Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[TMNTSSB4]

How could I forget Shiek? Yeah he's looking like a top 5 beast for sure his kill confirms are better, extremely mobile, a very scary fighter no.

Pit mid tier...just a vanilla fighter.

Also Shiek is a woman

 

[RandomAce]

Why would an unpredictable madman pick something that you'd rather not pick? Truly, this is a head scratcher. Also because Shadow is popular as ****. Dude got his own game, I didn't see The Adventures of Tails the Fox on store shelves.


damn i always knew you were the daddy sakky himself

Don't try to predict or declare that a character can only be in a certain way, we're getting "too big" levels of absurdities.

It doesn’t make that much sense to put Sakurai so much effort into him though.


P

Because he's more popular than tails these days and smash is ultimately a popularity contest. Shadow is just a cooler character

Amiibo sales need to be taken into consideration.

Shadow is easier to make than tails just being an echo fighter of sonic. Moreover if you addplayabletails in you kinda need knuckles too to get the original trio and with knuckles being deconfirmed I don't see tails getting in.

I’m unsure how to respond to this, but okay let’s break this down.

Yeah, Shadow is maybe more popular than Tails. But Smash really isn’t a popularity contest. It’s about representing Nintendo and Smash’s history. Yeah you have the ballot, but even if you’re in the top spot, it was stated that Sakurai still chooses who he feels best fits into the roster and who he ultimately wants. Also I’m unsure if Shadow had an uproar of support back in 2015/2016.

Amiibo probably isn’t something to consider at all. You need to sell people on the base. If this were the case we wouldn’t see the likes of Wii Fit Trainer, Duck Hunt, Game and Watch, ROB, Ness, Roy, etc.

I said he was going to get in as mostly an echo. You don’t need to have the trio of Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles in, that’s pretty irrational to think about. I’m not even supporting Tails, I just don’t think Sakurai is going to make Shadow unique in the first place or seriously consider him when had many other mind blowing characters and Nintendo characters to choose from.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

I'd rather have Tails than Shadow solely because I want to be able to recreate that old melee rumor with Sonic and Tails on Green Greens.

But honestly, even though I really like Tails, I'd rather keep one character per 3rd party series.

 

[Will]

What really still makes me so shocked is that practically EVERYONE has Rex & Pyra on their prediction roster for the game. Various big internet personalities, pretty much any Smash-related content creator, forums... I mean, hey. Xenoblade 2 is the closest we're ever gonna get to reaching for those pearly gates God is behind, but to have virutally EVERYONE say "Oh, Rex, Pyra, Mythra... Either of those are in, for sure."

I really wanna know, it fascinates me so much that two characters would be put on so many roster predictions.

Marth gets in Smash, people think "whats a fire emblem" and the next thing you know you got 6 of them because of a popularity boom. I think the same thing applies to Shulk and Xenoblade.

 

[WaxPython]

Popularity really isn't the only factor, adding Shadow before Tails would be like adding Wario before Luigi, tails is the more important character and if we were to get another unique sonic character then he's the clear next choice.

Wario isn't more popular than Luigi though.

Wario hasn't had a proper game since Wario world on GameCube. Since then he's been relegated to Minigame status whole Year of the Luigi was going on and Mansion 2

Tails being the most important character these days is subjective.

For most people Shadow is the obvious pick and the most likely one, I like Tails but realistically I'm fairly certain Shadow gets in over Tails due to how easy it would be to add him in.

 

[Deleted member]

Marth gets in Smash, people think "whats a fire emblem" and the next thing you know you got 6 of them because of a popularity boom. I think the same thing applies to Shulk and Xenoblade.

That's very true. I just never thought it'd happen to Xenoblade of all franchises, but I'm really happy regardless.

But let's be real why people want Pyra and Mythra in Smash Ultimate.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Wario isn't more popular than Luigi though.

Wario hasn't had a proper game since Wario world on GameCube. Since then he's been relegated to Minigame status whole Year of the Luigi was going on and Mansion 2

Tails being the most important character these days is subjective.

For most people Shadow is the obvious pick and the most likely one, I like Tails but realistically I'm fairly certain Shadow gets in over Tails due to how easy it would be to add him in.

We're talking about unique characters here, not clones, him being easy to make isn't a factor.

