All right, I want to settle this echo debate regarding Dixie Kong once and for all.
The thing with echoes is that they are a pretty nebulous clone concept. Some like Richter and Daisy are pretty much just alternate costumes with unique taunts, voices, and victory animations. Others like Chrom and Ken play much differently than who they are echoing due to special properties and differences that they have. Then you have others like Dark Samus who have only slight gameplay differences, but have animation differences on the level of a semi-clone (Dark Samus probably has the most unique animations of any echo in comparison to their original, even more than Ken). There are many different approaches with the echo category.
In general, the goal with the echo fighters is to provide another fighter on the roster that is able to be portrayed accurately with a fraction of the development time needed to normally implement a newcomer in Smash Bros.
All of the echoes have their attributes about what/who they are captured well even if they share their speed, weight, air speed is the same as the character that they are echoing (though Ken gets the privilege of being able to have a small increase in walk/run speed).
For example, back during pre-Smash 4, most Chrom supporters were selling him as the idea that he could be an intermediary between Marth and Ike. Even Sakurai toyed with this idea, before deeming it too uninteresting. Roy, when he was brought back, became this sort of intermediary, having Marth-like speed and Ike-like stength (at least at his sweetspot). With Lucina echoing Marth, it would make sense that her father would also have a similar fighting style. Thus, Chrom ends up a Roy echo instead of an Ike echo. However, Chrom was also given a move derivative of Ike's Aether in order to balance Chrom in relation to Roy and the rest of the cast, as well as help make him more of that hypothetical hybrid between Marth and Ike. The move itself was also based off a move Chrom performed in one of the cutscenes in Awakening (I think it was in the Two Falchions). To further show the breadth of the knowledge to the source material regarding Chrom, Chrom's actual Aether (Aether as it is performed in Awakening) was made into his Final Smash.
Even though an echo, a lot of Chrom's source material was referenced and the original idea for his playable inclusion was incorporated for him. Chrom fans were absolutely thrilled with his inclusion, and did not resent one bit that he ended up an echo.
Even for Richter, who only has a single gameplay difference from Simon (their holy waters), much of his source material was referenced. Much of his taunts and victory animations reference poses he made in official artwork or within Rondo of Blood.
The fact is though is that Richter is a bit of special case. Quite a bit of Simon's moveset has moves that originally belonged to Richter in Rondo of Blood and Symphony of the Night. Sakurai even flat out states as such back in the 8/8 Direct about this, and as a result it is arguable as to who is echoing who.
For Daisy, the truth is, that Daisy's differences with Peach in the eyes of most people lie with her personality. She is louder and more tomboyish. This is reflected through the voice work and various unique animations she did receive (her run animation, idle animations, taunts, and victory poses). Daisy is the exception among echoes in that she has few animation differences AND no gameplay differences. However, she did receive a bunch of different visual effects differences (daisies appearing instead of hearts, and her Final Smash having artwork particular to her).
Dark Samus is the opposite end of the spectrum. She is a character whose personality is defined by her movements. While she has a plethora of unique abilities and attacks (some of which were referenced in her Assist Trophy role in Smash 4), Sakurai and the Smash team did the best they could do to make Dark Samus feel like Dark Samus with only animations. Indeed, Dark Samus actually has the most unique animations of any of the echo fighters. She has unique run/walk animations, idle animations, dodge animation, roll animations, and jump animations. She even has different animations for when she performs Smash attacks and specials (just look at what her arms do). There are even small touches like how her body shakes itself if you are running and abruptly turn around. As with Chrom, subtle references to her source material are made. Dark Samus's entrance (probably the only echo with an unique entrance while at that) is shown coming out of a portal. This is a very subtle reference from a Japanese Metroid Prime 2 interview that mentioned Dark Samus was able to travel from Tallon IV to Aether through short distance teleportation. There is also the fact that one of her victory animations references one of her attacks from the battle with her in Prime 3 (the one where she splits into "echoes" of herself), as well as the the victory animation where her eyes appear to glow (a reference to the debut cutscene for the SA-X, the first antagonist version of Samus to appear in the Metroid series).
