TAKE THAT! Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney smashes the prosecution!

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Ah **** I just remembered.

Resident Evil exists. So we might get Leon/Jill. I’d be happy if it happened, but it ain’t Wright.

Then again, maybe they don’t want a gun fighter in the same pack as Joker.

Despite being seen on the ballot on the web, he's usually only in the 30th-40th place region. That's too low to be considered an expected addition.

He has competition, but it's been greatly reduced. Any represented series in Smash right now is out of the picture, as are Geno, Tails, Chun-Li, and Sephiroth. That's a chunk of the candidates removed in one fast swoop.

His main competitor is Dante. I am nearly convinced we'll get another Capcom character....but Dante would still have the surprise factor whilst being more recognizable and with a new game on the way (Ace Attorney is still MIA, but could have a new game announced next year. It's the usual time span for a new game to drop).

I'd view his chances at 20%-25%. It's not high, but it's better than the 1%-5% we had prior. All we can do is hope he got selected by Nintendo and Sakurai gave him the nod of approval. But I think we have a reason to be slightly optimistic and hopeful here.

One thing to remember regarding RE characters and Dante's fighting styles and how they're notably similar to other fighters.

Nintendo got a list but Sakurai got to pick the 5. And remember, he tries to go for as much variety as possible. Phoenix Wright would bring the most new to the table out of the three.

 

[GoodGrief741]

I haven't played Persona 5 specifically, but I believe the gun is only a small arsenal of Joker's moveset potential.

I dunno, I’m expecting his tilts, jabs and smashes to all be gun attacks.

 

[Sonsa]

I keep flip flopping on Geno wildly, it's either guaranteed or no chance haha

Um! As for...all this...I'm still so bewildered... umm! But I think that quote isn't exactly right, I think he just means "new to the series" like how they've said before, like when Sakurai said in the last direct "The DLC will be new since we have all the veterans" or something? I think they just meant that. I sure HOPE that's a direct quote cause thatd help a lot, be a huge hint! Either way uhh...shoot, I've never even seen Joker on any fan polls... Any idea how he did on the ballot? Did he even exist during the ballot? (I don't know much about Persona, still super happy for his fans and he looks real cool!)

This just like...really...ahh... Phoeniiix...! This even raised Monokuma's chances haha, ohhhh Phoenix please my boy oh goodness please don't let it be that Phoenix actually got the invite and that's the one Joker stole haha

 

[GoodGrief741]

I keep flip flopping on Geno wildly, it's either guaranteed or no chance haha

Um! As for...all this...I'm still so bewildered... umm! But I think that quote isn't exactly right, I think he just means "new to the series" like how they've said before, like when Sakurai said in the last direct "The DLC will be new since we have all the veterans" or something? I think they just meant that. I sure HOPE that's a direct quote cause thatd help a lot, be a huge hint! Either way uhh...shoot, I've never even seen Joker on any fan polls... Any idea how he did on the ballot? Did he even exist during the ballot? (I don't know much about Persona, still super happy for his fans and he looks real cool!)

This just like...really...ahh... Phoeniiix...! This even raised Monokuma's chances haha, ohhhh Phoenix please my boy oh goodness please don't let it be that Phoenix actually got the invite and that's the one Joker stole haha

Joker didn’t exist during the ballot, though he did place decently in polls after P5’s release.

Definitely below Phoenix though.

 

[An Archie]

I find this article pretty interesting... especially with the context of that photo of Sakurai meeting Takumi and Kamiya.
On one hand, I feel like it just makes their meeting irrelevant.
One the other hand, I'm probably going to sound like a crazy tin-foil hat conspiracy theorist, but almost sounds like Sakurai is directly referencing his meeting with Takumi, specifically this part:

In addition, it wouldn’t necessarily be the original creator I would meet – rather like how I was directly involved with the Kirby series, but don’t know about other projects now.

To my understanding, Takumi isn't directly involved in the mainline ace attorney games anymore.
Is Sakurai trying to throw us off the scent? It's probably just a coincidence though.

 

[Wyoming]

I think it depends which Phoenix he picks?

