Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Dukeofdeath5]

So this reminds me of a post someone made suggesting maybe the veterans could've been revealed one by one and not at E3 and we would've slowly realized everyone is here.
What sounds more exciting and marketable to you. "Everyone's here!...after a month of us piecing it together"
or
"EVERYONE IS HERE. AND YOU SAW THEM ALL AT E3. IN ACTION. EVERY SINGLE ONE AT ONCE."

Consider this, but as the last blowout for reveals.

But that was an exception not a rule, it's not like Nintendo are known for showing 8 goddamn new comers in a row.

Would it be effective? **** yes it would be effective, that's the only reason I'm even giving the leak any benefit of the doubt, but I refuse to look at this claim without a serious amount of skepticism

 

[Deleted member]

Real or fake, I'm scared to see what the pre-release of Smash 6 looks like after this. You KNOW everyone is going to try to copy this.

I for one welcome an era of fake leaks that stick characters from upcoming animated films in the background as proof of their legitimacy.

 

[Confirmation]

Thing is, if this were to get leaked post the initial Ridley or K.Rool reveal, I would have an easier time believing it.

But this is after they showed us Isabelle by herself and followed it up with saying they'd slow down reveals, while simultaneously having information coming from stuff like the blog grind to an absolute halt. We're talking daily blog posts here, and they decided to hold off on showing 8 (if I remember correctly) newcomers, all of which would be hype inducing to some capacity.

My question would then be why. Why would nintendo even do the marketing that way if they were holding so much of it off for the final month? Why would they slow down on reveals if they really don't have to? Why would they reveal Isabelle by herself (notably the only character to revealed by herself) if they really didn't have to?

It's not impossible for Nintendo decide to end on a splurge, a massive splurge, much larger than Everyone Is Here and Castle-Rool. But it's simply unlikely, and if true, kinda fuggin stupid.

I mean, maybe, if it hadn't be spoiled for me, for instance, and I watched such a show live, expecting only 2 characters to revealed, and getting about 8, I'd probably **** myself, so maybe Nintendo are geniuses after all. The only problem is they clearly didn't take into account leaks.

But Occam's Razor suggests to me this is just a fake.

Wouldn't Occam's Razor point to it being true? If it's fake this guy has access to digital design tools, is familiar with CAD, printed out numerous materials to pretend to be a design company and then became a 400k IQ 6th dimensional chess identity stealing wizard.

 

[Opossum]

Since people don't seem to be receptive on twitter, I just wanted to leave this here. Its purpose is to demonstrate that the background has not changed at all throughout these versions of the banner. Not asserting that it means anything. Just figured it's good to have a direct comparison where the alignment is completely fixed. Do with it what you will. =P

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/455060269526417408/505585571909861386/3-version-compare.gif

Great to see you back here, man. I still remember back when we all knew you as Hex. Your input is more than appreciated.

 

[Luigi The President]

But that was an exception not a rule, it's not like Nintendo are known for showing 8 goddamn new comers in a row.

Would it be effective? **** yes it would be effective, that's the only reason I'm even giving the leak any benefit of the doubt, but I refuse to look at this claim without a serious amount of skepticism

This whole game is exceptions tbh. I'm not trying to get all conspiracy on you. You should be skeptical.

 

[Dee Dude]

Honestly, who's to say we won't get a Robin/Lucina style trailer in early December a few days right before release?

 

[KingofKoopas]

True or not this leak managed to get Serebii AND ArtsyOmni to this thread. Who's next i wonder?

 

[FallofBrawl]

There is, sensibly, no point in changing the background where the characters cover up landmarks and clouds, if this leak was real.

But at the same time they are minor differences that may have been made for whatever reason, I understand at least the digital vs handdrawn argument but huge portions of the background are missing in 2-3 cases (all covered by characters in all the murals).

I’m on TeamHmmmm though.

 

[FallofBrawl]

That wasn't really a counter argument, just my personal feelings on the matter!

Ah I see sorry for assuming! Your feelings do make sense though, I don’t recall ESRB leak being this grainy.