Taken altogether, even with the echoes, there are efforts made to be true to who the characters are.
The general rules with the echoes are that they most have the same body as the character they are echoing and that they cannot differ when it comes to most general parameters (speed, weight, air speed, etc.).
Many of the echoes do not follow uniform rules. Look at Ken, Chrom, and Dark Samus in comparison to Richter and Daisy in regards to differences. However, I believe the differences in regards to how much an echo differs from the character that he/she is echoing comes from just what attributes the character is known for that needs to be taken into account to be captured faithfully as an echo.
Ken is known for his kicks, so several of Ryu's punches are substituted for kick animations in Ken's moveset. Dark Samus is known for being floaty and creepy, and so she is given an animation overhaul compared to Samus to capture this.
I highly doubt Dixie Kong would merely be given Diddy Kong's moveset, and unique taunts and victory animations, and the team would just call it a day. What is Dixie Kong mostly known for that makes her contrast with DK and Diddy? Her prehensile hair of course.
If chosen to be an echo fighter, Sakurai and his team would have to see where and how they could implement Dixie Kong's hair. While it would be obvious to implement it in an unique recovery that contrasts from Diddy Kong, I think Sakurai and his team would try to incorporate it into as much A-moves as possible (while possibly still having the same functionality as Diddy's A-moves). Other things would try to incorporate as much references to Dixie Kong's source material as possible whether it be idle animations, jump animations, or even her dash attack from DKC2/DKC3 (or Tropical Freeze). The Bubblegum Popgun is another reference for them. Picking up barrels with hair being another possible small touch. They might also decided to give her an unique down-special based off her hair ground pound from Tropical Freeze.
I think it is plausible that Sakurai and his team actually did explore the idea of Dixie Kong as an echo fighter, but came to the conclusion that it was either too much work to successfully capture Dixie Kong's essence as an echo, or that a "faithful" Dixie Kong would deviate too much from what an echo fighter is, or a combination of the two.
The point being is that we need to have confidence in Sakurai in regards to how he implements characters. Even if he were to decide Dixie Kong as an echo fighter, he would bend the rules as much as possible, or possibly throw out the rule book entirely and just say, "Dixie Kong is only considered an echo because I wanted her right alongside Diddy on the character select screen. *laughs"'. He basically did the same thing with Ken, to which he said "Why is Ken still considered an echo despite all of his differences? Because I said so."
Sakurai does his homework on characters added to the roster even for the echoes. If Dixie Kong is not feasible as an echo even with Ken-like liberties taken, Sakurai would have the good sense not add her if the results are not satisfactory.
As I said many times before, Dixie Kong is unique among potential newcomers in that she has an extreme amount of flexibility in regards to the kind of fighter she can be implemented as. There are multiple routes that they can go in regards to a fully unique moveset, different routes as a semi-clone, and different possibilities to how she could be an echo fighter. This unique sort of flexibility for Dixie Kong is a large contributor as to why it is so unsettling that Dixie Kong is still not a part of the roster.
However, regardless of what kind of fighter Sakurai and his team decides to implement Dixie Kong as (that is, if she ever does get onto the roster), I feel that Dixie Kong's charm and abilities will be captured well.
We shall see what happens. As I said before, right now I only expect four more newcomers for Ultimate. If they do plan additional echoes to fill out the character select screen, we would hear about one of them at E3. However, the fact that there is only two unlisted videos for Japanese Smash Bros. channel, makes me think we will just be getting Fighters Pass Character 2 and Fighters Pass Character 3.
I think Fighters Pass Character 4 and Fighters Pass Character 5 might be unveiled together, which would make three echoes being unveiled and sold at the same time unrealistic.
Dixie Kong being DLC for Ultimate would thus hinge upon whether additional DLC happens after the Fighters Pass concludes (whether additional Fighters Passes happen).
