The One Winged Angel~ Sephiroth Support Thread

Mezzama

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I believe everything I mentioned (with the exception of the wing ironically) is from FFVII - given most or all of the magic is Safer Sephiroth. If only FFVII is allowed: sacrifice the wing/multi-jumps and either meteor or shadow flare. It is more likely of course they'd just shorten the sword and make him a quick swordboi, but that'd be disappointing for me - likely wouldn't stop me from playing him and enjoying it admittedly. Preferable however for him to have some massive weakness(es) (maybe being really light and having just garbage up special) in exchange for magic and not gimping his speed. If they'd make him slow, let it be the 'lag' as others have mentioned rather than startup - may it have a bounce effect on block which leaves him wide open if needs be. If he manages to make it, a travesty it would be to implement him in any generic way.
 
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Yeah, I'm on that note too.
I don't believe any leakers at this point.
I posted that for funsies, and the idea of how development of other characters may be going along
 

Mezzama

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I said that because I wasn't sure which were you basing on.
Also, at the very beginning of this thread, there was a dude who posted an extensive look at his/her ideas for a moveset, and used KHII footage to show the moves in action.
But I got you dude

EDIT: Uhhhh......
Did anyone see this?
http://boards.4channel.org/v/thread/451551189
Totally understandable as every move I mentioned is also in KH. (except pale horse lol). Well, I put no faith in that leak but would be ecstatic if it turned out to be true. Know nothing of monster hunter, but none of the others would disappoint me and of course: Sephiroth.

Edit: Birth of a God would be hype.
 
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Mezzama

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Are you particularly excited for any of the other characters as well or just the glimmer of hope for Sephiroth? Personally, of the rest, I'd be most excited for Sans - unpopular opinion I know: really think he'd fit well in smash. Likely wouldn't play him much, but his existence in the game would be cool to me. Never played Banjo and Kazooie but I know many would be celebrating at that announcement so I'd be happy for them. Really though, with Joker's announcement, I lost any right to complain about future choices. Would drop Joker hype in an instant for Seph (Or Hazama but no chance of that lol) but I'm happy regardless. Really just hoping for whatever characters would make the most players hyped so more people play and enjoy the game.
 

fleshdude.gov

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I'm wishing really hard for that leak to be true. You have no idea. XD
I was thinking about that leak actually and I realized something.

So you know how Duck Hunt and Mii Swordsman can corrupt your save data like Pirahna Plant, and because of that people were thinking that Duck Hunt was being used as a base for a DLC fighter because Pirahna Plant had leftover data from Bowser Jr.?

Well, there's another fighter that can corrupt your save data (according to some reports) and that's Pikachu being used online. Now, I don't know that much about Monster Hunter, but just from a cursory glance at the character Feylin, they're both small, primarily quadrupedal mammals which can also stand on their hind legs. If I was a game designer trying to find a quick base for a skeleton to make Feylin off of, Pikachu would be a fairly logical choice.

And if Feylin and Banjo get in, well...
Sephiroth's chances will be looking real nice.
 

Mezzama

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I was thinking about that leak actually and I realized something.

So you know how Duck Hunt and Mii Swordsman can corrupt your save data like Pirahna Plant, and because of that people were thinking that Duck Hunt was being used as a base for a DLC fighter because Pirahna Plant had leftover data from Bowser Jr.?

Well, there's another fighter that can corrupt your save data (according to some reports) and that's Pikachu being used online. Now, I don't know that much about Monster Hunter, but just from a cursory glance at the character Feylin, they're both small, primarily quadrupedal mammals which can also stand on their hind legs. If I was a game designer trying to find a quick base for a skeleton to make Feylin off of, Pikachu would be a fairly logical choice.

And if Feylin and Banjo get in, well...
Sephiroth's chances will be looking real nice.
You people are too good at giving me hope. As much as I'll hope to my heart's future discontent; even if Feylin gets announced I won't place much more faith in the leak: always the chance only one character is known or correctly guessed. If they both get in though...as someone else mentioned: if B&K were to be announced it would be at E3 given Microsoft and Nintendo's presence there. So that would be the earliest any faith could be had (given of course a favorable prior announcement with Feylin).

