aloeknight47
Smash Rookie
Introduction
I'm a Canadian Ice Climber's player who goes by Eidolon. A few months ago I was messing around with various IC's tech in the lab and I came across an interesting attribute of the Ice Climber's synced smash turn. Well this isn't necessarily true, this property was previously outlined in Exarch's "Guide to Desyncing: treating your opponents more coldly" here on SB, where it was explained as follows:
This desync never held any weight, as it provides little advantage, and is far to slow to be used as a "setup" desync. However, the same desync can be performed with the C-stick.
Which produces this effect: https://gfycat.com/FarOffbeatHawaiianmonkseal
I haven't seen such a technique used or even so much as mentioned, so I assume its not yet discovered. We'll simply name it the Smash Turn Desync, referred to as the ST desync.
The Desync
First, how does this work? Inputing a smash turn causes Popo to go into his dash, before Nana's direction queue updates she is in a forward dash, during which you are able to give a c-stick input and cause her to just smash instead. NOTE: Nana can ONLY forward smash, up or down smash will not be received, but we can FSmash in-front or behind. Smashing too early will cause Popo to pivot>Fsmash, resulting in both climbers doing a standing smash, and smashing too late will miss Nana's actionable window, resulting in both climbers dashing. However, this is an easy widow to hit with a bit of practice.
The ST desync is a "non-buffer", "nana-first" type desync... What, so i'm not allowed to make up my own terminology? Ok fine, let's get into it.
First, this desync makes Nana move first. This isn't necessarily a pro or a con, but it changes our options. For example, ST desync is not a good option for setting up a Nanapult, which would require another Popo action after ST. However, leaving Popo actionable gives us some more interesting options, covered below.
Second, the ST desync doesn't utilize buffering, like a roll desync, but it takes advantage of Nana's lack of ability to pivot. This means that there is no delay (like waiting for a spotdodge) before our action. Secondly, and more importantly, unlike guard desync POPO IS ACTIONABLE IMMEDIATELY. This is the crux of the ST desync: speed.
What does this mean? ST desync can desync the climbers in LESS THAN 6 frames. And furthermore, it can be performed from standing, or out of a wavedash! The only other desync with these properties is a pivot, ST desync gives us the same properties without the technical difficulty (and we don't have to deal with nana's solo movement options).
Application
General Use : The Ice Climbers FSmash alone is a great move, essentially its a mini Marth Tipper. However, like most smashes, it has high end lag and is punishable. No longer! In any situation where you would synced FSmash, now we can ST desync. While Nana is throwing out a potentially punishable FSmash, Popo can be just behind her, waiting to counterattack anyone who goes in for a hit.
Wait, we're inventing tech? Doesn't that mean I'm allowed to make up silly names? Points to whoever gets my naming conventions.
Contingency (ST desync > DashDance) : Option selects! Being able to so quickly split up the climbers means we can quickly cover multiple options, specifically when tech chasing. When your opponent hits the ground, wavedash towards them and ST desync > DashDance. Nana's forward smash can cover Tech in-place, and Popo can be ready to cover the (more reactable) tech roll. While this isn't as optimal as reading tech in place for a grab, it removes the need for the read, or quick reaction.
Mislead (ST desync > Runnnn) : The simplest application, but has proven incredibly effective in my few months of play-testing. This works especially well against PEACH and PUFF. While Nana stands still in FSmash windup, Popo runs and draws your opponents eyes away for just enough time to leave them vulnerable to Nana's impending attack. Not recommended for regular use as you are intentionally splitting up yourself, however leaving Nana behind may be useful for baiting.
