Sonic's OoS Options

[B.A.M.]

No what youre talking about makes no absolute sense. I mean you can actually pivot while putting up the shield in the SpinDash Cancel. Just think of this: you're running right , you perform your side b the right but as you shield you smash the control stick left. What happens is you end up canceling the side b and instantly pivoting at the same time; so you cancel you side b facing the opposite direction. I assumed most ppl knew about that. Does anyone know what im referring to? Its relatively easy while walking, a bit harder to do out of the run, but it seems useful to me. I use it from time to time. Anyone think of any good applications for this?

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

So like.... Shield. Then SideB reverse shield? I guess it could be good for getting out a bair.

 

[infomon]

Yes that's what he's talking about, a B-reversed side-B shield-cancel out of a run.

It is useful. Like it's one of the ways I mess with people; get them above you, then run around haphazardly doing a few of these below them and they won't know how to land safely lol. And yeah, positioning one's self for a Bair or (better IMO) Fair (because Fair comes out so fast that using the side-B to pivot kinda matters, and we can jump OoS without shield-dropping first).....

....yeah.

 

[Tenki]

I used to use it to bait out moves from people who didn't know the matchup, because Sonic looks so twitchy if you're running at someone and do a B-reversed shield.

And I also used to use it as a replacement for pivot grabs when running behind people.

 

[B.A.M.]

yeah thats exactly what im talking about over b reversal shield cancel. I definitely see how it sets up up for fairs or bairs in a mindgaming fashion. is it faster than a screech stop then buffer any attack? it does seem faster than a standard pivot then shield grab. Nontheless I apologize for being off topic per say. Any other great OoS options besides IDA, Uair, ftilt,dtilt, and grab?

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Well it's not THAT offtopic. Setting UP the shield is PRETTY important to doing things out of it.

 

[B.A.M.]

hahaha agreed Terios.

 

[Kinzer]

Post.

Oh you mean SDSC (SpinDash Shield-Cancel) and it's reverse! Well yeah that actually works, but I thought we were assuming stuff with Sonic from a neutral position, meaning he's not running or doing any of that fancy work.

Way to think outside the box!

 

[B.A.M.]

the compliment is much appreciated Kinzer

 

[Browny]

i still think anything other than your fastest options is kinda bad. Lack of shield hitstun is broken, you should abuse it every chance you get. trying to be fancy out of shield just allows the opponent to roll dodge away in time, and resume the neutral state

 

[thecatinthehat]

jump down-b spinshot out of shield.

^_^ unnecessary flashiness.

 

[aeghrur]

It depends upon their position.
If they're in front of you, you might as well run when they're done with their attack.
If they're above you, Uair or shieldgrab, lol.
If they're like 45 degrees away or so, fair.
If they're behind you, and SDSC quickly.

That's just what I think =/

 

[Ayaz18]

Nair

but i generally like using sexkicks OoS

 

[JayBee]

You can read? Wow, I'm surprised! Oh, wait. You said you DIDN'T read the topic. No surprises there... just stupid, useless comments from ya.

On topic, IDA isn't that good, because he just gets grabbed out of it, or shielded. Its a great move, worked lots of times for me but its just so... predictable. I don't know of any really good OoS options at all. Ftilt is to slow. I suppose I like to use dtilt. Its reliable, decent ranged and has those... frames, the name escapes me. And you can make a decent combo out of it, if you have to, plus has tripping potential at the tip.

i've abandoned IDA just about entirely. either im not in tune with all of sonic's stuff all the time, or i love uair too much OoS. but it does have a place. i dunno...

 

[Browny]

now that i see my new tourney vids im only more certain on this. anything other than fair/uair oos is fail. tilts, jab, any b special is punishable and if you dont anticipate the shield knockback attempting a standing grab ends in fail.

 

[Kinzer]

WTH with Jabs DJ? it's only like his fastest move anyway (even if the whole d*** thing only does 7% damage unstalled), and the same could be said about the Spring thanks to it's freaking fast initiation.

