Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Gestahl]

I know that Ridley is too big to get into the roster but what if they do some crossover character like Spyro/Ridley (Spyridleyo) where Spyro has his SuperSmash as Ridley. It would certainly be a wonderful coalition!

 

[Tree Gelbman]

I know that Ridley is too big to get into the roster but what if they do some crossover character like Spyro/Ridley (Spyridleyo) where Spyro has his SuperSmash as Ridley. It would certainly be a wonderful coalition!

Every day we stray further from god.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Of course I'm sure no one would complain if they were both added! It just seems weird how often I see Waluigi discounted in favor of Daisy.

People will complain regardless of what happens. There's no pleasing everybody.

 

[vegeta18]

i really cant wait for them to give us like any bit of information at all

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I know that Ridley is too big to get into the roster but what if they do some crossover character like Spyro/Ridley (Spyridleyo) where Spyro has his SuperSmash as Ridley. It would certainly be a wonderful coalition!

Ah yes, I remember my first Spyro game, grabbing bounty hunters by the face and scraping them on walls while eating their parents

 

[Tree Gelbman]

i really cant wait for them to give us like any bit of information at all

At this point I could get ''Pikachu, Yoshi, Captain Falcon and Samus confirmed!" and still be all:

 

[Gestahl]

Ah yes, I remember my first Spyro game, grabbing bounty hunters by the face and scraping them on walls while eating their parents

Spyro could be ridley as a baby and then one day, he fell in a kettle with phazon and became Ridley. Its not just a theory it's a smash theory!

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Spyro could be ridley as a baby and then one day, he fell in a kettle with phazon and became Ridley. Its not just a theory it's a smash theory!

Hey bud.

There's a magical place called Youtube.com.

I think you'd be a hit there.

 

[Cosmic77]

I know that Ridley is too big to get into the roster but what if they do some crossover character like Spyro/Ridley (Spyridleyo) where Spyro has his SuperSmash as Ridley. It would certainly be a wonderful coalition!

Spyro could be ridley as a baby and then one day, he fell in a kettle with phazon and became Ridley. Its not just a theory it's a smash theory!

...I'm desperately hoping Sakurai didn't log on to Smashboards and get inspired by these ideas.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Spyro could be ridley as a baby and then one day, he fell in a kettle with phazon and became Ridley. Its not just a theory it's a smash theory!

I get the idea but honestly it's an awful one, it's such a strange compromise that both Ridley fans and Spyro fans would be unhappy with the outcome

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Spyro could be ridley as a baby and then one day, he fell in a kettle with phazon and became Ridley. Its not just a theory it's a smash theory!

Baby Ridley is already a thing though. He’s a little baby bird. I don’t like it, but that’s the canon.

 

[JustCallMeJon]

RUMORED INFO:
SMASH BALLOT REFERENCED ON THE UPCOMING GAME?

You may remember that Super Smash Bros 4 had a fighter ballot. Well, according to the reliable Source Gaming, it now appears as though the data from the Super Smash Bros ballot might be used for future Smash Bros. titles. We already know that Super Smash Bros is coming to the Nintendo Switch so no doubt some of the data collected could be used for that.

SOURCE:

TIL, the Japanese Smash Wii U/3DS Fighter Ballot has text that suggests the data may be used for future Smash Bros. titles.https://t.co/N5LqmIBqXy pic.twitter.com/EAszW66OUn

— Source Gaming (@AllSourceGaming) April 3, 2018

 

[Gestahl]

Hey bud.

There's a magical place called Youtube.com.

I think you'd be a hit there.

I'm more of a Vimeo-guy, but thanks for the cheer anyway.

 

[N3ON]

If any of you might be interested in an active poll made by our own very dormant @GiantBreadbug, I thought I'd bring it here!
https://goo.gl/forms/zNbeHgIIG56ocYVk2

Sound off if you'd like!

 

[NintenRob]

If any of you might be interested in an active poll made by our own very dormant @GiantBreadbug, I thought I'd bring it here!
https://goo.gl/forms/zNbeHgIIG56ocYVk2

Sound off if you'd like!

Kirby could do with more options.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

What newcomer characters do people see as imperative that we don't have as of Smash 4? Are there really any other than Inkling? I'm sure there's something I'm not thinking of right now, but I do feel that Inkling was really the only shoo-in as far as newcomers go for this game.

