Social The Ice Climber Communitiy

[Capybara Gaming]

Yo what's up, been a while since I even logged onto smashboards lol

I noticed from scouring YT today that ICs tagline on boxing ring is "bone-chilling duo", and also that bthrow does not kill in sudden death. Super important info

Oh man, I forgot that was a thing! Wonder what the other returning vets and newcomers' are...

 

[DeLux]

Some IC Humor lol

 

[BlueTerrorist]

While I did have my fun with ICs, there were some things that had me worried.

I have to note how hard it is to desynch in this game. Alot of the old desynching options we had is gone now. It's not clear on how we can desynch the two in a fast manner atm. I may have a theory on one way it can easily happen based on a video I saw.. It really feels like Sakurai wants them to focus less on desynching in this one.

Their grab game got gutted horribly compared to the last two games they were in. Nana can no longer be controlled when Popo grabs/throws anyone meaning they lose alot of damage and kill options out of grabs. Nana can also no longer free Popo from any grabs (She is just like Luma in this case) which makes grabs another option to separate the two. On a bit of a positive note, they do have Dthrow to Uair.

Not everything is doom and gloom for them though. The old way we played them may have taken a huge hit but we are in a new game. They feel much more faster and more agile compared to older games.

Blizzard now hits one way on the ground for both climbers. Before we had to short hop for that, now we don't have to do that as much anymore for the same effect. One other thing is the moves freezing effect, it no longer pop the opponent up. It now makes them fall down now and they stay frozen for alot longer compared to older versions. Also seems ICs was able to smash attack the opponent out of the ice. With this in mind, this is much more dangerous on the ledge than it already was.

I had no issues with their new Uair. I will miss that lingering hitbox of their old one but I still was able to juggle fine with this one. Pretty fast and can kill to boot.

The fact that they are more mobile this time around can be a changer here. That also means easier tech chasing and more landing trap opportunities they may not have had before due to being on the slow side before. I had fun with them and look forward to working on them more come December. Their old options may be dead but I wouldn't count them out just yet. I think they will focus more on damage this time around. We will just have to find new ways to desynch if we find them.

I will leave off with this. ICs have a desynch similar to Rosalina and Luma. I was able to have Popo grab and Nana do a dash attack at the same time. Same motion and everything.

 

[FunAtParties]

While I did have my fun with ICs, there were some things that had me worried.

I have to note how hard it is to desynch in this game. Alot of the old desynching options we had is gone now. It's not clear on how we can desynch the two in a fast manner atm. I may have a theory on one way it can easily happen based on a video I saw.. It really feels like Sakurai wants them to focus less on desynching in this one.

Their grab game got gutted horribly compared to the last two games they were in. Nana can no longer be controlled when Popo grabs/throws anyone meaning they lose alot of damage and kill options out of grabs. Nana can also no longer free Popo from any grabs (She is just like Luma in this case) which makes grabs another option to separate the two. On a bit of a positive note, they do have Dthrow to Uair.

Not everything is doom and gloom for them though. The old way we played them may have taken a huge hit but we are in a new game. They feel much more faster and more agile compared to older games.

Blizzard now hits one way on the ground for both climbers. Before we had to short hop for that, now we don't have to do that as much anymore for the same effect. One other thing is the moves freezing effect, it no longer pop the opponent up. It now makes them fall down now and they stay frozen for alot longer compared to older versions. Also seems ICs was able to smash attack the opponent out of the ice. With this in mind, this is much more dangerous on the ledge than it already was.

I had no issues with their new Uair. I will miss that lingering hitbox of their old one but I still was able to juggle fine with this one. Pretty fast and can kill to boot.

The fact that they are more mobile this time around can be a changer here. That also means easier tech chasing and more landing trap opportunities they may not have had before due to being on the slow side before. I had fun with them and look forward to working on them more come December. Their old options may be dead but I wouldn't count them out just yet. I think they will focus more on damage this time around. We will just have to find new ways to desynch if we find them.

I will leave off with this. ICs have a desynch similar to Rosalina and Luma. I was able to have Popo grab and Nana do a dash attack at the same time. Same motion and everything.

Good info, but the last thing I want is for IC's to be like Rosa and Luma. Also my personal hatred for the upair is just that I liked the old poke animation, I'm sure the new one's fine, but I don't see the point of changing it.

Being faster is nice, but does it mean much when that's a buff across the board? I guess it remains to be seen, but I feel like it's a wash.

From what I've seen Ice Climbers seem simplified, and I'm not sure I like it, as always I'll give them a shot, but rn I'm enamored with another hammer wielding character.

