TOASTYYYYYYYYY! Scorpion for Smash!

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

"I love the smell of Detention in the morning."

Spoiler

Kronika is a Goddess of Time. We also have a character similar to a golem with the same powers. She's basically the Titan to the Elder Gods, way more powerful. And the reason behind why Zombie Liu Kang exists and why he and Raiden went against each other. She actually offers the same thing to Scorpion to restore his clan. Obviously she lied to everyone with her offers, as she's severely selfish, and the big bad of the entire franchise. Even worse? Other Titans exist with her power. She outright killed the Elder Gods herself(offscreen), and only Gods are immune to her outright time powers... and possibly only certain ones?

Spoiler

Obviously, she took advantage of everyone's greed, because think about it; her whole point was to restart everything from the beggining, millions of years before any of them are born.

And her plans only need her two children, Cetrion and Shinnok, to create a neverending war between light and dark, which is what her twisted of "balance" is. She doesn't need any of the people she's allied with for that, does she?

If I recall, Past Erron Black is the only one to have caught up on that because he's the only antagonist to not have a particular desire; he just goes with the flow (and how deep people's wallets are)

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Prince Goro(his full name) was always the Gym Teacher. Very kind and respectable, and doesn't carry his weapons on him(his claws). Also is gay. Which unfortunately for another player's character, Hawke, didn't go so well when she found out. In the future, he marries Rain, effectively bringing Edenia and Outworld together in an alliance.

One major change for the regular roleplay is that Shao Kahn's changes has made Outworld a significantly nicer place. Unfortunately, Onaga didn't like the same idea... to the point he still has Reptile under him, make him a Butler for his own restaurant.

Spoiler

Obviously, she took advantage of everyone's greed, because think about it; her whole point was to restart everything from the beggining, millions of years before any of them are born.

And her plans only need her two children, Cetrion and Shinnok, to create a neverending war between light and dark, which is what her twisted of "balance" is. She doesn't need any of the people she's allied with for that, does she?

If I recall, Past Erron Black is the only one to have caught up on that because he's the only antagonist to not have a particular desire; he just goes with the flow (and how deep people's wallets are)

Spoiler

That too. I can't wait to go through the story mode myself~

 

[Graizen]

If it's Scorpion , ok.

But what if is Sub-Zero, would they put Bi-Han as the classic Sub-Zero?
Or the new one?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

If it's Scorpion , ok.

But what if is Sub-Zero, would they put Bi-Han as the classic Sub-Zero?
Or the new one?

I mean, it's possible. Do note there is a Sub-Zero character thread here too.

Incidentally, we don't have a lot of ice users in Smash.

 

[Crap-Zapper]

We got Ice Climbers? That's literally 2.

Sub-Zero is cool and all, but Scorpion, that's where it's at.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Sub-Zero is cool

Heh, puns.

 

[Crap-Zapper]

Heh, puns.

And you know it. but the point still stands.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Actually, we do have two ice users. Ice Climbers and technically Giga Bowser... till Ultimate changed his Final Smash, anyway. Though that counts as much as customs. To be fair, Giga Bowser is a full character in Melee and had ice moves. But we have one character focused on ice.

Sub-Zero would be a neat second one, even as an Echo.

 

[Arcadenik]

If it's Scorpion , ok.

But what if is Sub-Zero, would they put Bi-Han as the classic Sub-Zero?
Or the new one?

Why not both?

Default - classic costume from MK I and MK II (even though they are two different Sub-Zeroes)

Alternate costume - new costume from MK 3 (that one is the same Sub-Zero from MK II)

Mortal Kombat Trilogy (PSOne version) had both versions as separate fighters. The N64 version had classic Sub-Zero as the only Sub-Zero but he had the new Sub-Zero’s moves.

 

[BreadnJamTomorrow]

I think we're definitely more likely to get Scorpion than Sub-Zero mostly because of the Boon-bias. However, I should say that I still think Sub-Zero being an Echo is not out of the realm of possibility. Him and Scorpion would have different specials, of course. Some people might disagree, but I think Chrom proves that you can be labeled as an Echo and still have different specials from the original character.

The only thing that concerns me is that Sub-Zero's Final Smash should 100% be a Fatality. But the one he's most known for isn't very PG.

 

[Arcadenik]

The only thing that concerns me is that Sub-Zero's Final Smash should 100% be a Fatality. But the one he's most known for isn't very PG.

Hmm... Final Smash?

