The Better Lucario Official Guide/Faq/Database (Now with More Lawl!)

[Kitamerby]

But would jumping off the edge to your death take away decay as Rebonack says?

Yes, it does.

Spoiler

Grumble grumble movelist naming grumble

 

[Nodrak]

1. Cool, graph
2. phi1ny3 cheats
3. Thanks, didn't know dieing reduced delay

 

[Browny]

hmm my chart is a little screwy i just noticed the divisions on the bottom are in 4%, not 5%. ill fix that, and make the trend line more visible. update in a few mins

 

[phi1ny3]

1. Cool, graph
2. Don't quote large pics please
3. Thanks, didn't know dieing reduced delay

What large pic? lol

 

[Nodrak]

What large pic? lol

Exactly my question

 

[Jeepy Sol]

...


*chuckle*

 

[phi1ny3]

1. Cool, graph
2. phi1ny3 cheats
3. Thanks, didn't know dieing reduced delay

This is going to get quoted, u know as in, it's going to find a place in my sig or something.

 

[Xaile]

Great thread with lots of useful information, thanks to everyone who has contributed, and Infi-Tan for compiling and keeping the first post updated.

Great work, the effort does not go unappreciated. Hopefully it will help my Lucario play.

 

[Zero_Gamer]

Any chance you guys could also post a chart of Lucario's match-ups? Like who has favor against whom?
Not that it's gonna change my opinion that Lucario's awesome, aaah what am I talking about, its a FACT!

 

[Nodrak]

A chart like that exists on the Brawl Tactical Discussion forums. The problem is that it's an extremely subjective topic. Just because a group of people can easily kill the metaknights they play, doesn't mean it'll be easy for the next group to beat someone playing metaknight.

 

[Greenpoe]

Well, if we could get one nice post of all the info the Lucario community knows about Lucario's matchup (like advantages, disadvantages, what to watch out for, what moves to use more, etc.) that'd be really helpful.

 

[Milln]

Well, if we could get one nice post of all the info the Lucario community knows about Lucario's matchup (like advantages, disadvantages, what to watch out for, what moves to use more, etc.) that'd be really helpful.

That's what the Inverse Matchup thread is for. D=

 

[Nodrak]

It's true, though it's starting to semi-turn into a match-up thread. Still enough to be inverse though!

I think he means like a typical match-up thread. The one with a nice chart saying who is good against who and then we get into a big argue about how everyone (especially whoever posted, they're a prime target) is wrong about matchups... what? that's what I've seen through all the other character forums? =P

I have my inverse thread up, if there's still room (I haven't hit the post size limit yet) I'll put a chart in there to save space (or mabye Infi's guide would work too).

 

[Kitamerby]

That's what the Inverse Matchup thread is for. D=

Yeah, but an Inverse Inverse Matchup section would simplify things for the newbies and the desperate.

 

[Milln]

May 21st/22nd, 2008- Added Four new combos, Two new tricks, noted which throws are affected by the damage modifier, three approaches, and switched up the pictures for a change of pace. The first one wins for "Best Picture of Aura Storm".

Yay new pictures. Keep the information comin', guys.

 

[phi1ny3]

If u want a good pic of Aura Storm in action, look at this one:

 

[Milln]

No. The one displayed on the front page devours that one. Yours is also old. D= One morrrrrrrre thing. Stop posting so many huge pictures, please. You're clogging up the smooth scrolling for information.

 

[phi1ny3]

No. The one displayed on the front page devours that one. Yours is also old. D= One morrrrrrrre thing. Stop posting so many huge pictures, please. You're clogging up the smooth scrolling for information.

Sorry, but I've seen way too many pics like the one on the first page on photobucket (although I did like the sketch from "Claustrophobia"). btw, What "huge picture"?