Trilogy Phoenix and post-trilogy Phoenix may be the same man, but their appearances and personality slightly defer. So far in crossovers the only Phoenix we've seen is the OG Phoenix, since that's the one people know.

Not to mention the part before your quoted piece:

There are cases where I will meet with the original creators myself once or twice, but in general communication is carried out through Nintendo"

It's happened before that he meets the creator. I am going to guess Kojima and Kamiya are two instances based on past information.

It's wild times when we can make conspiracies about Phoenix being in Smash.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

I find this article pretty interesting... especially with the context of that photo of Sakurai meeting Takumi and Kamiya.

Let's not forget this bit:

There are cases where I will meet with the original creators myself once or twice,

Like Wyoming said, it's not out of the realms of possibility. Also, Reggie recently had this to say about Joker on Smash during an interview with IGN:

“It’s emblematic of the approach that Mr. Sakurai and the team are taking with the DLC. He wants characters that are unique, different, to bring them into the Smash Bros. environment."

This definitely hints even more at characters with fighting styles never before seen in Smash, and possibly even suggesting new franchises. Yet another favorable bit of evidence for Phoenix Wright!

 

[Caladuz]

Hopefully we get to see this for real, one day.

 

[Caladuz]

I have a pretty crazy conspiracy theory. What if the anime is teasing a smash bros reveal. We have the invitation and the "Phoenix wright joins the fray" ad.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

I have a pretty crazy conspiracy theory. What if the anime is teasing a smash bros reveal. We have the invitation and the "Phoenix wright joins the fray" ad.

Wouldn't be the first time we've gotten a tease that's led to something.

 

[Wyoming]

I have a pretty crazy conspiracy theory. What if the anime is teasing a smash bros reveal. We have the invitation and the "Phoenix wright joins the fray" ad.

Ha! To add fuel to your conspiracy; this is a completely original case they made up for the anime, thus not referencing anything from Trials and Tribulations.
The timing is a little peculiar for it as well.
I give your theory a 10/10 for conspiracy-ness.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Ha! To add fuel to your conspiracy; this is a completely original case they made up for the anime, thus not referencing anything from Trials and Tribulations.
The timing is a little peculiar for it as well.
I give your theory a 10/10 for conspiracy-ness.

And Takumi is helping out directly to the point of writing some of these episodes too!

Even more good for thought. You remember how Sakurai has spoken fondly of Persona 5 before?

Well he's spoken fondly of Ace Attorney as well. In the good kind of sense that could get playability rather than just the simple "I like it" format.

 

[Wyoming]

Time for some spirits ideas:

Mia Fey: Brunette Zelda, Pink Hair Bowser, Hazardless Fourside

Conditions:

- Zelda avoids conflict
- Items gravitate towards Bowser (Capsules only)
- Timed Battle
Goal: Defeat Bowser before he KOs Zelda or time runs out. (Or KOs you)

Maya Fey: Purple Zelda, Suzaku Castle

Conditions:

- Opponent loves to taunt
- Opponent is drawn to items
- Opponent will gain a speed boost after a while

Miles Edgeworth: Blue Villager, Battlefield New Donk City

Conditions:

- Opponent loves neutral specials
- The floor will tremble with earthquakes
- Items will gravitate towards opponent

Franziska von Karma: White Richter, Courtroom

- Opponent loves forward smashes
- Opponent's damage will increase in time

**** Gumshoe: Dark Yellow Luigi, Battlefield Prism Tower

Conditions:

-Opponent is distracted by items
-Opponent starts off with a Franklin Badge
-The floor is sticky

Godot: White Hair Phoenix, Omega Garden of Hope

Conditions:

-Opponent starts with a Killing Edge
-Fog will cover the stage
-Stamina Battle

Apollo Justice: Red Suit Phoenix, Cyan Isabelle, Courtroom

Conditions:

-Opponent loves side specials
-Stage will reverse itself

Athena Cykes: Yellow Zero Suit Samus, Tiny Red ROB, Tiny Blue ROB, Joker, Frigate Orpheon

-Gravity is decreased after a short while.
-Opponent's defenses will increase after a while

 

[GoodGrief741]

Time for some spirits ideas:

