Meta SSB4 Falco Matchup Discussion 45 - Olimar/Alph & Pikmin - I ain't your buddy! Go away!

[Ffamran]

Welcome to the Olimar/Alph matchup discussion.

All credit goes to Quas-quas for the original images.​

Here's a link to the main post: SSB4 Falco Matchup Discussion - Main Post. This will be more for general matchup discussions like making a suggestion and such. Or, you could head over to the social thread and ask there: Where We Prefer The Air And The Points Don't Matter!. Or PM me if you really have to, but don't make a habit out of it.

Oh, and if you guys and girls want to play each other to have fun or learn about the MU, check out the NNID and FC sharing thread on the Falco boards: http://smashboards.com/threads/anyone-want-to-exchange-nnids-or-friend-codes.386513/.

There's also the regular NNID and FC sharing threads in the Online discussion if you just want to ask anyone to play.

Notice: Some rules, guidelines, and tips. Some of these are a given since you joined any forum.

1. Be respectful of each other. No insults, no trolling, no flaming, or any of that nonsense.
2. Be aware that some of the discussions can and will be old, so don't call out someone for "wrong" data if that post was referring to say, patch 1.0.3 stuff.
3. Be impartial; learn to see things from other sides. So, don't boast about all the advantages. Notice weaknesses and strengths from both parties.
4. Stay on topic.
5. Have fun.

And here is a frame speed ranking of their regular attacks and grabs - no Specials yet, sorry - to clear up on things since sometimes a move may feel slow, but it's actually fast and vice versa. Plus more information doesn't always hurt. Data from http://sixriver.web.fc2.com/ssb4/Character_data.htm - search for ピクミン＆オリマー - and the Complete Hitbox/Frame Data For Every Character threads.

Note: Olimar/Alph's a special one to say the least. I'm assuming because of how the Pikmin act, a lot of stuff changes with how his moves work. As of patch 1.1.4.

Move Hit Frames||/
Jab|2-4, 10-12, 17-21, 22-26, 27-31, 32-36, (infinite), 41-42|4-5, 9-10
Dash Attack|8-11 or 12-19|8-10 or 11-14
Ftilt|6-8|15-15
Utilt|5-9, 12-16|6-6, (5 more hits), 18-18
Dtilt|7-9|6-12
Side Smash|17-19 or 20-20|11-14 or 15-20 or 21-29
Up Smash|7-12, 13-20|12-15 or 16-21
Down Smash|7-9|10-12 or 13-17
Nair|3-5, 6-9, 14-17, 21-24|7-8, 11-12, 15-16, 19-20, 23-24
Fair|10-13, 14-17, 18-21, 22-25, 26-27, 28-29|7-9
Bair|4-5 or 6-12|10-13
Uair|7-11|8-15
Dair|16-19 or 20-31|9-9 or 10-15
Grab|8-9|10-19
Dash Grab|10-11|10-19
Pivot Grab|11-12|10-19

 

[Blue Banana]

You got Olimar's Fair frame data wrong. Fair's hitbox appears on frame 7-9; the frame data that you have is for Oli's Nair.

 

[Ffamran]

You got Olimar's Fair frame data wrong. Fair's hitbox appears on frame 7-9; the frame data that you have is for Oli's Nair.

Fixed; I think I was trying to input that for his Nair and ended up skipping his Fair. Anyway, first note for everyone, please refrain from over-exaggerating Falco's Reflector or as a move that can be baited 100%. Reflects are powerful when used right and weak when used wrong; they do not invalidate anyone's moveset.

I really don't know how to fight Olimar and I bet lots of people do. One thing, is that the damage he tacks on is scary and people will panic as nobody has DoT (damage over time) moves like him other than a failed to kill Rest from Jigglypuff, customs like Wario's Rose Waft, or various items competitive players will likely not encounter. In a way, it's like fighting Sheik. The damage that happens can be made up and playing it safe it what matters in this MU for both sides since both characters punish hard. That's all I've got for now.

 

[Blue Banana]

Does Falco have any low-lag attacks that cover at least most of his body? It really helps in taking off Pikmin safely if Olimar is not close enough to punish him from extra hitlag.

 

[Ffamran]

Nair, Bair, and Utilt come to mind, but I rarely fight Olimar and I wasn't in to Brawl much to know what Falco could do. Also, on a Smash hiatus until I get a Wii U, so yeah. I could check with the CPU, but that'll be a pain.

 

[eshu125]

I really like this matchup. reflector is fast and long enough that it shuts down one of olimar's main options that makes him so viable in this game, that being walling people out with safe fsmashes and using pikmin throw to rack up some damage. We are kind of combo food out of throw so if you can help it just spend most of your time being slippery (jump alot! He doesn't have the greatest air options) and find your openings. My favorite tool in this matchup is bair, because the horizontal distance of his recovery is obvious enough that as long as you cover that potential option, chances are you can jump and bair him on reaction once he's in your zone off-stage.

 

[Angbad]

Yeah I think this one is definitely in Falco's favor. Hard to punish the reflector and kills us at 40% if we aren't careful. Olimar should be trying to kill with grabs in this MU.