The Sonic Boards Community Guide (Reformat) - General/Moveset

[Chis]

So yeah, instead of doing what I should have done and just add Browny’s write ups with some of my own I just had to try and fit ‘everything’ discussed into each move. Even though some of those things will be discussed in the later sections of the guide and that sections were becoming far too big and less user friendly. It was a time eater.

Sorry about that, now let’s get this locomotive moving!

Fsmash

Sonics’ most damaging move percentage wise and also his strongest killing option. You may find it difficult to actually land the move due to its moderately lengthy start time so be warned that a fair amount of kills come from punishing mistakes. In order to get the most out of its killing ability you must keep it fresh, so only use it to KO your opponent when they’re at a high percentage and not for general damage purposes. Despite its long charge up time the actual punch comes out surprisingly fast, helpful if you’ve charged Fsmash after having read an opponent correctly.

Its reasonably large disjoint allows it to have priority over other moves such as Metaknight’s tornado if spaced and timed correctly. Furthermore it can be sutter stepped forwards in three various degrees and even shutter stepped backwards. Useful for spacing the move although situational. Like his forward tilt, it can be tilted up and down. Upwards allows you to deal with areal opponents better and downwards for edge guarding purposes. It may be Sonic’s strongest kill move, but in comparison to other characters it’s not that great.


Also is there a video or something which introduces new players into competitive Brawl? I'm sure a good amount of them would get confused by a lot of the terms in this thread.

 

[Trent]

FSmash is insanely good at punishing spot dodgers. If you notice someone being spot dodge happy, bust that move out.

It's also known as the "Hypno-Smash." I've had good players walk into a fully charged FSmash because they mis-judge the reach on it. Sonic actually takes a step back while charging it, then steps forward and his fist grows and covers a large distance.

You can also angle the Fsmash up, forward, and downwards. Tilting the angle does NOT affect the damage nor the trajectory of the opponent, it simply just changes where the hit box goes.

Fun Fact- FSmash tilted up beats Wario's Bite.

 

[da K.I.D.]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jnJDUp6u0M

imo a fantastic display of how to space with f smash.

 

[Tesh]

I like the way X and KID (in that video) use Fsmash. Clearly its not as simple as just saving it because its a kill move. Once you limit yourself in that way, you stop yourself from making good punishes with appropriate moves. Fsmash has great range and shouldn't be overlooked just because it won't kill outright until 100+. Sonic has a good gimp game and his highest knockback move is also good for pushing people farther offstage earlier.

 

[Trent]

SH Fair, Pummel from Grab, and DThrow are all great for undecaying moves. You shouldn't purposely NOT punish someone because you wish to save the move when you have all of these great undecayers.

However, you shouldn't spam Fsmash before it gets incredibly decayed. That's the same for all moves though, since you don't want to be predictable either.

 

[Browny]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jnJDUp6u0M

imo a fantastic display of how to space with f smash.

I could only watch the first stock before I had to close it...

Sorry but thats an example of how to space it vs an opponent with terrible spacing and leaving themselves way too open.

 

[da K.I.D.]

and?

still a good showing of me disrupting his spacing (poor as it may be) with the lean back on the move. and also, me utilising the maximum range on the move.

 

[Tenki]

Way back, I used to push for the use of retreating Fsmash when everyone was all about regular stutterstep.

Anyone still use it?

 

[da K.I.D.]

tommygreenshirt does.

when he needs a kill, he f smash your shield, than do another retreating f smash right after.

which brings up another point. charged f smash is usually safe on block.

 

[Trent]

Charged FSmash is awesome against a shielding D3 as long as he doesn't power shield it.

 

[Chis]

Edited into the OP. I'll make it look pretty on a later date.

Now let's talk about Up smash.

 

[Trent]

USmash is one of those moves I just throw in randomly once a set to catch an opponent off guard. If they see it coming prepare to get punished.

You can perform a Delayed DACUS with it, which throws opponents through a loop if they don't know about it via fox trot -> waiting -> DACUS input.

Opponents can SDI out of USmash which is annoying as well, since the final hit is the knock-back hit. I would use USmash for racking up damage rather than killing because of this factor.

