Broasty
Smash Journeyman
Aggravate your opponent with Shield Reflects lol. It pisses the opponent off SO much.Also I don't like fighting Pit with Luigi
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The Luigi Discussion Thread - People Actually Play This Character?
- Thread starter DBSammy
- Start date
Cuban Pete
King of the Rumba Beat
how useful is being able to waveland fair, dair, uair, and bair?
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Broasty
Smash Journeyman
Super useful. Considering Luigi is easy to get hit off stage, you want to avoid damage instead of attempting to land an attack based off an opponent not knowing you can do double aerials. As such, you throw out an attack close range and it's blocked, move and Waveland away and reapproach.
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ThegreatVaporeon1
Smash Ace
It's not really just the arrows, it's just the many ranged and disjointed attacks that pit has that just give me trouble
I'll need to figure out that matchup
Broasty
Smash Journeyman
When approaching:It's not really just the arrows, it's just the many ranged and disjointed attacks that pit has that just give me trouble
Is Pit high in air? -> Jump UAir
Low in air? -> Upsmash (you can do it OoS if you expect an attack too)
On ground? -> DSmash
Cuban Pete
King of the Rumba Beat
Is there a trick to wavelanding fireballs or should I just keep practicing?
Cubelarooso
Smash Lord
Obviously, you want to Fireball as soon as possible. If you do it early enough, the jump sound won't play, and that guarantees you can waveland.
Personally, I have D-pad-Up set to jump, so I don't have to move my thumb so quickly, I just use the other one. It also allows Usmash OoS with tap-jump disabled.
Personally, I have D-pad-Up set to jump, so I don't have to move my thumb so quickly, I just use the other one. It also allows Usmash OoS with tap-jump disabled.
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ThegreatVaporeon1
Smash Ace
I don't see uair to waveland being that useful. I don't usually do it. The other ones though, bair, dair, and fair, are extremely useful for chasing your opponent or for some sick mindgames.
OnFullTilt
Smash Apprentice
Do you guys ever wavedash to the ledge just to get invincibility and then waveland back on for a free attack? It seems like it could actually be useful if you're forced to the ledge and manage to do it quickly (if they shield- grab, if they jump- Up smash). On a related note if you're facing Ganon, Captain Falcon, or anyone else with a predictable recovery you can wavedash to the ledge and then instantly drop to do a bair with invincibility as they try to attack through you. I feel like I may have mentioned this before? Sorry if I have.
ThegreatVaporeon1
Smash Ace
Yeah thats what i tend to do when I'm on the ledge. Although it requires a lot of practice or else you'll sd.
And against ganon and falcon, that's the best strat for edgeguarding. I made a 2 stock comeback on a ganon in tourny because of how easily I was able to gimp his recovery tools.
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DBSammy
Smash Ace
Yoooooo, all you Luigi homies should come to Shuffle 6 here in Columbus in a month. http://smashboards.com/threads/sept-13-14-2014-shuffle-vi-columbus-ohio.355896/
Broasty
Smash Journeyman
Come time I finish my college and start my career, I'll be able to come. But that's in a year.
For now I gotta settle for CEO as my only major haha
OnFullTilt
Smash Apprentice
Woah, I think that there may be a teeny chance for dash attack to be useful. If you were playing doubles and you were on one side of an opponent and your teammate was on the other you could dash attack in and the opponent may be helpless against your teammate's fury. If the other opponent was nearby it wouldn't work but you could do this when they were offstage/respawning. Oh, and off topic I'll be going to majors in a while but not quite yet.
Also, quick question: my friend mains Ike, but I don't think a Luigi+Ike team combo would work out (Ike moves everywhere and throws giant hitboxes while Luigi moves everywhere unpredictably- right into those hitboxes I'd guess). We're probably going to try a Luigi+DK combo (based off of the Abate+Green Ranger team that did well even in Melee, where both characters were worse) since DK is my friend's secondary, but could Ike+Luigi work if we wanted to mix things up?
Also random knowledge drop: you can side B the balloons on SmashVille to quickly and safely get 1 round closer to a misfire. A quick but dangerous way to get misfires when on the edge is to let go, instantly side B into the edge and then up B sweetspot (preferably before your opponent respawns). If you hate tap jump but want to up B out of shield set L to jump. Luigi's spotdodge seems to be really freakin' good and you should probably use it. That's all I have for now.
Also, quick question: my friend mains Ike, but I don't think a Luigi+Ike team combo would work out (Ike moves everywhere and throws giant hitboxes while Luigi moves everywhere unpredictably- right into those hitboxes I'd guess). We're probably going to try a Luigi+DK combo (based off of the Abate+Green Ranger team that did well even in Melee, where both characters were worse) since DK is my friend's secondary, but could Ike+Luigi work if we wanted to mix things up?
