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The ROB Matchup Thread

Mister Eric

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Yeah but I don't think Kakera is a better MK than M2K, and he lost to him right after that.
That's like inadvertently using Inui logic. Just because someone beat someone doesn't mean someone worse can't beat them lol.

-_- *Sigh*

Mister Eric, you don't understand my stand point toward R.O.B... I would have loved to be at APEX, I would have been in aw to have met OCEAN and to finally play him. I am not insulting him, nor am not insulting anything or anyone as a matter of fact. I respect OCEAN more than anyone R.O.B in the world. I would have said the same thing if I BEAT M2K....

Because if I beat the best MK in the world then I would assume he sandbagged, etc. I am not going to get into the MK MU. But I know damn well none of us can beat M2K, unless he simply does not care.

I go to tournaments because I love Super Smash Bros. Brawl, because I love the feeling when I don't go to a tourney for 2+ Months and come back and show everything I have improved on or learned. I go for the love of the game, and for the love of my character. You make it sound as if i hate R.O.B, last time I remember I said, multiple times, that I have mained him since Brawl's release. If I hated R.O.B, THEN WHY IN THE **** DO I STILL MAIN HIM?

I love it when people surround a T.V, that you're on, and people chant your name. I love the Hype, the community, the emotions and joy that come from it. Why do you ask that I go to tourneys? That is why!

So because I call ONE SET a fluke, I am not supposed to go to tournaments and drop my main that I have put my heart and soul into? No, I don't think so. I have more dedication to my character than most of you, and I am not assuming. I don't use Secondaries, because I want to win with MY MAIN, R.O.B.
8bit, I never said OCEAN > M2K. And I'm not saying that you're saying that I'm saying that (confusing sentence, no?).

What I am saying is, during that set, M2K got outplayed. OCEAN brought his A game and M2k couldn't figure out how to defeat it. But calling it a fluke is discrediting it imo. That's like saying it can't happen again and it shouldn't happen. I didn't go watch that set because I was hoping a fluke would happen. I watched that set from the very beginning because I believed in OCEAN. I watched his ROB the entire day. The kid is so smart. It's hard to even fathom unless you play him yourself, which I had a chance to. How about crediting hard work and passion for a character? If I beat someone at the caliber of m2k, I would hope to feel proud about it, not be told that it was a fluke, but rather be told it was because of my hard work.
 

Ralph Cecil

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I think what I said kind of contradicts Inui logic since I said Kakera beat Ocean when M2K lost to him, and then I said M2K was still better than him. o-o
 

Mister Eric

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No because it's saying something like
OCEAN > M2k therefore since m2k > Kakera
then OCEAN should be > Kakera
but he isn't because Kakera beat him.

Therefore, "fluke" lol.
 

Heartstring

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aw man i LOVE inui logic, i use it during the rock-paper scissors before a match all the time

i throw rock, they throw paper
i say 'yeah, but scissors beat you, and i beat scissors. Logic states that i beat you'
Someone actually fell right for it, i had to explain to joke -__-
 

8Bitman

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You kinda just restated your point, I understood what you were saying. But you're kind of making my standpoint look like *** rather than thinking about it. I realize that OCEAN beat him, but the fact that I am not the only one saying, that obviously means something isn't just about it.

I am not discrediting the set, I am simply saying, it would have seemed more legit to others, and myself if M2K didn't play like a complete jack***. Don't you find it a little weird that OCEAN got easily timed out on Delfino, yet M2K refused to use the same play style on BF and SV. Especially on SV where he seems to do it all the time.

M2K used to be a very smart player, but he stopped caring, and I feel he didn't beat M2K, he just beat some random MK.

He beat M2K, yes I completely comprehend that. But I am discussing my opinion of the set. -_-
 

Heartstring

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so guys, matchups! as this thread is intended for
i have photographic proof that ike beats rob head to head
 

-LzR-

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Offtopic like a boss. GP, are you coming to MSN3? Me and Loota might be coming, wish you could be there too.
Also badass snowstuff. There is barely snow there lol.
 

Heartstring

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cool and cool. its a little short notice considering flight cost a lot if not done ages in advance. but i shall take a good look on thursday, when i'm with other smashers
 

-LzR-

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Nah the flights can be super cheap. We found some really cheap flights, but I'm not the one who's in charge of finding them. Probably 2-3 Finns are coming.
 

Heartstring

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cool, although englands conversion rate is superduper crap right now. still, ill check it out with the other smashers
 

Chef Fox

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What do you guys think about the Game and Watch matchup? How does G&W usually approach R.O.B. if R.O.B. is camping nonstop?
 

Zwarm

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The same way G&W approaches everyone, Bair.

But honestly, it's not that bad of a MU, not in ROB's favor by any means, but still not too bad.
 