Mia Fey: Brunette Zelda, Pink Hair Bowser, Hazardless Fourside

Conditions:

- Zelda avoids conflict
- Items gravitate towards Bowser (Capsules only)
- Timed Battle
Goal: Defeat Bowser before he KOs Zelda or time runs out. (Or KOs you)

Maya Fey: Purple Zelda, Suzaku Castle

Conditions:

- Opponent loves to taunt
- Opponent is drawn to items
- Opponent will gain a speed boost after a while

Miles Edgeworth: Blue Villager, Battlefield New Donk City

Conditions:

- Opponent loves neutral specials
- The floor will tremble with earthquakes
- Items will gravitate towards opponent

Franziska von Karma: White Richter, Courtroom

- Opponent loves forward smashes
- Opponent's damage will increase in time

**** Gumshoe: Dark Yellow Luigi, Battlefield Prism Tower

Conditions:

-Opponent is distracted by items
-Opponent starts off with a Franklin Badge
-The floor is sticky

Godot: White Hair Phoenix, Omega Garden of Hope

Conditions:

-Opponent starts with a Killing Edge
-Fog will cover the stage
-Stamina Battle

Apollo Justice: Red Suit Phoenix, Cyan Isabelle, Courtroom

Conditions:

-Opponent loves side specials
-Stage will reverse itself

Athena Cykes: Yellow Zero Suit Samus, Tiny Red ROB, Tiny Blue ROB, Joker, Frigate Orpheon

-Gravity is decreased after a short while.
-Opponent's defenses will increase after a while

Great choices, I especially love how Edgeworth’s Battle replicates DL-6, poor Edgey lol.

Also Gumshoe’s name got censored? C’mon

 

[fogbadge]

Wouldn't be the first time we've gotten a tease that's led to something.

is isnt?

 

[MacDaddyNook]

Time for some spirits ideas:

Mia Fey: Brunette Zelda, Pink Hair Bowser, Hazardless Fourside

Conditions:

- Zelda avoids conflict
- Items gravitate towards Bowser (Capsules only)
- Timed Battle
Goal: Defeat Bowser before he KOs Zelda or time runs out. (Or KOs you)

Maya Fey: Purple Zelda, Suzaku Castle

Conditions:

- Opponent loves to taunt
- Opponent is drawn to items
- Opponent will gain a speed boost after a while

Miles Edgeworth: Blue Villager, Battlefield New Donk City

Conditions:

- Opponent loves neutral specials
- The floor will tremble with earthquakes
- Items will gravitate towards opponent

Franziska von Karma: White Richter, Courtroom

- Opponent loves forward smashes
- Opponent's damage will increase in time

**** Gumshoe: Dark Yellow Luigi, Battlefield Prism Tower

Conditions:

-Opponent is distracted by items
-Opponent starts off with a Franklin Badge
-The floor is sticky

Godot: White Hair Phoenix, Omega Garden of Hope

Conditions:

-Opponent starts with a Killing Edge
-Fog will cover the stage
-Stamina Battle

Apollo Justice: Red Suit Phoenix, Cyan Isabelle, Courtroom

Conditions:

-Opponent loves side specials
-Stage will reverse itself

Athena Cykes: Yellow Zero Suit Samus, Tiny Red ROB, Tiny Blue ROB, Joker, Frigate Orpheon

-Gravity is decreased after a short while.
-Opponent's defenses will increase after a while

Pretty good stuff, I can see these happening as official Spirit battles.

I feel bad for those named Richard though, not that I don't understand the censorship.

Huh.. Well that explains how Phoenix Wright and Maya survived the Spirit wave purge.

This is such a fun image. I could see her as a Spirit shop if they added DLC content to WoL.

 

[Wyoming]

Oh right I should specify what each other does, their type, and so on.

