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Smash Bros. Canon Tournament! (Mario Vs. ????) - 06/14/10

BSP

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I'd like to make a correction to something here. Although Ike's my favorite brawler and such, your reasoning behind his victories is completely false. Ike CAN be hurt by weapons not blessed by Ashera. The one who can't is the Black Knight, not Ike. Also that was only the Black Knights armor anyway not even him. In the end game when you receive Ragnell to fight Ashera, any enemy can hurt Ike. HOWEVER I would like to add that we can take Skills into account such as Aether which heals himself the damage he inflicts, resolve which raises his stats when low on health, Wrath which adds 50% to his crit when low on health. Also Nihil which completely nullifies enemy's combat related skills which I feel would be pretty important here.

Just thought I'd mention that
This is really going back, but no one ever responded to this.

So if Ike really isn't invincible to everything besides the blessed weapons, wouldn't sonic own him?

And if stalling just to survive is now considered a loss, kirby loses to sonic. He has to go to stone, or he gets owned by super sonic. Kirby can't defend himself from a time stop either.

And current match, Luigi loses. He has to work insanely hard just to survive against samus.
 

Ray_Kalm

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Eh.

Ike's not losing to anyone. Those enemies who were able to hurt Ike all had weapons blessed by Ashera, basically everyone Ike fought after being blessed were also blessed.
 

missingnomaster

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Ike is losing to Ganondorf, but that's another matchup. Or at least a draw.

And I guess a time stop would be trouble for Kirby, though he can stay pretty high in the air with a warp star.
 

REL38

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Ike is losing to Ganondorf, but that's another matchup. Or at least a draw.

And I guess a time stop would be trouble for Kirby, though he can stay pretty high in the air with a warp star.
I see Kirby stalling to time out Super Sonic (16-some minutes), but abandoning Stone/Metal Hat to attack normal Sonic.

Candy Pops, Warp Star and Attack Ability could be used to attack.


On the matter at hand, Luigi has nothing to defend against Samus.
Unless Luigi has something to protect himself long enough to use a Stopwatch, he ain't doing much anything.
 

Joeadok

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Luigi has the starman for invinciblity plus ohko, and the music box from smb3, which puts all enemies on the map to sleep for a stage worth of time. These should let him beat Samus or at least buy time to use the stopwatch or something.
 

Diddy Kong

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Ike is losing to Ganondorf, but that's another matchup. Or at least a draw.

And I guess a time stop would be trouble for Kirby, though he can stay pretty high in the air with a warp star.
Ike is actually one of the few characters who's able to beat Ganondorf. So I'd like to see him do so. Aether would do nice damage against Ganondorf, as would other skills like Wrath and stuff. But then again, Ike's low resistance would make it really hard for him against Ganon's magic.

There are still lots of characters that could beat Ike though. He'd lose to Pit for example, Marth and Roy can hurt him as well (though they both suck), Link would probably beat Ike cause the Master Sword is deffinatly blessed thus so would Young Link and Toon Link.

Lol... I see Donkey Kong even doing damage against Ike. He could be categorized as a Laguz King, because "Donkey Kong" is a title, not a name. It's the name given to the ruler of DK Isle, which was Cranky Kong before Donkey Kong Jr. (current DK). But yeah, that's another story. :p
 

Rkey

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Luigi has the starman for invinciblity plus ohko, and the music box from smb3, which puts all enemies on the map to sleep for a stage worth of time. These should let him beat Samus or at least buy time to use the stopwatch or something.
He might have those things, yes, but don't forget how FAT samus is, she has a LOAD of energy tanks and reserve tanks. And also her superhuman technology of destruction plays a part.

But this is indeed an issue, is luigi allowed to equip himself with a limitless inventory? If so, he stays invulnerable forever o.O
 

Diddy Kong

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Nah, Luigi gets all items he can have in his games with the applied limits of said game. So if he wants the Mega Mushroom from New Super Mario Bros. DS, he can get only 1.

Samus' reserve tanks make her stay alive. If she's hit by a jump from Mega Luigi, her reserve tanks will help her stay alive, if she even needs them that's it but seeing as Bowser gets OHKO'd by Mega Mario & Luigi you can't be sure.

Now, if the Mega Mushroom runs out and Luigi uses the Starman, Samus can easily avoid him with the Screw Attack. Though... the Super Jump from Super Paper Mario probably would by pass the Screw Attack's invincibility, especially if Luigi's invincible himself.

Most likely, Samus would then need to use Crystal Flash which'd restore her health completely. IF ofcoarse she'd survive Luigi's Super Jump. Luigi's Super Jump is like... Super Awesome, and it's just as strong as Bowser's regular attacks in SPM. Would 4 Energy Tanks be enough??

Luigi might very well win this!
 

_clinton

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Prove it.
Ok…please explain to me why running at supersonic speed makes you invincible? I mean by definition itself…Supersonic speed itself only means that something is moving faster than the speed of sound not something that is impervious to harm…but whatever…Samus has only taken down foes that have speed booster power as well...