 

[Kirbunny431]

Anyone think somehow someway the "leak" is fake, but the characters are right? Really the only thing keeping these characters somewhat adrift for me is how PapaGeno is essentially riding on this new source of his.

I can't conceive of the circumstances that would've resulted in an outcome like that. I find it hard to believe that a fake leak would perfectly line up with the actual roster, and I also don't think someone with info on the full roster (or an obsession with the Chad Ganondorf post) would take the time to make a full mockup, make it blurry as heck, then leak the information that way.

I'm personally of the opinion that this is all real, or all fake.

 

[StormC]

Honestly, who's to say we won't get a Robin/Lucina style trailer in early December a few days right before release?

Journalists will have the game by then.

 

[KingofKoopas]

BTW still on Team "Literally hiding in an old fallout shelter to avoid spoilers"

 

[Fenn]

I know I already said this, but the mural is definitely some sort of item to be mass-produced. I think because of the trapezoid shape and the hole on the other side that this is a bracelet the big are now it's some sort of event like the Wendy's tailgate tour.

 

[PsySmasher]

Found a video of the build used for the PGW tournament. Seems... like E3 demo to me. I don't think there's a new demo going around honestly.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKy0CJbz6uQ

Sucks it isn't a new build. However...

I don't know about you guys.

But those Link bomb plays were pretty hype.

 

[Luigi The President]

BTW still on Team "Literally hiding in an old fallout shelter to avoid spoilers"

Curious seeing as you stated you had a source telling you why the box theory isn't real

 

[Chrono.]

I for one welcome an era of fake leaks that stick characters from upcoming animated films in the background as proof of their legitimacy.

Can't wait for The Dennis the Menace leak.

 

[Artsy Omni]

Another comparison for kicks and giggles. Demonstrates that the version used on the wendy's truck is just the non-looping version of the one from simon & co's reveal. Also demonstrates that the empty version from E3 is the same exact background with no differences other than the obvious color balance difference from being off-screen.

In summary, absolutely no version of the banner from an official source has had any changes to the background. Only changes to character position, thus changing what parts of the background are visible between versions. Sometimes this results in things like castles being visible in one version and not the other, etc. due to being obstructed by characters who have changed position. For example, the crystal being visible behind megaman in one version and not others.

Again, interpret this however you want. =P

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/455060269526417408/505595607843471381/5-version-compare.gif

 

[TheKnight]

BTW still on Team "Literally hiding in an old fallout shelter to avoid spoilers"

Dang, good for you. Be careful though; it's dangerous out here on the leaky frontier of the internet.

 

[KMDP]

But that was an exception not a rule, it's not like Nintendo are known for showing 8 goddamn new comers in a row.

As they say: there's a first time for everything.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Wouldn't Occam's Razor point to it being true? If it's fake this guy has access to digital design tools, is familiar with CAD, printed out numerous materials to pretend to be a design company and then became a 400th dimensional chess indentity stealing wizard.

Another reason why I don't just scoff at it and completely dismiss it. It's not like it's a text leak or the Agnes leak, this one actually has stuff going for it.

I also kinda find it interesting this is another leak which claims "unkown character" and that character probably being Incineroar. But this would be far from the first fake leak to pull that card.

 

[supercopper64]

I haven’t been on since yesterday afternoon, will someone please give me an unbiased update on the leak and then what the common consensus is on it’s legitimaacy. I would appreciate it so much

 

[TVDart]

Another comparison for kicks and giggles. Demonstrates that the version used on the wendy's truck is just the non-looping version of the one from simon & co's reveal. Also demonstrates that the empty version from E3 is the same exact background with no differences other than the obvious color balance difference from being off-screen.

In summary, absolutely no version of the banner from an official source has had any changes to the background. Only changes to character position, thus changing what parts of the background are visible between versions. Sometimes this results in things like castles being visible in one version and not the other, etc. due to being obstructed by characters who have changed position.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/455060269526417408/505595607843471381/5-version-compare.gif

Nice catch Omni! Someone out there has access to the full empty background, at least, if they've moved around at least per promotional material. Interesting stuff.