Ward (ST desync > Shieldstop) : Can be performed from back-side ST desync, or front-side ST desync > dash back. You're shielding and attacking at the same time, what more do you want??
https://gfycat.com/GeneralNastyGuillemot
Binding (ST desync > Grab) : Affectionately known as the "Instant Fly-trap". While it doesn't share the DI trap properties of its namesake, it IS a true combo into grab. Whether your FSmash hits a shield or not a grab is still guaranteed.
https://gfycat.com/AromaticRareKittiwake
Binding variant : Raise Dead. Discovered while practicing hand-offs on dummys, normally knocked down opponents cannot be grabbed, this makes IC's players sad. But we CAN grab them from hitstun. (NOTE: In most cases jab reset is preferred, however this just looks cool)
https://gfycat.com/GiddyWeakFrenchbulldog
Wall of Force (ST desync > pivot USmash) : Still keen on pivoting? Pivot Usmash (or Fsmash in the other direction, if you need to guard from both sides, for whatever reason) allows the climbers to instantly perform TWO different smashes simultaneously. While this was possible before, keep in mind there is no setup required, this is immediate!
https://gfycat.com/InbornForcefulAnt
Freedom of Movement (ST desync > jump > aerial) : The few frames of startup on Nana's FSmash gives us some time to get airborne and cover area above while she covers in front. Good for covering high/low recoveries.
https://gfycat.com/BoringWiltedAmazondolphin
True Strike (ST desync > dash jump > aerial) : **My favourite technique** When the opponent is hit by Nana's FSmash Popo can preemptively move in for a followup. At high percentages this leads into tech-chase. But, at low percentages this TRUE COMBOS INTO ANY AERIAL. NOTE This can be done optionally out of a wavedash, with a front-side or back-side ST desync, and with any aerial! Shown below is a back-side ST desync > Fair.
https://gfycat.com/SphericalSelfreliantKomododragon
GET DUNKED
Extended desyncs : The speed of the ST desync allows us to quickly drop Nana off, take an action with Popo, and have Nana ready to cover us with a followup. Here's one example i've found: ST desync (whiffed) > SHFFL Fair > Nana Dash (this input is necessary) > L-cancel + Nana Grab. NOTE The last Z input L-cancel's for Popo and grabs with Nana.
https://gfycat.com/BlackUnimportantCatfish
(Mind the execution, Dolphin is weird)
Conclusion
Situational.
I'm a Canadian Ice Climber's player who goes by Eidolon. A few months ago I was messing around with various IC's tech in the lab and I came across an interesting attribute of the Ice Climber's synced smash turn. Well this isn't necessarily true, this property was previously outlined in Exarch's "Guide to Desyncing: treating your opponents more coldly" here on SB, where it was explained as follows:
Which produces this effect: https://gfycat.com/PlayfulNiftyFlycatcher
This desync never held any weight, as it provides little advantage, and is far to slow to be used as a "setup" desync. However, the same desync can be performed with the C-stick.
Which produces this effect: https://gfycat.com/FarOffbeatHawaiianmonkseal
I haven't seen such a technique used or even so much as mentioned, so I assume its not yet discovered. We'll simply name it the Smash Turn Desync, referred to as the ST desync.
The Desync
First, how does this work? Inputing a smash turn causes Popo to go into his dash, before Nana's direction queue updates she is in a forward dash, during which you are able to give a c-stick input and cause her to just smash instead. NOTE: Nana can ONLY forward smash, up or down smash will not be received, but we can FSmash in-front or behind. Smashing too early will cause Popo to pivot>Fsmash, resulting in both climbers doing a standing smash, and smashing too late will miss Nana's actionable window, resulting in both climbers dashing. However, this is an easy widow to hit with a bit of practice.
The ST desync is a "non-buffer", "nana-first" type desync... What, so i'm not allowed to make up my own terminology? Ok fine, let's get into it.
First, this desync makes Nana move first. This isn't necessarily a pro or a con, but it changes our options. For example, ST desync is not a good option for setting up a Nanapult, which would require another Popo action after ST. However, leaving Popo actionable gives us some more interesting options, covered below.
Second, the ST desync doesn't utilize buffering, like a roll desync, but it takes advantage of Nana's lack of ability to pivot. This means that there is no delay (like waiting for a spotdodge) before our action. Secondly, and more importantly, unlike guard desync POPO IS ACTIONABLE IMMEDIATELY. This is the crux of the ST desync: speed.