Regardless, atm my policy with leaks is to discuss with hope while pretending every leaked character is an official de-confirm as to not be too disappointed (or ecstatic if the leak contains characters considered by me to be garbage).
 
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Are you particularly excited for any of the other characters as well or just the glimmer of hope for Sephiroth? Personally, of the rest, I'd be most excited for Sans - unpopular opinion I know: really think he'd fit well in smash. Likely wouldn't play him much, but his existence in the game would be cool to me. Never played Banjo and Kazooie but I know many would be celebrating at that announcement so I'd be happy for them. Really though, with Joker's announcement, I lost any right to complain about future choices. Would drop Joker hype in an instant for Seph (Or Hazama but no chance of that lol) but I'm happy regardless. Really just hoping for whatever characters would make the most players hyped so more people play and enjoy the game.
I'm excited for basically every single character there, although MH is not a series I'm super familiar with. I love the little cat though. X3
But Seph being there is definitely what hypes me up more than anything.

I was thinking about that leak actually and I realized something.

So you know how Duck Hunt and Mii Swordsman can corrupt your save data like Pirahna Plant, and because of that people were thinking that Duck Hunt was being used as a base for a DLC fighter because Pirahna Plant had leftover data from Bowser Jr.?

Well, there's another fighter that can corrupt your save data (according to some reports) and that's Pikachu being used online. Now, I don't know that much about Monster Hunter, but just from a cursory glance at the character Feylin, they're both small, primarily quadrupedal mammals which can also stand on their hind legs. If I was a game designer trying to find a quick base for a skeleton to make Feylin off of, Pikachu would be a fairly logical choice.

And if Feylin and Banjo get in, well...
Sephiroth's chances will be looking real nice.
Now that is VERY interesting to know. Hoping it comes to fruition!

You people are too good at giving me hope. As much as I'll hope to my heart's future discontent; even if Feylin gets announced I won't place much more faith in the leak: always the chance only one character is known or correctly guessed. If they both get in though...as someone else mentioned: if B&K were to be announced it would be at E3 given Microsoft and Nintendo's presence there. So that would be the earliest any faith could be had (given of course a favorable prior announcement with Feylin).

Regardless, atm my policy with leaks is to discuss with hope while pretending every leaked character is an official de-confirm as to not be too disappointed (or ecstatic if the leak contains characters considered by me to be garbage).
Hahahahaha
I suggest everyone to keep their expectations tame as always.
And Banjo's chances are looking extremely good. Microsoft's recent approximation and teases are insanely hyping people up.
 
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So....about the direct today guys. FFIX comes out today but FFVII doesn't??? What's more, with us apparently getting more about Joker before April, there's high speculation of a Smash direct. The same month that FFVII finally comes to the Switch.......hm. If you do the math there......
I would hope that's the case... but I wouldn't get my hopes up for it happening though.

Another piece of fanart I'd want to see happen if Sephiroth gets in is another one of :ultbowser::ultbowserjr::ultlarry::ultroy2::ultwendy::ultiggy::ultmorton::ultlemmy::ultludwig::ultganondorf::ultkrool::ultpiranha::ultridley::ultdarksamus:and:ultwolf: with Sephiroth at a pub raising their mugs (Chocolate milk for Bowser Jr. and the Koopalings) all celebrating their returns and inclusions to Ultimate while other villains (Black Knight, Black Shadow, Porky Minch, Skull Kid, etc.) are all watching sadly outside through a window on the verge of tears having not made the cut.
You know Porky isn't out of the running yet right? He still has a chance.
 
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Wow, Sony copying strikes again.
I'll be happy for news on the Remake.
But a part of me will be sad bc I was really hoping for a reunveiling of the game on a Nintendo Direct. :(
It would be groundbreaking, fitting and would show which other platform the game would be in.
 

Nazyrus

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Concert happening just a few days before E3. Same place and time and everything like it was for KH3. KH3 had two of these, one after 2 years of hiatus and one before the game released, in which i believe Nomura attended even. Nomura and Kitase said 7 and long awaited for 2019 last year… This is it, they are gonna start snowballing marketing in June, about frigging time!
 