 

[Camalange]

I stopped using jab...for like ever, lol.

The only time I jab is if I do something like a single jab > turnaround grab.

Jab sucks.

 

[Jim Morrison]

I jab like... Too much. I'm like **** **** **** he's combing me, when can I do. I KNOW A THREE FRAME JAB. I try to finish jab combo and last hit gets shielded and it starts over again <_<

 

[MalcolmM]

lots of posts are a good thing ^_^

 

[da K.I.D.]

I also completely forgot about IDA, stuff works like magic.

i stopped reading when i saw this, this can punish a snake f tilt, a MK down smash, and a GaW down smash.

its super important.

its not his most damaging or even strongest punishment, but it is BY FAR his most guaranteed OOS option.

EDIT
i just read the posts on this page,

IDA is amazing.

if you buffer it correctly, it can punish moves no other move in the game can punish, use it when nothing else will reach the opponent and nothing else is fast enough.

also, f tilt and d tilt start on the same frame.

also, since grabs are so great, has anybody ever considered shield drop to running grab? just cause you can shield grab them, doesnt mean you still cant use grabs as punishment

 

[Camalange]

also, since grabs are so great, has anybody ever considered shield drop to running grab? just cause you can shield grab them, doesnt mean you still cant use grabs as punishment

Yes

I only really do it if I'm in a situation where...well, here's an example

Link Fsmash First Hit - Shield *shield push*

Link Fsmash Second Hit - Shield again *shield push*

Link Fsmash ending lag - Drop shield - Running grab

So I only ever try it in situations where I've been shield pushed, but I know the attack that pushed me has enough ending lag for me to punish with a running grab.


And I guess I should try IDA OoS moar.

 

[Tenki]

Dash attack is like Sonic's Falcon Kick.


Try it against a Marth and you'll see why >__>

 

[darkNES386]

Dash attack is like Sonic's Falcon Kick.


Try it against a Marth and you'll see why >__>

If I understand Tenki correctly, DA in many situations puts you in a spot you don't want to be. The attack lasts pretty long and if you hit too early with it you can easily get punished by most of the cast as their hit stun ends and your attack is just finishing. Is this where you're going Tenki?

I'm guilty as the next Sonic for allowing this to happen to me though.

 

[Chis]

If I understand Tenki correctly, DA in many situations puts you in a spot you don't want to be. The attack lasts pretty long and if you hit too early with it you can easily get punished by most of the cast as their hit stun ends and your attack is just finishing. Is this where you're going Tenki?

I'm guilty as the next Sonic for allowing this to happen to me though.

Wouldn't by the time the hit stun ended, Sonic would be out of range? Also doesn't DA have a someone ASAP frames at the end?

 

[da K.I.D.]

1. Its damage and hitbox and character weight dependant. Dash attack has either 2 or 3 hitboxes, if you hit MK with the last hitbox when he is below like 40% he can punish you with a dair, but many times you can shield and punish said dair.

2. no it doesnt. at least i dont think so. but the lag on it isnt too bad, its just that the hitbox stays out for ever, which can be a blessing or a curse.

pretty much, the better teh spacing your opponent has, the more useful IDA becomes.

also, characters like marth and link, characters with a lot of range to compensate for their lag, eat shield drop running grabs all day long

 

[B.A.M.]

Im with Da K.I.D on this. IDA is amazing its has such great speed. and although its not that great damage, it sets up up for a spring trap. It is an excellent punisher.

 

[da K.I.D.]

anthinus combos for the win

 

[Tenki]

early dash attack sucks if your opponent either has a fast D-air or B-air (or aerial that hits below him)

 

[da K.I.D.]

it doesnt matter if they are over 50 anyway

 

[ithrowthings]

I stopped using jab...for like ever, lol.

The only time I jab is if I do something like a single jab > turnaround grab.

