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Tools against IC's?

tunnelblaster

Smash Rookie
Joined
Sep 6, 2014
Messages
2
Location
Plainfield, Indiana
I got bodied in friendlies and knocked out of a bracket today by an Ice Climbers player. I'm a fairly new player but I never felt like I could get anything started in neutral game and whenever I had opportunities to punish I got denied because of my approach. Anyone know this matchup and want to give some pointers?
 

Wafflesaurus

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 23, 2013
Messages
47
NNID
Wafflesaurus
So ICs are a weird match up for Marth because they can stop your d tilt approach with desynch walls. Always look out for when they try to start them (most common way is from spot dodge or roll). If you see that, do whatever you can to stop it.
Grabbing them is also weird since if the ICs know what they are doing, they can stop you from getting much even if you get the grab. If you grab popo, they can make nana hit you and if you grab nana, popo will shield grab you and possibly get a wobble afterwards. I'm not saying to never grab them but be vary careful.
D tilt is really good when they haven't set up their walls. Hitting their shield with it is pretty good and you can easily link multiple d tilts together by walking or wavedashing. Be careful with being too obvious when doing d tilt since they can jump over it with a fair.
Comboing Nana is simple but be vary careful with Popo, d smash is pretty strong and so is back air lol
Using the platforms can be vary useful since you make the ICs guess what you are going to do but you can react to them. Platforms are NOT necessary to win this match up, so don't think FD is unwinnable (although it and Dreamland are Marth's worst stages in this match up)
I believe being grounded is superior to going to the platforms in this match up but they are still a really useful resource.
Be careful with using aerials since they can sneak below them with dash attack or similar stuff. The only situation where aerials are safe in neutral is when using retreating fairs, but you'd end up giving up a lot of stage when doing so.
It might go without saying but be vary careful when f smashing, even when comboing nana because popo can come and punish you easily. F smash in neutral might as well be a death sentence unless it's properly conditioned or hits their shield with the tip, else you're getting wobbled.
An easy way to get through Popo's ice blocks is to just short hop nair over them. D tilt is surprisingly good against full hop Nana Blizzard as an anti air (or so says Fly, haven't really tested it since no ICs do so against me)
Best stages for Marth are Battlefield and FoD. Worst is Dreamland and probably FD second.
If you need more help, I've seen that wobbles has written a little bit about this match up here in smashboards and fly on reddit.
 

AudioSilver

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 16, 2015
Messages
262
Location
Out of Nowhere
3DS FC
3797-7513-8784
My top solution to Ice Climbers is to change characters. The tricks with Marth just don't seem to pay off quite as much as using a different character...

That's all I have to offer. @ Wafflesaurus Wafflesaurus pretty much covered it as far as I see. (Although I only read some of it.)
 
Last edited:

Malcolm Pickering

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 22, 2014
Messages
27
Location
Millburn, NJ
thank you all for the tips,
the ICS i play are not ultra skilled, so dash dacing/ WD dtilt run away strategies, fair spacing and keeping area/ spacing pressure on them has been working pretty well
 

koKoRoro

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 5, 2015
Messages
38
Location
Boston, Massachusetts
As a player who has practiced IC's, I'd agree with AudioSilver. For them it's just too easy to WD out of your fsmash and get around all of your usual long range attacks. You'd be much better off picking a char who has a projectile than trying and failing repeatedly to approach. If you want, look up some Marth v IC sets on Youtube and see what the Marth player does
 

1000g2g3g4g800999

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 21, 2012
Messages
368
Location
Earth
If they approach via wavedash in, dtilt, Dancing Blade, jab, and fair (if you're in the air) are all very fast, and dtilt can avoid bair (not to mention, Dancing Blade stops you instantly). Nair and dair drifting away are both fairly useful when they're uncomfortably close. Dash dance is great, especially if they shield. Try to just stay out of bair's range, and be ready to punish any desync or WD forward attempts. If ICs are nearby, but don't have the opportunity to shield utilt is strong. Try to do fewer attacks, and more movement, it's easier to not be the proactive one. Stay close and watch for any desync attempts though, you don't want to deal with blizzard walls or ice block spam. Try to space gabs with shield stops if you go for them so that you drag a climber in to make the other punishing you harder.

Ftilt will clank with Iceblock, reducing its already low lag (and it's Marth's longest ranged move on ground). This doesn't mean you can't be punished, but it's something to consider since you can avoid going to the air with this option.

If you like going to the air a bit more, SH facing away dair or bair mixup can be hard to come in on and counter CC.

Again, I recommend dashing after most aerials. Low fair to dtilt is also fine when both will tip (and when the dtilt will punish some CC or desync attempt).
 
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