Also random knowledge drop: you can side B the balloons on SmashVille to quickly and safely get 1 round closer to a misfire. A quick but dangerous way to get misfires when on the edge is to let go, instantly side B into the edge and then up B sweetspot (preferably before your opponent respawns). If you hate tap jump but want to up B out of shield set L to jump. Luigi's spotdodge seems to be really freakin' good and you should probably use it. That's all I have for now.
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Cubelarooso
Smash Lord
For Up-B OoS without tap-jump, I just press up on the C-stick, which conveniently puts my thumb right over B.
CBO0tz
Smash Lord
Could Luigi use the ability to Super Jump Punch Cancel like Dr. Mario in Melee and actually be balanced?
I feel like it would be awesome, since Mario doesn't need that ability in P:M, but Luigi doesn't need to use his SJP apart from recoveries or the Fire Jump Punch.
I feel like it would be awesome, since Mario doesn't need that ability in P:M, but Luigi doesn't need to use his SJP apart from recoveries or the Fire Jump Punch.
DBSammy
Smash Ace
So this past saturday I went to my city's biweekly event and got 5th out of 42. This is the only Luigi set that I played that got recorded. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bsnmdCSy-8
OnFullTilt
Smash Apprentice
It probably wouldn't be balanced since it would take away a lot of the risk of the fire jump punch- it's already a viable move if you watch Vist. You can also edge cancel the up B to make it safer. If the technique you suggested was always guaranteed to get the sourspot somehow then you may as well have jabbed instead.
Good job man! I think technically this should be in the Luigi video thread but I'll try to check it out later.
ThegreatVaporeon1
Smash Ace
Here's some matches from a reditt wifi tourny with me as Luigi vs a diddy player. I'm a bit rusty and sd'd 3 times in the last match, but I still won the tourny :D I used a lot of tornado too for some reason and got punished, but it's w/e. Wifi tournies tho lel.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vguC1yycXV4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2trQ4yL6Hk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vguC1yycXV4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2trQ4yL6Hk
ThegreatVaporeon1
Smash Ace
Nice man!
Although you should try to edgeguard ivysaur more. As soon as she vines the ledge, do a drop zone bair or dair, and that will essentially be her stock (unless the ivy techs the bair)
OnFullTilt
Smash Apprentice
Eh, I suppose if everyone else is posting sets here I may as well do so.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7lPCJhFg88&feature=youtu.be vs. Pikachu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7lPCJhFg88&feature=youtu.be vs. Pikachu
ThegreatVaporeon1
Smash Ace
Dont know how to delete message, so here's this instead
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CBO0tz
Smash Lord
So
When you start a string of Uairs on somebody and they start DI'ing away, what's the best option to keep them in your combo? Follow them with a Side-B or Down-B, or land immediately and wait for them with an Up-Smash?
When you start a string of Uairs on somebody and they start DI'ing away, what's the best option to keep them in your combo? Follow them with a Side-B or Down-B, or land immediately and wait for them with an Up-Smash?
Cubelarooso
Smash Lord
It depend on the situation, and I'm assuming you've used you second jump. If you have a misfire and can kill, go for that. If they're too far vertically rather than horizontally - and you know you can mash it - then follow with Cyclone, ideally killing with its last hit or staying close enough below them for a final blow before hitstun ends (I've personally never even tried this, though, so second opinions from those who have are needed). If you're near a floor, or if it's a character like Zelda/Peach/Samus (or like Falcon if he's low-percent and above-stage), go ahead and (wave)land to continue with Usmash, Nair, or Uair. If none of that, just Fair.
It's better to recognize that they're escaping before using your second jump, though, so you can use that to put yourself into position for whatever followup you'd prefer (including soft Nair so they can't get as far, footstool>Cyclone, or Up-B).
It's better to recognize that they're escaping before using your second jump, though, so you can use that to put yourself into position for whatever followup you'd prefer (including soft Nair so they can't get as far, footstool>Cyclone, or Up-B).
OnFullTilt
Smash Apprentice
You sir just made my day. I had no idea this was a thing.
Cubelarooso
Smash Lord
It also works against shields, rather than doing that Luigi thing where you just float down with a Nair for them to shieldgrab.
It's more rude, though.
It's more rude, though.
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OnFullTilt
Smash Apprentice
I already have X set to taunt because I wanted to integrate footstooling into my game. Unfortunately I haven't done so yet... so I only use X just to WD->Plank. Glad to finally have a legitimate reason!
CBO0tz
Smash Lord
I've tried setting both X and Y to taunt for my game as well.. I wasn't used to it and it's hard to footstool with Luigi due to his more vertical aerial mobility.
ThegreatVaporeon1
Smash Ace
Footstool to down b is all youre really going to get for any footstool combos because of luigi's slow fall speed.
