yet enough damage % from Buster's boost improvement.

http://youtu.be/P1-JepaBdzg?t=10m21 = Meh 8% damage here, didn't really notice anything out of the ordinary for Shulk, other than maybe the freeze frame moment affecting the other Shulk, yet that seems to be a shared mechanic by Vision in general.

I haven't seen a Speed Art Vision counter proc yet, but I'm hoping it miraculously launches them quickly doing little damage, basically a quick punish counter that would make sense with the Art's setback of reduced damage.

Finishing up with more Questions:
Which Art was Shulk using during his first Vision counter in the trailer? http://youtu.be/ZUTU4OZrjzY?t=1m34s
Which Art was Shulk using during his second Vision counter in the trailer? http://youtu.be/ZUTU4OZrjzY?t=1m38s

Edit: Counters should not be spammed, but imo I feel they should be utilized more this time around for Smash. Shield-breaking moves are occurring much more, & the unnecessary broken shields can be avoided with a good used Vision. Using Vision off-stage during edgeguarding is a decent option but mis-timed, unless Shulk has Jump Art on, & retained his Double Jump, will never make it back. Hoping that's not the case.

Interesting find.....

Oh and

Finishing up with more Questions:
Which Art was Shulk using during his first Vision counter in the trailer? http://youtu.be/ZUTU4OZrjzY?t=1m34s
Which Art was Shulk using during his second Vision counter in the trailer? http://youtu.be/ZUTU4OZrjzY?t=1m38s

First one probably had no movement on the control stick

Second one probably was the one where you move the stick left or right

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Regarding Counter and stances: Buster has reduced KB, Smash has increased KB. You weren't really wrong tbh.

Also technically Speed and Shield have less KB because the damage % a move does is part of the KB formula.

I'm sorry if this is confusing to you guys.

I've updated this: http://smashboards.com/threads/shulk-monado-data-thread.368429/ with Vision

 

[Berserker.]

because the damage % a move does is part of the KB formula.

That very line clears up the confusion

Thanks again, Aero :D

 

[Rakurai]

It definitely scales its damage and knockback based on the strength of the attack being countered, as this clip of him KOing Villager at 24% shows: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-_Tv3KLTD4&t=1m36s

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Actually, the BKB and KBG I theorize is the same among all stances except for Buster and Smash.

That makes the prime decider of KB percent related (aka a counter attack that does 20% will do more knockback than a counter attack that does 10%)

 

[Rakurai]

When exactly are Vision's intangibility frames?

Having a counter that you can't get grabbed out of would be nice.

 

[Berserker.]

@ Masonomace

Finishing up with more Questions:
Which Art was Shulk using during his first Vision counter in the trailer? http://youtu.be/ZUTU4OZrjzY?t=1m34s
Which Art was Shulk using during his second Vision counter in the trailer? http://youtu.be/ZUTU4OZrjzY?t=1m38s

First one probably had no movement on the control stick

Second one probably was the one where you move the stick left or right

Timing does not affect the counter. My bad

Edit:

So, this is how it's looking like when you start a match. The art you start with...

Shield if it's a heavy hitting type to be safe
Speed against stage controlling characters, characters that are too fast or campers
If it's not a heavy hitter, camper or ultra fast, buster

 

[~ Gheb ~]

>If the multiplied damage is less than the base damage of the hitbox[...]

How is this even possible? o_O

 

[KuroganeHammer]

How is this even possible? o_O

Counter a weak attack like Falco 2%.

2% x 1.3 = 2.6%

2.6% is under all the base damages of 7/10 or 13% so it scales it up to those.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Oh, you meant by the hitbox of Shulk's counter attack then. I thought you were talking about the opponent's attacking hitbox.

 

[Masonomace]

Briefing: Practically half of Shulk's moves have a start-up with initial damage by the blade itself, following up with the beam portion coming right after being a two-hit move. Examples are USmash FSmash Uair Uthrow Bthrow etc. etc.

Questions:
Does Vanilla 's FullHop D-air option reach by hitting any characters from below the beam portion, or maybe the blade portion hits??