There really aren't any "imperative" characters at this point. Then again, Brawl covered all the "needed" characters. Smash 4 newcomer roster was basically the icing on the cake.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Nah, fam. Daisy is different. Her potential is there, but it's not unique potential. She has flower abilities.

And? So do tons of Pokemon characters. And they're wildly more known for their plant based abilities.

If Daisy gets in it's not gonna be for flower abilities.

It'll be for the sports abilities and that's well something of a different case, because you either have Waluigi who has been an assist trophy representing exactly just that (and Sakurai has shown he will let assist trophies get a promotion) or Peach representing the sports spin-off in her A attacks already.

Which to me screams ''Waluigi is considered the face of Mario sports spin-offs by Sakurai." and/or ''He has long deemed the sports spin-offs as something that is good with just some moves in Peach's set and an assist trophy."

I would have to agree with Sakurai in this case.

Waluigi was born from Mario sports games, and there's very few instances of him not being in Mario spin-offs. Definitely less games than there are with him in. Adding someone else to represent the same thing would rub me the wrong way.

I'd definitely love to see Waluigi get more than just sports (Wario Land & WarioWare anybody?) but I've never been able to understand Daisy. Every argument for her as playable can also be applied to Waluigi in some way aside from her appearances in SML and SMR, (which don't really give anything else to work with) but with arguably(?) less personality and visual distinction.

Of course I'm sure no one would complain if they were both added! It just seems weird how often I see Waluigi discounted in favor of Daisy.

I'd argue that this whole competition between the two to be the designated "spin-off character" is unneccesary, and probably based on the notion that Rosalina would be a "Galaxy rep"
She is not, it's her role as cosmic deity and calm and collected personality that gave her her current Galaxy-inspired moveset, along with her gimmick being that she's a puppeteer. Her role is not to be "the Galaxy character", her playstyle and personality merely took form through Galaxy elements.

There is no spot for a Villager-like character that smacks people with tennis rackets for forward air, then golf club for down air and baseball bat for back air.
There's a spot for a Mario character that can bring something new to the table, with Daisy and Waluigi being dark horses for that spot since the role of spin-offs in Smash is unclear, whereas characters like Captain Toad and Paper Mario are more conventional characters.

I admit, Daisy's potential is much less clear. She's a more conventional human character that just happens to be headstrong and energetic or whatever, whereas Waluigi is just undescribably weird in all sorts of ways, which gives him much more leeway to work with.
Waluigi doesn't really need his moveset to be unique. He could be a Bayonetta clone and his flamboyant personality would already make him stand out, just like his AT, while it is just him whacking and kicking people, already screams Waa.

Daisy's personality trait are much less lenient to make a moveset for, and does need spin-off elements to be unique.
This does absolutely not mean that she is that Villager-like character that wombo comboes the spin-off tools in a blender and whips them out at random, it means that her "glue", her "gimmick" cannot be drawn from her initiate character, but must come from a general spin-off element.

So, how do we define Daisy?
The Smash Bros. trophies generally describe her as a tomboy, but that's just straight up false.
Beyond that, there's this:
Like Peach, Daisy is a Technique player, but she has something else up her sleeve: a really powerful shot. Do you think the sedate pink and vivid orange reflect Peach and Daisy's different personalities?

She may be the princess of Sarasaland, but she doesn't exactly have the poise you might expect from royalty. Daisy is more of a headstrong, active type.

Spunky, Headstrong, active, technical and vivid.
Thanks Sakurai, that's not a lot, but you can't blame him for Daisy's less-than-unusual personality

But the core of her set is to find here, other bios only add that she's "not afraid to get her hands dirty" and "energetic"

Anyway, my preferred moveset would combine technical item play and stage control with hands-on dress brawling.
The "glue" in this would be the Superball, which would bounce around the stage and overwhelm and annoy opponents, y'know, like Daisy.
This Superball can be caught by special moves, and give opponents hitstun to give Daisy an opening.

The other part would be Daisy's Flower Power, with the main move being Flowerbed Return.
Flowerbed Return plants a garden where Daisy lands.
This garden gives the Flower-effect to everyone who is hit in it, so Daisy has to plan her combos in that area. Again, technical.

The Flowerbed Return Garden also turns the Superball in a Flowerball, that also gives a flower effect to any opponents hit in its trial.

As for normals, lunges, kicks and headbutts would work.
It'd show that Daisy does not care about her dress getting dirty

 

[N3ON]

There really aren't any "imperative" characters at this point. Then again, Brawl covered all the "needed" characters. Smash 4 newcomer roster was basically the icing on the cake.