P.S. LOTSA LAG on the move afterwards.

 

[Tesh]

The worst thing about it is that you don't even have to SDI to escape it. Even large characters are pretty much automatically tossed out at kill percents.

Poor SDI will actually keep you in sometimes though.

As most of us know, there is a lower mid percent range where upsmash tosses people out during the 5th through 7th hits resulting in a spike. Unfortunately its a fairly weak spike and its too laggy to setup for a tech chase on stage. You can also trip people on platforms above you to set up for bair kills.

Also, awesome skilled Sonic can pull off things like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZfz3CIrAQQ

 

[Browny]

I REALLY often dash-usmash people at the ledge and it hits very often rofl.

Like, stand well-outside their get-up attack range so the enemy know if the roll or legde attack they will be punished easily by sh fair etc. a normal get-up is quick enough and of course a ledgehop avoids anything you can react to from that distance, but a usmash covers both of those options. Its too slow to dash-usmash to react to them so I always do it before they make a move, people will rarely wait out theyre ledge invincibility and wont miss a chance to get back on stage if youre too far away.

This is great coz it can hit big characters even while they hang on the ledge Just be wary doing it vs anyone who might plank or ledgehop with something like ROBs fair.

 

[BSP]

Does Sonic's Usmash have any invincibiliity frames? I remember reading a while back that he was invincible while he's moving up into the ball position.

 

[Life]

Yeah, Usmash has a little invincibility to it. Great for breaking explosive blocks on Green Greens, among other things.

 

[Tesh]

Its just during the rising animation. With the distance and speed of sonic's dacus and hyphen smash, you can use this to tear through high priority aerials low to the ground.

Once he reaches the apex of his jump, the invincibility is definitely gone though.

Might be worth linking that old Upsmash spike thread, even though it was only half done.

 

[Chis]

Up smash out of shield sucks. I remeber someone saying something about Up smash being good against Snake or something...

Everything has been said really.

Does anyone have anything else to say?

 

[da K.I.D.]

up smash is great when people try to airdodge into the ground and a charged down smash wont kill.

 

[Tesh]

Make sure the OP explains how upsmash works and why it tosses people out before the killing blow. It spins people in a wheel but the knockback growth on some of the hits won't always link properly.

 

[Espy Rose]

Usmash is nice.
All 9% of it.

 

[Tesh]

It honestly seems to be that sometimes it DOES link properly without SDI. Every now and then I get a kill with it on light weights. Anyone else think there is a possibility of proper linking at some small percent ranges?

 

[da K.I.D.]

i think its postioning based.

when i run under somebody and up smash to beat their aerial, they pop out after like 1-3 hits, but when i use it to punish an airdodge, and they arent vulnerable until they actually touch the ground underneath the hitbox they usually stay in until the last hit.

 

[Chis]

Arn't there better ways to punish air dodges though? I mean, what does up smash do that makes it stand out?

 

[da K.I.D.]

lasts forever and covers mad distance.

theres also the fact that at times the invincibility gives you an option select. where it will beat an opponent move, and out last their airdodge at the same time, so itlly hit no matter what.

 

[Chis]

btw, have we done uair yet?

 

[da K.I.D.]

we should talk about which aerials up smash will beat reliably.

 

[Tesh]

Invincibility= All of them

Isn't it possible to show Invincibility using hacks now? Can't someone go see the exact frames we have for upsmash and SDH?

 

[da K.I.D.]

have you tried beating peachs/mks down air with it. invincibility only last 3 frames at the most. those 2 attacks will very regularly beat up smash.

HENCE WHY I SAID RELIABLY.

I know this character and I know wtf im talking about, so how about you dont second guess me next time... ****.

 

[kid craft 24/sonic master]

O_O!!!! ^^^mad?

 

[Chis]

I appreciate that we’re trying to be comprehensive, but let’s try not include everything eh? People may find it overwhelming and discouraging when faced with large walls of text and some information is more relevant than others. If they want to dig further, they can just ask members of the Sonic board right?

So are we done with Up smash yet?