What if Sub-Zero transforms into Noob Saibot and do his Fatality where he makes the opponent spin into nothingness?

 

[Graizen]

Why not both?

Default - classic costume from MK I and MK II (even though they are two different Sub-Zeroes)

Alternate costume - new costume from MK 3 (that one is the same Sub-Zero from MK II)

Mortal Kombat Trilogy (PSOne version) had both versions as separate fighters. The N64 version had classic Sub-Zero as the only Sub-Zero but he had the new Sub-Zero’s moves.

But i really think they will go for the "Diferent Ninja's as Costumes"

Scorpion with 7 different Ninjas as Costumes.

Sub-Zero
Ermac
Rain
Smoke
Reptile
Noob
Chameleon

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I think we're definitely more likely to get Scorpion than Sub-Zero mostly because of the Boon-bias. However, I should say that I still think Sub-Zero being an Echo is not out of the realm of possibility. Him and Scorpion would have different specials, of course. Some people might disagree, but I think Chrom proves that you can be labeled as an Echo and still have different specials from the original character.

And Ken has proven that you don't need to be a full clone to be labled as an Echo, so yeah, this can work.

The only thing that concerns me is that Sub-Zero's Final Smash should 100% be a Fatality. But the one he's most known for isn't very PG.

Not necessarily. Scorpion would absolutely get away with it because Toasty! is both iconic and able to fit Smash's E10+ rating

But Sub-Zero? As long as they keep the idea of him doing some kool stuff with ice, it can still fit him well. Injustice 2 proves this.

But i really think they will go for the "Diferent Ninja's as Costumes"

Scorpion with 7 different Ninjas as Costumes.

Sub-Zero
Ermac
Rain
Smoke
Reptile
Noob
Chameleon

I don't see how Chameleon would work...

Also, why not a Tremor alt?

 

[Graizen]

And Ken has proven that you don't need to be a full clone to be labled as an Echo, so yeah, this can work.


Not necessarily. Scorpion would absolutely get away with it because Toasty! is both iconic and able to fit Smash's E10+ rating

But Sub-Zero? As long as they keep the idea of him doing some kool stuff with ice, it can still fit him well. Injustice 2 proves this.

I don't see how Chameleon would work...

Also, why not a Tremor alt?

YEAH TREMOR, could be him as well!

 

[BreadnJamTomorrow]

As long as they keep the idea of him doing some kool stuff with ice, it can still fit him well. Injustice 2 proves this.

You're right in that FSs don't necessarily have to reference anything and can just be an aspect of a character. Mario, Jigglypuff, Yink, and Tink are all examples of this. But...I don't know. It just seems like a missed opportunity to me if you do have something that you could pull from the source material, but then you don't. Doesn't help that I personally don't like FSs like that already, so I am definitely biased.

The closest thing I can think of to include for Subbie's FSs would be his polar bear Animality from UMK3. Still retains his ice effect (somewhat) and is a reference to an MK game, so I think it could fit.

 

[Graizen]

You're right in that FSs don't necessarily have to reference anything and can just be an aspect of a character. Mario, Jigglypuff, Yink, and Tink are all examples of this. But...I don't know. It just seems like a missed opportunity to me if you do have something that you could pull from the source material, but then you don't. Doesn't help that I personally don't like FSs like that already, so I am definitely biased.

The closest thing I can think of to include for Subbie's FSs would be his polar bear Animality from UMK3. Still retains his ice effect (somewhat) and is a reference to an MK game, so I think it could fit.

He could very well make a big "ice breath" from his hands, and freeze all the fighters in place with hight%
After that he go and kick/punch all the characters.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

You're right in that FSs don't necessarily have to reference anything and can just be an aspect of a character. Mario, Jigglypuff, Yink, and Tink are all examples of this. But...I don't know. It just seems like a missed opportunity to me if you do have something that you could pull from the source material, but then you don't. Doesn't help that I personally don't like FSs like that already, so I am definitely biased.

The closest thing I can think of to include for Subbie's FSs would be his polar bear Animality from UMK3. Still retains his ice effect (somewhat) and is a reference to an MK game, so I think it could fit.

In all fairness, I could see Sub-Zero do the Head Rip as a victory screen pose, the same way Injustice 2 did it.

 

[TableCloth]

I would love to see both Scorpion and Sub-Zero in Smash equally. But I think Scorpion is more likely to be the first rep.

