SmashBoards Community Echo Voting Thread: Part 48 Shulk

[Flyboy]

There are so many great choices for Snake. MGS2 Raiden would be nice - they actually have Raiden's little kick in Snake's Brawl moveset - but I'm with the above poster who says that not having some MGS4 Raiden in there is a shame. Big Boss or Naked Snake both kinda resemble Smash Snake already so I see them as working just fine as a costume. The Boss is my personal pick, but I'm not gonna lie, Liquid Ocelot would be awesome.

Old Snake costume when

 

[slambros]

With the loose exception of Dark Samus, all Echoes so far have been different people, so I went with MGS2 Raiden because he is a different individual to Snake unequivocally, and because Metal Gear Rising Revengeance Raiden has already been taken by Playstation All-Stars anyway.

For Ike's Echo, I'd like to nominate Joshua from Fire Emblem: Sacred Stones.

 

[Rayleigh]

I know nothing about MGS, so I voted no echo for Snake.

On the other hand, I'm going pretty wild with the Ike nomination and I say Twilight Princess Ganondorf. In my opinion, it makes way more sense to make Ganon a clone of Ike than Falcon.

I see you are a man of culture as well. I fear the beard but, more importantly? I miss the beard.

 

[AirMac1]

Who do we nominate now?

Edit:oh it’s Ike!

 

[Zinith]

Who do we nominate now?

We nominate Ike Echoes...

 

[MrRoidley]

gotta go with my boy Jack.

For Ike I don't know much of Fire Emblem beyond Sacred Stones, Awakening or Echoes, so idk... Maybe Alm could work? Even tho yeah he'd be much better fit as a Marth/Roy echo. People mentioned Hector too, from what I know of him I guess he could work

 

[Mastermiine]

Ike is up guys! Just submitted the poll request! Going to bed.

Next up is Pokemon Trainer

You will have to submit 3 things to match // so no craziness!

 

[fogbadge]

dont know enough about fore emblem to vote for ike

now as for pokemon trainer echoes, bit tricky but i suppose there are other pokemon that could work as their echoes they just wouldnt follow the same pattern

squirtle the most natural fit would be wartortle as with most of the other turtle pokemon or others of a similar build youd have to change a fair amount of the animations

for ivysaur, blubasaur would work best, you could have othe for legged pokemon but youd have to change the animations involving the bud on its back

and charizard unlike the other two the other members of his family probably wouldnt work as a lot of his attacks use his wings youd have to change a lot more so youd probably need a dragon type like dragonite, druddigon or flygon

and the trainer him/herself any trainer for any other generation

 

[Diddy Kong]

For Ike I nominate Black Knight Zelgius and Greil. Alm is also a possibility even.

For Pokémon Trainer I’ll go with Mega Charizard X.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Pokemon Trainer is in a weird spot with echoes. With Squirtle, they could take advantage of Piplup or Oshawott's Japanese popularity. With Charizard, you have to resort to Pokemon that aren't fire types let alone fire starters. Dragonite and Flygon would be best for this. But with Ivysaur...there's nothing. So we might as well just have Squirtle and Charizard semiclones, with no trainer gimmick and the latter having Rock Smash back.

 

[DjinnandTonic]

Hmm... Pokemon Trainer is an odd one.

Depending on what "Echo" means. Is the main feature of Pokemon Trainer that s/he switches between Pokemon? Or is it that each individual Pokemon should have an Echo?

If it's the latter, then you can choose any Pokemon with similar body types. Squirtle matches nicely with Piplup, Totodile, Mudkip, and Oshawott. Ivysaur matches up decently with Grotle. And Charizard matches nicely with... Dragonite. Charizard could conceivably match with dragons from non-Pokemon sources, but I dislike that idea.

If the main feature is the switching, then perhaps Charizard could be replaced from the rotation? Perhaps a Pokemon Fire Starter could be mapped to a clone of Bowser or Donkey Kong or something?

Then you could have say.. a Gen 4 Pokemon Trainer using Piplup (Squirtle) - Grotle (Ivysaur) - Infernape (Donkey Kong or Diddy Kong echo as base).

Or perhaps a Gen 5 Pokemon Trainer using Oshawott (Squirtle) - Servine (heavily edited Ivysaur?) - Emboar (Bowser echo as base?)

Or even a mixed-generation Pokemon trainer using Totodile/Mudkip (Squirtle) - Grotle (Ivysaur) - Emboar (Bowser)

Personally, I'd just give the Trainer him/herself a bunch of costumes from the various Generations.

 

[Mastermiine]

For Ike I nominate Black Knight Zelgius and Greil. Alm is also a possibility even.