And Shadow hasn't been important since 2006, meanwhile Tails has main roles in lost world, colours, the boom franchise, unleashed, secret rings, the rush games etc etc. Tails is pretty clearly more important to the franchise.

And I wasn't talking about popularity with the wario comparison, I was talking about franchise importance, Tails is the Luigi to Sonic's Mario and if another Sonic character gets in it should be him

 

[WaxPython]

Also Shiek is a woman

He's not Zelda changed her gender with magic. Hence why Sheik doesn't have any Breasts.

Also Pit is placed low mid tier by most smashers including Esam etc. there's nothing that his very good or standout.

 

[Will]

That's very true. I just never thought it'd happen to Xenoblade of all franchises, but I'm really happy regardless.

But let's be real why people want Pyra and Mythra in Smash Ultimate.

Nah, Bors has been doing XC2 porn for a while. And he's the juggernaut of Smash porn.

 

[WaxPython]

We're talking about unique characters here, not clones, him being easy to make isn't a factor.

And Shadow hasn't been important since 2006, meanwhile Tails has main roles in lost world, colours, the boom franchise, unleashed, secret rings, the rush games etc etc. Tails is pretty clearly more important to the franchise.

And I wasn't talking about popularity with the wario comparison, I was talking about franchise importance.

Being easy to make is definitely a factor for developers lol. I don't see devs developing that much time on a 3rd party character when we already have sonic representing the franchise.

I don't have too much to say on a character's role in the series as if that were the case Eggman should be in the game.

It's just pretty clear imo that Shadow is the most popular character and likely to get in over Tails who isn't really a fighter and had to be I na mech for adventure 2

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Being easy to make is definitely a factor for developers lol. I don't see devs developing that much time on a 3rd party character when we already have sonic representing the franchise.

I don't have too much to say on a character's role in the series as if that were the case Eggman should be in the game.

It's just pretty clear imo that Shadow is the most popular character and likely to get in over Tails who isn't really a fighter and had to be I na mech for adventure 2

But we're talking about unique characters...not clones...

So the argument has changed to tails isn't a fighter? Did Sonic 2, 3, Adventure, Battle, the fighters, Heroes, 06, the boom games, the advance games and the rivals games all not happen?

But anyway popularity is not the most important factor and nothing in smash's history has ever really implied that it is.

 

[GunBlaze]

He's not Zelda changed her gender with magic. Hence why Sheik doesn't have any Breasts.

Nintendo says otherwise.

 

[Enderwoman]

oh boy its another zelda fans police others over sheik episode

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Nintendo says otherwise.

To be fair, Bill trinen had no involvement with the character, whether the developers intended Sheik to be physically male is still debatable, and given their drastically different body type compared to Zelda I'd argue that they very well could be. That's just Ocarina of Time Sheik though, the sheik in brawl and onwards appears significantly more feminine, nintendo probably wants to move away from that whole debate

 

[MainJPW]

It's just pretty clear imo that Shadow is the most popular character and likely to get in over Tails who isn't really a fighter and had to be I na mech for adventure 2

Tails literally fights all the time and he's in 2 fighting games, 3 if you count Fighting Vipers.

He's only in a mech in Adventure 2 because he had to be cloned off Eggman for the whole Speed/Treasure Hunter/Mech gimmick the game had going and that's 1 game. Like, just 1.

 

[Zinith]

Did someone just unironically claim that Tails is not a fighter?

 

[**Gilgamesh**]

Why is everyone suggesting that Sheik gets nerfed? She definitely need buffss such as kill power to some of her aerials!!

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Tails literally fights all the time and he's in 2 fighting games, 3 if you count Fighting Vipers.

He's only in a mech in Adventure 2 because he had to be cloned off Eggman for the whole Speed/Treasure Hunter/Mech gimmick the game had going and that's 1 game. Like, just 1.

He singlehandedly beat eggman with nothing but his Tails in the game that came directly before that, the idea that tails isn't a fighter is simply not true (let's not acknowledge his characterization in forces)

 

[Will]

He's not Zelda changed her gender with magic. Hence why Sheik doesn't have any Breasts.

Yeah- No, it's still a chick. She didn't give herself a ****.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

That's very true. I just never thought it'd happen to Xenoblade of all franchises, but I'm really happy regardless.

But let's be real why people want Pyra and Mythra in Smash Ultimate.