1. Cool, graph
2. phi1ny3 cheats
3. Thanks, didn't know dieing reduced delay

 

[Browny]

phi1ny3,

where did you get that pic? internode/aussie nintendo forums? coz thats mine lol

 

[Browny]

if you want moar lucario pics, refer to my thread here :>

http://games.internode.on.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=142266

page 2 has a few as well

----
oh **** lol duble post i thought i was editing >_>
----

 

[Silvran]

The new pics are awesome, especially the one by "Claustrophobia"

 

[Nodrak]

Ok, I know this may be stupid but something that should be added to the guide (for new users who don't frequent forums much)

Force Palm = sideB
Double Team = downB
Extreme Speed = upB
Aura Sphere = justB

 

[Jeepy Sol]

I have a question.

I am going to be doing some KO power tests (among other things), and I need to know what the actual aura multipliers are.

Like, we thought before that they were 0%, 50%, 100%, 150%, and 200%. Rebonack tested when the aura kicks in, and when it caps, but what are the individual percents? ... If that makes sense...

 

[Browny]

go back 1 page.... refer to my graph.

its an average all attacks, so its pretty accurate for testing purposes. the error involved at any point shouldnt make any more than a 5% difference in whether a move KO's or not

 

[Jeepy Sol]

Thanks!

But at what incriments should I test? Every 50%? Every 35%? 10%? That's kind of what I wanted to know.

 

[Milln]

Start at 50%, then increase in 30%'s. We don't really start looking for ways to kill until around 50% and it'll go 50 > 80 > 120 > 150 which seems like ideal steps. I doubt we'll hang around the damage cap long enough to get a KO off, so it's not important to test it, but do so if you like.

 

[KoalaBear]

Lucario is too good !

 

[Nodrak]

I'd stick to every 50% since it's easier, every 25% if you want to get accurate; every 10% is a bit much.
I'll make another excel sheet if you want. Man these business classes sure are paying off. =P

Edit: How the heck did Infi beat me to the reply by 5 minutes? It took me less then a minute to type this!

 

[Jeepy Sol]

I think I'll do every 50% first, then once I'm done do every 25% in between.

And I'll take that excel sheet!


EDIT: OMG, Milln, same time post!!!

AND PHI1NY3 TOO!!!!!

 

[Milln]

I'm A Sneaky Ninja.

Ha. And then I same Time Post as Jeepy.

 

[phi1ny3]

Ditto, me would like excel sheet.

 

[Zero_Gamer]

Umm, maybe I missed it but, it seems like u didn't add how Lucario's UpAir gains tremendous knockback at Aure Lvl 4 (80%) and up.

It's great how Lucario has one of the most versatile styles in the game. Easily shifting from offense to defense, and even then his defense will be as strong as Ike!

I'm liking all this info, its very....... informative.

 

[PSYCHE]

There are Aura levels now?!?

Sheesh, I havent been gone THAT long!

Anyways, what are they???

 

[adeptx]

Correct me if I'm wrong but a move is affected by decay when it hits an opponent. Not only that but moves are recorded in the decay queue for up to 9 moves. So if you
AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > AS
aura sphere will have horrible decay. Now if you do a fsmash, it shouldn't cancel out every other AS, it'll just get put into the queue.
AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > fsmash
And if you do lets say a usmash now it'll look like
AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > AS > fsmash > usmash
If you shoot an AS, would it not still be affected by 7 points of decay?

This makes sense to me, but I still have a few questions.

1) So any move that misses is completely disregarded by the queue? (Seems odd, since the only point of decay seems to be to discourage spamming, which is by definition performed regardless of whether it is expected to hit or not)

2) If a move is shielded, is it a hit? Reflected/Absorbed? Countered? Powershielded?

3) How is the AAA sequence treated?

4) Does ExSpeed fill a slot? Since most characters' Up B's deal damage, I would expect that they do.

5) What if I double team succesfully, but the counter attack misses?

6) Does each hit with a charging aura sphere fill a slot?

7) What happens when attacks cancel each other? Projectiles?

8) Is each throw direction treated separately?

I realize some of these might be almost impossible to answer empiricly, but I thought I'd throw them out anyway.