CBO0tz
Smash Lord
How effective is footstool>Down-B anyways? Is more hits from the Cyclone really going to make a difference from just Cycloning into somebody on the ground?
ThegreatVaporeon1
Smash Ace
To be honest, I don't use it all that much, although I am trying to implement it into my gameplay. But footstool allows you to freely get a move on the opponent as they are basically open to an attack. A follow up cyclone would ensure a hit and another follow up to an aerial, etc. A cyclone on the ground is a lot more riskier as correct spacing and reads by the opponent could get you punished if you miss..and people who know how to deal with cyclone will really give you a hard time.
Broasty
Smash Journeyman
The only thing slept on more than Footstools for Luigi are Chain Grabs. Never the less, if your opponent doesn't respect you as you descend and thinks they can just wait and Shield Grab, show they what's up with Foot Stool. I'm personally looking at trying to implement it into combos.
Broasty
Smash Journeyman
My new victory screen music for Luigi lol. http://youtu.be/izUYuvsMfoQ
Cubelarooso
Smash Lord
(continued from http://smashboards.com/threads/luigi-approach-options.364482/#post-17516225)
I wouldn't suggest approaching with aerials. Bair can be used to stuff approaches from unarmed opponents, but you want to use it as you leave the ground. If it hits a shield, you generally have three options:
If you predict a shield grab, you can go for a second Bair or a Cyclone.
If you predict more shield, you can WD backwards and grab/Dtilt.
If no prediction, you should WD forward, either to reset neutral or come back and punish their response.
Luigi isn't much of a shield pressure character; instead, he should be the one taking initiative when the enemy's in shield, either by seizing stage control, grabbing, Dtilt, or footstool if you're above.
Many of his attacks have extra shield damage, though (note that this doesn't affect shieldstun). Double fair > Dtilt is almost all a shield's health.
I wouldn't suggest approaching with aerials. Bair can be used to stuff approaches from unarmed opponents, but you want to use it as you leave the ground. If it hits a shield, you generally have three options:
If you predict a shield grab, you can go for a second Bair or a Cyclone.
If you predict more shield, you can WD backwards and grab/Dtilt.
If no prediction, you should WD forward, either to reset neutral or come back and punish their response.
Luigi isn't much of a shield pressure character; instead, he should be the one taking initiative when the enemy's in shield, either by seizing stage control, grabbing, Dtilt, or footstool if you're above.
Many of his attacks have extra shield damage, though (note that this doesn't affect shieldstun). Double fair > Dtilt is almost all a shield's health.
Broasty
Smash Journeyman
Dude, if only that DTilt was beefed up so he could pillar...
Broasty
Smash Journeyman
Alrighty, so I hate to double post, but I've got some interesting stuff I came across while competing in Smash Academy (Orlando Weekly).
->I forsee even with Luigi's current tools, to become a GREAT shield pressure character if played REALLY tight and smart. Almost every match had me so close to breaking a shield and my lack of flawless execution kept me from finishing it off. Sure grabbing is great, but in a lot of situations (Especially characters who bounce too high for CGs or even later percent followups) it's better to go for the pressure and potential breaks.
->Fireballs are the GAMECHANGER when it comes to matchups. For the most part, high level players will play based off reacting to your approach and punishing (usually by wiff punish). If you think really intelligently about when you can safely fireball, you can mix up your opponent and make them remember that you don't actually have to approach if you don't want to. This is what I noticed worked best on those who reacted perfectly to all of my approaches. (The ones limited to low percents since the opponent can CC).
->My new favorite method of wiff punish: get in close, Backflip (be sure to only hold back on the stick to make the animation but release to neutral to have no backward momentum)->Fast Fall->Dair. Works REALLY well on players who attack to get up from the ground. I found this to be the thing that really helped me beat a ZSS player who was keeping the ground under control via shots and whips. Stylish? Check. Effective as hell? You bet your ass it is!
->Great way to get an opponent to throw out an attack that can be wiff punished is to SH and DSpecial right at the apex of height to also Fast Fall, this screws with opponent since it grants you more aerial mobility than they're used to and in a lot of cases leads to the beginning of combos. This is really useful for "flyswatter" characters who can easily hit/grab you while you're in the air (Marth, Shiek, Roy, etc) since they think that if you enter the air, you're pretty much "stuck" in terms of aerial movement.
->OOS USmash is perfect for catching those pesky characters that have a dash attack that crosses you up (Kirby and Diddy are great examples). In general, if you spaced correctly so they are in range for the beginning of the headbutt, do it because even if they shield, you'll get pushed away (and damage their shield). If they're not that close, you almost always can OOS WD the direction they originally came from.
