Toon Link Suggestions

[DarkDeity15]

I really want to have Toon Link as one of my secondaries, and there are a few things that bother me about him. So I have a list of changes I would like done to him, which would also buff him to an extent. Tell me what you guys think. And if you have any suggestions, feel free to share your suggestions as well, if you have any.

1. Make his Fair and Bair more combo-able/decrease cool-down. It would be sweet if Toon Link could combo like Marth with Bairs and Fairs. Let him short hop double Fair/Bair while you're at it.

2. Speed up and polish his F-smash. Not only does it look strange, but It really isn't that good. Especially with how slow it is.

3. Slow down his up B momentum a little and increase it's vertical reach. It would help his recovery and would make bomb jumping easier. Keep it's original purpose as a kill move in the air though.

 

[MrDoubleT]

It seems to me, especially with points 3 and 4 that you want a Link clone. And considering you main Link in all games, it doesn't really surprise me. The multi-hit on Tink's bombs helps him combo, and for me it is a good combo starter. For point 3, again it seems you just want his recovery to be identical to Link's Up-B. While I believe that recovering with Tink is difficult, just learn AGTing well and you'll be fine. I can agree on point 2 though. However, I already believe that Tink's f-smash is good and doesn't have a sourspot like Marth's. Point 1: Tink's bair is already really good for comboing; I really like doing short hop bair into full jump double bair (the first being a rising bair), and Tink's fair is a good finisher, so I don't think it should be weakened into a combo move.

 

[DarkDeity15]

It seems to me, especially with points 3 and 4 that you want a Link clone. And considering you main Link in all games, it doesn't really surprise me. The multi-hit on Tink's bombs helps him combo, and for me it is a good combo starter. For point 3, again it seems you just want his recovery to be identical to Link's Up-B. While I believe that recovering with Tink is difficult, just learn AGTing well and you'll be fine. I can agree on point 2 though. However, I already believe that Tink's f-smash is good and doesn't have a sourspot like Marth's. Point 1: Tink's bair is already really good for comboing; I really like doing short hop bair into full jump double bair (the first being a rising bair), and Tink's fair is a good finisher, so I don't think it should be weakened into a combo move.

I know very well how to AGT (I know how to double AGT fluently, and with nearly the entire cast to be honest), and even then, it's nearly impossible to bomb jump with Toon Link without saving a jump. And no, that's not at all what I want. He can keep his unique attributes. The multi hit on his bombs are unnecessary and awkward though. If they wanted people to combo out of it, then they should've added more hitstun instead imo.

As for the Fair Bair thing, meh. Tink's Uair, Dair and Nair are good kill moves. All you would need to do is carry your opponent offstage and finalize with a Nair or Dair.

 

[EddyBearr]

I know very well how to AGT (I know how to double AGT fluently, and with nearly the entire cast to be honest), and even then, it's nearly impossible to bomb jump with Toon Link without saving a jump. And no, that's not at all what I want. He can keep his unique attributes. The multi hit on his bombs are unnecessary and awkward though. If they wanted people to combo out of it, then they should've added more hitstun instead imo.

As for the Fair Bair thing, meh. Tink's Uair, Dair and Nair are good kill moves. All you would need to do is carry your opponent offstage and finalize with a Nair or Dair.

Toon Link's bombs are perfect. Don't change them.

 

[DarkDeity15]

Toon Link's bombs are perfect. Don't change them.

How exactly are they "perfect"?

 

[EddyBearr]

How exactly are they "perfect"?

High damage, multi-hit allows for more combo ability, multi-hit makes DI easier to take note of, gives you a better chance of landing a bomb's hit (like falling bombs missing first hitboxes but hitting later ones) and gives you a more guaranteed momentum stop when a bomb explode, feel pretty fast/light.

Small Link has always been a fast projectile spamming hit confirmer, and his bombs do that better than almost anything else. You can't just give such a weak attack "more hitstun". If it's not your cup of tea, which it appears not to be, then play Link.

 

[DarkDeity15]

High damage, multi-hit allows for more combo ability, multi-hit makes DI easier to take note of, gives you a better chance of landing a bomb's hit (like falling bombs missing first hitboxes but hitting later ones) and gives you a more guaranteed momentum stop when a bomb explode, feel pretty fast/light.

Small Link has always been a fast projectile spamming hit confirmer, and his bombs do that better than almost anything else. You can't just give such a weak attack "more hitstun". If it's not your cup of tea, which it appears not to be, then play Link.

I've actually never thought of it that way lol. The DI read thing especially. I'm warming up to the idea now that you mention it. I'll take it off my list later. And lol, as if Tink's bomb affects alone would detur me from playing him. And it isn't a weak attack lol. It does 12 damage total. All they'd need to do is give it more knockback if it was a one-hit blast.

 

[EddyBearr]

I've actually never thought of it that way lol. The DI read thing especially. I'm warming up to the idea now that you mention it. I'll take it off my list later. And lol, as if Tink's bomb affects alone would detur me from playing him. And it isn't a weak attack lol. It does 12 damage total. All they'd need to do is give it more knockback if it was a one-hit blast.

Weak in terms of how it's not meant to have much knockback or stun.

 

[DarkDeity15]

Weak in terms of how it's not meant to have much knockback or stun.

If it was meant to though. As in, if they changed that.

 

[EddyBearr]

If it was meant to though. As in, if they changed that.

I'm gonna go ahead and say it's meant to be a weak, multi-hit, damaging attack. It's been that way in every game with a mini link.

 

[DarkDeity15]

I'm gonna go ahead and say it's meant to be a weak, multi-hit, damaging attack. It's been that way in every game with a mini link.