Of course…if you really don’t think it’s game mechs…then you should realize that Samus gets hurt by contact damage…and like I said before…

The speed booster only removes that part of the game mechs when Samus is running…

The Super Metroid Instruction Booklet says she's invincible when she uses the Speed Booster. Who am I going to believe?
Yeah…again…two/three of them give more info than the SNES one and they only say she is running at supersonic speed…when something is moving at supersonic speed…it makes a sonic boom

What's a sonic boom? If you're saying that "invincible" means "sonic boom" in this context, you'll have to provide proof.
Ok…You know how when Samus enters “speed booster” mode a loud noise is made? That is what happens when you reach supersonic speed…you create a Sonic boom…

When an object passes through the air, it creates a series of pressure waves in front of it and behind it, similar to the bow and stern waves created by a boat.

These waves travel at the speed of sound, and as the speed of the object increases, the waves are forced together, or compressed, because they cannot "get out of the way" of each other, eventually merging into a shock wave at the speed of sound.

It’s thus...a shock wave that breaks through things + protects her from contact from foes...

The noise Samus’ speed makes while using speed booster:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MIvhLSrYVk

Metroid Zero Mission got better with making it right...they added in a said wave:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agEzlcKMklA&feature=related

It doesn't say she's invincible, but that's beside the point, because Super Metroid isn't any less credible or canonical. I don't care if two of the three games with the Speed Booster do not mention "invincible." That's an argument from silence.
Super Metroid isn’t any less credible or canonical for events that happen…however Metroid Fusion and Metroid: Zero Mission where made after Super Metroid was and as such have more updated info on said equipment…I’ll take what they say about the speed booster before I take what Super Metroid says…thank you

Explain what these three things are and what they do. I tried looking up these on Google, and I'm not getting anything.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YyF_...0C62A2C1&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=39

Lol at "me lacking reading comprehension". I think it's fairly good, considering I usually only skim posts and english is only my secondary language.
Meh…fair enough I may have over reacted to your reply…sorry

Unless you're the one lacking in reading comprehension here, you should understand that this topic thread title is "true to their games". Anime =/= game, just as pokemon anime (which is more accurate btw) =/= pokemon games and thus irrelevant in this discussion by default. It has been so as early as from the earlier thread that preceded this.
I’m aware the thread is “true to their games” but like I said before…when games come out that are based off an anime…they are a bit different than an anime that comes out that is based off games…you see that is the point I’m trying to make with F-Zero…there are things that come out for the series that aren’t part of the game in full…but they explain some things that happen in the game…

Like that comic in the F-Zero instruction book…that actually gives some info on C. Falcon…far more than the games do by themselves…

Also…the Pokemon anime is hardly more accurate IMO…Ash and his Uberchu for whatever reason seem to drop down to level 1 whenever they enter a new land…

The Pork 'n' Beans, Saturn Cruiser and Coffee Table are all vehicles. Samus can just get on her spaceship and shoot missiles at 'em, carpet bomb 'em, or fly over them and grapple... From what I saw with all 3 of them, they does nothing but run and fly.

If Ness and Lucas are the only ones with vehicles, then Samus can just Speed Boost until either they run out of gas, or Samus gets bored and just rams 'em.
I never said Ness and Lucas where the only characters who could use vehicles…I’m just looking at the thread rules…oh and how is Samus going to carpet bomb them with her ship? For Lucas 2/3 of them can fly! Plus Ness can fly in his as well…Plus there is no in game evidence that they can get hurt while in them and if they run someone down…they die w/o any issue (see what I’m doing with this…it’s the same thing people are saying with Samus’ speed booster…how about that?)

Also…the Pork n’ Beans is the only vehicle in the series that has a charge…none of the others do…

Another thing I would like to point out is that when you complete the Story Mode in F-Zero GX, when the credits are playing, the person singing does bring up "Falcon Punch." So, while it is never shown, I'd say it is implied that Falcon can use a Falcon Punch.
Thank you…

Well, counting the F Zero anime which may, or may not relate as much to the actual game series as Pokemon does would just be.. unfair. Using the anime for Pokemon would solve... a lot of problems.
Ground type pokemon aren’t hurt by electric moves…yeah that is if anything a game mech IMO but whatever…and again…the F-Zero anime does count towards the games…the anime came 1st…then the games came…but whatever

Do you get it...do you get the order I'm going on with:

F-Zero Anime...than games based off anime

But for Pokemon...

Games...than Anime based off games...

It would also basically place Mewtwo much higher than ingame Mewtwo. Yet Mewtwo supporters like me agree with that. Why can't you accept the things for what they are? Like Lucas not getting ZOMGAPOLOCLYPSE
Lucas has the dragon’s power for his in game ability…that is why I don’t accept it…the dragon’s power by itself works the same way that many of the other “god level” skills do…and actually has a reference to something from an earlier game (The power of the earth is what I mean...that was absorbed into Ness and it became his...so why when a power that is also the power of the earth and shows proof that it is absorbed into the person using it...not be useable?)