 

[Smasher89]

Yea, the 3 frame jumpsquat across the board is just another nerf, as it was one of their strenghts before to have a fast one, but if movement is indeed faster atleast that is something small that if there is guarantied kill setups still can be a good thing. The ice thing too was a small thing I noticed when watching vids (or not the pop out, but the fact it seemed to always take a while until the pop out happened allowing for followups where there really wasnt much of that beforem, that said that's something sakurai prob nerfs if it gets used.).

 

[lightdasher]

I think just not letting Nana grab is enough, not being controllable at all in grab or while grabbed feels really really weird.

I still think Nana not being able to grab is weird too, people who complain about chaingrabbing coming to Smash Ultimate clearly don't understand how grab mechanics worked in Smash 4

 

[DeLux]

Some More IC Humor

 

[ClimbersOfIce]

Nakat uploaded a new video in which the ice climbers pull off some nice desync shenanigans. https://youtu.be/ladbDU-46dc
There is something that I'm wondering about that is hard to put into words but I'll try. Ok, here goes... So Nana goes into a celebrating animation while popo throws and she can't do anything while popo grabs, we know that. But what IF the climbers are desynced and the following sequence occurs: Popo Down B -> Nana down B (keep in mind they're desynced) -> popo grab(when popo is grabbing, Nana is still in her down b animation)
Is it possible for Nana to follow up after popos throw after her down b animation finishes, taking into account she can't celebrate when popo throws because she is till finalizing her down B animation? It sounds weird the way I put it but hopefully someone understands. Basically, can you cheat the game to NOT make Nana taunt while popo throws due to a desync?

 

[FunAtParties]

Nakat uploaded a new video in which the ice climbers pull off some nice desync shenanigans. https://youtu.be/ladbDU-46dc
There is something that I'm wondering about that is hard to put into words but I'll try. Ok, here goes... So Nana goes into a celebrating animation while popo throws and she can't do anything while popo grabs, we know that. But what IF the climbers are desynced and the following sequence occurs: Popo Down B -> Nana down B (keep in mind they're desynced) -> popo grab(when popo is grabbing, Nana is still in her down b animation)
Is it possible for Nana to follow up after popos throw after her down b animation finishes, taking into account she can't celebrate when popo throws because she is till finalizing her down B animation? It sounds weird the way I put it but hopefully someone understands. Basically, can you cheat the game to NOT make Nana taunt while popo throws due to a desync?

I'd like to test this

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Question, does Belay still function as a Tether is done below the ledge?

 

[Smasher89]

Question, does Belay still function as a Tether is done below the ledge?

It does, but in the initial clip in the E3 video (one of ics first shown clips), the opponent can trump you, even if Popo buffers walk up, to get nana getting trumped, meaning you prob lose Nana every time in that situation.

 

[FunAtParties]

It does, but in the initial clip in the E3 video (one of ics first shown clips), the opponent can trump you, even if Popo buffers walk up, to get nana getting trumped, meaning you prob lose Nana every time in that situation.

This is gonna be a rough go at it

 

[Excelsis]

hey gals

 

[Cheryl~]

https://youtu.be/pQx6ougrhzo

Just uploading some footage of the ICs in action. Notably in this video, at about 2:20 you can see a desync with Side-B, which gives me more hope about ICs in Ultimate even with the nerfs they took after Brawl. With enough labbing and time I think ICs could be a pretty cool character. Anyways it’s just nice to see some more gameplay of them.

 

[Smasher89]

https://youtu.be/pQx6ougrhzo

Just uploading some footage of the ICs in action. Notably in this video, at about 2:20 you can see a desync with Side-B, which gives me more hope about ICs in Ultimate even with the nerfs they took after Brawl. With enough labbing and time I think ICs could be a pretty cool character. Anyways it’s just nice to see some more gameplay of them.

Looking at it, 1.20 looks interesting!, so i guess i finally found something potentially positive!

 

[AMcsx2]

https://youtu.be/pQx6ougrhzo

Just uploading some footage of the ICs in action. Notably in this video, at about 2:20 you can see a desync with Side-B, which gives me more hope about ICs in Ultimate even with the nerfs they took after Brawl. With enough labbing and time I think ICs could be a pretty cool character. Anyways it’s just nice to see some more gameplay of them.

At 0:45 Popo lands with his nair before Nana and instantly performs a spot dodge allowing Nana to jump and independently do an aerial. That looks really interesting!