Honestly give me the Brawl roster, throw in Inkling, and, for good measure , and that roster would feel as complete to me as the current one.

 

[Wyoming]

It's sad that I basically agree. Most of the newcomers in Smash 4 did nothing for me. and Brawl's roster does the trick for me.

 

[Delzethin]

It's much bigger than Murasame Castle, lol. All the major titles have been localized going all the way back to the original on NES (though the first few titles had to change the name due to a pen and paper rpg from the 80s also being called Dragon Quest). The games don't break records over here but they sell well enough to keep sending them over. Plus it's up to 11 mainline games and dozens of spin-offs, including previous crossovers with Nintendo.

Dragon Quest III is basically comparable to Final Fantasy VII, both in its standing among fans of the franchise and it's impact on the genre itself. The protagonist from III, Erdrick, while not quite the household name Cloud is, has an iconic armor and sword design that reappears several times throughout the franchise, and is more or less synonymous with "Dragon Quest Hero." After Square merged with Enix, the armor and sword have crossed over into a couple Final Fantasy games as easter eggs, and he's even referenced in Zelda II, where you can find a tombstone in Saria town that says "The hero Erdrick sleeps here." Just recently, the sword was prominently displayed in the marketing for Dragon Quest XI. If anybody is the "face" of the franchise, it's him.

Hm. Well, if what you say is true, I'll have to keep a side eye on Erdrick.

 

[Bebe Mignon]

RUMORED INFO:
SMASH BALLOT REFERENCED ON THE UPCOMING GAME?

You may remember that Super Smash Bros 4 had a fighter ballot. Well, according to the reliable Source Gaming, it now appears as though the data from the Super Smash Bros ballot might be used for future Smash Bros. titles. We already know that Super Smash Bros is coming to the Nintendo Switch so no doubt some of the data collected could be used for that.

SOURCE:

TIL, the Japanese Smash Wii U/3DS Fighter Ballot has text that suggests the data may be used for future Smash Bros. titles.https://t.co/N5LqmIBqXy pic.twitter.com/EAszW66OUn

— Source Gaming (@AllSourceGaming) April 3, 2018

Wasn't this already known since the ballot began? I believe Nintendo made a formal announcement regarding this, so this isn't new information.

 

[Miifighters4Smash5]

A villains discussion? I'm just in time. Mimikyu, I'm grateful is my most wanted newcomer that, leans more towards a villain

Mimikyu is NOT A villain!!! The Anime Ruined everything I loved about Mikikyu; How Sympathizable it was; How it wanted to be loved; and Turned it into a Cliche Genocidal Imp of pure evil!!

 

[NinjaMario5]

Anyone think it's Sandbag's time to shine?

 

[BluePikmin11]

TIL, the Japanese Smash Wii U/3DS Fighter Ballot has text that suggests the data may be used for future Smash Bros. titles.https://t.co/N5LqmIBqXy pic.twitter.com/EAszW66OUn

— Source Gaming (@AllSourceGaming) April 3, 2018

Just a little something posted by Source Gaming. Food for thought.

Isn't this information we have seen before?

But, after re-thinking about why people rate certain 'fan-favorite' Nintendo characters like Lyn so high in RTC and looking at this ballot tweet, I can kinda see why people feel that way. But, I am not sure if Sakurai would apply this ballot to franchises like FE and Pokemon, whose additions revolve mainly around nearby promotion. I could kinda see the possibility, when I imagine the newcomer selection being 1/3 ballot influenced. But Lyn getting in over characters like Celica or an FE Switch character, not too keen about it honestly.

What newcomer characters do people see as imperative that we don't have as of Smash 4? Are there really any other than Inkling? I'm sure there's something I'm not thinking of right now, but I do feel that Inkling was really the only shoo-in as far as newcomers go for this game.

Isabelle is an essential to me. Tom Nook too. Although he is not as heavily marketed as Isabelle, Nook is still a major staple character of the Animal Crossing series that I feel needs to be included.

Tom is among one of the few Nintendo characters whose fame and fanbase comes from his characterization of being a 'debt collector', a 'deceptively devious' 'villain' that most people love to hate and satirize. He is such a widely-know character in the gaming community, that him not being playable in Smash Switch would surprise me greatly.

 

[The Original Robot boy]

Honestly give me the Brawl roster, throw in Inkling, and, for good measure , and that roster would feel as complete to me as the current one.