-LzR-

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I don't think G&W has that bad time getting in. He is still terrible at approaching, but when he gets in, Rob is gonna get hurt. It's a keep him out or die MU imo, but I haven't played the MU when both players have been good, just using the "I main both of them so I know everything logic".
 

Heartstring

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GYRO EVERYWHERE. THATS HOW
IMO this is probably -1. if one because we cant land vs. this guy. that nair's hitbox is SO WIDE. IT'S LIKE YOUR MOTHER!

But in all honestly, its obvious when a G&W is fishing for the bucket. just fire the gyro at him. his dodgy jab makes g7w have an ven harder time trying to pick it up than others (that is, if he's stupid enough to try and pick it up)
 

-LzR-

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GYRO EVERYWHERE. THATS HOW
IMO this is probably -1. if one because we cant land vs. this guy. that nair's hitbox is SO WIDE. IT'S LIKE YOUR MOTHER!

But in all honestly, its obvious when a G&W is fishing for the bucket. just fire the gyro at him. his dodgy jab makes g7w have an ven harder time trying to pick it up than others (that is, if he's stupid enough to try and pick it up)
No one picks items with jabs wtf? How about SH instant toss or nair? Also you can bucket laser on reaction unless you commit to something far away. I think it's a slight disadvantage, nair ftw.
 

Heartstring

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yeah you dont pick up items with jab because G&W jab is ***. Being an ike main. I'm used to have an all purpose jab :B
 

-LzR-

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Seriously, just SH away and z catch it. Much safer and allows you to retreat or approach while doing it. I actually prefer SH instant toss since it's damn fast, but I don't really like picking it up with jabs.
 

-LzR-

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If they are trying to punish when you pick up the gyro, I would prefer SH instant throw as it pretty much always gets them. Rob gets so many options with a gyro it's amazing.
 

8Bitman

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I was going to state my opinion, then I saw that ccst said it was a -2...

Dear lord....
 

Mister Eric

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Sorry for the long wait. I had a reply worked out in my head the moment I first read this a week ago, but I've been such a busy bot that I haven't felt comfortable taking the time to respond until I had more of a breather, so here ya go.


You kinda just restated your point, I understood what you were saying. But you're kind of making my standpoint look like *** rather than thinking about it. I realize that OCEAN beat him,
Lol, I'm aware that you know who won.

but the fact that I am not the only one saying, that obviously means something isn't just about it.
That's like saying that because people supported the Holocaust, it means something. Sure it does, but what does it mean exactly?
If you really want to go that route how about I just leave one of the most liked posts on that video:



Obviously means something, right? Ehh, maybe. I really don't think so.

I am not discrediting the set, I am simply saying, it would have seemed more legit to others, and myself if M2K didn't play like a complete jack***.
The funny thing, and something I'm unsure that you've realized, is I feel the same way. M2K wasn't playing like a star. But what players consistently do? It's hardly ever a breeze for anyone to snag first place anymore. I know he could of played 10x better. But what about OCEAN? Who's to say he was playing his best? All that really matters is what happened right then right there. Two players sat down, one that has a very high level background and another with a vision and a drive to stop at nothing to do the best he can. That alone is enough for me to say that whoever won, the other got outplayed. If M2K doesn't know the MU, then that's his fault. Any high caliber player should know ANY MU. No johns.

Don't you find it a little weird that OCEAN got easily timed out on Delfino, yet M2K refused to use the same play style on BF and SV. Especially on SV where he seems to do it all the time.
Well, isn't it a little weird to time someone out when they never ONCE had the % lead (game 1)? And you're telling me I'm not thinking about your standpoint? What about your own standpoint lol.
Game 2, it was fairly close, and probably uncomfortable for m2k to play around the OPEN space of DP.
Game 3, most of the time M2K even got a decent % lead, like 25% at 14:48, it's a bit difficult to process, oh snap, I'm 25% ahead, instead of, hey I'm MK, I should instead try punishing his landing. Besides, what's 25% on a ledge? A gyro and a laser? In 7.5 minutes do you rly think he couldn't land a gyro and a laser?

Well how about at 16:50, there's a good 34%, yeah, for a moment. MK has ROB off the stage, he prob wants to stay around and pressure him like any MK would. But before he knows it a gyro and a laser puts it back to 19% where another gyro could easily even the match out.

At around 17min, he has ROB right where he wants him, is he going to run away there then too? If he did against me, I would just think he was scared lol.

Right around 19:02, M2K realizes "3 min are left, I'm probably should zone him out with a 46% lead" But he just miszones him and get upward angled sniped. He isn't perfect. Just because we call him a robot doesn't make him that lol. And this is a very common camping strat for MKs on BF. You have to keep in mind that Delfino gives M2K a lot more room to work with. On top of that, OCEAN's flub on getting grabbed KO'd his 2nd stock really put him behind. THEN was a smart time to play safe and play for the time out.
Also, to point out at this time frame is how OCEAN handles the camping. He doesn't approach like most of us would. Especially since he's only a handful of projectiles from bringing it back. And 3 min is still plenty of time to work with.