Regardless, the point is that Dixie Kong fans should not be at each other's throats. How can we expect to convince others to support this phenomenal heroine and Nintendo icon if there is squabbling amongst ourselves? Instead of arguing about what kind of fighter Dixie Kong should or should not be, we should instead be saying what SHOULD be included as part of Dixie Kong's moveset regardless of fighter type. Focus on what is integral to Dixie Kong's identity. For example, her hair being used for flight is so iconic to her that being a Richter/Daisy style echo is off the table for her.
Let Sakurai and his team deem what form of fighter would be most appropriate for Dixie Kong and how she should be implemented. Our job should instead be talking about why Dixie Kong deserves to be in, and talking about just what sort of abilities she has.
I hope this is the last time there is squabbling about fighter type in regards to Dixie Kong. Even if she were to hypothetically end up as an echo, Sakurai and his team would make sure the essentials of who Dixie Kong is, is actually there (using her hair for flight, her prehensile hair in general). The echoes were not lazy additions at all and Sakurai and his team did their homework in regards to the source material for those characters. If Dixie Kong simply cannot work as an echo, Sakurai will not try to squeeze a square peg into a round hole and simply make her into an outright semi-clone (again look at how the rules were bent for Ken).
For Ridley, Sakurai for years felt that resizing Ridley would no longer make him Ridley. However, he re-evaluated his stance and him and his team took a lot of time and effort to get Ridley implemented as a fighter.
If Sakurai does not think he could do Dixie Kong justice by simply just giving her Diddy's moveset plus a different recovery, he simply will not do it. We need to have confidence in him and his team.
To re-iterate, I think we need to focus on selling Dixie Kong. Regardless, of what Dixie Kong's playable incarnation turns out to be, it is going to reference her source material quite a bit. Our job is to make Dixie Kong seem like a valuable addition the roster as well as make the stuff that is unique to her well known.
I do not want to see Dixie Kong fans argue with each other anymore. We love and appreciate this character. We need to bring this appreciation to the the rest of the Smash Bros. fanbase. She is a treasure that has been overlooked so far, and our challenge will be to get others to see that she would be a valuable and worthy addition to the roster. We have our work cut out for us (especially for those who intend to support her going into the 2020's), but if we encourage each other, and persevere with our hearts, we can grow Dixie Kong's fanbase even if no new source material is made for her in the years ahead.
You are right. Dixie is just about the last character I think it’s worth rallying for. Am also 28 right now, and even if the roster of Ultimate Ian beyond expectation thanks to K.Rool, I still think Dixie needs her inclusion to truly fulfill the DKC roster. She’s the perfect addition, and I would settle with a Isabelle type of situation at this point honestly.
That and Diddy’s spiteful recovery nerfs in Ultimate make me long for a Echo that has a better recovery. And that alone would be huge, because it would result in a very different play style, we already see that with Roy and Chrom.
I have very few wishes left for Smash honestly. Mostly I just want Diddy buffed through patches, but as for characters I still wanna hold out for the like of Dixie, Isaac and maybe Impa is a new appearance of her is going to be as hype as Skyward Sword and Hyrule Warriors was. Banjo is also a nice idea, but personally I don’t really think it to be so likely. I’d like to be proven wrong however.
Anyway am looking forward to your essay about Dixie. You where always a great cheerful speculator who was able to analyze any situation with realism, yet was always positive enough to see hope in the situation.
Like you, I probably won’t speculate more after my 30s. Smash has evolved too much for me to care and as long as it got the essentials in character selection, no weird cuts happen, Diddy remains in the game, and the absence of Sakurai in potential future games won’t result in disaster, I’ll just enjoy the games for what they are worth.
I appreciate your compliments regarding my works. I know you are probably familiar with my Roy support back during the pre-Smash 4 days. I have no idea when I will finish the Dixie Kong essay. I simply do not have much free time anymore. However, it is not going to be the miracle cure to build Dixie Kong into having one of the largest support bases going forward. Instead, I just want to be able to give something to the Dixie Kong fanbase moving forward that they can use and look at for why Dixie Kong is a Nintendo All-Star, why she is one of gaming's best heroines, and what she could bring to Smash Bros. Whether Dixie Kong soars or sinks will be up the the next generation of Dixie Kong supporters and/or the old guard that decides to stay on for speculation and character support for the next Smash Bros. installment.
