Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Wyoming]

I also believe (or want to believe) that franchises that had been in smash for very long without almost any new reps could get them.
F-Zero, Kirby, DK...

F-Zero is basically hinging on Black Shadow though. Goroh's disconfirmed and Blood Falcon costume remains on Falcon's body.

 

[Diddy Kong]

If she were an echo, she'd just use the jetpack since the B moves don't change.

Which would suck, since her whole point is her ponytail.

Exactly.

No point in adding Dixie if they are not gonna include the Helicopter Spin.

Especially not since DONKEY KONG is using a move extremely inspired by it: Spinning Kong.

Dixie Kong as Echo Fighter makes NO sense.

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

Not really.

He also has the meme going for him.

Can't believe I found a way to use this emote.

true

 

[Just a random scrub]

Question: Why are so many people convinced Geno is one of the most likely newcomers now? Over Waluigi? OVER TOAD? I mean I know we got Ridley but he's a long running recurring character that's owned by Nintendo, he's been in almost every single Metroid game AND cameoed in every single Smash. Geno is a one off character from a 20 year old spinoff game with no direct sequel, nobody outside of Smash speculation and SMRPG fans would even onow who he is. I think the Mii costume is perfect and will likely return, and I think that's the best case scenario. I'm not trying to generate salt but the idea that he's suddenly the Mario frontrunner in a game with limited newcomers is... weird.

I think it's because A: Geno is popular, B: Sakurai apparently really likes Geno and thinks he'd be a fun and unique addition, and actually wanted to get him in Brawl; it didn't work out, and he most likely considered him for Smash 4 (if it weren't for, you know, Cloud, Sakurai probably would have tried to negotiate Geno as more than a Mii costume). So, with the fact that Sakurai has been planning this game in advance for a while, it's very likely that he at least brought up geno when renewing his license for Cloud, because of the fact he wants him in Smash and he's a popular guy.

This does not make him a lock, of course, and I still won't hold my breath for safety reasons, but it does definitely make him all the more likely, especially considering the fact that the roster's most likely designed around fanservice.

 

[Guh-Huzzah!]

I think it's because A: Geno is popular, B: Sakurai apparently really likes Geno and thinks he'd be a fun and unique addition, and actually wanted to get him in Brawl; it didn't work out, and he most likely considered him for Smash 4 (if it weren't for, you know, Cloud, Sakurai probably would have tried to negotiate Geno as more than a Mii costume). So, with the fact that Sakurai has been planning this game in advance for a while, it's very likely that he at least brought up geno when renewing his license for Cloud, because of the fact he wants him in Smash and he's a popular guy.

This does not make him a lock, of course, and I still won't hold my breath for safety reasons, but it does definitely make him all the more likely, especially considering the fact that the roster's most likely designed around fanservice.

Other fighters have higher chances, honestly

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

There's always DLC if Geno doesn't make it into the base roster.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

assuming there's only 5 spots left, how likely is it that 1-2 are echoes on a 71 spot css?
I would still say belmont and chorus men are pretty likely as 2 newcomers at this point, followed by rayman and a dk rep IMO.

I might be misunderstanding you here but we have room for 7 more newcomers on a 71 spot CSS where Mii Fighter and Pokemon share spots, and echoes have their own.

So I'm predicting 5 more unique newcomers and 2 more echoes.

I mostly agree on your picks but am super unsure about Simon Belmont now. Vergeben seems to have mixed info, since a couple of his E3 predictions haven't shown (a capcaomxplatnium) and it looks like the Konami game was Hyper Sports R (or whatever it's called). Seriously the fact that Konami hasn't shown the Castlevania game at E3 like he said they would doesn't bode well...

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Exactly.

No point in adding Dixie if they are not gonna include the Helicopter Spin.

Especially not since DONKEY KONG is using a move extremely inspired by it: Spinning Kong.

Dixie Kong as Echo Fighter makes NO sense.

The only part that doesn't make sense is the up B.

