Snake Discussion

[CT Chia]

There's prob a bunch of these, and the MU discussion currently is not Snake, so lets discuss it here.

I've found out a BIG thing in the matchup that really helps it for ROB

 

[stingers]

fair the nikita and you dont get hit by it.

 

[CT Chia]

what happens exactly, i thought it just delays the hitbox for a bit and can some come back and hit you

 

[stingers]

something like that. youre faster then it is, just get past it afterwards.

 

[CT Chia]

Well no, it wasn't that I was referring to lol

When you throw Snake off at low percents you could always astart a fair gimp and I could never find a way around it if they double jump naired right away but realized finally that it sets them up perfectly to uair them. So either they get gimped or take 20+ more damage which helps so much, and after the uair they still arent in the best position.

 

[stingers]

thats not really a BIG THING...just a counter to their counter of a specific situation...just a lil footnote chibo

 

[CT Chia]

Losing the ability to gimp Snake was what heavily swayed the matchup from ROB's favor to Snake's favor. So now that we have a direct good answer to Snake's answer for avoiding the gimp, and getting a lot of damage on Snake is a really hard thing to do, it really helps imo.

 

[stingers]

how often to you get to bthrow snakes off the ledge -,-

 

[TeeVee]

lol i really want to see how candy plays the matchup compared to bizkit/fatal

 

[Mr.E]

Screw using UAir in this situation, stay on the ground so you can grab them again and throw them back off. ;[

 

[6Mizu]

Mmmm...Chibo...I doubt a Snake is really gonna get gimped that easily. But, using that we can easily rack up a bunch of damage.

For EX: Throw off > Fair > Fair > Fair > (read your opponent , then follow up). This would be great for racking up damage, because that right there is like 40%.

 

[CT Chia]

Screw using UAir in this situation, stay on the ground so you can grab them again and throw them back off. ;[

It's unlikely that you will be able to do this.

 

[TheMike]

I always try to do that Fair string after taking Snake off stage. Sometimes, Up B-ing(not jump because I usually use all my jumps when doing the string) > Dair can follow it.

Edit: btw, I think I gimped a Snake that way in one of my clips I sent to the community combo video.

 

[6Mizu]

That almost never happen to most Snakes MIKE, believe me.

 

[CT Chia]

If Snake doesn't double jump nair when you f or b throw them off stage at lowish percents its going to happen. I land it all the time.

 

[TheMike]

There's no reason for not to try it, because if ROB doesn't kill, he racks up some good damage. Snake can't recovery by attacking and killing us like Meta Knight can with his Up B. So, trying that Fair string isn't a bad idea, imo.

 

[6Mizu]

If Snake doesn't double jump nair when you f or b throw them off stage at lowish percents its going to happen. I land it all the time.

Please tell me you mean "Fair" when you say "it's going to happen", and not "gimp"...because I already said that gimping Snake most likely will not happen.

 

[Silhouette]

Guys you're missing his epiphany, if you knock snake off at low % he can immediately double jump Fair you, seemingly stopping all options (including your Fair gimps), but Chibo discovered that he can bait this and hit him with a spaced U-air instead, keeping snake in the air to juggle and racking up alot of damage. At least thats what I got out of it.

Thanks Chibo I would have never thought of this.

 

[stingers]

Guys you're missing his epiphany, if you knock snake off at low % he can immediately double jump Fair you, seemingly stopping all options (including your Fair gimps), but Chibo discovered that he can bait this and hit him with a spaced U-air instead, keeping snake in the air to juggle and racking up alot of damage. At least thats what I got out of it.

Thanks Chibo I would have never thought of this.

if you never would've thought of this then I just dont know what to say

 

[Afrayail]

I think it would be beneficial to turn this thread into a general Snake MU discussion instead of going back and forth about how certain things seem more obvious to others or whatnot. Chibo gave a decent tip, though it wasn't necessarily ground breaking. Can we please move on and discuss the actual match up? or is there no purpose for this thread? I personally am having some problems with Joker and his snake.. maybe, could we discuss stages? I heard Rainbow Cruise and Japes were good CPs--thoughts?


I've heard a lot of people that have had decent ish ideas or may have found something potentially useful, but they're too afraid to post on the boards because they've seen people get torn down or called a noob; and this is across all of the SWF.

Perhaps it's naive, but I think it would benefit everyone if posts all around were a little less prideful/hostile when it came to things like this. We all just want to help our beloved R.O.B. and his community succeed, so it's silly to try and detract from helping others.

 

[CT Chia]

since it was MLG rules I cp'd every snake i fought to pictochat. Never have done that b4 lol, and I don't know the stage too well but it worked great - especially against Takeover. It helped limit Snake's onstage game, and ROB adapts to crazy transformations better than Snake does. The high ceiling also kept me alive easier.

 

[Afrayail]

since it was MLG rules I cp'd every snake i fought to pictochat. Never have done that b4 lol, and I don't know the stage too well but it worked great - especially against Takeover. It helped limit Snake's onstage game, and ROB adapts to crazy transformations better than Snake does. The high ceiling also kept me alive easier.

I actually like pictochat, but Joker personally loves the stage... @_@;; It's one of his cps, he knows the stage really well. He actually taught Ally a trick on it with grenades.