DKC3 under DK64?
KiddyKongcrying.wav
Donkey Kong 64 is easily the worst of Rare's DK titles in my personal opinion. It is also worse than both Nintendo 64 Banjo titles. It is probably a 8/10 game, but compared to the the DKC trilogy, it is a subpar game. It also had the worst excesses of the 3D platformers genre, and probably the textbook example about why the genre mostly died out after the 64/PS1 generation.
Country 3 by comparison is probably easily the most underrated of Rare's DK works. I am still waiting for the day when most realize it is obviously Rare's second best DK title. The level design is top notch in that title.
Diddy still has a tail attack and those changes up in your post is why she has to break away from being an echo to bring properly represented, .
Dixie Kong could easily use her ponytail as a substitute for Diddy Kong's tail. Ken has multiple different A-moves, and many of Chrom's attacks animations are different from Roy's due to Chrom holding his sword in the proper grip (as opposed to reverse grip that Roy does), which has gameplay difference connotations. Examples of this are Chrom being able to hit higher with some of his A-moves.
Forgot about the tail attack. But still even without that move too, you can call her echo with all these changes. I mean look at ken lol. She would still be more echo than ken.
Also wasnt it worded like: no echoes in the fighters pass? We could still get echoes for free. Or an echoes fighter pass or something like that.
I know there is little chance we get more echoes but sakurai would make so many people happy with little effort. I am sure most of us smash fans would buy them all.
I doubt echoes would be sold for free when even Mii costumes are not sold for free.
As for additional echoes, I am not confident on them happening, and I think the window for it happening closes if no echo newcomers are announced next month. The probability of it happening after June, is much lower because they would effectively have to stretch three echoes over possibly one more Smash Bros. focused direct (I think we are getting two of the Fighters Pass newcomers announced next month, and the remaining two will also be revealed together toward the end of the year).
If there are additional Fighters Passes though, there is the possibility one of them will be all echoes though. However, that is only a possibility if additional Fighter Passes happen. We shall see what happens. However, for now, set your expectation that there are only four characters left to unveil.
I don't think Dixie as an Echo is an intrinsically bad idea, but what does make it worse is the fact that Sakurai won't change her initial moveset ever. The dude's really stupid in that regard. .
This is flat out misinformation. Most of the clones in the Smash Bros. series have been decloned or made more unique in comparison to their originals over time. Ganondorf got a set of new Smash attacks in Ultimate. Dr. Mario, the cloniest clone aside from the echoes, got a bunch of new animations in Ultimate.
Look at how much Bowser was changed after Melee and Brawl, or Zero Suit Samus after Brawl. Sheik was given two new specials after two games.
I also think there is a significant chance that the next Smash Bros. installment is going to be a massive overhaul of the series (there are various reasons I believe as such). I think many veterans are going to be completely re-worked as part of this overhaul.
There is a real danger to thinking that past trends will continue forever. Conventional wisdom would dictate that characters like Pichu and Young Link would never return to the roster, or that Dark Samus and Chrom would never be revisited as roster prospects. Sometimes circumstances change which results in the conventional rules changing as well.
Unique Dixie > Semi-clone Dixie > Echo Dixie > No Dixie > Dixie as part of an Ice Climbers-style "tag team" with Diddy
What would be ranked below Dixie as part of a tag-team with Diddy? Dixie as part of a tag-team with Kiddy, haha. Seriously though, there might actually be reason to think that idea must have crossed Sakurai's mind considering that Dixie's spirit upgrades to Dixie & Kiddy, and Sakurai likes to revisit scrapped ideas (his original intention for Dixie was as part of a tag-team). I would not be shocked if Dixie were to someday end up being playable with the tag-team idea with Kiddy as her partner.
