Official Toon Link 1.1.4 Patch Changes

[Dɛαd]

Everything about Toon Link patch changes must be posted here.


Proof not required but recommended.



Changes

Bair Landing Lag: 22 Frames -> 17 Frames

FSmash First Hit: Altered to properly connect at any %.

Spin Attack and Flying Spin Attack have 2 less frames of startup.

Spoiler: Previous Patches

Spoiler: 1.1.1

Sliding Spin Attack deals 1% more damage: 10% → 11%.

Sliding Spin Attack has received 5 additional hitboxes: 1 → 6.

Grounded Sliding Spin Attack's knockback growth increased.

Spoiler: 1.1.0

Dash grab is 2 frames faster

Pivot grab is 1 frame faster

Nair landing lag reduced (?)

Spoiler: 1.0.8

- Boomerang and Bomb Gliding Removed

Phoenix Bomb Removed (Check the Treasure Charts)

Spin Attack Fall Removed (Check the Treasure Charts)

Jab Hitboxes Changed (Nerf or Buff?)

Spoiler

Toon Link
---------
Jab1
    hitbox 0 and 2 IDs swapped
Jab2
    hitbox 0 and 2 IDs swapped
    kbg 37 -> 34
    bkb 16 -> 25
Jab3
    all hitboxes
        size 3.5 -> 4.2
    hitbox 0
        z 5.0 -> 4.5

 

[Deleted member]

Boomerang gliding is gone, and apparently phoenix bomb and spin attack fall are gone as well. I'm pretty sure there are other nerfs I'm forgetting, too.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Not being able to slide off edges with specials was a universal patch, so I'd assume that the 'F-bomb' doesn't work either. (I'm yet to actually touch the wii-u with the latest patch as I'm still in exam mode.)

Are you sure about there being no phoenix bomb? Who has verified this?

 

[Deleted member]

Not being able to slide off edges with specials was a universal patch, so I'd assume that the 'F-bomb' doesn't work either. (I'm yet to actually touch the wii-u with the latest patch as I'm still in exam mode.)

Are you sure about there being no phoenix bomb? Who has verified this?

I think it was Yacka or Zan who said phoenix bomb is gone, I forget which or if it was both who said that. I was never able to get it very easily, but I've been trying a bunch on Bowser and still haven't been able to get one since the patch.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

I think it was Yacka or Zan who said phoenix bomb is gone, I forget which or if it was both who said that. I was never able to get it very easily, but I've been trying a bunch on Bowser and still haven't been able to get one since the patch.

The way I'd test it would be to do an instant z-drop inside someone in 1/4 hold training mode, then instantly catch it with an aerial. So e.g. pull bomb get up close, let go of L, hold jump, flick L to skip forward 2 frames, flick L a few more times until Toon is on his way back up from the 'jump squat' animation, then before Toon actually leaves the ground, let go of L, with the joystick in neutral hold the grab button, flick L to skip forward two frames (if you did it right you'll see the explosion and Toon won't start a Zair), let go of grab and hold attack (to Nair), flick L to make the Nair come out. If that doesn't give you the phoenix bomb, then it has been patched out for sure. - someone test this real quick.

 

[CURRY]

Craaaap, boomerang gliding gone???
I'm kinda glad that I didn't work on that enough to perfect it, lol. That AT had so much going for it. Never pulled it off in a match once, but its uses are so obvious and effective.
I've seen Zan using it, lol. RIP.
..... Can't verify any TL changes at the moment. I'm reaallllyyyyy far away from home.
More details in the Social Thread. lol.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

Alright, never say I don't love you guys. Shoutouts to Schiffe for supplying the files.

REMEMBER, this does NOT include:

• IASA times on animations (endlag nor landing lag)
• Overall engine quirks/alterations
• Grabbable items
• Anything involving Mewtwo; I don't have readable 1.0.6/7 files for him. (If you do, please share?)
• Anything involving the new characters. (This is a changelog!)

This DOES include any and all possible changes to:

• Hitbox ID, damage, knockback, angle, element, size, position, tripping, SDI, hitlag, ect.
• Move startup times
• Animation speedup-based timing changes
• All move startup timings
• All AC timings
• All super/heavy armor (spoilers, no changes)
• All state transitions (like jabs)

It is possible but unlikely that any of these were missed while compiling this list.