Nazyrus

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Watch "brave" be Sephiroth for Smash Bros, since he was considered a "Hero" in the game before he went mad + Final Fantasy 7 Remake will be the highlight of SE's E3, perfect timming for marketing FF7 in general + mii costumes could be gunner = barret, brawler = tifa, zack = sword fighter, it just fits perfectly for miis (and obviously they could bring back geno, as we saw both new and returning sega miis with joker). A spirit board theme would be easy to get as well, and the remaining music we always wondered and were surprised were missing is actually coming with Sephiroth. A new stage? Maybe Nibelheim in flames… altho he has many other potential stages he could come with.
 
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Watch "brave" be Sephiroth for Smash Bros, since he was considered a "Hero" in the game before he went mad + Final Fantasy 7 Remake will be the highlight of SE's E3, perfect timming for marketing FF7 in general + mii costumes could be gunner = barret, brawler = tifa, zack = sword fighter, it just fits perfectly for miis (and obviously they could bring back geno, as we saw both new and returning sega miis with joker). A spirit board theme would be easy to get as well, and the remaining music we always wondered and were surprised were missing is actually coming with Sephiroth. A new stage? Maybe Nibelheim in flames… altho he has many other potential stages he could come with.
That would be our final chance to finally get the content FF7 desperately needs.
 
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Square announced its E3 with this tweet.
That green on the left painting is unmistakable.
FFVII is coming to E3.

https://twitter.com/SquareEnix?ref_src=twsrc^google|twcamp^serp|twgr^author

There is no better time for Sephiroth to be announced!
Every Erdrick has fallen apart, with only the words of leakers left to support it, alongside the circumstancial evidence that Brave is Erdrick's title.
Joker, alongside Arsene and PP show that codenames aren't necessarily direct references, and usually make sense once you know the character per se.
And with the Mii Costume theory being a thing that makes a ton of sense, and us having still no Smash 4 Mii Costumes returning, a S-E rep as DLC is basically confirmed
This could be Sephiroth's time to be in Smash!!
 

Nazyrus

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I'm seriously thinking that, if SE rep is coming at E3, it would have to be no other than Sephiroth (or Sora). Final Fantasy VII Remake taking the spotlight would TOTALLY overshadow another rep like a DQ one. With DQ not being that successfull worldwide but mostly in Japan, and on the other hand FFVII being the most controversial and successful SE game SE has ever made to this day, they would definitely feel more inclined in marketing whatever is taking the spotlight now I feel. Yes they are making a movie of DQ and doing a bunch of stuff for it, but not even a smash character would get them that much more success to the DQ games, they have been trying for years and years now. I think the smartest thing for them would be to put more FF7 content, specially after that lack of music and spirits, it's almost suspicious and I doubt very much that they are being stingy about it, when Sakurai (or Reggie I think it was) said themselves that they have never had issues getting the characters they've gotten so far. I dunno… If we are getting Erdrick instead, then I think it won't be at E3, because that would totally go against DQ with FF7R taking such a huge spotlight, lol. If it's erdrick, then they will definitely not reveal him at E3, unless they are dumb. This is why, If I want a SE rep to be announced soon, i have more hopes for Sephiroth. If nothing SE related, then Banjo, lol.
 
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So there was a new trailer for FFVII remake released that showed Sephiroth here a couple of days ago. Anybody think his chances of getting into Smash are improved by the good sales of the FFVII remaster port on Switch and the increased visibility with the FFVII remake coming to E3 this year as a big part of Sony's presentation?
 
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Nazyrus

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So there was a new trailer for FFVII remake released that showed Sephiroth here a couple of days ago. Anybody think his chances of getting into Smash are improved by the good sales of the FFVII remaster port on Switch and the increased visibility with the FFVII remake coming to E3 this year as a big part of Sony's presentation?
tbh putting him in smash now would be an insta win for both nintendo and square enix. Best timming possible ever
 
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tbh putting him in smash now would be an insta win for both nintendo and square enix. Best timming possible ever
That's what I'm thinking. The stars have basically aligned for this character. I feel like I can confidently say there will NEVER be a better time to include this character.