Mia Fey: Defense, 2 slots, improves speed
Maya Fey: Support, takes 2 slots, user starts equipped with a Lip's Stick
Miles Edgeworth: Neutral, 2 slots, can be enhanced;
Miles Edgeworth (enhanced, uses post-trilogy Edgeworth): Neutral, 3 slots, hyper smash attacks
Franziska von Karma: Shield, 1 slot, improves throws and grabs
Godot: Defense, 2 slots, reduces weight
**** Gumshoe: Neutral, 1 slot, increases physical attacks
Apollo Justice: Attack, 2 slots, no special attributes.
Athena Cykes: Support, 2 slots, grants immunity to reverse controls

 

[Luigifan18]

Time for some spirits ideas:

Mia Fey: Brunette Zelda, Pink Hair Bowser, Hazardless Fourside

Conditions:

- Zelda avoids conflict
- Items gravitate towards Bowser (Capsules only)
- Timed Battle
Goal: Defeat Bowser before he KOs Zelda or time runs out. (Or KOs you)

Maya Fey: Purple Zelda, Suzaku Castle

Conditions:

- Opponent loves to taunt
- Opponent is drawn to items
- Opponent will gain a speed boost after a while

Miles Edgeworth: Blue Villager, Battlefield New Donk City

Conditions:

- Opponent loves neutral specials
- The floor will tremble with earthquakes
- Items will gravitate towards opponent

Franziska von Karma: White Richter, Courtroom

- Opponent loves forward smashes
- Opponent's damage will increase in time

**** Gumshoe: Dark Yellow Luigi, Battlefield Prism Tower

Conditions:

-Opponent is distracted by items
-Opponent starts off with a Franklin Badge
-The floor is sticky

Godot: White Hair Phoenix, Omega Garden of Hope

Conditions:

-Opponent starts with a Killing Edge
-Fog will cover the stage
-Stamina Battle

Apollo Justice: Red Suit Phoenix, Cyan Isabelle, Courtroom

Conditions:

-Opponent loves side specials
-Stage will reverse itself

Athena Cykes: Yellow Zero Suit Samus, Tiny Red ROB, Tiny Blue ROB, Joker, Frigate Orpheon

-Gravity is decreased after a short while.
-Opponent's defenses will increase after a while

Oh right I should specify what each other does, their type, and so on.

Mia Fey: Defense, 2 slots, improves speed
Maya Fey: Support, takes 2 slots, user starts equipped with a Lip's Stick
Miles Edgeworth: Neutral, 2 slots, can be enhanced;
Miles Edgeworth (enhanced, uses post-trilogy Edgeworth): Neutral, 3 slots, hyper smash attacks
Franziska von Karma: Shield, 1 slot, improves throws and grabs
Godot: Defense, 2 slots, reduces weight
**** Gumshoe: Neutral, 1 slot, increases physical attacks
Apollo Justice: Attack, 2 slots, no special attributes.
Athena Cykes: Support, 2 slots, grants immunity to reverse controls

Hey, you forgot the Spirit ranks (Novice, Advanced, Ace, Legend).

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

is isnt?

Nope, plenty of franchises or their respective owners have teased at such beforehand.

 

[fogbadge]

Nope, plenty of franchises or their respective owners have teased at such beforehand.

oh those kind of teases, i always forget about them

 

[Wyoming]

Hey, you forgot the Spirit ranks (Novice, Advanced, Ace, Legend).

Might as well keep up the references then!

Maya: Novice
Mia: Ace (Attorney hehehe)
Edgeworth: Advanced
Enhanced Edgeworth: Legend
Franziska: Advanced
Godot: Novice
Gumshoe: Advanced
Apollo: Ace (Attorney hehehe)
Athena: Novice

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Hopefully we get to see this for real, one day.

I have a pretty crazy conspiracy theory. What if the anime is teasing a smash bros reveal. We have the invitation and the "Phoenix wright joins the fray" ad.

And Takumi is helping out directly to the point of writing some of these episodes too!

Even more good for thought. You remember how Sakurai has spoken fondly of Persona 5 before?

Well he's spoken fondly of Ace Attorney as well. In the good kind of sense that could get playability rather than just the simple "I like it" format.

Adding to all of that:

You know what

I’m calling it now, Sans is coming to Smash pic.twitter.com/wCf5I0lb27

— Karl Jung’s Youkai Boy @🎋Touhoufest☯️ (@HeroOnTheWind) December 7, 2018

HMMMMM. If we do get an Undertale rep, things are looking even brighter for us.