Toon Link
---------
Jab1
    hitbox 0 and 2 IDs swapped
Jab2
    hitbox 0 and 2 IDs swapped
    kbg 37 -> 34
    bkb 16 -> 25
Jab3
    all hitboxes
        size 3.5 -> 4.2
    hitbox 0
        z 5.0 -> 4.5

In practical terms, [the changes to Toon Link] generally means that the devs have investigated the way the hitboxes on the move are structured and tweaked them so they hid in a more intended way.

In mechanical terms, [the changes to Toon Link] dictates which of the two hitboxes will take effect in the region they overlap.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Hooray XD, we got a kind of a very slight buff...

[Also, fyi, yes, the phoenix bomb was patched out.]

 

[Kleric]

I don't feel too reliable in suggesting possible discoveries, but I get the feeling that Toon Link's up-special has more killing power since the update.
Someone may have to test this, I haven't looked at the previous notes regarding it.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

Nope any knockback changes would have been noted above.

 

[Deleted member]

What does any of that jab stuff mean? Are we sure it's a buff? A Ryu just fell out of my jab (I'm now kicking myself for not saving the replay), something I never once had happen before the patch.

 

[Theis]

on the 1.0.8 patch data findings im assuming it means our jab has a larger hitbox than it used to but as far as any other buffs are concerned thats probably it. and its not MUCH bigger to note

 

[TLMSheikant]

Every patch is the same...hate patches so much as a toon link main. Ever since the first patch, theyve been taking options away from the character. It's so dumb. Every tether now has a followup or some kind of reward when they grab and they even decreased their endlag on whiff, even Villager. But no, toon link is apparently too good to receive this change other tethers got.

 

[Mota]

Our time will come brother. I can see it now...Grabbing with a bomb, BLC will return, Brawl Bair autocancels, and new bomb-momentum-wavedashing mechanics. Praise Sakurai!

 

[Theis]

honestly, if our character were like 2 or 3 frames faster with all his normals, he'd be fair. if you compare our frame data to link's frame data its practically the same thing with link having more range and kill power and we're supposed to be the faster version of link with less reach. the only reason our character seems faster is because we dont have as much end lag with our tilts as link has.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

A new patch is upon us and other characters have had some confirmed changes. Posts concerning any possible actual changes to Toon (including placebo) and posts confirming or dis-confirming those changes should be made in this thread.

Edit: Wow. We may have actually gotten a buff to dash grab. http://smashboards.com/threads/tournament-mode-1-1-0-community-patch-notes.412130/#post-19790691

 

[Deleted member]

Dash grab looks the same to me, so I'd like to know where the thing on his dash grab came from. Especially since it still misses even when the tether has hit the opponent. I've also heard his bair and fsmash were buffed, but they look the same to me. Bair is still has no hitbox throughout most of the sword trail, and the damage is the same on both. I haven't checked if it was made easier to connect, but it doesn't look like it and I doubt that would happen especially after our jab was made less likely to connect last patch.

EDIT: Apparently this is the raw datamine, and shows changed for Gay. Can anyone read this? http://opensa.dantarion.com/s4/raw/diff-128-144/toonlink.html

 

[LotadAlittle]

from what I've found f smash is now a true combo for the double hit (works up to at least 110%).
tested on ness in training mode

edit:
just tested on Ganon and Jiggly, it's a true combo on them at kill percents
kill percents:
ness - around 61%
Ganon - around 80%
Jiggly - around 55%

not sure if you can still DI/vector out of it, doesn't look like it though.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

Nair landing lag reduced. http://gfycat.com/CanineSameAnchovy

 

[Artmastercorey]

This could just be placebo on my part but does TL's uncharged arrow now have more hitstun/knockback?
And was a charged arrow always able to stop a fully charged samus blast or go through a charged blast from megaman?

Also has Tl's down air knockback been changed? If u downair someone low to the ground usually they stay in place and can hit you back right away but I think now they get pushed away more. Again though it could just be placebo/coincidence on my part.

EDIT: Think im wrong about his dair when used low on ground. A yoshi was able to hit me back right away.