And again...Lucas and Ness have more rights to his power than what Link, Ganondorf, Zelda, or Bowser do to their's...for one...They are actually linked to it...

Ganondorf, Link, and Zelda are just "the 1st ones" there...and that is why they can use their's

And Bowser just robbed his...so it isn't even his...

and PK Time & Space Controlz.
This is what I mean by people not getting my post’s point when I see things like PK Time & Space controlz…

Psychic powers are formed by the controlling of matter…something like PK Fire is for example done by speeding up atom vibrations…or at least that is how you would think it is done…

The atom is a basic unit of matter…
The term matter traditionally refers to the substance that all objects are made of…

If you look at pretty much any psychic power...you should see that they are all formed by the control over matter...

Ness/Lucas being as powerful as they are with their PK (as in masters as seen with their descriptions) should be more than enough proof that they wouldn't be affected by the "fake" control over it (such as Bowser for example using a stop watch...that may be in his power still...but it is the stop watch's power...not his) compared to their real control...

He lost cause his car / racemachine thing exploded by Orange Grenades. Even steriods won't help you from getting killed from explosions.
lol...Yes…because a series that made someone the "poster boy" (as in champ) for a group of superheroes, supervillains, cyborgs, mutants, and aliens…is going to die from an explosive citrus…

I mean…I like how you think Falcon is going to lose his car from said orange as well…the thing is moving around at speeds that beat the speed of sound…and is prepped to deal with crashing at those speeds

In order for something to even go that fast it’s going to have to withstand the pressure from those speeds in the 1st place…

F Zero's message to the kidz: "It's OK to use steriods, drive your car too fast and too loud, go to hell and challenge God to a race! :) "
I find your view of the F-Zero games being stupid funny…like 90% of the things that happen in that series is just not something I would take seriously (Falcon saves the universe + a baby from a train all in a single day)

I mean it’s hardly the only series in this topic that is like that… do you think a monkey throwing an explosive orange is suppose to be serious then? Really…like 90% of the stuff that happens in the DK canon is silly in general as well…and I wouldn’t take it seriously…

Hell…with Mother…
your next door neighbor turns out to be a greater evil than a universal cosmic destroyer that has free range over space and time…

And Mario…well...
I hate this picture I'm showing...before I made this post...I spend like an hour trying to find a comic which had Mario dressed in his bee suit and had him calling Earthbound a weird game...I couldn't find it though...so you get this stupid picture instead
:
http://thenintendo.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/09043011506_1.jpg

The video game series itself takes place in the year 2560, GX is roughly estimated around 2571 and Maximum Velocity is 25 year later after the first F-Zero game. Anyway, my point is is that F-Zero: Falcon Densetsu isn't canonical at all, though they do have most facts in that game that'd work with the video game series.
Again…The games that came out after the anime are all based off the anime…they are seen as a reboot of the series…
http://fzero.wikia.com/wiki/F-Zero:_GP_Legend_(video_game)
http://fzero.wikia.com/wiki/F-Zero_Climax

This is the order on how the F-Zero games came out…
• F-Zero
• F-Zero X
• F-Zero MV
• F-Zero GX
• F-Zero AX
• F-Zero: GP Legend
• F-Zero Climax

I’m getting kind of sick about this chat anyway when my only reason for bringing up the anime/certain comics in general was just to point out that Falcon can fight…but…just looking at the other racers for the series and the fact that Falcon is “champ” among them should be proof that he can fight IMO…so...oh well...
 

_clinton

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Oh and as far as the current match goes...I'm like shocked no one has brought up a stop watch yet...
 

Crystanium

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_clinton, I cannot reply to you, because I won't be here all day. I'm going to be gone for another two weeks and four days, so if I replied, you would reply, and I wouldn't get to reply back to you, so for now I cannot reply.

By the way, I already knew what a sonic boom was. I just failed to see how "invincible" means "sonic boom." It just does not work.

"These boots allow Samus to run at a super high speed and make her invincible as she runs through enemies."

Taking that information and replacing "invincible" with "sonic boom" is silly.

"These boots allow Samus to run at a super high speed and makes her sonic boom as she runs through enemies."

"Invincible" is not synonymous with "sonic boom." If she didn't become invincible, it should just have said, "These boots allow Samus to run at supersonic speeds as she runs through her enemies."
 

Diddy Kong

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I’m aware the thread is “true to their games” but like I said before…when games come out that are based off an anime…they are a bit different than an anime that comes out that is based off games…you see that is the point I’m trying to make with F-Zero…there are things that come out for the series that aren’t part of the game in full…but they explain some things that happen in the game…
That's okay, but C.Falcon can only use things he uses in the games he's in.

Which isn't all that bad... seeing as the Blue Falcon is much better offence than anything else you would have... =/ Hence why it's Falcon's Final Smash in Brawl.

