The Problem with Pit

[Kiligar]

This post is meant to realistically analyze all of Pit’s weaknesses. Just how viable is Pit? Although some players are ridiculous in their claim that he’s low tier, such as SmashProGuides. It’s nothing new that some don’t know what they’re talking about, such as with Mr. Game&Watch. Many who’ve faced decent Pits think he’s somewhere in the upper part of mid tier. And certain skilled Pit mains think he’s low high tier. But where truly is he, and why? And what holds him back from being better?

Problem #1 Mid Percent Crisis

When Pit hits the medium percentage on his opponent, he loses all combos bar his throw combos. What this means is the only way he can deal a decent amount of damage is if he grabs the opponent. The problem with that is that grab is very punishable in this game, and opponents are spot dodging and covering their landings with jabs or tilts 24/7. This makes it more difficult to pull of a grab. And if he doesn’t pull off a grab, Pit’s going to be doing <15% with every interaction. Even with grab, Dair stops combining into X surprisingly quick . Pit’s Nair just doesn’t combo into anything at mid percent, everything you get will mean you have to win the neutral again. This puts Pit in a Sheik like situation. Although grab is a way out, the issue is Pit depends on it too much, while for other swordies it’s simply a mix up and nothing more due to the pressure their aerials put on the opponent .

Problem #2 Struggling to kill

What exactly does it mean Pit struggles to kill? Yes, his forward smash is quite strong for its amazing speed. Yes the arms are decent at killing, and so is Bair. Dash attack is pretty strong as well. But the problem isn’t simply power, but safe kill options. All of Pit’s kill confirms aren’t safe on shield. If they shield an f smash and you’re at high percent, you’re probably dead. Guaranteed if it’s Upperdash arm. The only safe kill option Pit has is Bair, and that’s very telegraphed due to his air mobility. Basically, the opponent can shield forever until they reach f throw percent, using the shield to bait grab and spamming Oos. So yes, Pit has an issue with killing, which comes off of hard reads. Usually you’ll have to get your opponent to around 150% if you don’t use a risky kill option. Of course this is problematic when there are opponents with oppressive and safe kill options such as Chroy, ZSS, the Links, Joker, Pikachu, Ness and more.

Problem #3 Exploitable Recovery

Pit’s recovery is very exploitable if he’s forced to use Wings of Flight at long distances. His side Special is terribly unreliable for recovery, the super armor comes out quite late which means an opponent can simply swat you with a Bair while you startup. It also lasts a measly amount of time and is very telegraphed, the opponent only has to Dair right before you reach ledge since you have no Super-Armor at that time. And projectiles mess this move way over, a surprisingly big problem, such as Samus Down Special, Mario Fire balls, Pikachu thunder jolt, Charizard/Bowser Firebreath, Yoshi Up Special, the Links’ projectiles Arsenal, and more. This can get you killed. Especially against Charizard. What this means is Pit prefers Wings of Flight, problem being it has no hitbox, is very reactable due to the startup and is easy to 2 frame. Against certain characters like Palutena, you can be 2 framed basically infinitely if the Palu is consistent with their timing. Of course arrows and multiple jumps do help to an extent, but his jumps don’t gain too much height nor does he have that much air speed. Arrows can be reflected or absorbed. When it comes down to it, Pit has an exploitable recovery overall, yes there are many worse out there but it’s a significant weakness nonetheless, especially against consistent 2 frames.

These sum up Pit’s main issues. Another one which only applies for certain matchups is Pit having bad reflectors, with the arm being useless the majority of the time and orbitals having a lot of lag and a dead zone in the bottom corners of the shields. But since this doesn’t apply to every matchup I didn’t include it. As of what I think of Pit’s viability, I believe he’s a gatekeeper, at the edge of mid and high tier. I’ll add a visual to clarify. Not all characters will be included, just enough to get the point across. The example tier list is unordered.

High High Tier:


Mid High Tier:


Low High Tier:


Borderline:

Upper Mid Tier:

What this example shows is the characters above Pit have a certain level of oppressive ability which Pit lacks. Whereas Pit had a certain level of consistency the Upper Mid tiers lack. Why’s Corrin there too? After the patch, Corrin has become consistent enough to reach the level of Pit, via the recovery buff mainly which further separates Corrin from Ike. Corrin struggles to kill just as Pit does but has a very good juggling game, a pretty good neutral and a great dash into shield. Corrin has more range than Pit, but worse frame data, but is a much better juggler, however most of Corrin’s specials are niche bar Side Special, the counter can be used to edgegaurd and prevent being edgegaurded. So overall, that’s how I feel where Pit is. In the next thread, I will discuss which moves Pit needs fixed, and how to make Pit better without losing the “honest” character archetype. Thanks for reading.

 

[Phyras]

We do lose most of our combos before kill percents, but grab isn't the only way to grind some damages, Down & up tilt, landing Nair/Dair can do it to, allowing Pit to put some pressure grounded and airborne. Pit has the tools to punish spotdodge, the "most pressuring defense" of smash ultimate, that's a strength we don't talk about. Once you've shown your opponent that Spotdodging is not an option and grab isn't mandatory, maybe down throw (or lethal forward throw) will be easier to get.

Pit's recovery's not that exploitable. Side Special and Up special have weakness but there's no absolute recovery. Jumps are not meant to "gain too much height" but you can use them to mix-up the timing of your recovery. Not every characters can two frames with down tilt and most must anticipate and commit with an aerial or a slow attack and your jumps allow to stale and wait for the commit. Of course the lower you are the easier it is to intercept but you don't need to go very low unless the opponent is already committing to the abyss.

I think Pit got the strength to shift from game plan to game plan because of his versatility. Good dash, dash attack, grab, pivot grab, Oos and spotdodge catcher like Fsmash and Nair indicate that Pit got strong whiff & punish game. But anytime you feel like it, you can shift from whiff & punish to ground pressure to Air pressure to ranged harassment and combine every bit of those game plans every time you get to press a button.

I never walked into 2 Pits with the same play style and it feel a lot like Pokemon trainer having 3 characters in one except you've access to every moves anytime at the cost of weaker versions of each move. But Pit didn't get his Leffen, nobody labs Pit day and night to documents every matchup in detail and prove his hard work in world wide tournament.

We did no documentation on follow-up, setups, projectile trade, what is safe on shield, everything depending of matchup.
If a new player would start playing Pit today, he'ld only got documentation on true combos, some obvious tips about not using Side b because it's trash and some pro tip about how to deal with the main cheesy moves from character X. If mankind must to re-discover everything every generation, it can't progress. Same is true with fighting game characters and especially true with a character that don't have an absolute game plan.

Setups are one of the most important part of fighting games, it's the gate to conditioning, damage enablers and kill opportunity. Pit definitely has some and nobody talk about it therefore nobody seems able to state all Pit's setups. As long we can't state Pit's setups, how can we judge effectively his strength once Combos are gone ? If we find some sequences of moves would always lead to a 50/50 with a kill opportunity, would you still claim that Pit struggle to kill ?

 

[Courageous Baka]

Someone on the Pit Discord found this here setup that could circumvent the killing issue.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1mz5UYD8oX8OlnQUNIbbiCrjvy9Un23N1/view


https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1vkvk8HGpWmJWYqRcqSq0dS1fsV3K3Ca5KJjuVlfnFEA/htmlview