I'll try taking him there for friendlies and see how it goes, though, if ROB should have an advantage. thanks

 

[Teh Future]

this topic is hellarious and perfectly explains why everyone that mains rob isn't good at this game

 

[Afrayail]

this topic is hellarious and perfectly explains why everyone that mains rob isn't good at this game

Oh you....

 

[Sudai]

Oh you....

Just ignore trolls plox.

 

[Darth Waffles]

this topic is hellarious and perfectly explains why everyone that mains rob isn't good at this game

oddly enough, this reminded me of part 2 of http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=239679

and wtf happened to the toon link zones picture? It's now some sunshine pic instead

I should update that =P

 

[stingers]

no hes pretty right. we all suck

 

[-LzR-]

http://allisbrawl.com/forum/topic.aspx?id=142409

 

[CT Chia]

Flick jumping? Really? People need to stop with the advanced techniques -_-

And everyone knows about that with Snake footstooling the C4 recovery. The main thing you have to be carefuly about is doing it at high percents cause if your chillin over Snake he can just throw out a uair or bair to kill you cand end up trading stocks.

 

[ccst]

Thanks for the tips!

 

[6Mizu]

Guys you're missing his epiphany, if you knock snake off at low % he can immediately double jump Fair you,

Why would you run into this. It's very slow. From what I remember it takes Snake's Fair 23 Frames to come out, it has no IASA, and it ends around Frame 68 or so.
If you throw Snake off and he tries this...wait on the ground and simply punish his horriblebad Fair or grab his landing.

 

[CT Chia]

lol snake fairing in that sit. is awful. ur fair will always hit him first. all u need to watch out for is nair

 

[6Mizu]

lol snake fairing in that sit. is awful. ur fair will always hit him first. all u need to watch out for is nair

Exactly, our Fair is Frame 6...compared to him double jumping > Fair.
Also, Nair is no problem, because you can:
- DI out and maybe counterattack, and you'll only get 23%.
- Since he pretty much has to land with and the fact that his Double Jump will only take him so high up... punish it with Shield Grab, Pivot Grab, Gyro, Laser, etc.

 

[CT Chia]

Exactly, our Fair is Frame 6...compared to him double jumping > Fair.
Also, Nair is no problem, because you can:
- DI out and maybe counterattack, and you'll only get 23%.
- Since he pretty much has to land with and the fact that his Double Jump will only take him so high up... punish it with Shield Grab, Pivot Grab, Gyro, Laser, etc.

-onyl 23%??? you cant afford to take that damage. also botch the DI and you can die at mid to high percents
-shield grab has to be done very precise since the nair pushes you away and can shield grab
-pivot grab i dont see how that wortks
-the nair will beat the gyro
-laser is too slow ul get hit

the only way i can see the gyro useful is if its fully charged and u perfectly predict the dj nair and u run away then reverse cancel gyro back at him and time it perfectly to do it b4 he can shield when he hits the ground. too situational. the 2 best options when throwing snake off is fair if he doesnt dj nair, or uair if he dj nairs. i dont see any other way around it rly

 

[6Mizu]

-onyl 23%??? you cant afford to take that damage. also botch the DI and you can die at mid to high percents
-shield grab has to be done very precise since the nair pushes you away and can shield grab
-pivot grab i dont see how that wortks
-the nair will beat the gyro
-laser is too slow ul get hit

the only way i can see the gyro useful is if its fully charged and u perfectly predict the dj nair and u run away then reverse cancel gyro back at him and time it perfectly to do it b4 he can shield when he hits the ground. too situational. the 2 best options when throwing snake off is fair if he doesnt dj nair, or uair if he dj nairs. i dont see any other way around it rly

Chibo i'm talking about punishing his landing lag.
And not all of those are OOS.
BTW, Pivot grab wouldn't work, so NM.

 

[CT Chia]

what landing lag? its autocanceled

 

[6Mizu]

hmmm...I guess not then. Well, then Nair can be somewhat of a problem. But it's not necessarily unpublishable.
-How about Fair or maybe Nair as soon as Snake tries this.
-Utilt may work, if you wait on the ground and not follow him to far off. Because this means since Utilt is faster and is disjointed it should hit Snake before his Nair can hit us. Also, Nair doesn't hit that far below Snake where we cannot Utilt it.
-What about F-tilt OOS.

 

[CT Chia]

whcih is why when i found out uair it was like a godsend to me lol. b4 that i would throw em off and run away in fear of this godly nair lol

 

[6Mizu]

hmmm...I guess not then. Well, then Nair can be somewhat of a problem. But it's not necessarily unpublishable.
-How about Fair or maybe Nair as soon as Snake tries this.
-Utilt may work, if you wait on the ground and not follow him to far off. Because this means since Utilt is faster and is disjointed it should hit Snake before his Nair can hit us. Also, Nair doesn't hit that far below Snake where we cannot Utilt it.
-What about F-tilt OOS.

whcih is why when i found out uair it was like a godsend to me lol. b4 that i would throw em off and run away in fear of this godly nair lol

Well, I don't think if we throw him off stage we should:
Fair > Fair > Fair > Uair.
I think we should:
Fair > Fair > Fair > read our opponent > follow up.

But, my point is that this "little discovery" of yours works Chibo.

 

[CT Chia]

no no no no no

when u throw them off u have 2 options depending on what snake does. either immediately jump and fair him and do the whole fair fair fair follow up kind of thing and gimp him
or if the snakes gonna dj nair, wait a sec and uair the nair

fair fair fair uair makes no sense lol