Like that comic in the F-Zero instruction book…that actually gives some info on C. Falcon…far more than the games do by themselves…
Famous bounty hunter or not, there are cutscenes in F Zero GCN and there Falcon didn't fight either. Thus, Falcon doesn't get the Falcon Punch from the anime. Or other things besides his Blue Falcon.

Also…the Pokemon anime is hardly more accurate IMO…Ash and his Uberchu for whatever reason seem to drop down to level 1 whenever they enter a new land…
Well... yeah that's true indeed. I always wondered why Pikachu became so sucky everytime Ash entered a new continent. =/ Charizard stayed awesome though everytime.

I never said Ness and Lucas where the only characters who could use vehicles…I’m just looking at the thread rules…oh and how is Samus going to carpet bomb them with her ship? For Lucas 2/3 of them can fly! Plus Ness can fly in his as well…Plus there is no in game evidence that they can get hurt while in them and if they run someone down…they die w/o any issue (see what I’m doing with this…it’s the same thing people are saying with Samus’ speed booster…how about that?)
Speed Booster is an actual ability of Samus, the verhiles Ness and Lucas ride in aren't. They are just there. That they run down and kill enemies in Mother 3 might probably be a game mechanic, cause it'd be hard to fight while on those verhiles, and it'd slow you down.

While we're at it... Can the Kongs get their animal buddies then?

Thank you…
Falcon Punch or not, most likely the Blue Falcon is a better way of attacking.

Ground type pokemon aren’t hurt by electric moves…yeah that is if anything a game mech IMO but whatever…and again…the F-Zero anime does count towards the games…the anime came 1st…then the games came…but whatever

Do you get it...do you get the order I'm going on with:

F-Zero Anime...than games based off anime

But for Pokemon...

Games...than Anime based off games...
Anime based of games would still reflect the games a lot wouldn't you think? But we aren't counting anime, comics, news paper articles or anything. Just games.

Lucas has the dragon’s power for his in game ability…that is why I don’t accept it…the dragon’s power by itself works the same way that many of the other “god level” skills do…and actually has a reference to something from an earlier game (The power of the earth is what I mean...that was absorbed into Ness and it became his...so why when a power that is also the power of the earth and shows proof that it is absorbed into the person using it...not be useable?)
Lucas is just screwed by his game's bad ending. I'll leave it at that.

And again...Lucas and Ness have more rights to his power than what Link, Ganondorf, Zelda, or Bowser do to their's...for one...They are actually linked to it...
The Triforce of Courage is Link's birthright in TP. Same goes for Zelda in most cases. Ganondorf got his Triforce of Power in OoT, and kept it in TP and WW. It never left him ever since he got in the Sacred Realm. Ganondorf clearly has all rights to have his Triforce of Power, it's what made him that powerful throughout all the Zelda games. <_<

Same for Link, but he and Zelda can still be defeated by normal means so nothing to worry about there.

Ganondorf, Link, and Zelda are just "the 1st ones" there...and that is why they can use their's
Would be the same logic as if Lucas got an older brother, he and Claus would be pretty useless in Mother 3...

And Bowser just robbed his...so it isn't even his...
Robbed means he still has it, he actually robbed it himself. It's part of the game plot, so yes Bowser should get it therefore.

That he loses it in the end is a better arguement here.

This is what I mean by people not getting my post’s point when I see things like PK Time & Space controlz…
I was just fooling you there, don't take it too serious. I know why you think "PKTIME&SPACECONTROLZ" it's cause the enemies in Mother come from a different time, and Ness and Lucas beat them therefore you assume Ness and Lucas have control over it, while space and time control aren't mentioned in any fight in both games, neither on the overworld map except the teleporting of the Starmen.

There is a clock enemy in Earthbound who does stop the time though. But for the rest, no mention... only that Giygas send them, Giygas might very well be the reason why they travel through space and time. He probably has send them.

I'm not wanting to discuss it much further, but no. Lucas and Ness shouldn't get time and space control cause of your assumption. There's just not enough effidence, and there's again... no PK Time Control or PK Space Control.

Psychic powers are formed by the controlling of matter…something like PK Fire is for example done by speeding up atom vibrations…or at least that is how you would think it is done…

The atom is a basic unit of matter…
The term matter traditionally refers to the substance that all objects are made of…

If you look at pretty much any psychic power...you should see that they are all formed by the control over matter...
You might very well be right here.

Ness/Lucas being as powerful as they are with their PK (as in masters as seen with their descriptions) should be more than enough proof that they wouldn't be affected by the "fake" control over it (such as Bowser for example using a stop watch...that may be in his power still...but it is the stop watch's power...not his) compared to their real control...
Stop Watch works. Theres this clock enemy in Earthbound who stops the time, and Ness is effected. Ness will be effected by the Stop Watch. Period.

lol...Yes…because a series that made someone the "poster boy" (as in champ) for a group of superheroes, supervillains, cyborgs, mutants, and aliens…is going to die from an explosive citrus…
It's just shaped as a orange, as in comic relief.