 

[ClimbersOfIce]

Ni

At 0:45 Popo lands with his nair before Nana and instantly performs a spot dodge allowing Nana to jump and independently do an aerial. That looks really interesting!

Nice catch! If that turns out to be a reliable desync option that would be AWESOME. Landing Nair spotdodge to Nana down b or something.

 

[DeLux]

FYI to some new IC players that weren't familiar to the Brawl days, this post is to the Twitter of some super notable IC players throughout the life of Brawl. It seems people have a tendency right now to only look at the Melee IC players since the game is still active, but it might be good to get insight from these guys since Brawl ICs seem much more related to the Brawl iteration than the Melee

https://twitter.com/ChaseTheLux/status/1017102914223894528

Also, more IC humor:
https://twitter.com/ChaseTheLux/status/1017652180973522944

 

[Smasher89]

9b not mentioned? wasnt he the one that traveled to apex 2010?, was like him kakera and someone else I dont recall that was worth watching i recall, as they frequently found out new stuff and brought alright results. EDIT: it has to have been 9b https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JA6PJVxK2rM

 

[DeLux]

9b not mentioned? wasnt he the one that traveled to apex 2010?, was like him kakera and someone else I dont recall that was worth watching i recall, as they frequently found out new stuff and brought alright results. EDIT: it has to have been 9b https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JA6PJVxK2rM

9B is in my post.

Also he traveled to Apex 2013, since most of Japan didn't make it until Apex 2012.

 

[Smasher89]

Apparently shorthopping aerials makes them do less knockback and damage now compared to fullhop no matter when you commit to the attack, how do you think it'll affect ics combogame?

 

[DJ3DS]

You know how Blizzard can freeze people? It used to send them flying upwards in an ice block when this happened, similarly (though not as extremely) to Lucas' PK Freeze.

It doesn't do that anymore. If you freeze someone with it, they're subject to gravity as usual, so if you freeze them midair they will plummet until they mash out.

This isn't speculation, by the way. At the Nintendo UKVS Live event in London I was using it to try get a little extra damage (as the cone makes it reach slightly below the ledge) and froze my opponent (Mario) at the ledge, scoring a KO as by the time he mashed out he was too far below the ledge to recover.

 

[Cheryl~]

In the UK Invitational we also saw footage of the Ice Climbers juggling a Donkey Kong to 70% with the new Up-Air which was really nice to see. Up-Air seems to be an excellent move all around, having the potential to juggle and also being able to be comboed into. (Down Throw into Up-Air does work I believe) This new juggling ability (more effective on heavies but could also work on other fighters) along with the new Blizzard edgeguard gives me even more hope for the ICs in Ultimate once the meta forms.

 

[DJ3DS]

In the UK Invitational we also saw footage of the Ice Climbers juggling a Donkey Kong to 70% with the new Up-Air which was really nice to see. Up-Air seems to be an excellent move all around, having the potential to juggle and also being able to be comboed into. (Down Throw into Up-Air does work I believe) This new juggling ability (more effective on heavies but could also work on other fighters) along with the new Blizzard edgeguard gives me even more hope for the ICs in Ultimate once the meta forms.

Yeah, Down Throw Up Air works once you've got some percent on them. Before that Down Throw Up-Tilt seems to work too.

They're still fairly slow, don't like being outranged and I had difficulty approaching with them (and hadn't yet figured out the desyncs to outcamp my opponents). They perhaps didn't seem as vulnerable to separation by grabs as I thought (Nana can't attack whilst throwing, but can in the lag immediately after) though need to watch out for throws that will also hurt the climber who isn't damaged.

It's early days but I kind of expect them to be difficult to solo main with the likes of Corrin running around (seriously, their F-Smash will tipper you through Blizzard, nearly everything they have seems safe and if they grab you their Down Throw can hurt the other climber if they don't shield) but to have good value as a counterpick. Desyncs are still going to cause some polarising matchups; unless Macs Side B can prioritise through it I genuinely don't know what he can do against a desynced Blizzard wall, for example.

 

[Smasher89]

Looked in that clip like it was dthrow uptil, dk jumped, then popo upair caught him midjump, needs labbing day 1 to know if he can airdodge out at any point there.

 

[Nintykid]

VOLUME WARNING

Thought I'd add this here

 

[Bayopuff]

Does anyone have any kind of Smash Ultimate footage where Nana doesn't die when they're trying to recover?

 

[Deleted member]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSWK8_FTNdI&feature=youtu.be

Holy moly that damage in the beginning. Given it's a heavy and easy to juggle but, that's an eye opener.