You had me at

 

[New_Dumal]

I know I'm six pages late to the counter-discussion party but I want to add that counters are very underused, even into the metagame. Counters are pretty powerful against a lot of recoveries, as reverse-edeguard,and even vs landing, and to keep pressuring (after some condiotioning). While high risk/medium reward in most of cases, sometimes is reverted to medium/low risk-high reward.Imagine if Finishing Touch was a counter...oh, the dream.

I just wish that counters become more unique one from another (as you suggested) and don't turn out to be powerless (as the one from Palutena).

Some ideas:
<> I never understood why Marth's counter don't have a tipper. It should.
<> Ike's counter should give always fixed 25% damage but weak knockback.
<>Corrin counter should extend the length of countering after the first hit, being able to counter multiple attacks one after another.
<>Shulk's counter should rewind the opponent (with position) giving you some frame advantage, but no damage/knockback
<> Palutena counter should give a weak spike knockback

 

[Lukingordex]

Hey bud.

There's a magical place called Youtube.com.

I think you'd be a hit there.

Either he's trolling or his calendar is 2 days late and he thinks april fools is today

 

[Pakky]

Does anyone actually want Undertale in smash?

I'd rather anything else like popular waifus but...\

He's back BABY

 

[Spazzy_D]

Hm. Well, if what you say is true, I'll have to keep a side eye on Erdrick.

Sure, when Vaan says all this about Erdrick you listen, but when I say the same thing in Discord you ignore me. #salty

So hey Smashboards, what sort of fresh topics are we.... oh, Ridley talk.

Carry on.

 

[Crap-Zapper]

My Wanted Villains:
- (Pig) Ganon
- Hades
- Black Shadow (taking Ganondorf's moveset.)
- Ridley and/or Sylux
- Porky Minch
- King K. Rool

Other than that, SMH, the list is great, and I guess I should be happy hearing someone wanted another F-Zero character, but still at the wrong cost.

Continue that list;

- Samurai Goroh.
- Masked Man.
- Dr. Coyle.
- Medeus (Fire Emblem)
- Wolf O'Donell.
- Kamek.
- Medusa.

At least some of them I could think of that I would not mind at all.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Isn't this information we have seen before?

Source Gaming translated that 2 years ago. We are sharing it again since it came to our attention that people either didn't know or have already forgotten it was a thing.

Also, while I'm here, please make sure to participate in the latest Mega Smash Poll we are running:

https://sourcegaming.info/2018/03/28/vote-in-the-mega-smash-poll-switch-version/

 

[TheMagicalKuja]

There is always something you can do. Have you ever played the insect glaive in Monster hunter? You could make some stat boosting mechanic like that if you wanted to. My big thing is that I really dont want Decidueye. I want something thats new and feels fresh. I also like the smaller pokemon. Also, Mythics always end up in the top 50 for popularity polls. So you know thats not a concern and we dont have a mythic on the roster yet. It seems like a cooler idea than filling out the "starter elements" which has already been done.

Nope, never seen it. It might be why I'm having a time imagining it... though it seems that Spectral Thief would probably gel as a command grab.

I also kinda agree that there's far too much in the way of the "cool" pokes (Charizard, Lucario, Greninja, and Mewtwo) and only Pika/Jiggs look "cute". Mimikyuu is pretty popular, but Marshadow might strike that balance too. I can agree with you there.

 

[Deleted member]

Anyone think it's Sandbag's time to shine?

No.
The whole "Sandbag" fighter thing is honestly a joke.
Let Sandbag be a punching bag, the whole Sandbag fighter thing is getting old.

 

[TylerBlackRunIt]

I'm bored so here is my updated wish roster

Returning Character
----------------------------------
Ice Climbers
Wolf
Snake

Newcomers
---------------------
Monster Hunter
Karate Joe
Rayman
King K. Rool
Paper Mario
Dixie Kong
Spring Man (Ribbon Girl as a alt skin)
Crash Bandicoot
Takamaru
Travis Touchdown
Bomberman (Konami)
Jibanyan (Yokai Watch)
Professor Layton
Rex & Pyra/Mythra
Ryu Hayabusa (Ninja Gaiden/Koei Tecmo)
Captain Toad (Toadette as a alt skin)
Bandana Waddle Dee
Simon Belmont (Castlevania/Konami)
Excitebiker
Lip (Panel De Pon/Puzzle League)
Ridley
Generation 8 Pokemon (Pokemon Switch)
New Fire Emblem Character (Fire Emblem Switch)

*Dark Pit now use the Dark Pit Staff instead of the Silver Bow
*Rex can switch blades from Pyra to Mythra during battle (Pyra/Mythra will be in the background similar to the pokemon trainer but more useful)

 

[Crap-Zapper]

TylerBlackRunIt

I see:
- King K. Rool.
- Bandana Waddle Dee.
- Chibi-Robo.
- Lip.
- Crash Bandicoot.