 

[Sonsa]

My goodness I dunno haha, I mean, I'd love it but... my absolute dream is:
1. Phoenix Wright
2. Frisk
3. Monokuma
I dunno why Sans is so supported as the series rep, I mean, I know a big part of it is a joke, but still, no one seems to talk about Frisk! They'd represent the whole game and have more moveset potential and stuff, but eh! Stage and music, victory theme, either way <3

I also love Monokuma and have a moveset for him, but I really just want a stage and music from Danganronpa mostly <3

After Joker, I feel dumb and biased but all of these seem more likely...but Smash usually starts with the best stuff and then ends on less mind-blowing things... Like hey, Snake in Brawl and then ending with Olimar, which I'm sure many people love but comparatively mmm... Smash 4 started with Megaman, got Pac-Man, and ended with Shulk, with Bowser Jr and Duck Hunt (which are great!!) as secrets when everyone still had hope for Ridley and surprise for Mewtwos absence... The DLC was great though, I think Bayo was a good finale! But then Ultimate again starts with Ridley, K.Rool, Chrom, Dark Samus, two Belmonts, and Daisy in the first two months and then Isabelle, Ken, and grand finale Incineroar in the last 4 months...plus Piranha Plant at the same time they deconfirmed Isaac after accidentally hyping him up by emphasizing a reference and having an item and etc... So I dunno! Maybe it starts with Joker and ends with...Sylux or something, who I would personally find boring...

I'm just rambling here, I just...wanna stay level-headed? Predicting seems impossible, I'm just along for the ride, but hoo boy, Phoenix, Frisk, and Monokuma might get me to cry if a trailer with a smash logo showed up haha

 

[MacDaddyNook]

Adding to all of that:

You know what

I’m calling it now, Sans is coming to Smash pic.twitter.com/wCf5I0lb27

— Karl Jung’s Youkai Boy @🎋Touhoufest☯️ (@HeroOnTheWind) December 7, 2018

HMMMMM. If we do get an Undertale rep, things are looking even brighter for us.

As much as I want things to look in favor for Mr. Wright, I really hope Smash Bros keeps as far far away from Undertale as possible.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Part of me wants Phoenix as an assist at some point because I think he would fit best there, but another part of me wants him playable just to see if they make his final smash what his super move was in MVC3.

I mean imagine how awesome it would be to have "No justice. No strive, no dream, no hope! It's time for you to pay for your crimes, TAKE THAT!"

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Part of me wants Phoenix as an assist at some point because I think he would fit best there, but another part of me wants him playable just to see if they make his final smash what his super move was in MVC3.

I mean imagine how awesome it would be to have "No justice. No strive, no dream, no hope! It's time for you to pay for your crimes, TAKE THAT!"

At this point, considering how ATs have never been DLC before, actual playable fighter status is looking more likely.

Besides, with his amount of moveset potential, an assist trophy wouldn't quite capture it all.......well okay unless they're well fleshed out, but fighter status is what's gonna get him more attention.

 

[Wyoming]

Adding to all of that:

You know what

I’m calling it now, Sans is coming to Smash pic.twitter.com/wCf5I0lb27

— Karl Jung’s Youkai Boy @🎋Touhoufest☯️ (@HeroOnTheWind) December 7, 2018

HMMMMM. If we do get an Undertale rep, things are looking even brighter for us.

Those quotes pre-date Undertale. They were in Smash 4.
Toby Fox is a huge Smash fan, so undoubtedly he'd make references to them in his game as a tribute.

Nothing burger. And even if it was, how would this benefit Phoenix at all? It wouldn't change anything.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Hello, everyone. I have...

...a theory.

We know Capcom's going to release the Phoenix Wright HD Trilogy (for, like, the third time in a row or something) on PS4, Xbox, Steam, AND the Nintendo Switch. We know it's going to release sometime in "early 2019," which could range anywhere from January to May, possibly. It's peculiar, though: why be so ambiguous about the release date? It shouldn't take that long to port/quality-test/approve the game for multiple platforms unless...