EDIT:
Does Jump 's ShortHop D-air option make contact with most, if not all of the Smash cast??
If so, I'd like a bonus answer of whether the beam portion only would hit, or rather both the blade & beam portion.
EDIT: Does 's Monado blade portion deal more % damage on his tilts, rather than the beam portion???
Answer: yes

 

[Ralph Cecil]

Can anyone tell me how long your counter is active? I've tried the waiting it out/charging smashes approach to it, but it always gets countered anyway lol. If I can find out that it's active longer than most counters i'll know to just wait longer.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Can anyone tell me how long your counter is active? I've tried the waiting it out/charging smashes approach to it, but it always gets countered anyway lol. If I can find out that it's active longer than most counters i'll know to just wait longer.

it's been hardly a week and counter frames are easily some of the hardest data to get along with reflect frames.

so

 

[Berserker.]

Does 's Monado blade portion deal more % damage on his tilts, rather than the beam portion???

Can't really answer your first question that well but I can answer this one because you already know the answer

Yes

 

[Ralph Cecil]

Snap kk D: Just checking for the off chance lol.

 

[Masonomace]

Can anyone tell me how long your counter is active? I've tried the waiting it out/charging smashes approach to it, but it always gets countered anyway lol. If I can find out that it's active longer than most counters i'll know to just wait longer.

I don't have the direct answer, but I have an indirect answer. Sorry if you already knew this: Shulk's Vision counter window becomes smaller the more times it is used in succession.
http://youtu.be/QlzYvktDgIQ?t=2m30s
The moment he repeatedly uses Vision, the counter frames keep appearing unchanged, but as soon as he procs the counter once at 2:37, he tries doing it again at 2:39 & the counter window looks heavily shortened. I'm not entirely sure if Vision's counter window gradually increases again after a set period of time goes by not using it in succession, but hoped that helped.

 

[Ralph Cecil]

Not quite what I was looking for, but still some useful information to be on the lookout for lol. ^_^

 

[Masonomace]

Question: Is Shulk's beam portion of the Monado an Energy-based attack?

I'm wondering because the thought of Ness' PSI Magnet somehow absorbing it sounds really dumb in Singles. Awesome for Doubles though.

EDIT-in bonus question: Would 盾 Shield happen to increase Shulk's basic defense gameplay in any way?

Mainly I'm curious whether 盾 Shield increases Shulk's bubble shield strength or not.

EDIT#2 bonus question: Has anyone noticed Shulk turning around to counter an attack proc'd from behind? The alternative if not would be B-reversing Vision right before landing.
EDIT: Answer : yes I saw it done in a video sorry for asking this.

 

[Berserker.]

Question: Is Shulk's beam portion of the Monado an Energy-based attack?

I'm wondering because the thought of Ness' PSI Magnet somehow absorbing it sounds really dumb in Singles. Awesome for Doubles though.

EDIT-in bonus question: Would 盾 Shield happen to increase Shulk's basic defense gameplay in any way?

Mainly I'm curious whether 盾 Shield increases Shulk's bubble shield strength or not.

EDIT#2 bonus question: Has anyone noticed Shulk turning around to counter an attack proc'd from behind? The alternative if not would be B-reversing Vision right before landing.
EDIT: Answer : yes I saw it done in a video sorry for asking this.

1.) IIRC, Ness' PSI magnet only absorbs energy based projectiles. I'm not sure if Shulk's beam portion is considered as Energy-based but I don't think it can be absorbed

Bonus question: Probably not

Well, this was a late response

 

[Masonomace]

1.) IIRC, Ness' PSI magnet only absorbs energy based projectiles. I'm not sure if Shulk's beam portion is considered as Energy-based but I don't think it can be absorbed

Bonus question: Probably not

Well, this was a late response

Spoiler: this is a big response & doesn't need to take up space

True, Ness' PSI Magnet only absorbs certain projectiles being energy-based or elemental-based like Flame or Electric-types of attacks. Shulk's blade-portioned attacks are without a doubt physical, yet Shulk's Monado attacks using the beam portion is what I cogitate over being true or not. Some beam-like attacks that were either Energy-based or Battering like Beam Sword were absorb-able by Ness' PSI Magnet & some were not, although it was able to absorb Lucario's close range aura flame. Shulk's beam-portioned attacks aren't exactly like Lucario's Force Palm flame, but as long as the possibility is likely & not out there, I'm willing to expect Shulk's long-ranged attacks being the beam portion having the chance they're absorb-able.