And before you bring up the Peanut Popgun, it can be replaced by the Gumball Popgun.

I agree that putting Dixie without using her hair is a crime, but there's not that much holding her back from being an Echo Fighter.

 

[SquashiniKun]

Updated my prediction roster thing, Now with potential new pokemon rep, 2nd echo clone, and 3rd party character choices!

Spoiler: Filled Version

 

[TMNTSSB4]

We still haven't seen Fountain of Dreams. I'm becoming concerned

I need that stage back in my life

All that I'm saying is that if Shadow was ever considered to be a fighter, he has more to work with than just being a mere Sonic copycat. I've already mentioned Chaos Spear, but there's also Chaos Control and Chaos Blast to keep in mind.

and guns...lots and lots of guns

 

[Just a random scrub]

Other fighters have higher chances, honestly

Hence the "not a lock" statement.

(fingers crossed tho)

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

and guns...lots and lots of guns

If Solid Snake is restricted to explosives, while Bayonetta fires energy blasts from her guns, any firearms that Shadow uses would have to fire energy blasts to avoid a parental rating increase.

 

[Jetsurge]

I don't think making Shadow an echo fighter would make any sense. He has his own unique attacks, such as Chaos Spear.

In his most recent appearance in Sonic forces he was identical to Sonic except he had a stronger homing attack

 

[New_Dumal]

All that I'm saying is that if Shadow was ever considered to be a fighter, he has more to work with than just being a mere Sonic copycat. I've already mentioned Chaos Spear, but there's also Chaos Control and Chaos Blast to keep in mind.

Lucina and D.Pit also had more to work with.The thing with Shadow is that they can make him a echo fighter, with minimum changes from Sonic (maybe a slower but stronger version or something like that), and this would please more people than he being a AT.
It's not like he can't be a brand newcomer,it's more like "he is a possible choice for a echo fighter".
Daisy herself had potential as stated by Daisy fans on this board. But with his absense on the demo,people reached the conclusion that maybe he will be a echo character. I would appreciate it.

 

[Zeox]

Shadow and Dark Pit would get along.

 

[Nani?]

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/234547-super-smash-bros-ultimate/76514442

oh snap! waddle dee might be in!!!

Hate to be that guy, but can you tag that with spoilers next time? I don't really like leaks for games like this.

 

[Jetsurge]

Lucina and D.Pit also had more to work with.The thing with Shadow is that they can make him a echo fighter, with minimum changes from Sonic (maybe a slower but stronger version or something like that), and this would please more people than he being a AT.
It's not like he can't be a brand newcomer,it's more like "he is a possible choice for a echo fighter".
Daisy herself had potential as stated by Daisy fans on this board. But with his absense on the demo,people reached the conclusion that maybe he will be a echo character. I would appreciate it.

All they have to do is make his running animation skating

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

New_Dumal : I never thought that Daisy had any real chance of making the cut, especially since any moveset ideas for her were non-existent in my head.

 

[Zeox]

Hate to be that guy, but can you tag that with spoilers next time? I don't really like leaks for games like this.

But in the smash discussion thread is where we talk about everythign related with smash, even leaks.
If you don't wanna look at leaks why are you even in this thread.

 

[New_Dumal]

Shadow and Dark Pit would get along.

Completely sure. They would listen to some old Linkin Park together while ranting that nobody is 100% original at life.Cool guys.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Shadow and Dark Pit would get along.

They probably already do (Cloud also)

If Solid Snake is restricted to explosives, while Bayonetta fires energy blasts from her guns, any firearms that Shadow uses would have to fire energy blasts to avoid a parental rating increase.

If Shadow used those in his game then I don’t mind (though of course I wouldn’t mind how he works as long as he’s playable and has guns)

 

[Jetsurge]

Hate to be that guy, but can you tag that with spoilers next time? I don't really like leaks for games like this.

Don't worry there already is a Waddle Dee amiibo for the Kirby series. It doesn't confirm anything.

 

[Wyoming]

The only part that doesn't make sense is the up B.