My reason relates to Etika and Mythra saying “Pervert”

He's not Zelda changed her gender with magic. Hence why Sheik doesn't have any Breasts.

Also Pit is placed low mid tier by most smashers including Esam etc. there's nothing that his very good or standout.

In Smash 4 yeah, but Ultimate Pit has been getting good praise by many players not named Esam (with good possibility of him being in the low high/high mid tier range) due to his power buffs and easier ways to combo (I also saw something about Nairo considering picking him up again but I can’t find the proof...though I would like a Pit/ZSS combo)

As for Sheik’s gender...We asked Nintendo if there was an official word on this, and they answered the call. Nintendo's official line, quoted from Nintendo senior product marketing manager Bill Trinen, is this: "The definitive answer is that Sheik is a woman — simply Zelda in a different outfit."

From Polygon and Bill representing Nintendo as a whole (don’t think he’d lie about info like this
https://www.polygon.com/2014/8/5/5948989/zelda-nintendo-sheik-gender-cosplay

 

[Cheryl~]

Wario isn't more popular than Luigi though.

Wario hasn't had a proper game since Wario world on GameCube. Since then he's been relegated to Minigame status whole Year of the Luigi was going on and Mansion 2

Tails being the most important character these days is subjective.

For most people Shadow is the obvious pick and the most likely one, I like Tails but realistically I'm fairly certain Shadow gets in over Tails due to how easy it would be to add him in.

Nitpicking here to say that Wario did get a proper game after Wario World if we’re not counting the WarioWare series: Wario Land: Shake It! for the Wii.

 

[P.Kat]

No wait, I’m allergic to adorableness!!

...Awww.

(RIP me)

Nice, I caught the reference.

While they're at it, make packs for all the old announcers too. I'd love to have Pat Cashman back.

I wouldn't mind that it'll be cool to have some female announcer voices too.

Which 15 characters do you all think will be the best characters in Smash Ultimate?

in no particular order.

 

[WaxPython]

Nitpicking here to say that Wario did get a proper game after Wario World if we’re not counting the WarioWare series: Wario Land: Shake It! for the Wii.

Those are microgames he's barely in it. It's just a brand name he's not the star of those games.

 

[Zinith]

So with Jigglypuff getting on the blog, the remaining characters who have yet to get on the blog and who ALSO wasn't displayed in the Direct and the E3 demo are:

Spoiler

If Jigglypuff got displayed so early, I'm beginning to fear my boi WILL be last...

 

[WaxPython]

From Polygon and Bill representing Nintendo as a whole (don’t think he’d lie about info like this
https://www.polygon.com/2014/8/5/5948989/zelda-nintendo-sheik-gender-cosplay

Well thats a matter of opinion, they weren't around during the development of ocarina

'Sheik is presented as, and seen by others, as a man. Ruto herself actually refers to Sheik as “a young man” and “him” when Link finds her in the Water Temple. Sheik’s lean, muscular body type and demeanor further support this claim'

For me that's definitive proof, Nintendo reps in America who have nothing to do with Ocarina can say what they want but disguised don't somehow give you muscles and make breasts disappear.

 

[Will]

Well thats a matter of opinion, they weren't around during the development of ocarina

'Sheik is presented as, and seen by others, as a man. Ruto herself actually refers to Sheik as “a young man” and “him” when Link finds her in the Water Temple. Sheik’s lean, muscular body type and demeanor further support this claim'

For me that's definitive proof, Nintendo reps in America who have nothing to do with Ocarina can say what they want but disguised don't somehow give you muscles and make breasts disappear.

It doesn't have to make sense to you, the lore is that she's a chick.

Spoiler

You also forgot flat chicks and certain clothing that specifically make the appearance of breasts smaller exist.

 

[Smashiny]

Well thats a matter of opinion, they weren't around during the development of ocarina

'Sheik is presented as, and seen by others, as a man. Ruto herself actually refers to Sheik as “a young man” and “him” when Link finds her in the Water Temple. Sheik’s lean, muscular body type and demeanor further support this claim'

For me that's definitive proof, Nintendo reps in America who have nothing to do with Ocarina can say what they want but disguised don't somehow give you muscles and make breasts disappear.

How is her being called a man proof? That only means her dressing like a man was convincing

 

[NextChannelGames]

Ganondorf is Ganon so would be a bit weird imo

It isn’t since Ganon is big and blue with a Trident as a weapon. He could even use his powers like throwing bats, lighting and fireballs.