Playability is the most important part. The difference between a character and an assist trophy, a character and a spirit, a character and a Mii Costume. Playable characters are broadcast to the masses and the general public, to millions of people who aren't heavily invested in Nintendo. Everything else that falls below playability is ignored and fades into obscurity outside of their dedicated fandoms. The only exception to this is Waluigi, who's only been able to escape this due to his star power in other Mario spin offs like Mario Kart, which sells better than Smash anyway. Dixie doesn't have that screaming fanbase that Ridley and K. Rool had to launch her into Sakurai's view.
Dixie being playable means she gets to be introduced to millions of fans, she gets a place in fan art, fan animations, comics, tournament scenes, official promotions, her influence spreads considerably and she gets an incredible boost of stardom. Look at K. Rool and Dark Samus and what Smash did for them. Look at what Smash did for Fire Emblem and Kid Icarus.
Yes, gameplay is important. But it is not the only factor. I'd rather she get in at any means necessary.
Her being a full echo is incredibly unlikely anyway, she wouldn't be Daisy-tier, but more Chrom/Ken tier at the very least anyway.
I don't want to wait for the next game, that's for sure. I want her to be in the Ultimate roster with no cuts.
See what happened to Krystal? Everyone thought she was a shoo in for Smash 4. Then her popularity waned and now she's lucky to get in as an Assist Trophy.
Pretty dangerous to assume Dixie's popularity won't wane even further. Even in this DLC cycle her place among fan polls dropped considerably, to the point she's losing to characters that used to be far below her. Characters that have all the same points against Dixie when it comes to DLC, some characters that have even more against them, are now all winning against Dixie.
Honestly, even now, we're just repeating the exact same arguments we've had months prior because there literally is nothing to talk about. Other characters get their leaks and hints and enormous dicussions and fan requests and Dixie barely has anything in terms of contemporary speculation and discussion in the community. Part of the reason some people here are OK with her being an echo is that that is literally the only time she appears on anyone's "wants" lists these days, as part of a potential echo fighter's pass. I hate to see her being ignored again and again, but alas, we should be more vocal outside of this base if we want this to change.
Also I don’t think stupidity is a part of it as much as the fact that the roster is so enormous at this point that adding new characters and bringing back so many old ones just takes so much time in it of itself that changing every character’s movesets might not fit in time constraints. And despite this, several characters did have their movesets updated from Smash 4 to Ultimate.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
This is absolutely one of the best posts in regards to the "pro-echo" side of the debate. It "echoes" some of the same sentiments I have as well as concerns I have about the future.
For Dark Samus, she was a character on the precipice of being forgotten (she did not even have a massive push to be in Smash Bros. like K. Rool has had over the last decade). The combination of her last new appearance being all the way back in 2007 combined with Ridley continuously not making the roster until Ultimate dissolved her own fanbase over time. Many, many people who are unfamiliar with Dark Samus now play as her solely due to how "cool" she looks and moves even though she is barely different from Samus competitively.
For Dixie Kong, her co-starring in DKC2 might save her from becoming as obscure as Dark Samus, but as we can see now, she is definitely in danger of "fading".
My sentiment is not, "playability at any cost". My personal judgment is to leave the type of fighter Dixie Kong should be to Sakurai, and as a fan merely try to convince the wider Smash Bros. fanbase that Dixie Kong is one of the top candidates left for Smash Bros. regardless of what possible type of fighter she could be translated as. That is the purpose of the essay. To talk about Dixie Kong's importance and legacy. However, my prose do not compare to the fond memories people can have actually experiencing Dixie Kong and her adventures. It is imperative that Country 2, Country 3, and Tropical Freeze are encouraged to be played. Dixie Kong is an integral part to those masterpieces, and to their enjoyment as a whole.
Another thing you touched on that was poignant is the fact that some characters if they lose an opportunity to get in Smash Bros., they might never regain it, or it takes decades for another opportunity to emerge. For every miracle story like Dark Samus and Chrom, there is a story of "lost their chance" like Isaac and Krystal (though their fortunes would probably change if they were to ever have a new title).