This is a fantastic roster.

Still, I'm more Balloon Fighter over Excitebiker, but I know EB is somewhat popular so I get it.

 

[Superyoshiom]

If Sakurai would only look at the Smash ballot results for Japan for the next game, I'd be so happy. There isn't a single choice here that pains me:

The thing with this list is that Bayonetta is listed so low on this list, which means that US and Europe probably had her near the top, and Sakurai barely took the Japanese into account for once. So even though characters people have been wanting such as K. Rool Wolf, Bandanna Waddle Dee, Geno, Ashley, Dixie Kong, and Isaac, were all more popular in Japan, they must have been massively outclasses by characters like Bayonetta in the US and Europe, but moreover I believe they were outclasses by meme characters like Goku and Steve from minecraft.

Now this could go either two ways:

1) The one realizable character from EU and NA has been exhausted, meaning next in line for a slot would be K. Rool, Wolf, and Waddle Dee. Inkling was on this list and is in the game, so it's definitely a possiblity.

2) Instead of looking to Japan for reference, Sakurai continues catering to the Western territories, going through and adding characters from games like Minecraft.

Either way, the way I see it, it is very unlikely at this point that K. Rool is not in the next Smash. He outright won the ballot and got a Mii costume. I actually believe the only reason we didn't see him is because Bayonetta won in Europe and was probably second in the US to Goku.

 

[Opossum]

Does anyone actually want Undertale in smash?

I'd rather anything else like popular waifus but...\

He's back BABY

Yeah, I'd personally love to see Undertale content in Smash, especially the music.

 

[Spazzy_D]

If Sakurai would only look at the Smash ballot results for Japan for the next game, I'd be so happy. There isn't a single choice here that pains me:

The thing with this list is that Bayonetta is listed so low on this list, which means that US and Europe probably had her near the top, and Sakurai barely took the Japanese into account for once. So even though characters people have been wanting such as K. Rool Wolf, Bandanna Waddle Dee, Geno, Ashley, Dixie Kong, and Isaac, were all more popular in Japan, they must have been massively outclasses by characters like Bayonetta in the US and Europe, but moreover I believe they were outclasses by meme characters like Goku and Steve from minecraft.

Now this could go either two ways:

1) The one realizable character from EU and NA has been exhausted, meaning next in line for a slot would be K. Rool, Wolf, and Waddle Dee. Inkling was on this list and is in the game, so it's definitely a possiblity.

2) Instead of looking to Japan for reference, Sakurai continues catering to the Western territories, going through and adding characters from games like Minecraft.

Either way, the way I see it, it is very unlikely at this point that K. Rool is not in the next Smash. He outright won the ballot and got a Mii costume. I actually believe the only reason we didn't see him is because Bayonetta won in Europe and was probably second in the US to Goku.

First things first, that is good data but it was taken with Smash fans in mind. The actual ballot, world wide, was likely far different than most online polling would suggest.

Second of all... Minecraft is fairly popular and heavily associated with Nintendo in Japan. Sorry to burst your bubble.

http://www.techtimes.com/articles/129504/20160201/minecraft-dominates-japan-wii-u-eshop.htm

 

[Curious Villager]

Mimikyu is NOT A villain!!! The Anime Ruined everything I loved about Mikikyu; How Sympathizable it was; How it wanted to be loved; and Turned it into a Cliche Genocidal Imp of pure evil!!

Really? I think I actually prefer anime Mimikyu, game Mimikyu felt too much like Gamefreak was trying too hard to give Pikachu his own "I live in the popular guy's shadow" Luigi equivalent. Even though Raichu already exists....

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Given that the Smash Ballot stated that the ballot is specifically for video game characters only, any votes for Goku would have already been discarded. The top results for the Smash Ballot won't by default include characters that didn't even originate from video games.

Steve has a more probable chance of topping the Ballot in terms of requests by virtue of the fact that votes for him would still be treated the same as any other video game character.