For Pokémon Trainer I’ll go with Mega Charizard X.

And for the other 2?

 

[slambros]

Here is my idea for a Pokemon Trainer Echo:

The Pokemon Trainer would be Wes from Pokemon Colosseum. And he would have 2nd gen starters: Totodile, Bayleef, and Typhlosion.

 

[Guynamednelson]

How is Typhlosion supposed to echo Charizard?

 

[Vingag]

Waiting for Ike's poll to upload, though I'm not very well acquainted with Fire Emblem (for example: I though Chrom was Ike's echo? Though is Chrom actually Roy's echo? What are the differences between Ike and Roy? Have we ever seen them in the same room together? Is it possible that they are actually... THE SAME PERSON?!)

Okay, Pokemon trainers. I think I've already shown that I play a bit looser with echoes than some here, but there are plenty of choices:

- Ethan/Lyra (with Totodile, Bayleef, and Typhlosion)
- Brendan/May (with Mudkip, Grovyle, and Blaziken) though Mudkip would admittedly need a bit more tweaking then most.
- Lucas/Dawn (with Piplup, Grotle, and Infernape)
- Hilbert/Hilda (with Oshawott, Pignite, and Serperior) although this is a tough generation, as its mostly the final evolutions that have the visual distinction and the moveset potential.
- Calem/Serena (with Froakie, Braixen, and Chesnaught) another tricky generation due to the inclusion of Greninja as their own fighter.
- Sun/Moon (with Rowlet, Brionne, and Incineroar). Though I'm also tempted to have Decidueye as the highest evolution, though that's mostly personal preference and not because Decidueye would make for a good Charizard echo.

We could also have Rocket Grunts (though they'd make a much better semi-clone fighter, and they'd need to have Meowth- that's right!- who is already deconfirmed), Rivals, Gym Leaders, other game villains like Lusamine, or other fighters you meet throughout the game.

 

[MrRoidley]

I can only see a Gen IV Trainer with Piplup, Grotle and Infernape working without major changes... the biggest one would be in Infernape's moveset

 

[Rayleigh]

Despite nominating Zephiel, I am a man of culture and vote TP-Ganondorf.

-----------------------------

Intro

Pokemon Trainer Echoes are bad ideas given the level of work to be done. You either end up with an entirely different character, making the notion of an echo irrelevant, or your struggle ends up with something unfitting. But, in the interest of insanity, I'll think on it.

Scenario One: Simple Echo

Spoiler

An uninteresting human that has no active role in the fight, accompanied by a small water type, a medium grass type, and a large fire type. All of them starters, with the the fire one capable of multiple jumps and the grass one with a tether option. To make the simplest type of echo, you'd need pokemon who can match these options but with some different animations.

No Gen fits this category. The closest is Gen IV, but Piplup will likely re-appear in the background of the Kalos Map, but could fit over Squirtle with animation changes. Grotle can largely fit over Ivysaur save for the flower attacks and bullet seed. Infernape cannot fit over charizard, and Infernape is also on the Kalos Map.

Scenario Two - Not an Echo

Spoiler

An uninteresting human that has no active role in the fight, accompanied by pokemon of three different sizes, all of them starters. One can have multiple jumps and the other can have a tether.

Any Gen could fit here, but not as simple echoes. Honestly, none of them make good echoes.

Gen II could feature the small Totodile, with Bayleef in the middle, followed by Typhlosion at the end. Totodile is popular and the anime made it a quirky favorite. Bayleef would need multiple changes over Bulbasaur due to its shape and size, while Typhlosion works as a heavy brawler that has Flame Wheel instead of Flare Blitz. You could switch Bayleef for Meganium and Typhlosion for Quilava....but no one likes Meganium.

Gen III could feature the small Mudkip, the popular Grovile, and the iconic Blazekin. I heard people like mudkips, and it could use mud attacks that affect opponent speed, but is slower itself. Grovile has leaf and vine usage, and is a fast fighter. Blazekin is the powerhouse with moves like Hi Jump Kick (UP Special with Recoil on failed hit). You could swap the later for Combuskin and Sceptile...but no one likes Combuskin, and Grovile also has that Mystery Dungeon hype that people like...but as a trio of echo fighters, they do not work.

Gen IV. still has the same problems from before, so no.

Gen V. This one has multiple problems. Oshawott could work over Squirtle (though its second evolution could work instead), but the other two have no solid picks. Tepig could be done over Ivysaur (No one wants Emboar) as a dramatic change, but then wouldn't be an echo. Tepig is also on the Kalos map, however. Also no one in the Snivy Line works for Charizard. No final evolution works here, really. Forget Gen V PKMN Trainer, and just vote Golurk for Smash.