 

[IcyBrawler]

Found a video of the build used for the PGW tournament. Seems... like E3 demo to me. I don't think there's a new demo going around honestly.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKy0CJbz6uQ

This is weird, someone on Reddit said the version number changed and I've seen multiple people say they spotted differences. I don't know at this point.

 

[KingofKoopas]

Curious seeing as you stated you had a source telling you why the box theory isn't real

That isn't alot of info though its only that theres more than 2 characters not which ones there are.

 

[TheCJBrine]

So, has anyone else thought about this?

The landmass there; there's colors of green and brown (I found this when using the color-picker tool in Paint.NET; they appear to be light shades set to a dark value; the green is also sorta visible), similar to the official banner, and the shape is similar, with the blues/waterfall being below the landmass.

 

[CosmicQuark]

I feel like I'm one of the few who can be on Team Real and Team Hmmmm at the same time--owing to my 60/40 it being real. I feel like regardless of what ends up being true, it still doesn't make sense. This isn't sports, I can be on one or more team because "nuance"

Also, on Team Zinith .

 

[Akiak]

I just had a really weird thought...

I think we're going a bit too fast with this whole thing and there's potential for mistakes...

We're all assuming that the E3 banner is identical to the background from the website, but how do we know this is the case?

What if the E3 banner is actually a special, improved version (given that it's also animated and back-lit) with extra-detail thrown in given how large it has to be, and it's the first time it's being shown empty to the public?

For example, there's those three shaded rocks behing Dedede on the right...

The first two are visible even with the characters (even if barely), while the third, smaller one to the right is completely hidden by Dedede.

It also is the only one that's happening to be missing in the leak, which might seem like a strong point for team fake...

But what if the rock is also missing in the website??

We actually have no way of knowing because, just like the leaker, we can't see it in any iteration of the banner!

So basically my theory is that the rock was added exclusively to the E3 banner due to it requiring more detail. This goes for any other changes as well

And, in conclusion, the empty banner in the leak is the original version of the background, without the E3 improvements.

Apologies if maybe this has been brought up before, I think it's a really good point. Thoughts?

 

[vigneault.charles]

There is, sensibly, no point in changing the background where the characters cover up landmarks and clouds, if this leak was real.

But at the same time they are minor differences that may have been made for whatever reason, I understand at least the digital vs handdrawn argument but huge portions of the background are missing in 2-3 cases (all covered by characters in all the murals).

I’m on TeamHmmmm though.

The differences are always on parts that were hidden but every shown part is the same:

 

[FallofBrawl]

The only reason I can think of why background was changed for the ‘final’ mural is if they somehow just wanted to make a new background and change colour/contrast to better fit the inclusion of all characters on the ‘wristband’, got lazy at the background portion, and just left things unfinished that were going to be covered by the characters anyway.

Something more plausible is that the background was made very bare in the first place, and the digital version was made extra nice because it would be bare of characters in the showcase.

 

[vigneault.charles]

I just had a really weird thought...

I think we're going a bit too fast with this whole thing and there's potential for mistakes...

We're all assuming that the E3 banner is identical to the background from the website, but how do we know this is the case?

What if the E3 banner is actually a special, improved version (given that it's also animated and back-lit) with extra-detail thrown in given how large it has to be, and it's the first time it's being shown empty to the public?

For example, there's those three shaded rocks behing Dedede on the right...

View attachment 172532

The first two are visible even with the characters (even if barely), while the third, smaller one to the right is completely hidden by Dedede.

It also is the only one that's happening to be missing in the leak, which might seem like a strong point for team fake...

But what if the rock is also missing in the website??

We actually have no way of knowing because, just like the leaker, we can't see it in any iteration of the banner!

So basically my theory is that the rock was added exclusively to the E3 banner due to it requiring more detail. This goes for any other changes as well

And, in conclusion, the empty banner in the leak is the original version of the background, without the E3 improvements.

Apologies if maybe this has been brought up before, I think it's a really good point. Thoughts?