Diddy could also beat Falcon by playing the guitar as I mentioned there. If Falcon would knock Diddy away with the Blue Falcon (but no damage of for Going Bananas) he would have a hard time locating Diddy again, thus likely wouldn't drive at full speed searching for him. If Diddy hit Falcon with the guitar's blast, he'd likely lose control and crash. If he'd survive, Diddy beats him from there.

I mean…I like how you think Falcon is going to lose his car from said orange as well…the thing is moving around at speeds that beat the speed of sound…and is prepped to deal with crashing at those speeds
Invincibility from Going Bananas.

In order for something to even go that fast it’s going to have to withstand the pressure from those speeds in the 1st place…
Don't bring science here, invincibility cannot be clarified with science.

I find your view of the F-Zero games being stupid funny…like 90% of the things that happen in that series is just not something I would take seriously (Falcon saves the universe + a baby from a train all in a single day)
I was just saying, it isn't my opinion about the F Zero series, it's more an summarised.. thing of ridicilous things Captain Falcon does which you told me in the first place. :p I just found those things funny, so I said it.

I mean it’s hardly the only series in this topic that is like that… do you think a monkey throwing an explosive orange is suppose to be serious then? Really…like 90% of the stuff that happens in the DK canon is silly in general as well…and I wouldn’t take it seriously…
Neither do I, and nobody should. DK canon is also pretty ridiculous, but it's more fantasy orientated and stuffz. Rare was good at adding comic relief.

For example, in Diddy Kong Racing there where 2 characters which started to get their own game series. Conker (Conker's Bad Fur Day, on N64 and XBox) and Banjo (from Banjo-Kazooie, N64 and XBox 360). Conker while starting out as a cute little squirrel, became a badd *** mofo who curses and kills.

The Peanut Popguns and Coconut Gun from Diddy and Donkey Kong originally where ordinary guns. Nintendo probably didn't want that, so they replaced it with wooden guns which shoot fruits. If it where for Rare... Diddy Kong could probably evolve to such a character as Conker. He'd look more like this maybe:



Could also explain Diddy's bad *** shootery in the Subspace Emisarry.

Proof of Diddy originally holding double guns:



With your logic applied, Diddy's peanuts hit as hard as bullets. Awesome. =) Now, how did Captain Falcon beat an invincible shotta chimp again?

Hell…with Mother…
your next door neighbor turns out to be a greater evil than a universal cosmic destroyer that has free range over space and time…
Yes, and I like that. ^^

And Mario…well...
I hate this picture I'm showing...before I made this post...I spend like an hour trying to find a comic which had Mario dressed in his bee suit and had him calling Earthbound a weird game...I couldn't find it though...so you get this stupid picture instead
:
http://thenintendo.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/09043011506_1.jpg
Yes, that was a pretty gay thing from Mario Galaxy. No wonder why it's called UR MR GAY. =/

Again…The games that came out after the anime are all based off the anime…they are seen as a reboot of the series…
http://fzero.wikia.com/wiki/F-Zero:_GP_Legend_(video_game)
http://fzero.wikia.com/wiki/F-Zero_Climax

This is the order on how the F-Zero games came out…
• F-Zero
• F-Zero X
• F-Zero MV
• F-Zero GX
• F-Zero AX
• F-Zero: GP Legend
• F-Zero Climax

I’m getting kind of sick about this chat anyway when my only reason for bringing up the anime/certain comics in general was just to point out that Falcon can fight…but…just looking at the other racers for the series and the fact that Falcon is “champ” among them should be proof that he can fight IMO…so...oh well...
TLDR. Sorry. In game abilities only, which in Falcon's case isn't all that bad...

EDIT: Btw, I want Luigi to win this. Samus is pretty overrated, any character that can beat her is awesome in my books.
 

Kewkky

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All of you guys' assumptions are based in the off-chance that Samus doesn't start with the imperialist and shoots luigi as soon as the fight starts. What can Luigi do about a 300,000,000 meters per second energy projectile which 1HKOs? He can't use any items THAT fast, since you can't start fights with skill, items or whatever (everyone starts in a neutral position, and Samus's weapon is a part of her, so she can start with it). His hand would still be reaching for his pockets when Samus already has a clear shot of him. And if you guys think of something to go by that, she can just shoot him with the Sonicboom from MP2 (which travels so fast, as soon as you shoot it, it's already hitting the opponent, no matter what the distance is).

If Mega Luigi stomps on Samus, she uses her reserve tanks which revive her whenever she dies, runs away and uses Crystal Flash and refills all of her energy tanks (do her reserve tanks get full too?), then keeps running until Mega Luigi runs out of time.

If Starman Luigi appears, Samus can just speedboost while shooting Annihilator Beam projectiles, which are homing. As soon as Luigi's starman runs out, he's GOING to get hit. There is no way Luigi can catch up to Samus while she runs at the speed of sound... She can literally do circles around Luigi without him being able to touch her. Why should she jump if she can just run? She avoids Luigi's superjump this way, and Luigi can't do anything.