 

[Kamikazek]

Did someone just unironically claim that Tails is not a fighter?

"You ain't no air fighter Tails!"

"But I-"

"Quit fooling around up there, Smash ain't no joke."

 

[Will]

It isn’t since Ganon is big and blue with a Trident as a weapon. He could even use his powers like throwing bats, lighting and fireballs.

They're literally the same person.

 

[osby]

Sheik is Zelda, so she's a woman regardless of her physical sex. As far as we know, Sheik wasn't anything more than a persona, so it doesn't effect Zelda's gender.

 

[PhantomShab]

There are actually still people who think Sheik was really a man? Really? lmao

For me that's definitive proof, Nintendo reps in America who have nothing to do with Ocarina can say what they want but disguised don't somehow give you muscles and make breasts disappear.

Sheik is literally wearing bandages around her chest in Ocarina of Time lol.

 

[Zerp]

Why is everyone suggesting that Sheik gets nerfed? She definitely need buffss such as kill power to some of her aerials!!

I'm too tired to give a in-depth explanation as to why but it's mostly because she's seen as one of the best characters in Smash 4 by most people who play the game competitively. This is because despite all the nerfs her neutral is still very safe due to having arguably the best frame data in the entire game which helps lend to her being amazing at obtaining stage control, and also because she still has a overall great combo game.

Also, you did get your wish in a way, her B-air and U-air both have more knockback in Ultimate than they did in Smash 4.

 

[MBRedboy31]

Those are microgames he's barely in it. It's just a brand name he's not the star of those games.

1. Read their reply again.
2. While Warioware does spread attention around to all of its characters, they almost always both begin and end with Wario's microgames, and said microgames mostly star him or at least reference his visage. And so, yes, you do get to play as him, even if just for brief moments (or for longer in some side modes.) None of the other characters get more than one microgame set in a game (excluding ones that are just rehashing other characters' microgames; correct me if I'm wrong, though) and none of the other characters feature so heavily in their own microgames.

They're literally the same person.

That's more physical difference than between some other characters, so that wouldn't be an issue.

 

[P.Kat]

Actually, the biggest hurdle to my boi's success has still yet to be overcome:

His history of tax fraud? XD

Never got to use the joke, so this was my one opportunity sorry.

Ashley could literally be so bad she gets a tier all her own and i'd still main her, just cause I love the character.

Amaterasu could be so bad, that she could earn a tier placement called 'old run down doghouse', and I'd still main her.

It doesn't, but I still don't give a ****. People can bad mouth Bayonetta all they want for being top tier, etc, etc, I still don't care. She's in Smash. I wouldn't care if she was bottom or top tier or what people say.

I also don't think you should give a crap what people think about Yoshi as long as you enjoy Yoshi. You are all that matters in the end.

And to be fair, no matter what the Smash community says about any character in this game? It takes nothing from that character, because Smash is filled with nothing but the best of the best in video gaming, so...

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Yep Sheik was my favorite character from since Melee, and I didn't even know what a Tier list was. I just like ninjas/ninja-esque characters

 

[7NATOR]

I don't know what we talking in here about, All im gonna say s that it's possible for Shadow to be the Big 3rd Party Character...

What i mean is that while Simon and Geno are known, they aren't as known as my Boy Shadow

just theory, Just Prediction, Shadow for Smash, No Echo Shadow, Bring in the Chaos

 

[Zinith]

Never got to use the joke, so this was my one opportunity sorry.

Just don't go down the dark side like every non-Yoshi fan before you has...

 

[SuperSceptile15]

I can't be the only one who feels like Metal Sonic has slightly higher chances of being a Sonic echo as Shadow, right? Sonic Mania is very popular right now and has always been more popular than the most recent game that Shadow was in (Sonic Forces). I don't dislike either character, by the way.

 

[MainJPW]

I can't be the only one who feels like Metal Sonic has slightly higher chances of being a Sonic echo as Shadow, right? Sonic Mania is very popular right now and has always been more popular than the most recent game that Shadow was in (Sonic Forces). I don't dislike either character, by the way.

Metal Sonic can't do Sonic's Up-throw.

 

[MSmariosonic]

Tails is more deserving to be in Ultimate than Shadow imo