The North Carolina Melee Power Rankings! Updated 8/14/14!

[bossa nova ♪]

idk josh, i feel like you're a pretty straight forward falco.


this is by no means a bad thing, if not a better thing. PP's style is very simplistic, and it's perhaps how simple and clear he's made everything that he is more efficient in focusing on the stuff that works... and he has a consistently-intact understanding of what it means for something to "work" or be "risky". you're clearly a cub of this wise spacebear...


i wouldn't generally mind if you compare yourself to foxy and the both of you to me...cuz you're both good...but in this case there's something to be said for the sacrifice austin (from what i understand of him) and myself make for the way we want to play the game. we do a lot of stupid *** **** (call it "irrational"... i'd make a "real-life" analogy but **** whatever the hell real-life is) just for the look of it.... to achieve some homo ***...uhh i guess "supreme aesthetic" you could call it... and it's just cuz otherwise we get bored, so we don't like to win without it. in fact, our improvement is marked by how well we can mesh the objective reality that is the metagame of super smash brothers melee with our idea of what's beautiful... so it's a slower process.


i don't call it a handicap because it's how i learn the game, i can't learn it any other way. maybe we're dafter than daffy, but it's worth it to not be dreadfully bored even if our improvement is slow...

in my opinion you do not apply to this, which is why i'm a little put off by you saying "the way we evolved"... because i simply do not see that you had or have the same "way" as me or austin. which is probably how you got smart with falco as easily as you did.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Hey cam I talked you up on that livestream thing I went on yesterday

You should listen to it if you feel like sitting through it(maybe at different times).



Edit:

1. Fox is the only damn character in this game that approaches

2. Blame Canada

3. **** that Dorsey guy

1. That approaches a lot? Approaches into your baits? Because I approach with Falco so I already disagree with that statement.

2. lol

if you falcos used your wavelands half as well as i try to use mine, i'd be so **** out of luck.

Yeah I started to work on that then forgot. I should do it again because I learned a thing that I just realized will be my next discussion with Cam lol.

 

[-ACE-]

u mad fallacy?

 

[stingers]

thats my favorite fallacy

 

[Dark Hart]

I tried to click on, 'NO'

 

[Todd Bonney]

NC Threads

A strange game.

The only winning move is not to play.

How about a nice game of ... smash?

 

[Lightsyde]

idk josh, i feel like you're a pretty straight forward falco.


this is by no means a bad thing, if not a better thing. PP's style is very simplistic, and it's perhaps how simple and clear he's made everything that he is more efficient in focusing on the stuff that works... and he has a consistently-intact understanding of what it means for something to "work" or be "risky". you're clearly a cub of this wise spacebear...


i wouldn't generally mind if you compare yourself to foxy and the both of you to me...cuz you're both good...but in this case there's something to be said for the sacrifice austin (from what i understand of him) and myself make for the way we want to play the game. we do a lot of stupid *** **** (call it "irrational"... i'd make a "real-life" analogy but **** whatever the hell real-life is) just for the look of it.... to achieve some homo ***...uhh i guess "supreme aesthetic" you could call it... and it's just cuz otherwise we get bored, so we don't like to win without it. in fact, our improvement is marked by how well we can mesh the objective reality that is the metagame of super smash brothers melee with our idea of what's beautiful... so it's a slower process.


i don't call it a handicap because it's how i learn the game, i can't learn it any other way. maybe we're dafter than daffy, but it's worth it to not be dreadfully bored even if our improvement is slow...

in my opinion you do not apply to this, which is why i'm a little put off by you saying "the way we evolved"... because i simply do not see that you had or have the same "way" as me or austin. which is probably how you got smart with falco as easily as you did.

Well, I used to would have agreed with you. I developed a lot of my initial Falco game from watching Kevin and playing with Adam. I still have a weird mix of Kevin's mechanistic stuff and Adam's rushdown in my play.

However, within the last year, probably around my civil union with Alex DeLarge I got really into the supreme asthetic (I didn't call it this, but I know exactly what you're talking about). It's stopped ever being enough to win or just do regular combos. Whenever I play with Austin or you I see how much of myself I derived from little things about your play; little freedoms or eccentricities in ways to use wave lands or shines. We all started into the edge cancelling stuff about the same time but all of our styles are as different as they are similar. Austin and I normally get into really flashy showoff type matches after a super serious mood has passed and have talked about this aspect a lot. I think you might underestimate how many matches/stocks etc I've sacrificed for this bigger ideal as well. Remember though, Adam taught me always that the crazy combos and the weird movement was more important than anything else. haha

I do think a lot of why you might see my Falco as more straight forward is we tend to play mostly Falco dittos when we're both really moving, which I feel, if played at the pace we play, brings out the more PP-esque elements of my play you were talking about. I do a lot more asthetic stuff vs characters who aren't quite as fast. I definitely do a lot of the slick stuff and mindgames that I know you'd consider part of this look you're talking about, though it might not be QUITE as dominant in my play as yours or Austin's.

Regardless, I think all this means is, we need to play more. Miss ewe, booooo.