I mentioned several times over the course of this thread that Dixie Kong fans cannot take "well she is inevitable" as a cop-out. The absolute best way to convince people that she should be more than an echo, is by building her fanbase and selling her as a Nintendo icon in general. That is going to take work. Unfortunately, I do not feel like putting that sort of work in. I would like to have faith in Dixie Kong's fanbase that is has the talent and drive necessary to get Dixie Kong to the forefront of the "Smash bubble's" most wanted characters. I understand that many in the Dixie Kong fanbase are in a similar situation or feeling as me where they simply feel too fatigued or do not have the time to sink into online character support. That is why it is imperative we need to grow the fanbase and try to get the younger generation to play her source material.
I think she is a real treasure for the future. Someone on par with the the Nintendo chacters added to the franchise so far. That is something to really say and hopefully something to feel. Aside from the Toads, who else has a long and storied history of importance within their franchise going back decades at this point? Dixie Kong was a pioneer. She made her debut before the likes of Jill Valentine and Lara Croft (even if it was by a few months) and it showed not only that girls could make viable popular gaming heroes, but also that they could be massively popular among boys without even having to use sex appeal. Simply old fashioned fun gameplay mechanics and abilities, ingame charm, and character design went a very long way.
Thing is though, Dixie is in much, much more comfortable and safer place than Krystal or K. Rool use to be because she is relevant in her franchise. Support will probably stay strong for Dixie unlike Krystal because she still has a presence in her franchise. Not saying she is going to rise to the top in the polls, but however popular or more popular Dixie get's, it's going to stay that way and she ain't going down. There is no going backwards for her, it's either she stays in the top 20 or she advances to the top 10.
I am sure the conventional belief was after Brawl's release was that Krystal and K. Rool had secure futures in their franchises. Again, this is counting chickens before they hatch.
As for Dixie's place in the polls, I already re-iterated this probably a few times already in this response, but here is the thing things. We do not know how much of Dixie Kong's fanbase is simply going to leave the Smash Bros. fanbase entirely in the coming years. A lot of us are in our late 20's and early 30's, and as such much of this demographic is not going to be interested in spending their scarce free time championing a video game character.
There have been multiple historical precedents as well of Dixie Kong missing critical DK games and being gone for long stretches of time. Her last appearance was 1997's Donkey Kong Land 3, and she did not make another game appearance (outside of Smash Bros.) until 2004's Donkey Konga 2. This same disappearing act happened again with 2007's Donkey Kong Barrel Blast and Jungle Climber being her last DK appearances and 2008's Mario Super Sluggers being her last Mario spinoff appearance ever, with her not making any new appearances until 2014's Tropical Freeze. It now has been five years, and Tropical Freeze is still the newest DK title.
We absolutely cannot count on that the wind will blow in the direction we want it to blow us towards. We might very well have to sail against wind and current.
Personally, I think it's a mix between a lack of consistent appearances and a failure to distinguish the characters through their separate personalities. The latter reason is probably why Funky typically stands out to fans. His personality does a really good job of separating himself from the other Kongs, whereas Dixie is usually seen as girl Diddy.
I actually think Nintendo has done a better job with DK and Funky than Rare did.
In regards to the last comment about Dixie being seen as "girl Diddy", I actually had a conversation with another user (vaanrose) on that. After Rare, her personality has mostly been the "girly" Kong. With DKC2 and DKC3, she had the sort of 90's valley girl stereotype to her (which explains the kneepads). She chewed gum and drank soda in her idle animations and she rocked out on a guitar. She also had little touches given to display her personality like her sassing K. Rool before their battle in DKC3, or casually popping a bubble gum bubble to get ahead of Kiddy. There are still shades of this in Tropical Freeze (like her playing air guitar in her idle animation, or her taking the Joy-Cons from DK in the new idle animation in the Switch port). I do like what Retro has done with Dixie Kong, but I think her portrayal in the Mario spinoffs and the two 2007 racing titles (Diddy Kong Racing DS and Barrel Blast) has made her viewed as "girl Diddy".