If Luigi dies and he uses a life shroom to revive, then Samus can just shoot him down as he revives everytime. She can just stand in front of him and keep shooting with no fears, thanks to her infinite ammunition on most of her weapons. If she needs Luigi somewhere, she could shoot the Dark Beam's special in MP2 (forgot the name) which opens this blackhole-like rift and is shown to suck matter into it for a short time.

Music box? So, assuming the Music box plays music, when Samus runs at supersonic speeds, she beats sound. She could either run through the soundwaves and nothing would happen due to her breaking the sound barrier and not giving sound a chance to get to her, or she could run away until the music dissipates enough for her to not be able to hear it, then head back while shooting Luigi. She can even shoot Annihilator beams at Luigi meanwhile, since they're homing.

Samus' Speed Booster makes her invincible, which is why enemy bullets don't hurt Samus. Energy isn't sound, so a sonicboom wouldn't protect her from energy attacks. Have you tried going speed boost, cancelling it so that you can jump any direction with it, then jumping INTO an attack? Nothing happens. And you know what? Even if you're creating a sonicboom, stuff can still hit you, and you can still crash against stuff, otherwise you'd see Army jets crashing into buildings and mountains and missiles and bullets and other jets... And surviving. All sonicbooms do, like you said, is make it so that the microscopic particles in your surroundings can't get out of your way fast enough and creates sonicbooms, not that macroscopic things will get destroyed and the thing in the sonicboom be unharmed... This further proves the point that Samus IS invincible while in Speed Booster, unless sonicbooms also push away the particles that comprise the opponent when Samus meets them, which still means she's invincible since she can't be hurt by ANYTHING.

And about the Mother kids' vehicles... Have they been shown to kill people when they crash into them? No. You can actually crash onto people and the Pork n' Beans does nothing to them. Samus is a "people". Samus has inhuman protection with her armor, energy tanks and reserve tanks. The enemies you can OHKO are naked, and the robots you kill are scrapped. Samus can even shoot Wave beams and hit the Mother boys in their vehicles, since Wave beams go through all inorganic matter (walls, machines, VEHICLES...). What prevents her from running away from the vehicles and shooting at them nonstop? Before the vehicle reach the supersonic-speed Samus, they WILL get hit... And the Wave beam will go right past them, and hit the people inside.


And _clinton, this thead is called "If Smash Characters were true to their games", which means that even if there's a connection to other characters to anime and whatever, the only things we're allowed to talk about are stuff IN THE GAMES. If C.Falcon has the Falcon Punch, congratulkations... But he doesn't use it in his game, so thinking about what it might be able to do, or the size of the destruction, is all pure assumption and NOT part of the game. During any F-Zero games, do you see scenes from the anime? Do you see Falcon punching people? No, so that's IT. Don't start trying to bend the rules, cuz they're quite clear in that ONLY STUFF FROM THE GAMES, FROM INSIDE THE GAMES, MATTER HERE. Get it? You're trying to find a loophole in which to put a non-game into a game-only discussion, where it's supposed to be GAME ONLY. Canonical and non-canonical? This goes for official instruction booklets, the back of the boxes, and official strategy guides. Can you repeat anything from the anime in the game? NO. Is anything from the anime able to be used during the gameplay, besides racing? NO. Therefore it can't be used in a GAME discussion such as "if all smash characters were true to their GAMES".
 

BSP

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Oh and as far as the current match goes...I'm like shocked no one has brought up a stop watch yet...
4 second activation time, Luigi would be dead by then.

And Kewkky is right, Luigi can't win this. Samus has a better response for all of Luigi's options. Now if this was mario, this would be different (danger mario is...dangerous).
 

Crystanium

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All of you guys' assumptions are based in the off-chance that Samus doesn't start with the imperialist and shoots luigi as soon as the fight starts. What can Luigi do about a 300,000,000 meters per second energy projectile which 1HKOs?
Actually, it's 299,792,458 meters per second (186,282 miles per second; 983,571,056 feet per second). Perhaps you were thinking 300,000 kilometers.

If Mega Luigi stomps on Samus, she uses her reserve tanks which revive her whenever she dies, runs away and uses Crystal Flash and refills all of her energy tanks (do her reserve tanks get full too?), then keeps running until Mega Luigi runs out of time.
Reserve Tanks are not restored when Samus uses Crystal Flash.
 

Kewkky

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Actually, it's 299,792,458 meters per second (186,282 miles per second; 983,571,056 feet per second). Perhaps you were thinking 300,000 kilometers.
Yeah, exactly. Well, rounded up it's still the same thing.

Reserve Tanks are not restored when Samus uses Crystal Flash.
Good to know, thanks.
 

WhatIsRaizen?

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Vs.