->The green missile strikes fear into people's hearts. I've seen it especially against High Level players since they're aware how early it kills. If you pull off a greenie kill, be sure to ledge farm another so they know that could happen again at anytime. Most players will play extra defensive thinking you'll just throw it out as an approach, rather than a punish. This means you can go for grabs more, or better yet, shield pressure. If you think Roy installs THE FEAR into people's hearts, wait til you see what happens when someone's on the verge of shield break and you have a stored green missile...
->I forsee even with Luigi's current tools, to become a GREAT shield pressure character if played REALLY tight and smart. Almost every match had me so close to breaking a shield and my lack of flawless execution kept me from finishing it off. Sure grabbing is great, but in a lot of situations (Especially characters who bounce too high for CGs or even later percent followups) it's better to go for the pressure and potential breaks.
->Fireballs are the GAMECHANGER when it comes to matchups. For the most part, high level players will play based off reacting to your approach and punishing (usually by wiff punish). If you think really intelligently about when you can safely fireball, you can mix up your opponent and make them remember that you don't actually have to approach if you don't want to. This is what I noticed worked best on those who reacted perfectly to all of my approaches. (The ones limited to low percents since the opponent can CC).
->My new favorite method of wiff punish: get in close, Backflip (be sure to only hold back on the stick to make the animation but release to neutral to have no backward momentum)->Fast Fall->Dair. Works REALLY well on players who attack to get up from the ground. I found this to be the thing that really helped me beat a ZSS player who was keeping the ground under control via shots and whips. Stylish? Check. Effective as hell? You bet your ass it is!
->Great way to get an opponent to throw out an attack that can be wiff punished is to SH and DSpecial right at the apex of height to also Fast Fall, this screws with opponent since it grants you more aerial mobility than they're used to and in a lot of cases leads to the beginning of combos. This is really useful for "flyswatter" characters who can easily hit/grab you while you're in the air (Marth, Shiek, Roy, etc) since they think that if you enter the air, you're pretty much "stuck" in terms of aerial movement.
->OOS USmash is perfect for catching those pesky characters that have a dash attack that crosses you up (Kirby and Diddy are great examples). In general, if you spaced correctly so they are in range for the beginning of the headbutt, do it because even if they shield, you'll get pushed away (and damage their shield). If they're not that close, you almost always can OOS WD the direction they originally came from.
->The green missile strikes fear into people's hearts. I've seen it especially against High Level players since they're aware how early it kills. If you pull off a greenie kill, be sure to ledge farm another so they know that could happen again at anytime. Most players will play extra defensive thinking you'll just throw it out as an approach, rather than a punish. This means you can go for grabs more, or better yet, shield pressure. If you think Roy installs THE FEAR into people's hearts, wait til you see what happens when someone's on the verge of shield break and you have a stored green missile...
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Cubelarooso
Smash Lord
I have important real-life work to do, so I'd rather doing video games instead. I'm getting tired of just relying on intuition for stage data, so I'm considering making an easy reference document. But I'm not sure this doesn't already exist somewhere; does it? If not, here's a preview:
Edges are blast zones, dark area is off-camera.
Critique/suggestions on the format is encouraged. I'm already thinking a sleeker font is necessary.
Also, anyone going Tipped Off?
Edges are blast zones, dark area is off-camera.
Critique/suggestions on the format is encouraged. I'm already thinking a sleeker font is necessary.
Also, anyone going Tipped Off?
Broasty
Smash Journeyman
I honestly can't think of a better format approach buddy. And I wish I could, but I gotta finish my Senior year for Engineering strong.I have important real-life work to do, so I'd rather doing video games instead. I'm getting tired of just relying on intuition for stage data, so I'm considering making an easy reference document. But I'm not sure this doesn't already exist somewhere; does it? If not, here's a preview:
Edges are blast zones, dark area is off-camera.
Critique/suggestions on the format is encouraged. I'm already thinking a sleeker font is necessary.
Also, anyone going Tipped Off?
On another note...I'VE GOT VIDEO CAPTURE TO WORK, HERE COME THE VIDEOS.
Cubelarooso
Smash Lord
I think I've decided on a final format,
[collapse=Battlefield]
[collapse=Absolute]
[/collapse]
[collapse=Relative]
[/collapse]
[/collapse]
Question now is, should I post this stuff here as a trade secret, or in the Statistics thread, or make a new thread in General Discussion?
[collapse=Battlefield]
[collapse=Absolute]
[/collapse]
[collapse=Relative]
[/collapse]
[/collapse]
Question now is, should I post this stuff here as a trade secret, or in the Statistics thread, or make a new thread in General Discussion?
Broasty
Smash Journeyman
Yo, all in favor we have a little Weegee ($1-$5 lol) bracket at the next CEO? Might as well find out who da best for the mirror match, record that **** on video (via capture card), and we'll all have a plethora of Weegee styles to watch back at home!