 

[Noventiaa]

I was kind of skeptical about the ICs at first in ultimate, but...wow, they look so cool. I love how they're being made into the ultimate glass cannon - massive damage output and strong basically everywhere when together, but gimp nana and the field drastically changes. They've moved from "character i'll try day 1" to "possible main/secondary."

 

[ClimbersOfIce]

I was kind of skeptical about the ICs at first in ultimate, but...wow, they look so cool. I love how they're being made into the ultimate glass cannon - massive damage output and strong basically everywhere when together, but gimp nana and the field drastically changes. They've moved from "character i'll try day 1" to "possible main/secondary."

I don't know if it's just me but, I don't really like what they are doing with them. Seems like their eliminating desync options which bothers me. Desyncing was a very stylish form of getting combos and set ups... Now they just increased their raw damage output which is kind of boring... It basically makes them a heavyweight hitter except that when Nana dies they are way worse.

 

[Noventiaa]

I don't know if it's just me but, I don't really like what they are doing with them. Seems like their eliminating desync options which bothers me. Desyncing was a very stylish form of getting combos and set ups... Now they just increased their raw damage output which is kind of boring... It basically makes them a heavyweight hitter except that when Nana dies they are way worse.

Desyncs still definitely still exist, just usually not out of grabs that most aren't used to.

 

[ClimbersOfIce]

Desyncs still definitely still exist, just usually not out of grabs that most aren't used to.

Not out of grabs, not out of a spot Dodge, not out of a roll, not out of a dash dance. There is no practical way to desync them in neutral anymore and it's honestly pretty lame. Granted, we don't have the game in our hands yet but it seems that practical desyncing options are virtually nonexistent right now, which takes away the point of the character for me.

The icies are suppose to be somewhat glass cannon, absurdly powerful together but pathetically weak without the other.. now they are just "pretty alright" together, while still being equally as awful without each other as in previous games.

Project M did the ice climbers right. They still gave them desync options but they removed broken mechanics like wobbling and infinites. It seems like fans understand the characters' niche better than the developers of smash ultimate.

 

[MERPIS]

Desync squall hammer looks like the scariest thing ever its basically unpunishable since the other climber's squall hammer starts when the other one ends and it just looks painful

 

[DJ3DS]

So guys - NAKAT has the Blizzard edgeguard I mentioned a couple of things ago recorded now:

In particular, you should pay attention to Ridley's second stock loss.

 

[DeLux]

lol Is freeze no longer mashable?

 

[DJ3DS]

lol Is freeze no longer mashable?

It is, but the duration may vary based on percentage.

Either way I've no illusion that it's an infallible edgeguard but it does work quite well against certain opponents, especially those with poor vertical recoveries. I hit a Mario with it at around 80% and he escaped but too low to recover with just his up b.

 

[DeLux]

It is, but the duration may vary based on percentage.

Either way I've no illusion that it's an infallible edgeguard but it does work quite well against certain opponents, especially those with poor vertical recoveries. I hit a Mario with it at around 80% and he escaped but too low to recover with just his up b.

hype, winter is coming

 

[ClimbersOfIce]

So guys - NAKAT has the Blizzard edgeguard I mentioned a couple of things ago recorded now:

In particular, you should pay attention to Ridley's second stock loss.

He seems to be having trouble desyncing. Not a good sign for the ice climbers. Rip. I know the game isn't out yet but they've had enough time to figure something out and the only thing we have is pivot f smash which SUCKS as a form of desyncing. Looks like I'll have to look for a new main for ultimate.

 

[DJ3DS]

He seems to be having trouble desyncing. Not a good sign for the ice climbers. Rip. I know the game isn't out yet but they've had enough time to figure something out and the only thing we have is pivot f smash which SUCKS as a form of desyncing. Looks like I'll have to look for a new main for ultimate.

This feels a little premature. Tons of things in games take time to figure out (they got a new launch glitch in BOTW just this week, for example) and I think it's unfair to expect someone to be perfectly consistent in the tech for a character in a game they've had no time to play outside of demos and during which they'll have had no opportunity to just practice uninterrupted.

 

[DeLux]

Yea, if you look at the Brawl IC forums, it took until like 2010 for someone to start posting all kinds of new discoveries on the character.

Edit:jokes about me aside, ICs kept seeing huge growth in meta discoveries through like... 2013 late, early 2014. Probably the most growth of any character on a technical level in Brawl. The early discoveries were wild, but even the late ones continued the wildness lol