...they're looking for the right opportunity to drop not only the debut trailer, but a DLC character reveal for Ultimate. Sakurai likes to be pretty sneaky with character reveals whether it's building them up or dropping them out of complete nowhere. This would also be the perfect opportunity for Capcom to get more people to buy the HD Trilogy, especially those who have never played an Ace Attorney game before. A new Ace Attorney game is long overdue for fans outside of Japan as well (It is absolutely criminal that we will never get an official localization for AAI2 or DGS). Mega Man 11 wouldn't have existed if it weren't for Super Smash Bros. 4 or the Mega Man Legacy Collection...

...so why can't it be the same for Phoenix Wright?

Anyway, I'm more optimistic for Phoenix Wright's chances than ever before thanks to the Joker reveal.
(Edit: I just realized the images were broken, so I had to replace the Greg sprites with Miles. The joke's still there: it's just not as obvious as before)

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Those quotes pre-date Undertale. They were in Smash 4.

What? I don't recall Persona or Undertale being in Smash 4.

 

[Wyoming]

What? I don't recall Persona or Undertale being in Smash 4.

The quotes in the tweet thread.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

The quotes in the tweet thread.

Ummm. I haven't see those. Wasn't even referring to them.

Toby Fox is a huge Smash fan, so undoubtedly he'd make references to them in his game as a tribute.

Nothing burger. And even if it was, how would this benefit Phoenix at all? It wouldn't change anything

Are those what this^ is referring to?

 

[Caladuz]

...they're looking for the right opportunity to drop not only the debut trailer, but a DLC character reveal for Ultimate.

You know I did find it peculiar that the last tweet from the official Ace Attorney twitter was something along the lines of "we'll have new info about the north American release of the trilogy stay tuned", but that was over a month ago. Probably nothing but might be something to keep in mind anyway.

 

[GoodGrief741]

It’s Phoenix Wright’s day on the Rate their Chances thread! Let’s go over there and make our case.

 

[Jave]

Man, I've supported Phoenix in Smash since I played the original trilogy on DS, and for some reason I never got to post in this thread. I think the case for him being one of the DLC characters is pretty strong now that they confirmed Joker. Since SEGA has three series now represented through playables, maybe Capcom should be next and give us Ace Attorney alongside Mega Man and Street Fighter. Here's hoping for the best (and for a personal wish, I really hope Maya is a big part of his moveset).

Please put me in the support list.

 

[Wyoming]

If Phoenix is in Smash, I wonder who AA fans will want after that.

Edgeworth? Apollo? Maya? Probably the big three and the latter could be involved in his moveset.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

If Phoenix is in Smash, I wonder who AA fans will want after that.

Imagine if it's Franziska to avenge the fallen Tatsunko vs Capcom duo.

 

[Flyboy]

If Phoenix is in Smash, I wonder who AA fans will want after that.

Edgeworth? Apollo? Maya? Probably the big three and the latter could be involved in his moveset.

Incorporate Apollo and Athena into Phoenix's moveset and then have an Edgeworth echo with Godot and Franziska instead. Boom.

Real talk, though, outside of the Edgeworth echo I wouldn't want another one. As long as Athena and Apollo get shoutouts or appearances I'm good with just Phoenix.

 

[fogbadge]

If Phoenix is in Smash, I wonder who AA fans will want after that.

Edgeworth? Apollo? Maya? Probably the big three and the latter could be involved in his moveset.

well id want maya

 

[Wyoming]

If we had a "priority list"

1. Phoenix Wright
2. Miles Edgeworth
3. Apollo Justice
4. Maya Fey
5. Athena Cykes

Then it gets a little blurry. Godot could possibly be 6th due to his popularity, but there's also Gumshoe. I'd put the joint 6th/7th. Then you have Mia, Franziska, and Ema rounding up the top 10 in no particular order.

Based on personal preference: Edgeworth > Maya > Godot > Apollo > Gumshoe > Mia > Franziska > Athena > Ema

 

[GoodGrief741]

I think Edgeworth makes the most sense as the second rep, but I’d like it if it could be Apollo.

I just feel like he was pretty disrespected as a character in AA5 and 6 and this would be a nice thing to make up for it.