After this, M2K baits a plank, OCEAN baits a bite and reacted properly. From there, they just gruel it out.

I can break down each and every hit if you want me to. Anything to convince you that I'm considering your standpoint and the scenario at hand.

M2K used to be a very smart player, but he stopped caring, and I feel he didn't beat M2K, he just beat some random MK.
Last time I checked, random MKs don't typically get the opportunity to be playing for auto 9th place if they win ( I believe that's right) at an international tourney.

He beat M2K, yes I completely comprehend that.
very nice


But I am discussing my opinion of the set. -_-
As am I.

------------------------------

I'm not trying to hype you up over this match. You can be as little hyped as you prefer. But don't say words that discredit this guy's loss.
If I sound like a d**k, I'm not meaning to. I'm just finding a lot of holes in what you're arguing with me against.
The entire match all boils down to two words for me:
No johns.
 

-LzR-

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What is the current opinion of Rob vs Marth? From what I have heard it has been supposedly even, but I don't see what Rob is able to do after Marth gets past his tilts and stuff. Is there any reason for me to use Rob at all with an ICs/G&W combo anyways?
 

Heartstring

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It's even. Our close range options are faster than his Barring up-B, which is risky unless used on battlefield in the right position.
The matchup is even relying on you playing it correctly, which is-of course-not letting him get on your robotic ****
 

Heartstring

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Err, depends if you're prefer to try and keep marth out or try and get in. I personally play keepout MUCH better. But I mean, just look at my mains :B
I disagree with R.O.B being useless, He just doesnt have any standout matchups for you because you already main 2 good characters
 

-LzR-

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That's what I kinda mean't, useless for me. Rob is not a bad character, he just isn't too much of a use for me except some situational use like Marth on certain stages where I don't want to use Icies.
 

Heartstring

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Well, He also has use vs. icies if you hate the ditto. And other things. But if your high tiers are already better than your rob, then theres hardly any reason for you to keep using him
 

-LzR-

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Agreed. Glad there are only 2 Icies here and the other one isn't nearly at my level so I'm fine with the ditto. Rob is still probably my best char though, maybe he is like what I'm using on Frigate and stuff, don't want to face Marth there with Icies at all.
 

8Bitman

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what is your opinion on it?
I feel the R.O.B/GW MU is dead even. I have used GW since the beggining of Brawl, just not as heavily as I did R.O.B. I have also played against many R.O.B's (With GW) and against many GW's (With R.O.B).

If you mained GW you wouldn't begin to understand how lucky you have to be to get a successful approach in. His only good option is Bair, and don't you think R.O.B would know that? R.O.B has TOO MUCH range over GW, and R.O.B's projectiles help combo the crap out of GW. Plus there is no point in GW absorbing them, it leads to an extremely weak Bucket.

As long as R.O.B stays grounded, FTilts, and Bairs, this MU is pretty harsh for GW. Yes we can get combo'd, but what does that do, rack up 60% tops? then we just land and combo them. As long as you aren't a ROLLING GOPHER and get Usmashed 9,001 times, you should be fine.

Any problems?
I just feel that you are damning the MU to be 10X harder than it truly is. It is dead even, if not in R.O.B's favor.
 

dettadeus

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I have a lot of experience with the MU, so let's see what I can think up:
-Powershield or reflect the eggs. If Yoshi is at the ledge or at a distance where he can't punish it, RoboCopter works as a good deterrent to throwing eggs. Otherwise just powershield them.
-If Yoshi gets on the edge, get a gyro next to him and get ready to powershield a lot of eggs. IIRC Yoshi can only regrab the ledge with his U-Special five times, so after that he'll try to get back on. Make sure to have a laser ready to punish whatever he gets back with for some free damage.
-Watch out for slopes. Yoshi has some neat tricks with slopes, so generally avoid them (especially the platform on Yoshi's Island).
-You're going to beat him off-stage, so don't be afraid to try and gimp him.
-When you're at high percents, stay on the ground and camp. Yoshi's camping game is terrible compared to R.O.B.'s and his shield takes another couple of frames to come out IIRC so lasers will become more difficult to block. Don't ever go into the air when Yoshi is near you because it's like a free U-Air which will kill at high percents.
-If you manage to shield a SH Bair approach (instead of like F-Tilting him out of it) keep shielding after he lands because he's going to go for an U-Tilt or Jab Combo and those are punishable on shield at the range he'll be doing them.

Not a whole lot else I can think of.
 

AnseLm

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So stay grounded as much as possible until he's off stage? It feels like FSmash should shut down his approaches, do you have a lot of success with it? Or is Ftilt a better option?
 
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