Trying to learn DI

[MrWeavile]

So I've been practising at Melee more than I ever have before, learning all of the technical stuff I didn't know about way back when. The subject of "DI" still confuses me somewhat.

I get the general idea of it; You can influence the trajectory at which you are hit. But there are some things I don't understand about it, and for that reason I'm having trouble learning exactly when to do it and when I have done it.
Every time I literally try to point the stick in a 90 degree angle from where I've been hit, I don't see any real change. I feel as though any time I actually do DI, I do it completely by accident.

Is it literally learning each and every character's moves and knowing when you see them coming to DI in advance? After playing a load of matches against CPU, I can see directly when he DI's (like out of a Marth f-grab chain) but I can't see any difference when I do it against a move.

So there are some things I'd like to know:
1) When exactly is the optimal time to DI (i.e. when being flown through the air or literally before you get hit)?
2) What exactly are the angles it works at? I've made an example below, and I'd like to know if this triggers DI or not.
So let's say a move hits me at a 9 angle, and I DI at a 7 angle on the stick. Will this work with DI? I can't see any difference when I try it.
3) What are the times you should DI?
4) Does DI work at all when being flown through the air AFTER you've been hit by an attack?
I was playing against a proper competitive player who could literally call out when DI happens between the both of us, and frankly I couldn't tell.
5) Is the timing and physics of DI at all like crouch cancelling? Or is that a completely different thing?

I know this may be somewhat of a bloated post, but it's been bugging me for a while now and no description I've read of the mechanic has helped me understand it more than the general concept of it.

All help greatly appreciated.

 

[RaigothDagon]

First off, optimally you would want to DI at a 90 degree angle, it doesn't necessarily mean you want to hit that all the time unless you committed such a thing to muscle memory. Otherwise, by the time such a thought goes through your head and reaches your hands, it'll already be too late to input the DI. Secondly, to alleviate your concern and to simplify things a bit, always DI upwards, because it works against most moves. After becoming more familiar with moves and their trajectories and followups, you'll gain the discretion to change this up. Plus, people on the boards can tell you smaller details about what DI works against specific moves or combos, and ways to mix it up just to throw off your opponent.

Now on to your numbered questions:

1)When is the optimal time to DI?
It is literally after hitstun wears off. Assuming an attack is too fast for you to react to, it doesn't hurt planning beforehand. FYI, most aerial attacks come out faster than a human can react to visually, they have to be anticipated. Thankfully, during the time you throw out your own aerials during a shffl is a perfect opportunity to execute "just in case DI".

2)What exactly are the angles it works at?
As you mentioned, the angles work at up to 90 degrees of influence. So in your example, assuming a move did hit you at a 9 angle and you input a 7 angle on the stick, the trajectory you'd see yourself fly would be 8. But keep in mind, I said to always DI up? Most moves in the game that don't spike or meteor actually hit around the same angle. But unfortunately, they aren't all the same, there are very slight differences. So the safest bet is to DI upwards since it'll still work even if the number is closer to 6 than 9.

3)What are the times you should DI?
Coming back on stage, almost everybody that is new or simply doesn't grasp DI properly, and even a few experienced people will just push their control stick towards the stage. This allows for people that pursue you offstage to get followups on their attack that normally wouldn't happen to people, often leading to some painful gimps. That's a good time especially to DI, but honestly in every aspect of the game that should be something in the back of your mind.

4)Does DI work at all when being flown through the air AFTER you've been hit by an attack?
DI doesn't work in this instance at all. I don't recall what this animation is called, like hurdling or something. But during that animation, you have absolutely no control over what happens unless you come into contact with a solid surface. The time that you gain control back is when you go into "tumble" animation, or as some of my other friends call it, "the stupid spinning thing."

One other important thing to note, I just covered some of the basics of just your standard DI. There are several other forms of DI in the game, but I feel that what things I covered should sufficiently answer the questions you had. In the case you feel curious about the other kinds of DI, I'm sure someone who has a deal of understanding or experience in those DI will be happy to help you out!

Edit: Defer to Bones' info, he accurately defined the terms and clarified that I was referring to hitlag and not hitstun.

 

[MrWeavile]

First off, optimally you would want to DI at a 90 degree angle, it doesn't necessarily mean you want to hit that all the time unless you committed such a thing to muscle memory. Otherwise, by the time such a thought goes through your head and reaches your hands, it'll already be too late to input the DI. Secondly, to alleviate your concern and to simplify things a bit, always DI upwards, because it works against most moves. After becoming more familiar with moves and their trajectories and followups, you'll gain the discretion to change this up. Plus, people on the boards can tell you smaller details about what DI works against specific moves or combos, and ways to mix it up just to throw off your opponent.

Now on to your numbered questions:

1)When is the optimal time to DI?
It is literally after hitstun wears off. Assuming an attack is too fast for you to react to, it doesn't hurt planning beforehand. FYI, most aerial attacks come out faster than a human can react to visually, they have to be anticipated. Thankfully, during the time you throw out your own aerials during a shffl is a perfect opportunity to execute "just in case DI".