If there is a better time, it's slim because it would basically require the remake to come out at the same time as another fighter pass or a new Smash game (which also happens to contain Cloud). Our time is now!
 

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Honestly Sephiroth seems inevitable to me. It all just fits too well. Especially with the complete lack of FF content in base. Leakers aside, I think he's by far the most likely square rep.
 

Nazyrus

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If there happened to be a dual reveal in E3 I wouldn't be surprised at all if one of them was Microsoft (Banjo) and a Square Enix one (Hopefully Sephiroth), since those 2 conferences will have the biggest pressence this time around. It would make one hell of an E3 for sure …
 
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My fellow friends
I was intending on posting this tomorrow, but because of a discussion held at a particular server on Discord, I'll post now the summary of Sephiroth's current state and chances before E3.

A bit of bg outside of the game itself: Sakurai himself is good friends with Uematsu and Nomura long before Smash Ultimate's launch (dating back decades by now).
He is a renowned Final Fantasy VII fan, and is one of the reasons he aimed for Cloud in Smash 4.
At the time of Smash 4's release, Nintendo and Square's relationship was still rocky, and Cloud was basically the ambassador for the companies to reestablish a relationship and aim for future work on the line of the SNES days.
Cloud in Smash 4 was successfully their first step for them.

Regarding FF representation in Smash Bros.

If you know Square-Enix, you know they tend to be very protective of their IP and how it is handled, something Sakurai himself has expressed in a Famitsu column years ago. And Square only managed to be open to having their characters appear as guests in third party developed games in this last decade. Their usual practice is usually a character and one or two songs, as they not only have more papers than usual to deal with but it is also more expensive and harder to obtain (they base their strategies a lot on trust).
Fast forward to today. Cloud has been the most used character online in Smash Ultimate, according to Sakurai himself. Cloud and Midgar with the summons in the base game were already insane given that their IPs were never in a base game of a third party developed game before. This shows a huge improvement in their relationship (not even counting the FF ports, VII being made a huge deal by Nintendo and selling well, and the rest of the new games launching on Switch). It shows they trust Nintendo. But if there were to have any more content, it would deviate from the original contract, and thus, it would only be possible for it to be possible if a DLC focused on FFVII is a thing. The DLC packs focus on a new character, stage, music and spirits. FFVII lacked strongly in the last two, and as a character, Sephiroth is, alongside Eggman, the most popular third party villain of all time. The lack of new content in Ultimate imo actually improves the chances of a FFVII character by a ton.

Regarding Sephiroth himself, he is a character that has never appeared in Smash Bros. in any form, but has been referenced three times in Smash Bros 4 and Ultimate, two of them being made in Ultimate in very weird places. The following three pictures are references to Sephiroth:

The Congratulations screen for Cloud in Smash 4


The One Winged Angel in the Smash blog for Chrom for some reason


Finally, when the Castlevania content was shown, they presented Alucard and ended with him in Midgar like this. Not only do the visuals remind of Sephiroth, but the black cape is definitely interesting. In the original game, Sephiroth is called "The Man in the Black Cape" for a good portion of it


In terms of likelihood for the future and the DLCs themselves: Nintendo chooses the characters, and Sakurai gives the approval, even though Sakurai tends to influence people there When Nintendo approached SE for Cloud before E3, this discussion could have happened immediately at the table. They must have talked to the very ambassadors that appear in the credits for SSBU. And notice that the people there are strictly the heads of the Final Fantasy VII Remake. Considering we've been hearing that a Square character was supposed to land on the base game, and we've heard of such character as early as August 2018, it's likely that the character must have come from the very reunion I mentioned with Sakurai and Nomura.
As you might know, Square tends to go for IPs in DLCs that are from games that would give them a considerable return in the future. While Nintendo choosing characters would open up the possibility for purely legacy characters to show up, Square-Enix also would have to have a say on the choice. They would favor characters that are relevant to history while also being profitable today and in a future game of the respective franchise. The list that Vergeben leaked was a list of names that Square had spread internally. Of those characters, Sephiroth matches Square's intentions with promotion.
Since the Square ambassadors were the heads of the FFVII Remake, it would be hard to assume they would ignore the opportunity to suggest Nintendo to promote it with another FFVII character to make the headlines. FFVII Remake is set to make a huge blast already in this E3, and Square had already the PR schedule planned back then when they determined how the Remake and KHIII PR would work. And considering the community has been speculating on a Switch version of the remake for a long time now, after the announcement of DQXI coming to Switch and using the same engine as FFVII, Sephiroth fits the bill quite perfectly.