 

[Browny]

Havent you learned yet kid? Everything Tesh says is sarcastic.

If he wants to be taken seriously, he has to mention it first.

 

[Chis]

I have a write up in the works, so while I find the time to finish it of, let's move on to the spring.

 

[Tesh]

Sonic's last resort escape move and vertical recovery. Sonic pulls a spring out of the air and shoots himself into the sky. When used on the ground, other characters can use the spring until it disappears 3 seconds later. In the air, the spring will will fall and deal 4-5 damage with weak mostly horizontal knockback.

Sonic can still use regular A button aerials and dodges after his Up B. He also retains the ability to footstool and walljump. However he cannot double jump or use specials after using Spring. The distance traveled can be slightly increased by using an an aerial attack or dodge (except down air) and can be cut short by using down air.

Unlike most other recovery moves, Sonic's spring is affected by gravity changes. In high gravity, spring will cover less distance than Sonic's double jump. In low gravity, Sonic shoots off the top of the screen and can take between 5-20 seconds to come back down. However, these changes almost never occur in standard competitive play.

Should be bother going into the details about Air Tripping in this section?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BF4puiGjP6g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdAotiHgkvQ

 

[Browny]

Spring dair is underrated.

Watch how __X__ uses it. In the same way Snakes dair is a horrible move, but A1ly makes it amazing, same thing applies here.

Flame away b*****s, but dont come here crying about how MK makes it impossible to land/***** your landing lag etc is unfair; X knows whats up

 

[Tesh]

Spring-dair is indeed underrated. Or it was at least.

Being predictable with anything gets you punished. Even great moves like tornado.

Also Spring-dair is one of the best combos out of spindash. Does more damage and is easier to follow up on. But I don't think we are going to be talking about all the uses here in the moveset overview.

 

[Espy Rose]

Spring dair is underrated.

Watch how __X__ uses it. In the same way Snakes dair is a horrible move, but A1ly makes it amazing, same thing applies here.

Flame away b*****s, but dont come here crying about how MK makes it impossible to land/***** your landing lag etc is unfair; X knows whats up

He got punished pretty heavily in some of the matches I spectated of him at MLG Dallas. One of them even lead to a stock loss at a low percent because he was read.

...just sayin'.

 

[da K.I.D.]

I use dair a ton to get to the ground against people who have amazing juggle games from below, like mk, zss, and marth.

 

[Life]

Sonic can be cypher-grabbed out of spring for an easy gimp. If you need to recover low with spring for some reason, do it low enough so you can airdodge through the grab.

 

[Mr. Johan]

Spring is typically used for 5 different scenarios, some moreso than others:

1) To recover.
2) As a "get the hell out" move.
3) To chase after an opponent high in the air.
4) As a damaging move out of a Spin Dash combo or as an out-of-the-blue move, and as a gimping tool, particularly on characters that require momentum to get to the edge, such as Link.
5) To abuse a grounded Spring's mechanic, to carry other characters up with Sonic.

I've seen some combo videos where a Spring was placed just as the opponent was landing, either from an aerial offense or as he was recovering, and Sonic and the opponent will fly up, and Sonic would Uair him over the top blastzone. It could be a good way to net a surprise kill every once in a while, but it's not something to use frequently.

Specifically in matchups, if a Meta Knight bounces on the Spring as he's moving over it with his Mach Tornado, it almost always results in the MK automatically going into Drill Rush, because the Tornado immediately stops, but the MK player is pressing B as quickly as he can to keep the Tornado moving. The Spring is also the only way (as far as I know) that a character can forcibly prevent Olimar from plucking Pikmin upon respawning (aside from the Olimar himself choosing not to pluck Pikmin), so long as the Sonic predicts where the Olimar is going to land. From there, Sonic can shark Olimar, keep kicking him back up in the air, and get as much damage or get him as close to the edge as he possibly can before Olimar gets enough time to get Pikmin.

Small note: the vertical distance Sonic gets from the Spring changes depending on where the Spring was used. A Spring used in the air grants Sonic a slightly smaller distance than a grounded Spring; it takes roughly a short hop + an aerial Spring to match the distance a grounded Spring gives.