I think a big problem is that aside from DKC2, DKC3, and Tropical Freeze, her appearances have mostly been ensemble cast appearances (DK spinoff non-platformers and Mario spinoffs). After 2008, the only members of the DK cast that have been playable have been DK and Diddy, which means she gets less contemporary exposure.
With that all in mind, my best solution to all this is to keep coming up with creative ideas. SeashoreWar has been kicking *** with all those Mario Kart designs, and we have a Twitter page we can use to broadcast more creative things too. I thought that after doing the Dixie Kong moveset (shameless plug for those who haven't seen it) all those years back we wouldn't see this Kong come under fire for not having potential, but that didn't last long. So, I'mma do more imaginative stuff and I invite everyone who's willing to do the same. Fanart, crossovers, retrospective vids, essays, merch, stuff along those lines; You don't have to be an artist or professional writer, just be a fan of Donkey Kong. Talk more about what you want in a new DKC or DK game; if you want to make your own Kong be my guest, BUT I MUST say, no Sonic-style OCs or "Kong-sonas". We're not a weird bunch and we will keep it that way. I like that I'm NOT embarrassed to be supporting an adorable chimp and I'm among those who aren't making cringey things; We can keep the fandom alive and more importantly, healthy. Since we at the moment can't count on Nintendo to generate DK hype we should take it upon ourselves for the time being. I'll show something soon; also character reveal scripts are fine too--I'll put it in the OP once they start reemerging.
I very much agree with this sentiment. We need to work together and use our individual talents to help promote Dixie Kong. I think there is always going to be a debate about what type of fighter Dixie Kong will be (which is why I said we should just leave that question for Sakurai and his team). We should instead just be promoting Dixie Kong in general. I absolutely agree it will be up to Dixie Kong fans themselves to keep her fanbase alive. We cannot be reliant on external factors to help get us where we want to go. Sure it would make things exponentially easier for us, but we cannot depend on it or expect it.
I can definitely understand your desire to move away from this thread and character support in general. There is simply not the same drive anymore as you get older.
One of the most touching things I remember about this thread, are the various stories we shared about why we support Dixie Kong and like her. These were all deeply personal stories, and shows a connection that often came from childhood or adolescence. For many other characters, the support often comes from a certain "social" aspect of it, but for Dixie fans it seems to stem from the fun we had with the character and her games. While we are not as big as many other support bases out there, we probably have a lot more "heart" and genuineness.
Collecting these stories for the opening post (I believe you already have done this for a few testimonials) might at least help others understand why so many of us would want "girl Diddy" in Smash Bros. Dixie Kong is an integral facet to the appeal of the Donkey Kong series. Her charm and abilities still reverberating to us after all these years.
Here's the thing, though: Diddy and Dixie really are very similar mechanically. Yes, Dixie can float, Diddy's a little faster and can jump farther, and they both hold their barrels differently, but other than that, their differences come entirely from their personalities. That's why I think a Dixie Echo is a perfectly acceptable compromise. As long as the Smash team changed Dixie's animations (plus some models, like the peanut popgun changing to the gumball popgun) and gave her a ponytail dash and recovery, she could function exactly like Diddy and still be perfectly true to her character.
Keep in mind though, if we're going by the SNES DKCs what each Kong was able to do there's not much difference between DK, Diddy, Dixie or Kiddy. They all could do at least 4 things: Dash Attack, Hold a Barrel, Grab a lever and Run. DK's biggest distinctions was killing faster and a ground pound. Kiddy was heavy and could skip on water. Dixie could float through the air. All Diddy had on all of them was a slight speed advantage but otherwise was the most normal of the 4. Before the Rocket Barrel and Popguns, Diddy had only speed.