 

[CURRY]

This could just be placebo on my part but does TL's uncharged arrow now have more hitstun/knockback?
And was a charged arrow always able to stop a fully charged samus blast? I thought only bombs could?

Also has Tl's down air knockback been changed? If u downair someone low to the ground usually they stay in place and can hit you back right away but I think now they get pushed away more. Again though it could just be placebo/coincidence on my part.

EDIT: Think im wrong about his dair when used low on ground. A yoshi was able to hit me back right away.

Those are probably placebo because those sound like they were there before. Can't say for SURE because I don't have Smash 4 open right now and I'm not testing the new patch, but yeah, I'm pretty sure it was Lucario with the projectile-eating energy ball that could be blocked by the bomb. Toon also already had a dair that pushed people back.

Well yay, it's confirmed that we get other slight buffs to frame data, though, I guess. I wonder how much our dash grab got changed though? I don't think any of us really used it, so we can't really feel it out if we wanted to.

We should be thankful for any buffs we get... I think it's just me, but I feel unsatisfied, probably because I secondary Marth and he got HUGE buffs that changed how he was played. Expecting the same thing for Toon is a bit unreasonable though, lol. Marth was kinda trash.

 

[Artmastercorey]

Yeah , but I think some of the frame buffs mentioned might not be true for TL. Like I dont think his nair landing lag was reduced i was recently playing with that before the patch and it seems the same to me. But Im hoping his arrow buff isnt just a placebo effect im having. I just dont remember an arrow stopping samus or megaman full blast attacks(just bombs) but probably has for all I know.

 

[Dɛαd]

First Post Edited

 

[W.A.C.]

At one point, I did tests and was not able to do a buffered neutral air or a buffered back air without end lag from a short hope. I don't know if I simply screwed up last time I did tests, but I'm able to do buffered back airs without end lag now along with buffered neutral airs.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

Maybe not.

Toon Link's n-air landing lag is unchanged. It's still 12 frames.

(Perhaps this was a 3DS specific fix? Since your vid is showing a clear difference between the two, but I'm not seeing one between two Wii U versions)

 

[Deleted member]

Turns out the original source on Gay's dash grab being 2 frames faster is the person who got the raw data for the patch, so that's definitely confirmed. Maybe zair>grab will be a little more reliable now? Also, does anyone have a source on the pivot grab thing? I figure if that had been changed it would've definitely been mentioned along with the dash grab change, even if other changes wouldn't have been mentioned for whatever reason.

from what I've found f smash is now a true combo for the double hit (works up to at least 110%).
tested on ness in training mode

edit:
just tested on Ganon and Jiggly, it's a true combo on them at kill percents
kill percents:
ness - around 61%
Ganon - around 80%
Jiggly - around 55%

not sure if you can still DI/vector out of it, doesn't look like it though.

Jiggz still falls out of fsmash, so it's probably untouched.

Yeah , but I think some of the frame buffs mentioned might not be true for TL. Like I dont think his nair landing lag was reduced i was recently playing with that before the patch and it seems the same to me.

I thought the same about Gay's dash grab when I heard it got buffed. If nair only got a tiny landing lag reduction then I could see that being hard to pick up on, too.

Maybe not.

Gay's nair has always had 12 frames of landing lag. Unless the frame data from when the 3DS version came out before any patches was done by someone with psychic visions of a future nair buff that went unnoticed for several months. If nair really does still have 12 frames of landing lag then that gif is strange.

 

[PKEarthbound]

I think this might just be a placebo or the opponents DI but, i think back throw might've been changed somehow.
I recently played against a Shulk on FG and I grabbed him pretty close to the left side of the Omega Find Mii stage at around 140% and it didnt kill him. It actually looked like it threw him across more vertically than horizontally, but like I said, it could just be placebo or the opponents DI

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

I believe that the only changes were to the dash grab and pivot grab. I'm basing this off the raw data that artemis posted earlier, the link to which no longer works it would seem. Anyway, it only showed changes to those two. Everything else is placebo. Maybe you just never realised how good Toon was until you started looking for buffs XD.