 

[SK919]

I use to play really straight forward all the time but as of late I've been trying to go out there and do ******** ****. It's fun and I believe in the end it increases your level of control.. but if i'm playing to win i'm just going to make sure the other player dies.

Being creative in friendlies is important.. sometimes you find new things that are pretty practical and flashy

 

[lord karn]

One thing to think about is that playing with somebody doesn't always make you develop a style similar to them, but instead can sometimes make you play in a quite different fashion. From what I've been able to tell, this holds for playing with Adam. The thing I've noticed about Adam is that he has a really good, unpredictable offense. The way to beat him most effectively, is to not work as much on predicting him, but to focus more on punishing him (of course being good at both is best, but I'm talking about his weaknesses). Adam doesn't always do safe moves, and if you are prepared sometimes you can react and punish him. This makes a lot of sense to me, because I would say Josh's greatest strength is punishment by far. This is the same reason why I would say Josh tends to beat me harder than Austin/Cam, because my weakness is that I make a lot of stupid mistakes that can be punished hard.

It's not as simple as saying one style is more straight-forward than another, though, because there are many aspects of the game to be creative in. I think that Josh is very creative in the combos he does, whereas Austin and Cam are more creative with movement and other things (although this can have the effect of making their combos look weird, but mainly because they started the combo in a novel way, which makes the whole thing look different, where Josh creatively combos even when he starts the combos in a very standard way oftentimes).

But yeah, beware oversimplifying.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Playing with others definitely causes people to develop different styles that are often counters to one another. Cactuar focused a lot on first hits while M2K focused on punishments when they were learning the game.

I think they had another guy that did something else but I forgot what it was LOL.

This is evident in my play vs Twitch's as well, but he is not finished evolving that style so I'm not sure exactly what it will be.

 

[everlasting yayuhzz]

my falco focuses on throwing bricks very carelessly into place in a very ugly manner to make a house that is somewhat livable.

it's an art.

 

[Dorsey]

NC Threads

A strange game.

The only winning move is not to play.

How about a nice game of ... smash?

classic ad hominem

 

[Dorsey]

Well, I used to would have agreed with you. I developed a lot of my initial Falco game from watching Kevin and playing with Adam. I still have a weird mix of Kevin's mechanistic stuff and Adam's rushdown in my play.

However, within the last year, probably around my civil union with Alex DeLarge I got really into the supreme asthetic (I didn't call it this, but I know exactly what you're talking about). It's stopped ever being enough to win or just do regular combos. Whenever I play with Austin or you I see how much of myself I derived from little things about your play; little freedoms or eccentricities in ways to use wave lands or shines. We all started into the edge cancelling stuff about the same time but all of our styles are as different as they are similar. Austin and I normally get into really flashy showoff type matches after a super serious mood has passed and have talked about this aspect a lot. I think you might underestimate how many matches/stocks etc I've sacrificed for this bigger ideal as well. Remember though, Adam taught me always that the crazy combos and the weird movement was more important than anything else. haha

I do think a lot of why you might see my Falco as more straight forward is we tend to play mostly Falco dittos when we're both really moving, which I feel, if played at the pace we play, brings out the more PP-esque elements of my play you were talking about. I do a lot more asthetic stuff vs characters who aren't quite as fast. I definitely do a lot of the slick stuff and mindgames that I know you'd consider part of this look you're talking about, though it might not be QUITE as dominant in my play as yours or Austin's.

Regardless, I think all this means is, we need to play more. Miss ewe, booooo.

This is an invincible ignorance fallacy. It may be attributed to your napoleon complex.

 

[Moophobia]

Man I think I'm like a cool peach when I play then I watch my videos and I'm just some average peach and I hate my self.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Well you can still be cool and average. Getting better often lets the style appear more solidly in fact.

 

[Moophobia]

How can I be cool and average if I'm average I'm not cool! MERH
Edit: my peach is ****ing boring

 

[Dr Peepee]

stop being weird!

 

[Dark Hart]

I beat Malk in tourney am I on these yet?

 

[Moophobia]

I'm not being weird, just more honest to my self.

 

[Dr Peepee]

sounds more harsh when you say ****ing boring.

if you truly believe that then find ways to spice it up.

just know you'll have to make improvements overall to see the greatest results with it.

 

[Moophobia]

I know and I say ****ing boring because I'm just disappointed in my self.
Will continue tomorrow while on break at school and maybe during marvel tournament.

 

[bossa nova ♪]

lmao @ dorsey


@josh: o fruhl?

 

[Divinokage]

Can you actually inherently change your inner style consciously? Because in the end, no matter how you try to change your style, you'll still have a certain way of thinking which will reflect what your character does in one match.. which is why everyone has different styles and you can actually clearly attribute it to players. Like for example, Shizwiz, he's like a crazy Falco in your face trying to do crazy technical stuff and kill you.. you know? lol. I mean when he was weaker, his style was probably the same too, just at higher level.. it's more solid like PP says. Heh.. Idk, that's pretty interesting..