 

[Greenpoe]

1) So any move that misses is completely disregarded by the queue? (Seems odd, since the only point of decay seems to be to discourage spamming, which is by definition performed regardless of whether it is expected to hit or not)
Yes, it is disregarded.

2) If a move is shielded, is it a hit? Reflected/Absorbed? Countered? Powershielded?
No, it is disregarded.

4) Does ExSpeed fill a slot? Since most characters' Up B's deal damage, I would expect that they do.
No.

Sorry, I dunno about #3 or the others for sure.

 

[Kitamerby]

This makes sense to me, but I still have a few questions.

1) So any move that misses is completely disregarded by the queue? (Seems odd, since the only point of decay seems to be to discourage spamming, which is by definition performed regardless of whether it is expected to hit or not)

Yup.

2) If a move is shielded, is it a hit? Reflected/Absorbed? Countered? Powershielded?

Nope. Only connected attacks count that deal damage, even by fractional amounts, such as Lucario's grabpunches.

3) How is the AAA sequence treated?

Each as individual hits. I'm pretty darn sure the only moves that don't count as individual hits are multi-hit moves which don't require extra button input, such as Mario's dair and possibly Fox's fair.

4) Does ExSpeed fill a slot? Since most characters' Up B's deal damage, I would expect that they do.

Nope. Only damaging attacks have slots.

5) What if I double team succesfully, but the counter attack misses?

It doesn't have any effect on the cheque in that case, as the attack did no knockback nor damage. Only successful attacks that do damage register.

6) Does each hit with a charging aura sphere fill a slot?

Yeah. Unfortunately, each hit with a charging aura sphere shares the slot with the aura sphere projectile itself. Luckily, we have grabpunches to even this out afterwards.

7) What happens when attacks cancel each other? Projectiles?

Attacks that cancel have no effect on the cheque due to them technically not hitting any other character. Same thing with destroying projectiles.

8) Is each throw direction treated separately?

Yup. Each throw's damage and knockback diminishes. If I throw upwards 5 times, then throw downwards once, then the downwards throw will be at full power.


Speaking of which, can someone please tell me if hitting the sandbag has any effect on diminishing returns? I can't really check it out for myself right now due to wii problems. I'm pretty darn sure it shouldn't due to Sandbag not being counted as a character anymore, but I'd feel better if I knew for sure.

 

[Browny]

There can be no aura level, since it changes with every attack. for example Aura sphere changes in damage 13 times while upsmash only changes 9 times by the time lucario gets to max strength.

 

[Zero_Gamer]

Well, by Aura Levels, I mean the general change in power as damage increases. (sounds really cool too)

One more thing... even though UpSmash only upgrades in damage by 9 levels, is it possible that the knockback power could still continue to increase by more levels? Is there a chance that all moves increase in terms of both damage and knockback combined to an equal extent for each attack?

Lucario is the cure to emo's

 

[Kitamerby]

Well, by Aura Levels, I mean the general change in power as damage increases. (sounds really cool too)

One more thing... even though UpSmash only upgrades in damage by 9 levels, is it possible that the knockback power could still continue to increase by more levels? Is there a chance that all moves increase in terms of both damage and knockback combined to an equal extent for each attack?

Unfortunately not. Knockback and damage caps go hand in hand.

Lucario is the cure to emo's

...*NEARLY CHOKES ON DRINK LAUGHING*

 

[Nodrak]

Contrary to popular belief, not playing Brawl for a month does not improve the level you play at... Though I pulled off a 0-to-death on Ganon on skyworld. FPCG until he was off the edge (he had 48% at that point) fair > dair, he couldn't get back. Maybe that counts for something

6) Does each hit with a charging aura sphere fill a slot?
... yes it does... holy fruit cups batman! All you have to do is get someone trapped in a charging AS for a a couple seconds and you've completely reset your decay to all attacks besides AS O.O Meaning your AS will be crap but every other attack will be at full power.