And before you bring up the Peanut Popgun, it can be replaced by the Gumball Popgun.

I agree that putting Dixie without using her hair is a crime, but there's not that much holding her back from being an Echo Fighter.

Exactly. It's one attack. And we know echoes can have different final smashes thanks to Dark Pit, but even if she copies Diddy who's to say both won't get the guitar?

 

[osby]

F-Zero is basically hinging on Black Shadow though. Goroh's disconfirmed and Blood Falcon costume remains on Falcon's body.

Is there a F-Zero fan who actually wants Black Shadow as a fighter, not a moveset dump?

 

[Cosmic77]

People shouldn't take the 6x12 roster size too seriously. No one said the CSS had to be a perfect rectangle with all gaps filled in with a character. Need I remind you of the ESRB Smash 3DS leak when everyone thought there were more hidden unlockable characters because of the weird gaps at the bottom of the screen?

Besides, the fact that we're likely getting DLC should tell us that the arrangement of the roster is going to end up changing anyways.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Interesting if true.
Also if true, that would meant that the only characters with existing amiibo to get in would be Daisy and BLANK. That narrows down some things, and leaves others wide open. DK representation for one thing.

 

[TheNerdyOne_]

Honestly I think the whole idea of a character's relevancy should be thrown completely out the window for this game.

Every decision made for this game so far seems to be done with the fans in mind. It's the ultimate Smash Bros game, Sakurai brought everybody back because he saw that that's what the fans wanted. We got Ridley despite Sakurai saying before he wouldn't work in Smash, again because that's what the fans wanted. They did an entire ballot just to find out what the fans wanted.

Calling it now, almost every newcomer/echo character is going to be someone that has been highly requested by the fans. I would count Xenoblade and probably Fire Emblem out of the equation.

 

[StrangeMann]

I might be misunderstanding you here but we have room for 7 more newcomers on a 71 spot CSS where Mii Fighter and Pokemon share spots, and echoes have their own.

So I'm predicting 5 more unique newcomers and 2 more echoes.

I mostly agree on your picks but am super unsure about Simon Belmont now. Vergeben seems to have mixed info, since a couple of his E3 predictions haven't shown (a capcaomxplatnium) and it looks like the Konami game was Hyper Sports R (or whatever it's called). Seriously the fact that Konami hasn't shown the Castlevania game at E3 like he said they would doesn't bode well...

Ah okay.
Well there's one small issue with 7 more fighters: You need room for the random button... There's 66 fighters on the website
https://www.smashbros.com/en_US/fighter/index.html 66 fighters right now, adding 67,68,69,70,and 71
However assuming we have a 6 x 12 CSS, the website doesn't count echoes as separate roster spots. So if so spots 67,68,and 69 are already filled by echoes, leaving spots 70 and 71 remaining.
TL:DR: If echoes take up their own spots we have 2 spots left in a 6 by 12 including echoes.
If echoes don't take up their own spots we have 5 spots left in a 6 by 12 not including echoes.

 

[Wyoming]

Is there a F-Zero fan who actually wants Black Shadow as a fighter, not a moveset dump?

Most people if not all who want a moveset dump are salty Zelda fans.

F-Zero fans aren't very common on Smash. I'd say Goroh is the leader but Black Shadow might have some true supporters.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Ah okay.
Well there's one small issue with 7 more fighters: You need room for the random button...
So it would instead be 6 right?

Nope , 7 more accounts for 71 so random button is 72. Triple checking my math now, I'll let you know if I'm wrong lol.

Honestly I think the whole idea of a character's relevancy should be thrown completely out the window for this game.

Every decision made for this game so far seems to be done with the fans in mind. It's the ultimate Smash Bros game, Sakurai brought everybody back because he saw that that's what the fans wanted. We got Ridley despite Sakurai saying before he wouldn't work in Smash, again because that's what the fans wanted. They did an entire ballot just to find out what the fans wanted.