Jab sucks.

Hate to go a lil' OT

I jab when my spindash clashes with something usually, it's the quickest option right? Why don't you like the jab? I love jab. considering how you know the timing on the dthrow tech I'm assuming you know something about jab that I don't. Is it the perfect shield ppl can get between hits 2 and 3?


Also, WTF did da kid say? IDA? buffer? the? and "just cause you can shield grab them, doesnt mean you still cant use grabs as punishment"

why drop a shield to run to grab when you can just shield grab? I'm so confused.

 

[da K.I.D.]

Also, WTF did da kid say? IDA? buffer? the? and "just cause you can shield grab them, doesnt mean you still cant use grabs as punishment"

why drop a shield to run to grab when you can just shield grab? I'm so confused.

IDA
instant dash attack. hit forward and down on the cstick at the same time.

buffer. even though its not much, theres still shield stun in brawl so as soon as an attack hits your shield, if you let go of shield and hit forward and down c all in one fluid motion, the IDA will come out on the first available frames.

the. im sorry, i cant define "the" any further for you...

that was supposed to be just cause you CANT shield grab them...

imagine marth trying to hit you with a tipper f smash. if he hits you at the very end of its range and you shield it, theres absolutely no way you can shield grab it. but marth f smash has so much lag, that you can drop your shield, run in, and grab marth.

basically saying, just cause they space well and dont let themselves get shield grabbed, doesnt mean that you cant grab them as punishment for their attack anyway

 

[darkNES386]

When I get pushed out of grab range I usually look for an ftilt before an instant dash attack. Against most characters I like the position ftilt puts me in.

 

[Camalange]

I jab when my spindash clashes with something usually, it's the quickest option right? Why don't you like the jab? I love jab.

Okay, maybe I lied...that's the only time I might use jab, lol

Is it the perfect shield ppl can get between hits 2 and 3?

Yeah...that's the reason. Everyone I play just know to powershield the jab hits >_>
Even if I hold the A button, there's still a way for them to powershield the hits...so I try to not do the jab combo as much as possible.

 

[da K.I.D.]

When I get pushed out of grab range I usually look for an ftilt before an instant dash attack. Against most characters I like the position ftilt puts me in.

you shouldnt be punishing a snake f tilt with a sonic f tilt any time soon...

thats when you IDA

i actually came up with IDAing specifically for snake and MK, and punishing moves that we usually wouldnt be able to

 

[darkNES386]

You're putting words in my mouth. Ever eat a bair from a snake who you just iDA'ed?

 

[da K.I.D.]

lolno

you can shield grab, f smash, d smash, and possibly even up smash snake out of that...

now I HAVE been MK daired out of it, but hey, nothings perfect right?

except MK...

 

[darkNES386]

lolno

you can shield grab, f smash, d smash, and possibly even up smash snake out of that...

now I HAVE been MK daired out of it, but hey, nothings perfect right?

except MK...

Well then you must be really good at avoiding the use of dash attack near the edge of a stage. Sonic just rolls in place on the edge while his opponent recovers from the dash attack's hitstun to punish Sonic.

 

[da K.I.D.]

the snake/MKs that i play are very good at controlling the stage, so alot of the time, they are controlling the middle of the stage when they are doing the things that i use IDA to punish.

so i guess a better way to put it is that I am bad enough so that i dont have to use IDA at the edge...

but yea, IDA at the ledge is a badkid move.

 

[HazZarD]

How about you show me what to do outta shield amongst other things, Malcolm?

Maybe I'll actually be half decent wit Sonic.

You know what, I don't even know what I'm doing here. Must be lost......

*Fades out of thread*

 

[MalcolmM]

Really Hazz? 305 posts in like 4 years and u waste 1 trolling my thread? Im tight.

U will get ur training 1 of these days lol.

WHEN AM I GONNA GET THAT MELEE PRACTICE THO?