I could see Sub-Zero being an echo with the only difference from Scorpion in his moveset being the specials and Final Smash. Various moves he could use like ice ball, slide, ground freeze, clones etc. And I love cryomancers in games and I think Smash is in desperate need of a proper one.

Plus who wouldn't want to see a 2v2 match of Ryu and Ken vs Scorpion and Sub-Zero.

 

[pupNapoleon]

Where was this page of the responses when Chinder and I were getting into the echo debate?!!?!???!

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

In all fairness, I could see Sub-Zero do the Head Rip as a victory screen pose, the same way Injustice 2 did it.

How does it do it again? I never played/saw Injustice. I just know a few details.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

How does it do it again? I never played/saw Injustice. I just know a few details.

Something like this.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Something like this.

Hmm. That still feels a little bit unfriendly enough for it to not exist. It's not the same thing as Ridley's immense hits, as they're just on a character. This feels like it's being done on you, so I can imagine some will get uncomfortable.

I could see it being passed over due to that. They might still be able to do something really neat for a victory screen otherwise.

 

[TableCloth]

The closest thing I can think of to include for Subbie's FSs would be his polar bear Animality from UMK3. Still retains his ice effect (somewhat) and is a reference to an MK game, so I think it could fit.

Ngl I actually think this would be a pretty funny and neat idea for his FS. Maybe if the final hit of the match was from the FS it would get a special victory screen where it says "Sub-Zero wins...*animal noise effect* Animality." In the similar vain to Joker getting a unique win screen when he wins with a FS KO.

 

[Graizen]

Spoiler: Major story stuff for 11

So , Mortal Kombat 11 ended with Liu Kang restarting the MK Universe.

What if: Mortal Kombat 12 have this music and characters?

Mod Edit: Please mark major story spoilers, especially for just released games.

 

[MacDaddyNook]

I think we're definitely more likely to get Scorpion than Sub-Zero mostly because of the Boon-bias. However, I should say that I still think Sub-Zero being an Echo is not out of the realm of possibility. Him and Scorpion would have different specials, of course. Some people might disagree, but I think Chrom proves that you can be labeled as an Echo and still have different specials from the original character.

The only thing that concerns me is that Sub-Zero's Final Smash should 100% be a Fatality. But the one he's most known for isn't very PG.

I think Sub-Zero's Deep Freeze could work as a Final Smash. Going off him being an Echo of Scorpion, it could function identically to Toasty but be visually different.

With Toasty, I can see it having two variations, based on the target's damage, following a similar affect as Bayonetta & Ridley's FS. Scorpion would initiate the FS with a slightly differently animated Spear that pulls the target to him. This is immediately followed with the target placed in the dizzy animation while the iconic "Finish Him/Her/It/Them" message appears on screen (accompanied with the vocalization). As expected, Scorpion pulls off his mask to expose the flaming skull and then breathes fire, completely covering the target.

The variations come in which the outcome depends on the target's damage; if the damage is below 100%, the character will get burned and then launched away. For a little bit of humor, a "failed" Toasty can have the likeness of Dan Forden pop in and exclaim his famous "Toasty!" catchphrase. However, if the target is 100% or above, the character will be despawned (just like Bayo or Ridley's FS) and a "Fatality" message will appear in the same manner the "Finish" message, once again accompanied with the vocals. To keep things E-Rated, there will be no trace of the despawned character (no gore, remains, etc). If the phrase "Fatality" is too much for the E-10 rating, the phrase "Flawless Victory" could be used instead.

As for Deep Freeze, the FS would behave the same way. In this case, Sub-Zero would do an Ice Slide dash to connect with his target. Again the "Finished Him/Etc" message will happen with Sub-Zero encasing the target completely in ice, once again obscuring the character from view. He would then create an hammer of ice and smash it into the frozen character, shattering all ice constructs. Again, the damage would play a role in the final outcome with sub-100% damaged characters being launched out, this time with Forden exclaiming "Frosty!" like in MK3, and characters with 100% damage or more being completely despawned with the "Fatality/Flawless" message.

I believe this would work fine without going over the rating while keeping the feel of each character and minimizing the workload by keeping things functionally the same but visually different.

 

[UserKev]

How can Scorpion be likely if every Fighters Pass were decided?

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

How can Scorpion be likely if every Fighters Pass were decided?

Whoever says that Scorpion is "likely" frankly needs to rethink things, imo. And that's coming from someone whose most wanted is actually Scorpion.