Finally, regarding the rumor mill
I have come across reports that initially Vergeben had Sephiroth at the top of his most heard names, but was switched to Erdrick, specially after the discovery of Brave in the game's files. Tansut a few weeks after the discovery posted the Dairy Queen image and backed Erdrick since then. After that most people followed suit, and the narrative formed.
Some of the Square 7 have taken some hits since the list was leaked, and tbh, I have never seen one that brought down Sephiroth's chances down or deconfirmed. He is the only character outside of Erdrick with a considerable amount of things leading to him with few things pointing to a no-go


There are some things that one could argue against the likelihood of Sephiroth being the rep. First would be a second unique third party character being unlikely, second being the chance of Nintendo themselves willingly choosing such a character over one from a new series, and finally, the idea of the choice not have been made by August, and the decision being made with completely different ambassadors altogether.

The first point falls flat when you remember that this is just a fan rule. Much like back then when we thought a second rep from a third party was impossible, we got Richter
The second point is understandable, but also not a locked deconfirm in any way, considering the possible issues that could ensue, as well as not knowing for certain how lenient would Sakurai be in accepting Nomura's suggestion.
It should be of note that Sephiroth would be the easiest character to license given FFVII already being in the game
And he would be an easy plan A or B, if Sakurai was concerned
The final point is one of the most interesting ones, but you gotta ask yourself, if that is truly the case, it is funny to see how Sora was reportedly shot down back then (not even mentioning Shinji's recent remarks). For characters to have been denied means a discussion must have taken place by then.
Or it could have all been just a huge prank and it was Sora all along, although I find this too convoluted to believe


In conclusion, I'm not saying he is the most likely necessarily
But I believe that everyone is sleeping hard on him
I do think Erdrick is still the one with the most "evidence" backing him, those being Tansut and Brave potentially being a direct reference to him. But Sephiroth ain't far behind. And once you break things down, Banjo has a great chance of showing up this E3. With the amount of buzz surrounding him, it would make sense for him to be the character to be shadowdropped after E3. Considering that Brave was the second character being made after Jack, the fact that the mechanics and stats (even though are subject to change) match Banjo better than Erdrick by a long shot, the codename turns the evidence into dust. And Tansut himself isn't a leaker or insider with enough reputation to be as much of a groundbreaking lead as a statement by Shinobi, who has had a lot more things said and basically nothing was wrong.

I also asked some people about their opinions on what they thought about chances and the situations of the characters, and I got similar responses. papagenos papagenos , among others, shared the stance of Sephiroth being the #2 most likely Square candidate (although he stressed that Erdrick is the NUMBER 1 most likely as of now).

I'm a fan of both FF and DQ
I would be happy with either and I'm a realist
If there is something that shoots them down, I'll acknowledge
But as of now, my gut feeling says if the Square rep is at this E3, it's Sephiroth
He is a character with worldwide recognition, regardless of which console you are a fan of
He is a character that is historically hype inducing
Anytime his theme plays, people go wild
And most importantly
This E3 Square themselves will make a big deal out of FFVII Remake
It would be extremely advantageous for them to have Sephiroth show up at E3 a day after their conference to end E3 with a high note for them
For all I know though, Erdrick could still show up with a surprise DQIII remake announcement or something. :4pacman:



Anyway, this is the basic rundown I wanted to give y'all before E3.
It's everything I managed to gather.
I'm not saying for myself or anyone else that Sephiroth IS the rep. But I hope this makes things clear for everyone about the current status. And to anyone not believing that it could be possible, maybe this raises your hopes or changes your mind.

Final note
He is a character like Joker
Nobody is seeing it coming
And he is the type of character that will rock the speculation community to its core
 

TCT~Phantom

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Glad to see some Sephy support still going strong.

I still have hope for Sephiroth, if we get a wave 2 I will be much more optimistic.
 
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