That spoiler is coming from optimism, foolhardy expectations, & no information regarding to it. I personally don't believe Shulk's beam-portioned attacks of the Monado are absorb-able by Ness' PSI Magnet either, & believe they're still physical-based attacks. BUT in the slim chance they are, then the Team Battle Duo idea of + is plausible & effective for us & the VS MU will be tricky . If not, then the trade-off is my Team Battle idea of them being together wont have as much synergy or Ness unable to absorb Shulk's beam-portion attacks.

I appreciate your replied answer for my bonus question, but the particular bulletin, whether it's true or not being from a wiki site, it helps me believe that the Monado Art Shield mode shield's strength may get more powerful. Source is here: (search with Ctrl+F)

Shulk: Monado Arts – In Shield mode, the power of your shield is boosted but you can't move as fast, jump as high, or deal as much damage.

And thanks for the responses. Thanks for Answering~

 

[OnFullTilt]

I keep seeing people mention "extreme" monado arts- I haven't seen it explained anywhere though (unless I'm very oblivious). Does Shulk maintain some vestiges of a stance after it has officially worn off? If so is the extreme stance what he is in during the time that he is glowing?

 

[Berserker.]

I keep seeing people mention "extreme" monado arts- I haven't seen it explained anywhere though (unless I'm very oblivious). Does Shulk maintain some vestiges of a stance after it has officially worn off? If so is the extreme stance what he is in during the time that he is glowing?

Extreme Monado arts is a custom special for Shulk's neutral special

It drastically increases both buffs and debuffs of all types of arts, and also reduces all Monado arts' up time

 

[ksizl4life]

Very interested in this character but having trouble figuring something out the Monado Arts(info that wasn't depicted in the other thread)

To cancel your current Monado Art, you press B 3 times and the the gray symbol will flash.

1. Once that is cancelled, how long does it take for it to regenerate?

2. Does regeneration differ when it's self cancelled as opposed to letting it run out?

3. Does taking damage or being hurt reduce the timer of the art?

and also just to be sure:

if I change into something i didn't mean to, like normally to change arts I just press B 3 times to cancel it but if I want to do instantly after I just changed into an art, I can buffer the inputs even if my art symbol isn't on screen(during Shulks stance change pose). I'll be pressing B 3 times(timing the 3rd button press for when the pose is over, though the window seems quite large) and the art will be cancelled.

Am I on the right track? Thanks! Will frequent this board a lot more.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Very interested in this character but having trouble figuring something out the Monado Arts(info that wasn't depicted in the other thread)

To cancel your current Monado Art, you press B 3 times and the the gray symbol will flash.

1. Once that is cancelled, how long does it take for it to regenerate?

2. Does regeneration differ when it's self cancelled as opposed to letting it run out?

3. Does taking damage or being hurt reduce the timer of the art?

and also just to be sure:

if I change into something i didn't mean to, like normally to change arts I just press B 3 times to cancel it but if I want to do instantly after I just changed into an art, I can buffer the inputs even if my art symbol isn't on screen(during Shulks stance change pose). I'll be pressing B 3 times(timing the 3rd button press for when the pose is over, though the window seems quite large) and the art will be cancelled.

Am I on the right track? Thanks! Will frequent this board a lot more.

regeneration is the same whether it's cancelled or runs out

taking damage doesnt reduce the timer

 

[ksizl4life]

regeneration is the same whether it's cancelled or runs out

taking damage doesnt reduce the timer

Okay. And is cooldown duration always around 8 seconds?

 

[Berserker.]

Okay. And is cooldown duration always around 8 seconds?

We're not so sure about how long Monado art's internal cooldown is

Which reminds me, someone should try testing it

 

[KuroganeHammer]

jump art lasted from 2 min to 1:43 (roughly 17 seconds)
and came off CD about 1:32, or 1:33

speed is the same

cbf testing the others, they're probably the same as well

 

[KassandraNova]

So one thing I've been wondering is if short hop Nair autocancels and can be followed up with jab everytime the nair hits, or if a short hop nair on shield gives enough time for you to follow up with a grab?? I've done a short hop nair into jab, but sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.
I feel like sometimes it looks like nair autocancels and other times I lag a ton after wards. I think it autocancels and maybe just sometimes I'm not short hopping or something? But I want someone with the game to confirm that these follow up options are viable.

