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Sheik Up-B Mechanics

Discussion in 'Sheik' started by Sycorax, Nov 23, 2015.

  1. Sycorax

    Sycorax
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    Smash Ace

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    The following is the result of some exploration I did into Sheik's up-b on account of comments I've heard going around about reducing the landing lag by landing close to the ledge. For example, NMW told people that it reduces it by half. Put shortly, this is false. However, he's not entirely wrong. The people talking about this didn't give examples, but I believe this is one.

    Practical TAS summarized the benefits well: "It's not that vulnerability is reduced. It's that the vulnerability window is drastically changed so, by the time you expect Sheik to be vulnerable, she's already able to shield."

    Here are the specifics of what is going on:


    Sheik's up-b has three main parts. The first is the initial launch. The action state that corresponds to this launch is labeled 358. (Special moves are labeled with numbers in develop mode. It's annoying.) It takes 35 frames and becomes intangible on frame 18. Sheik can grab the ledge out of it as soon as frame 21. During this launch part, Sheik retains all of her regular aerial mobility. There is a fair amount of ECB contortion during this part, too. If Sheik lands during this animation, a poof hitbox will instantly appear, but Sheik will continue with the animation as if she had up-b'd on the ground. Another poof hitbox will appear as Sheik enters the second part of her up-b.

    The second part is the invisible part. This state is labeled 359. The poof hitbox comes out on the first frame of this part. The animation lasts 20 frames and Sheik is intangible for the entirety of it. During this animation, the bottom of Sheik's ECB extends downward considerably. Also, Sheik can control the distance she travels while in this state. The the magnitude of the displacement from neutral position of the analog stick is read on the 34th frame of animation 358, and if the value is greater than 0.5, the value is added to 1 to give the velocity for the entirety of this animation (e.g. inputting full right will give you a velocity of 2 to the right for the 20 frames of this animation.) If Sheik runs into a wall during this animation, the animation is stopped and she instantly enters the next animation which is 360.

    The third part is when Sheik reappears and falls. This state is labeled 360 and lasts 39 frames. She reappears and flips around then falls. During the flip, the bottom of her ECB rises from the position is was in during 359 getting fairly high up, then it falls back down to a position similar to that of when she was in 359. If Sheik lands during these 39 frames, she enters LandingFallSpecial and cannot act for 30 frames. If Sheik is still airborne after these 39 frames, she enters FallSpecial and when she lands on the ground, she has 4 frames of landing lag. If Sheik up-b's into the ground, when she reappears, she enters 39 of landing lag during which she is completely vulnerable.

    Two mechanics mentioned above allow Plup to do things like this. The total lag of this maneuver is less than that of poofing above the stage and then falling onto it. But also, it reduces the animation length of 359. The landing lag he suffers in this maneuver is still 30 frames of LandingFallSepcial, but he is using his ECB to land earlier. Normally, when Sheik reappears, she has no vertical velocity for 8 frames, and then starts to fall according to her gravity. It takes time to build up speed and then when she finally hits the ground, she is vulnerable for 30 frames. This is basically 45 or more frames of vulnerability, usually more. However, Sheik can use ECB tricks to land more quickly. If Sheik up-b's toward the ledge, while in 359, the downward extension of her ECB will stop her from moving past the ledge. This interaction will also cause the 359 animation to cut short. If she does this too low, she will enter 360 in front of the ledge and fall and grab it, which is what happens when one misses a sweetspot with her. If she does it higher, Sheik will exit 359 just above the ledge and enter 360 with a tiny bit of forward velocity. Her ECB will rise while in animation 360 and this forward velocity will propel her over the ledge. Then, Sheik and the bottom of her ECB will fall back down starting on frame 9 of animation 360, and Sheik will land as the ECB collides with the ground. When she lands exactly depends on how high you are relative to the ground when you up-b, but it's usually frame 11. With LandingFallSpecial lag, this is about 41 frames of lag. The fact that animation 359 is cut short is also important. It makes Sheik land much earlier than people would expect. Players are used to waiting until Sheik finishes her teleport and punishing, and they have learned the specific timing for it. This maneuver messes that timing up. Together with the lag reduction, you can trick your opponent's timing.

    In conclusion, this recovery technique is a decent mixup with Sheik. On most stages you can make it ambiguous whether you will recover to a side platform or onto the end of the ledge. To perform this maneuver, up-b close to the stage so that at the apex of the initial launch, you are slightly above level with the stage. Hold horizontally towards the stage. With the correct vertical spacing, you should land just at the edge. Too low and you'll appear and grab the ledge. Too high and you'll appear far into the stage and fall to the ground.

    Video

    I hope this all makes sense. Feel free to ask questions about it, or ask further questions about the mechanics of Sheik's up-b.
     
    #1 Sycorax, Nov 23, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2015
    6VI6, ~Fusion~, Lupoor and 3 others like this.
  2. Poccoishere

    Poccoishere
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    Smash Cadet

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    Add a tl;dr ples but I will read this later
     
    #2 Poccoishere, Nov 24, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2015
  3. LovinMitts

    LovinMitts
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    Good read. Thanks for the information.
     
  4. ShrieK1295

    ShrieK1295
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    Thanks for the analysis. This had been confusing me forever. It seems like, effectively speaking, you do have to treat it as if it's half landing lag because Sheik should be able to go to the ledge if she poofs at the same place where she gets the earlier vulnerability window. Moreover, in relation to when the hitbox comes out from her poof, she is going to be actionable sooner, but you will still have to do ledge standup at the same time. Am I wrong? Is there a way to tell if she's going to anticipate the earlier window by looking at where she starts her poof and also know that she won't go to the ledge?
     
    #4 ShrieK1295, Mar 18, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2016
  5. Sycorax

    Sycorax
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    Smash Ace

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    You can always do a neutral get up from the ledge that prevents her from going to the ledge and gives you at least some frames on stage to punish. If she poofs closer to the stage, you can get up sooner. This technique of hers will only serve to reduce the amount of time you have to punish her but you still have time.
     

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