2)What exactly are the angles it works at?
As you mentioned, the angles work at up to 90 degrees of influence. So in your example, assuming a move did hit you at a 9 angle and you input a 7 angle on the stick, the trajectory you'd see yourself fly would be 8. But keep in mind, I said to always DI up? Most moves in the game that don't spike or meteor actually hit around the same angle. But unfortunately, they aren't all the same, there are very slight differences. So the safest bet is to DI upwards since it'll still work even if the number is closer to 6 than 9.

3)What are the times you should DI?
Coming back on stage, almost everybody that is new or simply doesn't grasp DI properly, and even a few experienced people will just push their control stick towards the stage. This allows for people that pursue you offstage to get followups on their attack that normally wouldn't happen to people, often leading to some painful gimps. That's a good time especially to DI, but honestly in every aspect of the game that should be something in the back of your mind.

4)Does DI work at all when being flown through the air AFTER you've been hit by an attack?
DI doesn't work in this instance at all. I don't recall what this animation is called, like hurdling or something. But during that animation, you have absolutely no control over what happens unless you come into contact with a solid surface. The time that you gain control back is when you go into "tumble" animation, or as some of my other friends call it, "the stupid spinning thing."

One other important thing to note, I just covered some of the basics of just your standard DI. There are several other forms of DI in the game, but I feel that what things I covered should sufficiently answer the questions you had. In the case you feel curious about the other kinds of DI, I'm sure someone who has a deal of understanding or experience in those DI will be happy to help you out!

Wow, thanks a lot man. That literally answered all the questions I had about DI at the moment. Much appreciated dood!

 

[xCardiac]

Very good questions. I appreciated the answer from RaigothDragon. Very good answer! Thanks!

 

[Paradoxium]

lol, i've been doing this since i first started playing smash and i never realized it was DI

 

[Bones0]

Just to clarify some things:

First off, optimally you would want to DI at a 90 degree angle, it doesn't necessarily mean you want to hit that all the time unless you committed such a thing to muscle memory. Otherwise, by the time such a thought goes through your head and reaches your hands, it'll already be too late to input the DI. Secondly, to alleviate your concern and to simplify things a bit, always DI upwards, because it works against most moves. After becoming more familiar with moves and their trajectories and followups, you'll gain the discretion to change this up. Plus, people on the boards can tell you smaller details about what DI works against specific moves or combos, and ways to mix it up just to throw off your opponent.

DIing up is a great default, but only for survival DI. If you are getting comboed, DIing up is usually the last thing you want to do. I would default to up for when you are trying to survive a strong hit and down-away for trying to get out of combos. Like Raigoth said, once you get a better idea of each move's trajectory without DI, you can start adjusting your angles to increase your influence.

1)When is the optimal time to DI?
It is literally after hitstun wears off. Assuming an attack is too fast for you to react to, it doesn't hurt planning beforehand. FYI, most aerial attacks come out faster than a human can react to visually, they have to be anticipated. Thankfully, during the time you throw out your own aerials during a shffl is a perfect opportunity to execute "just in case DI".

This is just wrong (probably just confused your terminology. Here is the simplest way of explaining the DI windows:

1. Hitlag
--- this is when the opponent's hitbox collides with your char's hurtbox and both chars are frozen for a small period of time
--- Inputting a direction during hitlag will result in a SDI which means your character is transposed to whichever angle you pressed
--- It does not reduce knockback (KB) or stun; it only changes the location from which your char begins flying

2. Last frame of hitlag
--- This is the last frame to input ASDI and DI
--- ASDI is similar to SDI, but the distance you move is shorter and you do not have to time the stick press (holding left before you are hit will not cause you to SDI, but you will still ASDI)
--- DI affects the angle your character is sent; DIing at a 90 degree angle will alter your trajectory the most, but you cannot change the angle by more than 15-18 degrees (I forget the exact number)

3. Hitstun
--- After hitlag ends, hitstun begins
--- Your character's KB angle is set and none of your inputs will do anything until you collide with something or hitstun ends

4. Tumble
--- Your character will visually begin to tumble
--- You regain the ability to jump, fastfall, attack, and drift left or right
--- In order to airdodge, you must first wiggle out (it only takes a single press left or right to stabilize your char, but people usually do a dashdance motion to make sure they get it)


If that is too much to take in, just ignore ASDI and SDI. The main thing you should be focused on is whether or not to survival DI or combo DI. Survival DI is usually going to be between up-away and up-in while combo DI is usually going to be between down-away and up-away. Within those ranges, you will have to alter your angle based on the move's normal trajectory. It can help to go into Training Mode and knock a CPU around with all of the moves at 300%. This will give you a good idea of where perpendicular is, and then you simply have to decide if you want to survival or combo DI. For an example, if Marth is comboing you with fairs, you will want to DI down-away, but if he trying to KO you off stage with a fair, you will want to DI up-in. Both angles are perpendicular, but the former is combo DI while the latter is survival DI.