 

[PKEarthbound]

Okay then lol, it seemed kinda odd to me though, but I guess it was just placebo. Thanks for clarifying ^^'

 

[Disfunkshunal]

Lack of buffs and minimal nerfs specific to Toon Link since the game has released must mean he's perfect. We chose right.

I think this might just be a placebo or the opponents DI but, i think back throw might've been changed somehow.
I recently played against a Shulk on FG and I grabbed him pretty close to the left side of the Omega Find Mii stage at around 140% and it didnt kill him. It actually looked like it threw him across more vertically than horizontally, but like I said, it could just be placebo or the opponents DI

I'm betting it was DI.

 

[jdubYOU]

He definitely seemed exactly the same to me when I was playing earlier today.

 

[LotadAlittle]

does anyone have anything confirmed about f smash? I could swear it's quicker or the first hit has less knockback/more hitstun. I've managed to connect both hits on just about everyone i try it on (mostly for glory).

 

[Wormy.EXE]

Toon Link's Bombs got a 4% to 8 % buff. If thrown on the floor of the stage right when the opponent is in the blast radius of the bomb. It's really hard to explain completely.

So that's why I made two videos about this interesting detail. One from a replay and the other i took myself which has super bad quality. So sorry about that there was nothing i could really do their.

Video #1: I tested it out on training mode and it worked fine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zch_7b8H8PU

Video #2 I tested it out against a cpu and it also worked.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZK26EeQMK0

 

[Disfunkshunal]

Toon Link's Bombs got a 4% to 8 % buff. If thrown on the floor of the stage right when the opponent is in the blast radius of the bomb. It's really hard to explain completely.

So that's why I made two videos about this interesting detail. One from a replay and the other i took myself which has super bad quality. So sorry about that there was nothing i could really do their.

Video #1: I tested it out on training mode and it worked fine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zch_7b8H8PU

Video #2 I tested it out against a cpu and it also worked.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZK26EeQMK0

It's always been that way.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

It's always been that way.

Exactly.
To be specific, direct hits will always do 4% as will timed explosions if the bomb is being held, while indirect hits (including timed explosions after the bomb has been thrown/dropped) will do more damage up to 8%, and the amount they do will depend on how fast the bomb was traveling at the time, so yes, you can do 5, 6, or 7% as well.

 

[mush21]

I was really hoping for a buff to his bair and (to a lesser extent) nair. The lag on those moves need to be reduced. I can understand his fair, it is a kill move, but those two should be faster and not as punishable. It doesn't seem as though they're ever going to reduce the lag on any of his moves :/

 

[Wormy.EXE]

It's always been that way.

Oops i did not know that sorry.Thanks fox and disfunked

 

[hiramsthoughts]

Ok I just repicked Tink si it's probably nothing, but I think arrows now can be air cancelled? I recall before if yoy shot an arrow you'd land with arrow animation endlag even if the arrow had already come out, now if the arrow comes out before you touch the ground you get regular landing animation. There is still landing lag, it might even be the same amount as before, but I'm 80% certain that the landing lag animation changed, at least.

 

[ksizl4life]

Hey guys, ksizzle of VitaminZK here. We've been releasing patch notes videos recently and Toon Link is looking to be in the next compilation(will look something like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ePbgb07TXw )

I'm working on Toon Link now but I'm finding some inconsistencies with data. While Pivot Grab did get one frame faster, Dash grab hasnt changed at all. Both 1.0.9 and 1.1.0 grab on frame 14. I've tried it on several characters, even giving them Super Mushrooms so that their hurtbox is enlarged. So is there a better way of testing this or am I right in saying whatever got changed with Dash Grab wasn't the startup of the move? Thanks.

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

Hey guys, ksizzle of VitaminZK here. We've been releasing patch notes videos recently and Toon Link is looking to be in the next compilation(will look something like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ePbgb07TXw )

I'm working on Toon Link now but I'm finding some inconsistencies with data. While Pivot Grab did get one frame faster, Dash grab hasnt changed at all. Both 1.0.9 and 1.1.0 grab on frame 14. I've tried it on several characters, even giving them Super Mushrooms so that their hurtbox is enlarged. So is there a better way of testing this or am I right in saying whatever got changed with Dash Grab wasn't the startup of the move? Thanks.

Have you checked the end-lag?