What does this mean? ST desync can desync the climbers in LESS THAN 6 frames. And furthermore, it can be performed from standing, or out of a wavedash! The only other desync with these properties is a pivot, ST desync gives us the same properties without the technical difficulty (and we don't have to deal with nana's solo movement options).
Application
General Use : The Ice Climbers FSmash alone is a great move, essentially its a mini Marth Tipper. However, like most smashes, it has high end lag and is punishable. No longer! In any situation where you would synced FSmash, now we can ST desync. While Nana is throwing out a potentially punishable FSmash, Popo can be just behind her, waiting to counterattack anyone who goes in for a hit.
Wait, we're inventing tech? Doesn't that mean I'm allowed to make up silly names? Points to whoever gets my naming conventions.
Contingency (ST desync > DashDance) : Option selects! Being able to so quickly split up the climbers means we can quickly cover multiple options, specifically when tech chasing. When your opponent hits the ground, wavedash towards them and ST desync > DashDance. Nana's forward smash can cover Tech in-place, and Popo can be ready to cover the (more reactable) tech roll. While this isn't as optimal as reading tech in place for a grab, it removes the need for the read, or quick reaction.
Mislead (ST desync > Runnnn) : The simplest application, but has proven incredibly effective in my few months of play-testing. This works especially well against PEACH and PUFF. While Nana stands still in FSmash windup, Popo runs and draws your opponents eyes away for just enough time to leave them vulnerable to Nana's impending attack. Not recommended for regular use as you are intentionally splitting up yourself, however leaving Nana behind may be useful for baiting.
Ward (ST desync > Shieldstop) : Can be performed from back-side ST desync, or front-side ST desync > dash back. You're shielding and attacking at the same time, what more do you want??
https://gfycat.com/GeneralNastyGuillemot
Binding (ST desync > Grab) : Affectionately known as the "Instant Fly-trap". While it doesn't share the DI trap properties of its namesake, it IS a true combo into grab. Whether your FSmash hits a shield or not a grab is still guaranteed.
https://gfycat.com/AromaticRareKittiwake
Binding variant : Raise Dead. Discovered while practicing hand-offs on dummys, normally knocked down opponents cannot be grabbed, this makes IC's players sad. But we CAN grab them from hitstun. (NOTE: In most cases jab reset is preferred, however this just looks cool)
https://gfycat.com/GiddyWeakFrenchbulldog
Wall of Force (ST desync > pivot USmash) : Still keen on pivoting? Pivot Usmash (or Fsmash in the other direction, if you need to guard from both sides, for whatever reason) allows the climbers to instantly perform TWO different smashes simultaneously. While this was possible before, keep in mind there is no setup required, this is immediate!
https://gfycat.com/InbornForcefulAnt
Freedom of Movement (ST desync > jump > aerial) : The few frames of startup on Nana's FSmash gives us some time to get airborne and cover area above while she covers in front. Good for covering high/low recoveries.
https://gfycat.com/BoringWiltedAmazondolphin
True Strike (ST desync > dash jump > aerial) : **My favourite technique** When the opponent is hit by Nana's FSmash Popo can preemptively move in for a followup. At high percentages this leads into tech-chase. But, at low percentages this TRUE COMBOS INTO ANY AERIAL. NOTE This can be done optionally out of a wavedash, with a front-side or back-side ST desync, and with any aerial! Shown below is a back-side ST desync > Fair.
https://gfycat.com/SphericalSelfreliantKomododragon
Extended desyncs : The speed of the ST desync allows us to quickly drop Nana off, take an action with Popo, and have Nana ready to cover us with a followup. Here's one example i've found: ST desync (whiffed) > SHFFL Fair > Nana Dash (this input is necessary) > L-cancel + Nana Grab. NOTE The last Z input L-cancel's for Popo and grabs with Nana.
https://gfycat.com/BlackUnimportantCatfish
Conclusion
Situational.
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