Current Match-Up:
THE PSYCHIC POKEMON Vs. THE HERO OF WINDS

Mewtwo Vs. Toon Link

:mewtwo: Vs. :toonlink:

Round 4, Match 2.

Who will win? YOU decide!

Overall Results

Wins +4:

:samus2:

Wins +3:

:ike:, :ness2:, :ganondorf:

Wins +2:

:mario2:, :wolf:, :fox:, :snake:

Wins +1:

:sonic:, :pit:, :younglinkmelee:, :toonlink:, :bowser2:, :mewtwo:, :pikachu:, :luigi2:

Neutral:

:kirby2:, :zelda:, :peach:, :metaknight:, :pt:, :lucario:, :link2:, :diddy:, :marth:, :roymelee:, :falco:, :lucas:

Loss -1:

:dk2:

Loss -2:

:jigglypuff:, :zerosuitsamus:, :wario:, :falcon:, :pichu:, :yoshi2:, :dedede:

Loss -3:

:olimar:, :popo:

Loss -4:

:gw:, :rob:
 

Kewkky

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I assure you, it is much more fun to watch these debates, than be a part of them. *goes back to lurking this thread*
 

Joeadok

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Wait, I've never seen Samus start off at whatever pace, she picks speed, at least in Super Metroid. Music box takes affect immediately and affects the WHOLE map.
 

Kewkky

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Wait, I've never seen Samus start off at whatever pace, she picks speed, at least in Super Metroid. Music box takes affect immediately and affects the WHOLE map.
So, Luigi doesn't have to open the menu, find it and choose it? Thats enough time to get her running.
 

Kewkky

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That's in SMB3, I think, he does it before the match.
Then it can't be used, since you can't start a fight here with skills activated, or use items before a match. Everyone starts in a neutral position.

And even if you managed to use it and put Samus to sleep and hit her with a mega shroom or whatever... She'd get hit, reserve tanks keep her alive, wake up, run away, Crystal Flash, then do everything I said before. She could even shoot HOMING Annihilator beams the whole time so that Luigi doesn't have time to use any other items.

Luigi's done, just move to the next match.
 

Joeadok

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No, it just takes the b button then a, depending when he got it, seriously, it'd take 3 seconds tops, if he brought alot of stuff.
 

justaway12

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You can start a fight with skills activeated, that's why Luigi can start with his coustumes, I also think you set it up in battle, which only takes a second, not sure though, I haven't played that game for a long time.
 

Kewkky

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The imperialist shoots at the speed of light and is an OHKO. Even if it takes a second to activate the music box, Luigi might die if he doesn't do it fast enough.

And if you can start a fight with Skills activated, what's preventing Samus from starting with the Speed Boost activated? She could just ram Luigi as soon as the fight starts and it's over. Luigi can't activate anything at the speed of sound, which is the speed Samus will be traveling at (or faster).


Just move on to M2 vs TL. My input would be Mewtwo wins. Prove me wrong.
 

Kewkky

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He'd have the starman, it's on his person and all you need to do is touch it, if there are inventories then I'll assume he has 1 of each, in smb3 you choose multiple items in the overworld.
Then she'll start with the speed booster, run out of Luigi's reach while shooting him with any weapon she desires, then once his starman runs out, he's going to get hit. She can even ram him if she wants to.

The point is, once Luigi loses any invincibility, he loses. Samus has OHKOing weaponry that travel at the speed of light and are long-range, she has invincibility for as long as she desires while Luigi's has a timer, and she can outspeed Luigi at any moment. Luigi can't win.

Speed boost is always activated, she has to run first.
She doesn't have to be running to maintain a speed boost. She can run, then once she's in speed boost, press down and now she's standing around with the power still activated. She can start with that, then jump away and she'll be too far for Luigi, and able to run in peace (and the jumping remains supersonic).
 

Joeadok

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Like i said, speed booster is part of the speed boots, which are always active after you get them, she has to pick up speed, thats it.
 

Diddy Kong

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Mega Mushroom I think, starts up faster than the Speed Booster. If Luigi's Mega, Speed Booster doesn't hurt him.

Got me thinking though... Luigi can't have both the Mega Mushroom and the Starman. IIRC, he can't start out with both, thus making one of them his collective item.

So yeah, Luigi pretty much loses. It's a shame though, he had potential of winning this.

Anyways, Mewtwo already beat Link. Toon Link isn't anything different. Embargo blocks item usage except the sword and shield. Calm Mind is for stat boosting, Psychic for killing and Recover for healing. With every effective option of Toon Link blocked, his best bet is the Hurricane Spin, but Mewtwo can heal damage of- Toon Link can't, besides Mewtwo would likely do more damage than Toon Link anyways.
 

Crystanium

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Speed boost is always activated, she has to run first.
It's online, but I wouldn't say it's active. Activity is a state of being active. It's from the Latin, actus. Another word we have is "action." If you're playing a game, you might have a button the game would call an "action button." If you were playing The Legend of Zelda, and you wanted to use your sword, the B button is online. It's on, it's ready for use, but it is not active.
 