 

[Berserker.]

So one thing I've been wondering is if short hop Nair autocancels and can be followed up with jab everytime the nair hits, or if a short hop nair on shield gives enough time for you to follow up with a grab?? I've done a short hop nair into jab, but sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.
I feel like sometimes it looks like nair autocancels and other times I lag a ton after wards. I think it autocancels and maybe just sometimes I'm not short hopping or something? But I want someone with the game to confirm that these follow up options are viable.

I think this segment of this video answers your question

I'm not sure of what @Jellyfishn is inputting here. It looks like he's cancelling n-air's landing with another move

He cancelled into jab combo for the first n-air

Then cancelled into grab for the second n-air

Then he cancelled into shield for the third n-air

 

[Masonomace]

I have one question, & I sort of have my own insight on the answer, but I really want to know what you guys think about it.

http://youtu.be/qUy2BEtszlQ?t=5m6s

How would one explain what just went on @ 5:07?

Because the only explanation I can give for it, is Shulk has a backward hit-box on his Monado when swinging it overhead. Also apparently the Glass circle is the sweet-spot of Enduring Back Slash.

 

[Rakurai]

Pretty sure that was just the game being wacky and thinking that Shulk hit Mario from behind.

Mario's stagger animation suggests as much, anyways.

 

[Berserker.]

Pretty sure that was just the game being wacky and thinking that Shulk hit Mario from behind.

Mario's stagger animation suggests as much, anyways.

I think it's more of the weird hitbox of back slash rather than the game messing up. I've seen it happen at some streams and videos but that may be either because back slash has a weird hitbox or my eyes are betraying me (which is possible also)

 

[Masonomace]

@ R Rakurai & @ Berserker.
I actually found a way to explain it thoroughly. What happened exactly was due to Shulk having a hit-box right as he's swinging the Monado behind from behind. I believe the first active-frame hit-box EBS starts on is what I have circled in red in that picture below:

So if we were to hit someone with that portion of the Monado hit-box airborne, we'd land a hit & deal % damage to them. The new question is:

Why does it deal 15% to Mario if Shulk's back is turned to Mario's back? their both facing away from each other so how is this possible?

Answer: Shulk's EBS is the most particularly situational move he has so far up to date.

Explanation: Shulk's EBS appears to have Mario's cape mechanic including his default Back-turned % damage increase element. I'm gonna show you screenshots I took of it all happening bit-by-bit.
The chronological order in which it all happens is:

1. Cape mechanic effect
2. % damage dealing to Mario
3. Hit-stun
4. Knock-back
5. Fin~

Spoiler: See this if you want visual pictures & explanations

Above we see Mario's Nair connecting with Shulk's EBS animation of lunging mid-air. the EBS takes the hit with Super Armor.

Now Mario's Nair emits a visual effect likely to be the move connecting & starting the hit-stun. Anything after the Nair would most likely be the sex-kick properties staying out. Again, Shulk's Super Armor granted by EBS gives none.

Now this time frames later, Mario's hurt-box is literally inside of Shulk's hurt-box, while Shulk's Monado doesn't have a active hit-box yet. His Monado happens to also be completely behind him while still lunging with EBS. Those visual effects express the knock-back happening here, but again, EBS's Super Armor ignores everything.

This is literally what happens as quick as I could with slamming my spacebar for pausing at 0.25 speed. But here's the interesting portion! Shulk's EBS airborne at that on-hit apparently has Mario Cape properties! It's undeniable when you see Mario's entire motion & direction face the opposite still using Nair due to it's sex-kick element staying out longer. The oval yellow out-line is showing that yellow glow around Mario & the Monado, probably being the "Cape proc", not sure what the yellow flare visual effect is for (Arrow hinting bro), but the high-lighted light red is the Monado finally active & out. So at that moment, EBS airborne capes you.

Spamming Spacebar, I get capture this moment, where the move is now doing % damage with the jagged appearing 19%, 15% being dealt to Mario's current 4%. As odd as it may look, it's natural for Mario to be facing left after being dealt % damage, as proving the Monado's hit-box starts overhead & is shown with the light-red high-lighting to be the general area of where the EBS airborne hits. It even further proves that around the starting portion the Monado is the Blade portion more-less, which is hitting Mario's back first, which is why it deals 15% in mid-air. Answer stops here, the rest is for fun.