But the banner who the company had 2 weeks ago would be a banner more outdated than june?! And clearly they moved every characters randomly they didn't draw the banner each time for each move. The right rock was in the 1st banner. Why would they had make it so small because "We don't need a complete background" and add the second part later. They don't create the background around every characters..

 

[Honest Slug]

I haven’t been on since yesterday afternoon, will someone please give me an unbiased update on the leak and then what the common consensus is on it’s legitimaacy. I would appreciate it so much

Banner has inconsistencies.

New item looks like it's from Golden Sun revealed at Wendy's.

Insiders don't buy the leak.

Most of said insiders expect Incineroar, although some characters from the leak might make it in regardless, probably Isaac with the new item.

Consensus Split between fake and real about evenly.

No concrete evidence proving it right or wrong, it's really just up to you to interpret what we know.

 

[Robertman2]

BTW still on Team "Literally hiding in an old fallout shelter to avoid spoilers"

Why hide in a small shelter when you can hide in a Vault-Tec Vault?

 

[Wiziliz]

My stance is basically this:

If the leak is true, this is my favorite game of all time.

If it’s fake, it’s at least in my top ten.

I don’t stand to lose much by cautiously believe it. But I don’t want to nitpick too much. I just want to see Nintendo play their hand by now.

Exactly how I'm feeling.
Either it's the greatest Smash game, and will be my favourite entry in the series forever, or it's one of my favourite games, but has the possibility of being surpassed in the future.
Problem is that I need Nintendo to play their hand as soon as possible, hahaha.

 

[ekc]

When the banner first got shown I couldn't wait to hang up the full thing, now I don't even know if I can look at it the same way without it thinking of this crazy situation.

 

[Tollhouse]

How do we know this is a wristband exactly? Doesn't seem like a good idea from a designer's perspective to include 80+ characters on something that goes on your wrist. You'd think it would just be the smash title logo.

 

[Luigi The President]

What gets me is that leaker clearly knew what to do with obscured stuff like Greninja's tongue and Roy's foot

Saddens me he'd slip up with the obscured BG stuff

 

[KMDP]

Another comparison for kicks and giggles. Demonstrates that the version used on the wendy's truck is just the non-looping version of the one from simon & co's reveal. Also demonstrates that the empty version from E3 is the same exact background with no differences other than the obvious color balance difference from being off-screen.

In summary, absolutely no version of the banner from an official source has had any changes to the background. Only changes to character position, thus changing what parts of the background are visible between versions. Sometimes this results in things like castles being visible in one version and not the other, etc. due to being obstructed by characters who have changed position. For example, the crystal being visible behind megaman in one version and not others.

Again, interpret this however you want. =P

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/455060269526417408/505595607843471381/5-version-compare.gif

These two posts of yours have been super interesting.

But... I have a question! (For anyone who might have the answer)

Would any of the background design changes be justified by being a result of accounting for printing/ink costs?

i.e. simplifying colours in the background so it doesn't cost as much to print.

The mural can look however you want it to when all you need it to do is be a graphic on a screen, but when you need to print hundreds of them in a large size, then you might start worrying about ink costs (and the more characters there are, the more you'd want the background to be simple to allow those characters to pop and to not break the bank).

 

[vigneault.charles]

The only reason I can think of why background was changed for the ‘final’ mural is if they somehow just wanted to make a new background and change colour/contrast to better fit the inclusion of all characters on the ‘wristband’, got lazy at the background portion, and just left things unfinished that were going to be covered by the characters anyway.

Something more plausible is that the background was made very bare in the first place, and the digital version was made extra nice because it would be bare of characters in the showcase.

But they move every character of sometime 1/2cm and reveal new parts of the banner that are all identical at E3. How every time they revealed 1mm more on the left of one character they redraw everything behind. No one would work like that.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

As said even if the banner isn't real. I still think Isaac is in which will be good for the his fans. They deserve their golden boy after so many years.

 

[KingofKoopas]

Why hide in a small shelter when you can hide in a Vault-Tec Vault?

Because i aint gonna be some guinea pig for social engineering experiments btw never played fallout but got friends who love it just thought i'd say