Kewkky

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Like i said, speed booster is part of the speed boots, which are always active after you get them, she has to pick up speed, thats it.
And items have to be activated before you use them.

Point is, even if she can't start with that, Luigi hits her while she's sleeping, she survives thanks to her reserve tanks which activate when she's KO'd, she runs away, fully heals, and does everything I said. GEEZ. Luigi Loses. Just move on to the next MU already.



Or, she could go Hyper Mode and now nothing Luigi has can hurt her.
 

Ganonsburg

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I have a question....

If Samus really is invincible as much as everyone says she is, how does she ever get hurt in her games? Or does she not, and the game is just stupid to play? And if she can't be invincible in the games all the time, why is she allowed to here?


On the current matchup:

WW Link can change night and day. Any of Mew2s attacks that increase/decrease with day/night can and will be weakened by Link (I don't know if M2 has anything like that, I just know that there are some moves like that out there).
He can also control others via the Wind Waker (not sure if it has to be voluntary, I can't remember what they say in game).
He has the mirror shield in this one, as well as arrows that can freeze volcanoes and melt icebergs. He's very agile (he jumps 10+ feet in the air as he stabs Ganon at the end, not to mention all that rolling with his sword and shield).
He can also change the weather and call upon cyclones. And he's blessed by the goddesses w/ ToC.

:034:
 

REL38

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My 2 cents.

If Luigi manages the Music Box to make Samus sleep, then Luigi closes in.

From there, he uses Stopwatch.

Luigi spams attacks and activates another Stopwatch before the first one runs out.
The Stopwatch can keep enemies in a constant time freeze if another is used before the one before it ends.

Luigi just makes sure to use another Stopwatch before the one before it ends.
Keeps attacking in between each one.
His attacks are strong enough to kill Samus before he uses up all 99 Stopwatches.
 

Kewkky

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I have a question....

If Samus really is invincible as much as everyone says she is, how does she ever get hurt in her games? Or does she not, and the game is just stupid to play? And if she can't be invincible in the games all the time, why is she allowed to here?
There are too many walls and obstacles in the game to maintain a decent speed boost active. And there are some bosses where you have to shoot them with beam weapons in closed places to beat them, meaning no speed boost either. So, you have to go at the majority of the game vulnerable. Here, the arenas are all without obstacles, and she can go 3D now due to the Metroid Primes, which should make it easier to do a speed boost. Just go A La Earthbound and run in circles till she's got it, or straight away from the opponent.

If Luigi manages the Music Box to make Samus sleep
Samus would already be shooting him down with the imperialist.
 

Kewkky

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I have a question....

If Samus really is invincible as much as everyone says she is, how does she ever get hurt in her games? Or does she not, and the game is just stupid to play? And if she can't be invincible in the games all the time, why is she allowed to here?
There are too many walls and obstacles in the game to maintain a decent speed boost active. And there are some bosses where you have to shoot them with beam weapons in closed places to beat them, meaning no speed boost either. So, you have to go at the majority of the game vulnerable. Here, the arenas are all without obstacles, and she can go 3D now due to the Metroid Primes, which should make it easier to do a speed boost. Just go A La Earthbound and run in circles till she's got it, or straight away from the opponent.

If Luigi manages the Music Box to make Samus sleep
Samus would already be shooting him down with the imperialist.


And if you guys REALLY insist on starting with stuff, then Samus can just start with her INTERGALACTIC spaceship too high for Luigi's superjump to reach, fly off at SPEEDS THAT LET HER CROSS GALAXIES WITHOUT AGING to a VERY far-off point in the arena, get the speed boost going, and it's over.
 

Diddy Kong

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Stop Watch spam wouldn't work. Samus' beams travel fast, and Stop Watch has start up lag. It doesn't come out instantly.

I agree with the others that Speed Booster > Music Box. Speed Booster goes faster than sound, and Music Box is likely sound based. It just wouldn't work.

If Luigi can get both the Mega Mushroom and Starman, I see him winning. Speed Booster works against smaller enemies, but not on bosses. I assume Samus' body type should be about the same size as the ones she's Speed Boosting. I think, Mega Luigi could hurt Samus while Speed Boosting. He just needs to catch her... Which he probably won't... So never mind.

@Ganonsburg:

Embargo prevents Toon Link of using items besides the sword and shield. Psychic based attacks likely bypass the Mirror Shield, and it's not like the Mirror Shield reflects projectiles at all... Just light beams and the Twinrova's beams. Psychic isn't a beam, it's a blast.

Calm Mind makes Mewtwo's attacks stronger, but he likely can kill Toon Link without it. Recover heals off damage Toon Link might do, while Embargo still prevents Toon Link of using items to heal himself.
 

Ray_Kalm

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I personally think WW Link is much better than TP/OoT Link. He has access to a lot more powerful stuff, he's much more agile, much faster in general, and has some really helpful items.
 
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