It wouldn't make sense to have Dixie be an Echo since she was established from the get-go to over-rely on her hair. She swung with it (Dash Attack), lifted with it (Grab), held onto levers with it, threw with it (Throw), and moved through the air with it, and that was her first appearance. Now we have her groundpounding with it, double-jumping with it and swimming through water with it as of Tropical Freeze. This is in addition to getting a popgun of her own. Diddy was always more of a full-body type of character; he was cartwheeling around letting his body hit foes while Dixie let her hair do the work for her. Diddy's SSB moveset involves him using momentum and full-body attacks more often than not, so a Dixie following the same pattern when her hair is her main form of offense AND movement is quite out of character for her.
The "replace hair attacks with tail attacks" mindset doesn't work either, because even before Ultimate, Diddy had only 2: Infinite Jab and a Ledge Sweep. The sweep barely got used due to context, leaving Diddy with virtually 1, and now that it's gone there's less reason to even bring that mindset, which I know you didn't, but it leads to my next point: unlike Dixie, Diddy's not relying on one specific aspect for leverage. The closest thing he has to her hair is his tail, and both in Smash and his home series, Diddy doesn't rely on it as much as Dixie relies on hers.
It is really up to Sakurai in the end. Just as it is possible we could get an "echo" incarnation to Dixie that is faithful to who she is and captures her abilities and charm well, or Sakurai deems the "echo" category (even with Ken-like liberties taken) too restrictive to successfully translate Dixie. Both sides have good arguments. In the end, I do think most Dixie Kong fans would be pleased with what Sakurai and his team do with Dixie Kong, even if it were to end up being a tag-team with Kiddy Kong, haha.
Personally, I would love for Dixie Kong to be a part of Ultimate's roster, but I realize this most likely will not happen. I can still hope for it as long as DLC is being made for Ultimate though.
I am not sure how much longer I will be a part of this community. A year ago, I did not think the only fanbase I would be a part of would be Dixie Kong's, or that I would even be involved at all (I had low personal expectations going into Ultimate as I felt realistically there was little it could add that would get me personally interested in it).
While we are not at the forefront, there is still stuff to say and share. The Dixie Kong fanbase likely has a very long journey ahead of them, and while I do not intend to stick around much longer, I hope someday I will get to congratulate them if the day ever comes that Dixie Kong ever does make it in.
We do not know what may come. BirthNote has said I have been right on many things, but I also have been wrong quite a bit as well. For example, I thought Dixie Kong was set to get a massive boost in popularity after K. Rool's confirmation. I thought Nintendo characters would be DLC in Ultimate prior to Joker's unveil. While I might have a prescient insight on some matters, I do not know what lies ahead. I can try and cover as much scenarios as possible, but in the end I am bound by only what I know, and I work what I know into what I say and write.
As a speculator, I never would have thought Dark Samus would ever be playable after Brawl as long as she remained irrelevant. It went against the conventional wisdom I had for nearly two decades as a roster speculator. Similarly, as a Ridley fan, I thought after Smash 4 it was most likely the end of the line in regards to him ever making the roster with Sakurai finally stating his perspective on Ridley.
On the other side, if you asked be ten years ago if you asked me if Dixie Kong would be in by Smash 5, I would be absolutely confident she would make it in (under the assumption that the very least K. Rool would make Smash 4, and Dixie would at least make Smash 5 if she was not added in Smash 4).
We do not know when and how (or even if) Dixie Kong will be implemented onto Smash Bros.'s roster in the future, but in the mean time we should all come together to appreciate her and think of how to sell Dixie Kong as a character. As much as some say my prose and insight uplifts, I think artists such as SeashoreWar are just an integral to the future of the fanbase. Everyone has their place and talent.
We may not be much. Back during the days of pre-Smash 4, the Roy fanbase went through similar trials and tribulations. There was certainly a large Roy fanbase, but we were often overlooked by many fans and attacked for supporting a clone (as well as various other detactor arguments). However, despite all of this, the Roy fanbase stuck together. Of the many things I posted over there, these few pages from the manga Hasha no Tsurigi were particularly poignant:
Similarly, we have various strengths and abilities that we all must use in tangent.
In less than three weeks, we will get two more characters confirmed for Smash Bros. Time will tell whether one of these newcomers portends to good or bad news going forward for Dixie Kong's prospects.