If they can change the way Tink's spin attack works in the air that much, I'm pretty sure they can change the way his bombs work.

 

[EddyBearr]

If they can change the way Tink's spin attack works in the air that much, I'm pretty sure they can change the way his bombs work.

Yeah, but why would they? His bombs worked great for him, his up-B didn't work as well (and is now a homage to 64 link, as is F-Smash)

 

[MrDoubleT]

If they can change the way Tink's spin attack works in the air that much, I'm pretty sure they can change the way his bombs work.

Wait, so do you want to change his bombs for the sake of "improving" his recovery?

 

[DarkDeity15]

Wait, so do you want to change his bombs for the sake of "improving" his recovery?

Other than more knockback, I don't think there's any way to have Tink's bombs more beneficial to his recovery. They're fine the way they are (changed my mind). His up B is his main issue when it comes to recovery imo.

 

[MrDoubleT]

For me, having his up B like that makes it a nice kill move. Down throw to Up B. Plus it works nicely when you up B your opponent through the platform and ledge cancel it. I believe it has more knockback than Fair which makes it's better for killing off the sides - something uair or dair cannot do. Honestly, we don't need Project Recovery to go into Phase 2: Electric Boogaloo with even more buffs to recoveries (.... even Falco's). Recoveries are already OP in this game; leave them as they are.

 

[DarkDeity15]

For me, having his up B like that makes it a nice kill move. Down throw to Up B. Plus it works nicely when someone is above you on a platform and you ledge cancel it. I believe it has more knockback than Fair and it's good for killing off the sides unlike uair or dair. Honestly, we don't need Project Recovery to go into phase 2: Electric Boogaloo with buffs to recoveries (.... even Falco's). Recoveries are already OP in this game; leave them as they are.

They can keep those attributes. All I ask is that they increase vertical reach and to slow its momentum down just a tad. It wouldn't hurt it as a kill move. In fact, it would buff it.

 

[Spralwers]

Tinks fsmash has ridiculous killing power, and has the perfect speed for hard reads, especially on techs and recoveries. You can very easily kill people at around 80-90% with it. Also, boomerang at higher percentages has enough hitstun for an fsmash follow up if you go for the hard read, assuming the rang hits. You'd have to sacrifice its KO power if you want it faster. I personally love it the way it is.

 

[DarkDeity15]

Tinks fsmash has ridiculous killing power, and has the perfect speed for hard reads, especially on techs and recoveries. You can very easily kill people at around 80-90% with it. Also, boomerang at higher percentages has enough hitstun for an fsmash follow up if you go for the hard read, assuming the rang hits. You'd have to sacrifice its KO power if you want it faster. I personally love it the way it is.

Fox's Usmash would like to say hi. It's ridiculously powerful for such a quick move.

 

[Spralwers]

But they'll never give any character a move as good as Fox's usmash <_<

 

[MrDoubleT]

Tink's F-smash is like Marth's but without a weak spot. Why increase Tink's Up-B vertical reach? As I said, there is no need to buff ANY recoveries in Project Recovery (even Falco's).

Pikachu and Ivysaur have up smashes as strong and as good as Fox's... I think even Ganon does, but I'm not sure.

 

[Spralwers]

Dorf's up smash is around the same strength as Fox's (in terms of knockback, not damage), but it has very limited horizontal range and extremely slow start up.

 

[DarkDeity15]

Tink's F-smash is like Marth's but without a weak spot. Why increase Tink's Up-B vertical reach? As I said, there is no need to buff ANY recoveries in Project Recovery (even Falco's).

Pikachu and Ivysaur have up smashes as strong and as good as Fox's... I think even Ganon does, but I'm not sure.

No, it's not like Marth's imo. It works quite differently.

 

[MrDoubleT]

Long ranged f-smash with hitbox above the head swung with a sword? Sounds pretty similar to me. They are both even similar to Roy and Ike's (probably even more like Ike's with less range but faster)

 

[DarkDeity15]

Long ranged f-smash with hitbox above the head swung with a sword? Sounds pretty similar to me. They are both even similar to Roy and Ike's (probably even more like Ike's with less range but faster)

Yeah, Tink's Fsmash is a lot like Ike's now that you menton it, only a tad bit worse.

 

[B.W.]

T.Link's F-Smash combos from D-Throw on a lot of characters when D-Throw > Aerial Up-B doesn't send them high enough.

 

[Samurai Jack]

Definitely looking into using Tink as a secondary to Ness. Mostly posting to see what else comes up here

 

[DarkDeity15]

Mah b. Overreacted. I forgot I make this thread a while ago.

 

[DethM]

But they'll never give any character a move as good as Fox's usmash <_<

Pikachu.

Fox's usmash is overrated. It's the character that's good, not his usmash.
His usmash is a good kill. That's all.

 

[B.W.]

Fox's U-Smash is still, in a few ways, better than Pikachu's.

Pika might have more power in his, but it also comes with more end lag and a bad flub hitbox behind the move.

If Fox misses his U-Smash you have to be way more on point when trying to punish it, and the "bad" hitbox is still very much able to kill, or at the very least give Fox a great advantage.

Being better isn't always about being stronger.

 

[DethM]

Fox's U-Smash is still, in a few ways, better than Pikachu's.

Pika might have more power in his, but it also comes with more end lag and a bad flub hitbox behind the move.

If Fox misses his U-Smash you have to be way more on point when trying to punish it, and the "bad" hitbox is still very much able to kill, or at the very least give Fox a great advantage.

Being better isn't always about being stronger.

GAW? Idk.

Fox's usmash really isn't all that broken of a move, though.

 

[AndrogynousOkami]

Fox's usmash is probably still better than G&W's 'cause of the huge lag.