 

[Sneak8288]

i feel like my style and cams is pretty similar in falco dittos

 

[Dr Peepee]

My style has changed as I've improved and learned from other players. I was a very defensive player in the beginning on my Falco career, but Lambchops and eventually Mango influenced me to play more aggressively.

If I can do it then I figure anyone else can do it too.

 

[Sneak8288]

you decision making skills are pretty beast, its like you always choose the best option

 

[Dr Peepee]

Haha well I definitely do try to pick the best option every time, but setting up that best option and such is the issue I have more often than not.

 

[Divinokage]

My style has changed as I've improved and learned from other players. I was a very defensive player in the beginning on my Falco career, but Lambchops and eventually Mango influenced me to play more aggressively.

If I can do it then I figure anyone else can do it too.

Really? I honestly don't think your style changed ever since I first played you from Tipped Off 4. I don't think my style changed ever since I remember started playing this game.. I was always trying to limiting the opponent's options and do what I want to him.. that's the best way I can describe my style. It's like... a style feels almost like genetics. lol. I mean it feels like you have to turn your being upside down for a style to change completely..

 

[Dr Peepee]

Well to be honest I feel like there's only way for me to fight Ganon and my old way works pretty good against you sooooooo =p

 

[Divinokage]

I swear to ****, PP. lollll.

Or I wanted to add.. maybe I just don't have the eyes to see the difference from back in the day and now but to me it feels like I've always used the same base style from 10 years ago.

 

[Dr Peepee]

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

<3

on the real though, I might just study those vids tonight/tomorrow and see if I really didn't change that much or whatever. I'd be surprised if I didn't though.



Edit: Watched our set from TO4, and it looks like the shiz influence is stronnnggggg LOLLL. I never knew hahaha.

But anyway, I know I was overconfident in that set since I had beaten you in pools by then and felt good vs Ganon, so me approaching that much wasn't as common back then. Maybe I'll grab a different set like that match I had vs Col bol to show what I mean....


Double edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVx18u0dgbo&feature=related

first 7 seconds LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL that's all I gotta say

 

[Moophobia]

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

<3

on the real though, I might just study those vids tonight/tomorrow and see if I really didn't change that much or whatever. I'd be surprised if I didn't though.



Edit: Watched our set from TO4, and it looks like the shiz influence is stronnnggggg LOLLL. I never knew hahaha.

But anyway, I know I was overconfident in that set since I had beaten you in pools by then and felt good vs Ganon, so me approaching that much wasn't as common back then. Maybe I'll grab a different set like that match I had vs Col bol to show what I mean....


Double edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVx18u0dgbo&feature=related

first 7 seconds LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL that's all I gotta say

Oh my god that is gross.

 

[~Twitch~]

the **** is this thread anymore...

 

[Bl@ckChris]

john is right.

things.

i mostly meant wavelands on shields. cause spacing wavelands on shields and getting to comparatively awkward places on a shield is my primary form of pressure...but you falcos have "actual" shield pressure. so carry on with your button pressing, falcos.

don't mind a poor ganon main's ramblings about implied shield pressure when you guys can just have the real thing =/

 

[foxyisemo]

i feel your misery bl@ckchris 10lulz nojohns

 

[Moophobia]

Peach has good shield pressure especially since people don't know how to avoid it yet. Kevin don't tell them the secret so I can do better than I should just a little bit longer

 

[lord karn]

Roll, shield angled down, light shield

 

[Dark Hart]

GUYS I BEAT MALK IN TOURNEY AM I ON HERE YET??????

 

[Dr Peepee]

john is right.

things.

i mostly meant wavelands on shields. cause spacing wavelands on shields and getting to comparatively awkward places on a shield is my primary form of pressure...but you falcos have "actual" shield pressure. so carry on with your button pressing, falcos.

don't mind a poor ganon main's ramblings about implied shield pressure when you guys can just have the real thing =/

Technically Falcos and Foxes have to mix up their shield pressure too since frame holes exist they have to be punished out of, so they have to do awkward spacings and timings to be effective as well.

One style is just more technical than another.

 

[Divinokage]

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

<3

on the real though, I might just study those vids tonight/tomorrow and see if I really didn't change that much or whatever. I'd be surprised if I didn't though.



Edit: Watched our set from TO4, and it looks like the shiz influence is stronnnggggg LOLLL. I never knew hahaha.

But anyway, I know I was overconfident in that set since I had beaten you in pools by then and felt good vs Ganon, so me approaching that much wasn't as common back then. Maybe I'll grab a different set like that match I had vs Col bol to show what I mean....


Double edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVx18u0dgbo&feature=related

first 7 seconds LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL that's all I gotta say

Hahaha!! Shiz did indeed use a lot of lasers but the way you were approaching it was clearly different for sure. Like you see what I mean? Like the base style you started with isn't any different, it's just that your style got A LOT tighter with different decision making while finding the holes in your opponents play. Does that mean your style changed? I attribute a style to a way of thinking or like the whole process of how YOU would approach the game. And.. also to prove my point, you clearly see every player do not play anywhere close to anyone. Everyone has something that is different from one and another.. even if someone tries to copy someone else's style, it's still completely different. Not sure what else I could add for that. =P