Still in hit-stun it looks like since Shulk is moving forward while Mario isn't going anywhere, hence hit-stun. This is where EBS starts to lunge farther horizontal distance.

Spammed that spacebar so quick I got this. The cutting slash crescent visual effect foretells perhaps that is the general launching direction Mario would go. Regardless it looks cool.

Here I'm just showing the general area of the EBS's hit-box with the red high-lighting. The red that I didn't high-light is also a hit-box I'm assuming.

Jeez Mario, why don't you just stay in hit-stun forever. Nothing really happening too different, except Shulk is slowly moving while Mario isn't due to being in hit-stun. The area Mario's hit from is the trailing slashing red visual effect given off from the Monado swung during the EBS animation, apparently. Nothing else to really show because it would get too deep into other details of other topics. And I'ev done enough for a one question getting answered. Sorry but thank you for reading.

What happens right after the last picture. The outside red high-lighted line seems to be the very tipped hit-box of the EBS, the white arrow possibly being his 2nd best tipped hit-box & anything past that is the blunt blade portion of the move. Idk at this point.

For show. The greencircle near the ground is the very tipped hit that I'mg uessing it is. Look closely & you'll see a green triangle showing basically what the 2nd tipper hit-box could be, & the the rest being the blunt blade portion of the attack. It's peculation as Idk the hit-bubbles of Shulk's attacks let alone this one move in every frame-by-frame action.

This is something I made from something extra I did for the Q&A thread.

So, what do you guys think?

 

[Berserker.]

That was a very interesting read. Kudos Masonomace

Oh, here's a good QA for the OP @ Hokori

Q: Buster's knockback reduction makes it easier to combo, right?
A: No. If anything, it made it much harder. The knockback reduction also affects the hitsun which really hurts Shulk's combo potential. This might not be a problem if you're fighting a lightweight or if the opponent's health is at ~50%+

Q: Does Monado speed increase your attack speed also?
A: No, it doesn't. It increases Shulk's ground speed. It also weakens his damage by around 28%

Q: Does Monado jump increase your recovery, air speed and falling speed?
A: For recovery and air speed, yes it does. For falling speed? Well with extreme monado arts, it seems like Shulk falls incredibly fast so it's safe to assume that with normal monado arts, your falling speed is probably increased. Maybe by a slight bit. This answer will be updated once it's confirmed but for now, this is just an assumption

Q: Does vision countering get harder each time you use it
A: Based on what Sakurai said, yes. The counter window becomes shorter

Q: Can you quickly switch out of your currently used Monado arts
A: Yes, but once you do that, it's put on cooldown

Q: How long do Monado arts last?
A: Approximately 17 seconds

Q: How long is its cooldown?
A: I haven't seen an exact value for it.... Someone help

Q: Is back slash actually useful for something?
A: It's more on the situational side but it actually has its uses. Mostly, it's a decent-good option for closing gaps and it's great for punishing from a distance. Its range is tremendous and even if you don't sweetspot it or land it on the rear of your opponent, it deals good damage

Q: What are Shulk's custom specials
A: For his neutral special, you have decisive monado arts (Monado arts last much longer but you can't switch out of them) and extreme monado arts (Monado arts last for a shorter duration and all buffs and debuffs are multiplied). For his side special, you got jumping back slash (Shulk jumps higher while back slashing) and enduring back slash (Shulk has super armor while back slashing). For his downward special, you got dash vision (Shulk dashes forward when his counter is triggered) and powerful vision (Deals more damage). For his upward special, you have Forward air slash (His 2nd slash sends him forward) and Strong air slash (Deals more damage but the second slash doesn't really help in terms of recovering)

Q: What's the monado's sweetspot?
A: The base of his monado. Not the tip

Q: Can Shulk perform combos
A: It's possible but he's not primarily a combo character. He's more of a defensive character

Q: Does timing your counter affect the variation used?
A: No. You can use the second variation (aka: the stronger one) by simply moving the circle pad forward

Q: Can I see some numbers regarding Shulk's monado arts?
A: Sure, why not?

Q: Does Shulk's counter scale with the countered attack's damage?
A: Yes. The multiplier is at 1.3x



Feel free to add more and to correct this