Calling it now, almost every newcomer/echo character is going to be someone that has been highly requested by the fans. I would count Xenoblade and probably Fire Emblem out of the equation.

I'd agree...except for the fact that the fan characters that have been added (Ridley, Inkling, and argubly Daisy) are still relevant. King K Rool is highly requested but I could see Dixie getting chosen instead because she is both requested and still used by Nintendo. This can obviously change with the next reveal though.

I agree on counting out Xenoblade and Fire Emblem for now...because I think they need popularity/fan demand AND relevancy (or you know at least appeared in a Nintendo game in the last decade).

 

[osby]

Honestly I think the whole idea of a character's relevancy should be thrown completely out the window for this game.

Every decision made for this game so far seems to be done with the fans in mind. It's the ultimate Smash Bros game, Sakurai brought everybody back because he saw that that's what the fans wanted. We got Ridley despite Sakurai saying before he wouldn't work in Smash, again because that's what the fans wanted. They did an entire ballot just to find out what the fans wanted.

Calling it now, almost every newcomer/echo character is going to be someone that has been highly requested by the fans. I would count Xenoblade and probably Fire Emblem out of the equation.

You are saying it like those two have no heavily requested characters. I don't think FE will get a new fighter, though.

 

[TheNerdyOne_]

You are saying it like those two have no heavily requested characters. I don't think FE will get a new fighter, though.

I mean, they really don't. Elma's getting up there as of late, but she wasn't relevant at all at the time of the ballot, or when the game's roster was decided.

 

[StrangeMann]

Nope , 7 more accounts for 71 so random button is 72. Triple checking my math now, I'll let you know if I'm wrong lol.

I'd agree...except for the fact that the fan characters that have been added (Ridley, Inkling, and argubly Daisy) are still relevant. King K Rool is highly requested but I could see Dixie getting chosen instead because she is both requested and still used by Nintendo. This can obviously change with the next reveal though.

I agree on counting out Xenoblade and Fire Emblem for now...because I think they need popularity/fan demand AND relevancy (or you know at least appeared in a Nintendo game in the last decade).

If possible could you visualize it? I'm simply not seeing the math for 7 more characters in a 6 by 12

 

[papagenos]

Hate to be that guy, but can you tag that with spoilers next time? I don't really like leaks for games like this.

sorry about that, its just speculation for now anyway but yes its pretty solid evidence.

 

[papagenos]

If possible could you visualize it? I'm simply not seeing the math for 7 more characters in a 6 by 12

here ya go.

 

[Skyblade12]

If she were an echo, she'd just use the jetpack since the B moves don't change.

Which would suck, since her whole point is her ponytail.

Upperdash Arm from Pit became Electroshock Arm for Dark Pit. So, yeah, B-Moves can change.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

People shouldn't take the 6x12 roster size too seriously. No one said the CSS had to be a perfect rectangle with all gaps filled in with a character. Need I remind you of the ESRB Smash 3DS leak when everyone thought there were more hidden unlockable characters because of the weird gaps at the bottom of the screen?

Besides, the fact that we're likely getting DLC should tell us that the arrangement of the roster is going to end up changing anyways.

For all we know, the roster format could be the same as that of how I've set up my newest roster image; 15x5, with four vacant slots if the random icon is absent.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Upperdash Arm from Pit became Electroshock Arm for Dark Pit. So, yeah, B-Moves can change.

It's still the same animation though.

Heck, it's basically the same move, but with a different name, look and knockback trajectory.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

View attachment 148337

here ya go.

Thank you! I'm at work and was like idk how I'm gunna do this lol.

But yea 7 spots left.

ALSO I get that this isn't the best way to predict the roster, but it just happens to line up with my idea that 10 newcomers seems about right. So I'm sticking with it for now, fully aware that the css could be any shape or size and that Sakuri doesn't pick characters based on how they'll fit on a screen.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Upperdash Arm from Pit became Electroshock Arm for Dark Pit. So, yeah, B-Moves can change.

Those are still technically the same move, it just looks a little different and the angle/damage is different