Scorpion is basically a pipe dream that makes Cloud and Joker look like they were the most guaranteed characters ever in comparison.

He's associated with a franchise that is the peak of violence and gore to the point where some countries outright ban the games including Japan, which is where Sakurai lives.

It's possible to tone that down enough for him to work, but still, really hard for a creator to get a moveset going if the source material is considered illegal where they live, don't you think?

And that's why him getting in Smash would be the most mind-blowing thing ever to me.

With that said, if he's chosen, MK11 likely had zero impact on the matter, which I'm guessing is what you're implying with your question. The nearly three decades that the franchise had before it are the main factor here, and those decades obviously existed back when Sakurai was making choices for the DLC.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

People tend to think that Sakurai works himself too much. Meanwhile, in America…

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20...sed_of_taking_advantage_of_contracted_workers

Here it's clearly a case of it being unwilling...

 

[SKX31]

Whoever says that Scorpion is "likely" frankly needs to rethink things, imo. And that's coming from someone whose most wanted is actually Scorpion.

Scorpion is basically a pipe dream that makes Cloud and Joker look like they were the most guaranteed characters ever in comparison.

He's associated with a franchise that is the peak of violence and gore to the point where some countries outright ban the games including Japan, which is where Sakurai lives.

It's possible to tone that down enough for him to work, but still, really hard for a creator to get a moveset going if the source material is considered illegal where they live, don't you think?

And that's why him getting in Smash would be the most mind-blowing thing ever to me.

With that said, if he's chosen, MK11 likely had zero impact on the matter, which I'm guessing is what you're implying with your question. The nearly three decades that the franchise had before it are the main factor here, and those decades obviously existed back when Sakurai was making choices for the DLC.

I do agree that Scorpion's chances are pretty / very low, I'm just going to posit a small but important counterpoint:

First of all, CEVO's censorship regulations do not strictly ban games based on gore / blood, but instead they want Japanese releases to edit out gore / blood (to my knowledge, this is why Japanese RE4 doesn't have blood in it). The true problem come in with the X-Rays / Fatal Blows as well as Fatalities. They're integrated gameplay elements, and CEVO's position is thus (speculating here) focused on those elements - to a bigger degree than say RE4's use of blood.

Toning them down for release in just one country (even if it's a big one) is not in Netherrealm's interest when it a ) means changing animations from the ground up. For example, Sonya's helicopter Fatality smacking away the opponent instead of shredding him / her. And b ) would be another MK1 SNES story with most Japanese MK fans going for the unedited, pirated version anyway. On a bigger scale.

I find it more likely that the ban thing is more or less CEVO and Netherrealm both saying "Not worth the hassle".

However, Mortal Kombat could easily become an anime. Now I can't comment on how a possible MK anime would be censored in Japan, but I'm basing the possibility off how Japan early on had several really gory manga / anime series on MK's level (Fist of the North Star comes really close with its heavily-implied-to-be-Fatalities, Devilman Crybaby, Berserk etc.). I find it rather likely that a MK anime wouldn't have to be as toned down as a MK game.

Also, one of the series already repped in Smash lives on nowadays mainly as an animated series. Castlevania, with its Netflix show. I don't find it impossible that Scorpion could be included with a push for a MK manga / anime. A manga / anime also gives the Japanese creator(s) some degree of freedom to fit MK to a Japanese audience.

Just gotta convince Ed Boon et al on that, which isn't neccessarily easy.

 

[pupNapoleon]

For me, Scorpion and Sora, being heavily involved in crossovers themselves, truly would add an extra spice that not many other characters can.
That would just be one set removed from all of Disney, many horror characters (probably now also owned by Disney thanks to Fox purchase), and the Ninja Turtles (Which will probably soon be owned by Disney).

 

[UserKev]

I literally just seen a MK11 add on this very site. Haha Has Scorpion's Final Smash been thought of yet? I have a hard time coming up with it.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I literally just seen a MK11 add on this very site. Haha Has Scorpion's Final Smash been thought of yet? I have a hard time coming up with it.

That's one of the easiest things for me, honestly

Spoiler

 

[UserKev]

Scorpion's known fatality, while iconic, its a bit basic in Smash and the flamethrower would look Rate M coming from Scorpion. Have Scorpion transport the foe or foes to the Netherrealm where he teleports to the background, takes off his mask and shoot aim-able red fireballs. The final smash would work similar to how the Bowser boss fight operates in Yoshi's Island.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Scorpion's known fatality, while iconic, its a bit basic in Smash and the flamethrower would look Rate M coming from Scorpion. Have Scorpion transport the foe or foes to the Netherrealm where he teleports to the background, takes off his mask and shoot aim-able red fireballs. The final smash would work similar to how the Bowser boss fight operates in Yoshi's Island.