Gen VI. No. Greninja is already in. Having a lesser form of Greninja, while possible, doesn't fit well. What's more, no one would fit over Ivysaur.

Gen VII. Unknown. Potential separate newcomer may join. Best outcome likely Pupleo, Torracat, and Decidueye. Even then, not great. Decidueye has nothing in common with Charizard outside of having wings...which, even then, function differently from each other.

The only other option is to look at Non-Player Trainers (like Jessie&James, Blue, or popular Gym Leaders/Villains )and non-starter favorites (Meowth, Gengar, ETC) ...but starters are designed for that overarching appeal and maintain more popularity, and it would be harder to get another trio of non-starters to fit over the three...what...Dragonite for Charizard, maybe, but the other two? Not so much. Throw three unrelated Pokemon together and call it a day? Thematic to the pokemon franchise, but a mismatch of non-comparable options as far as echoes go.

In summary, a new Pokemon Trainer could work for a non-echo similar to Wolf versus Fox, but not as an Echo in the modern sense. Thus, I (finally) vote No Logical Option.

 

[Peridorito]

For Pokémon Trainer, there's no other logical Pokémon trio. Squirtle and Ivysaur could be replaced with other starters but Charizard couldn't. And it would be weird if only two out of the trainer's three Pokémon were starters.

I'm gonna go with Oshawott, Turtwig and Garchomp, but they should be separate characters rather than being tied to another trainer.

 

[Pizza Robo]

I voted for Black Knight
As for Echos for Pokemon Trainer i nominate Oshawott,Grotle,and Dragonite

 

[Awakining]

Nominating Dragon Tamer (Bagon / Zweilous / Dragonite) as a Pokemon Trainer echo.

The three starters used by our current trainer are difficult to feasibly recreate with others of their ilk, so I decided to go for a different archetype of trainer instead. Bagon is a similar size and build as Squirtle, and is capable of performing most of Squirtle's attacks, although certain shell moves would need to be either reskinned or replaced with headbutts. Zweilous is a bit of an unconventional choice, but it's a quadrupedal Pokemon that is surprisingly capable of performing Ivysaur's moveset, given that it could easily lash out with its two necks to replicate Ivysaur's vines and use blades of wind (or its wings; it does use Wing Attack in the anime, after al) in place of the leafy moves. Finally, Dragonite is a fairly self-explanatory choice, given its popularity and physical similarity to Charizard, and it rounds out the trio nicely as a realistic and inoffensive echo.

Additionally, this concept respects the diversity of trainers within the Pokemon universe by acknowledging the Pokemon Trainer's starter trio without attempting to replace or update it. Instead, these three echoes bring their own unique flavor to the base moveset, and provide an equally cohesive theme under a different type of trainer.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Black Knight's the obvious one (imagine if we did this before Chrom was announced), but I wanted to go with something more fun. I'd prefer Siggy and Nightmare with their own kits, so I'll just go with Ganondorf. If he has to be an echo, I'd rather it be for someone else I like too.

It's tough to consider a trainer echo - it may have been easier to consider a possible echo for each mon individually. Still, I'd love to see a Team Rocket character, it's just tough to consider who the Pokémon could be. They tend to stick to poison and dark types, so I'd go with Croagunk over Squirtle. I suppose Dragonite makes the most sense as a Charizard echo - the TCG expansion has had some Dark Dragonite cards. Over Ivy, though...I can't really see too many good options...I guess I'll go with Skuntank for the poison gas explosions and being a quadruped, he'll just have to use his tail for the whips.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Somebody really wanted us to notice and / or vote for Zephiel.

 

[Luigifan18]

New poll is up.

I appologize for making everyone wait so long.

EDIT:We got Boshi and Yarn Yoshi for tomorrow. Any other nominations?

The new poll is... wrong. Why does it say "Snake", and why are Zephiel and Eckesach's Wielder listed seperately?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

The new poll is... wrong. Why does it say "Snake", and why are Zephiel and Eckesach's Wielder listed seperately?

Oh, that Snake bit was my bad. It's a lot to edit and I had a rough week. Sorry about that.

Keep in mind the user doesn't know if a character is the same or not. That's up to the people informing him. Nor did I when I edited the poll. It's very important people are concise with their character choices.

Also, Eckesach's Wielder is a short way of saying "whoever happens to use it". Not meant to mean one specific character. I can understand the confusion though. I'll update a little.