Taking them to the Netherrealm would be a cool touch.

 

[UserKev]

Taking them to the Netherrealm would be a cool touch.

The Netherrealm doesn't even need to be overly "serious" It could look like an environment shared with Bowser. That's what would make Scorpion so brilliant in Smash since Mortal Kombat already has a silly side.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

For something that hasn't been brought up yet (at least in detail), I think Scorpion's extra moves he has available when customizing in MK11 could be interesting for part of a moveset.

My favorites include

. Demon Breath, where he does the toasty fire breath as a regular special instead of a finishing move
. Demon Dash, where he dashes through the opponent and grabs them with a fiery arm (could work as a command grab)
. Death Spin, where he spins his kunai around in circles, making it a multi hitting attack
. Burning Spear, where he ignites the kunai which increases the damage on all spear attacks

Suppose some of these would be overkill, but fun to think of nonetheless for other move inspired ideas. Demon Dash would easily be my favorite idea for a side B now if I had to choose though.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I think I figured out the proper specials for Scorpion.

Neutral Special: Spear
Not much needs to be said here. It's the klassic Scorpion move. Works in the air, instantly performing his air throw he has in certain games like in MK9.

With that said, you can't set up combos with a stun, instead having a sword strike like MK11. And for both the air and ground versions, you choose the direction of the attack.

Side Special: Hell Flame (Nether Flame if they decide to censor the H word)
I hesitated between it and Demon Dash, but Hell Flame is slightly more prominent, as a similar move was in MKX as both a variation move and part of a Fatality. This type of projectile is also common in MK as a whole, so it's good franchise representation.

As a neat little touch to how you can decide the range depending on your input in MK11, you have the option of deciding how far the fireball goes depending on how long you hold the B button.

Up Special: Burning Wraith
Completely made up, being simply him launching himself while being covered in flames, but it has some connection to the games, as both his MKX X-Ray and one of his MK11 Fatalities has a similar thing. The direction can be chosen.

Down Special: Hell Port (Nether Port)
If he is within range of an enemy, he will teleport to them, striking them with a somewhat weak blow, but still packs enough of a punch to reset neutral.


With all of that said...

Gimmick: Gauge Management
Just like the latest games, he'd get a gauge that allowed him to enhance most of his specials. To enhance a special, a button would need to be pressed at the right time. I'm thinking Shield, but honestly, another B button press could work too. All enhanced specials require half your gauge.

Grounded Spear become the iconic combo starter that stuns the foes for a while if you enhance it as he begins to pull.
Aerial Spear simply adds much more damage, knockback and a fire effect. Based on MK11's Demon Slam.
Hell Flame causes an explosion if enhanced on hit.
Hell Port goes from a neutral reseter to a genuine kill option if enhanced upon landing it, as Scorpion would strike another time.
Hell Port also gets the bonus ability of being cancellable by holding down, which will also cost half your gauge.

Second Gimmick: Traditional Kombat (Kommand Inputs + Always facing foe in 1v1 + Special Kancels)
Basically, just like Ryu and Ken due to all three being from traditional fighting games, he gets extra damage and knockback from most of his specials when doing the kommand inputs. He also gets the same gimmick of always facing the foe on 1v1s to make those inputs easier.

Back - Forward - Attack gives Spear
Down - Forward - Attack gives Hell Flame
Down - Back - Attack gives Hell Port

Additionally, he can cancel any hit of his jab, his tilts and his aerials into specials, just like Ryu and Ken.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Aparently, even Mortal Kombat has fake feakers.

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20...ppearing_in_mortal_kombat_11_as_a_dlc_fighter

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Aparently, even Mortal Kombat has fake feakers.

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20...ppearing_in_mortal_kombat_11_as_a_dlc_fighter

It's not Mortal Kombat having fake leakers.

It's the Nintendo Switch port of it that has them.

Us Nintendo fanboys are just the worst, aren't we?

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/20...r_had_to_see_a_therapist_after_violent_dreams

You know...if there are any developers that legitimately need a break, it's these guys. Not anyone can see so much like this without being affected.