 

[DjinnandTonic]

Black Knight and Hector are the only two I'd personally consider. Black Knight (Zelgius) is the best known villain in the franchise so he would be a nice addition to the potential "Heroes vs. Villains" theme. Hector would be a non-sword-wielding FE rep, and also the second-most popular male character in the franchise, which would be hype-attracting.

Zephiel is the King of Bern. He is also literally the only unit in any Fire Emblem game who can wield Eckesachs. (Also... who are Zweihander and Harbinger of Dragonkind? Are these also vague references to Zephiel?)

 

[Rayleigh]

(I gave Zephiel lofty titles in my nomination because I'm a sleep deprived madman, I myself didn't even notice he put them up to begin with, let alone as separate things.)

 

[FancySmash]

I think an Alolan trainer would work pretty well.
Poplio - Let's be honest, Squirtle being a turtle, and Poplio being a seal, both would move pretty awkwardly on land, so movement would match up well. As for moves, Waterfall lines up, withdraw could just be surf (like Piplup's pokeball in brawl used), and it'd still match up well, and Water Gun would also match up well.
Torracat - This might look a little weird, but both Ivysaur and Torracat are quadrupeds, so movement wouldn't differ too much. Bullet seed could just be spitting ember's upwards. Razor Leaf could be will-o-wisp, as both moves seem like they'd move about the same speed (and Will-O-Wisp damaging instead of burning isn't to big a deal, look at Jigglypuff's rest). Vine Wip is the only thing that'd have to change dramatically, but that isn't a big deal in my opinion what with Chrom using Ike's recovery.
Decidueye - Both have wings which would lead to similar air movement, with decidueye being slightly faster in the air I imagine. Flamethrower becomes leaf storm, explaining why it weakens over time, just like in the games. Fly is obviously fly. Flare Blitz would easily become brave bird, as they both work the same way in the games. Spirit Shackle could probably be in the the final smash, or as a simple long range attack.

 

[SmasherMaster]

I am going to suggest Cynthia, because she is the most popular champion, but her pokemon would be
-Flygon (Charizard echo)
-Oshawott (Squirtle echo)
-Grotle (Ivysaur echo)
I feel like the Pokemon Trainer should have been split into 3 voting though. Each Pokemon Trainer themselves is listed as fighters 33-35.

 

[Banjodorf]

Voted for the Black Knight because villain and because he’s one of my favorite characters in the series, and would fit well with some tweaks.

The King of Bern (Zephiel’s father)’s name is Desmond by the way.

 

[Mastermiine]

Bump! New Day!

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Putting them all together, I really don't think there's a viable echo here. The trainer's mechanic is too unique.

Next is Diddy, right? Obviously Dixie's a possible echo - just move the tail bones to the head and done. Despite how a lot of Dixie supporters may not like that.

 

[Zinith]

Tiny Kong as an echo?

 

[fogbadge]

they do all have some candidates for echoes, though i dont think some of those options would work, but theyd probably work better as separate fighters so ill just vote for my own suggestions

as for diddy, as most would say dixie works best

 

[The Prankster 16]

Really is no viable choice
Dixie for Diddy

 

[Guynamednelson]

There are viable choices for Squirtle and Charizard, and they have the most reasons to be echoed (Other base water starters being more popular, Charizard losing a move), but not Ivysaur or the trainer.

 

[Sari]

I voted no viable echo for Pokemon Trainer.

Dixie would be better off as a semi-clone ala Isabelle though if Diddy really needed an echo she'd probably be the best candidate.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I feel like Pokemon Trainer would be more likely to get individual echoes based on Squirtle, Ivysaur and Charizard than to get one encompassing all three.

It makes a certain amount of sense to make echoes that have their own separate movesets. (for example they could make an echo of Squirtle based on Oshawott or Piplup)

 

[PeridotGX]

We really should've given each Pokémon it's own poll, it did nothing but ruin the poll results.

Anyways I nominate Monferno for Diddy.

 

[Mastermiine]

Zinith Zinith
fogbadge fogbadge
CaptainAmerica CaptainAmerica
Peridorito Peridorito
MrRoidley MrRoidley
[IMG]https://smashboards.com/data/avatars/s/133/133435.jpg?1447792648[/IMG] FooltheFlames

We really should've given each Pokémon it's own poll, it did nothing but ruin the poll results.

Anyways I nominate Monferno for Diddy.

Since Pokemon Trainer is one on the select screen I figured the echo needed to match it as a unit.

 

[Pizza Robo]

I vote for Oshawott,Grotle,and Flygon :D
Tiny Kong for Diddy Kong Echo