She can't rest without her bair - A Project M Jigglypuff Guide

[leekslap]

#puns

With 3.5 on the horizon, I thought we could bring together the Puff community to make an awesome guide and update it so when the surge of new Puffs come out, they'll be right at home and learn. Puff was my very first PM main and the only reason why I didn't stick with her is because she flat out sucked and because Meta Knight was way more fun and fitting for me. I always play her in friendlies so it doesn't mean I'm out of practice. But without further adieu, here is the guide!

PROS AND CONS
Pros:
- great aerial game
- rest
- amazing recovery
- gimps characters with bad recovery easily
- hard to combo
- strong punishes
- good spacing game
- decent mixups
- good grabs
- godlike aerial mobility
- can force you to play footsies where nobody combos each other
Cons:
- mediocre if not poor ground game
- rest is the most punishable move in the game
- easy to eat her many jumps
- can't gimp as easily as in Melee
- can't combo easily
- is outranged by many characters
- many bad or useless moves
- neutral game mainly consists of one move: bair
- not very safe on shield
- crouch cancel can destroy her
- can be boring to watch
- insanely easy to kill
- no projectiles
- Rest is broken
- Kirby makes her obsolete
- shield burst leads to automatic KO
- horrible MU spread
- kind of slow
- no recovery up special

MY TOTALLY PROFFESIONAL RATING SYSTEM FROM WORST TO BEST
- TRASH!
- Very Nearly Almost TRASH!
- TRASHish?
- Horrible!
- Bad.
- Not Bad.
- Decent.
- Good.
- Great.
- Marbles.
- Awesome(tacular)!
- GODLIKE.

MOVESET
Jab - Not bad. Useful for jab reset and sometimes a combo.
Forward Tilt - Bad. Good for spacing but there will always be a better option.
Down Tilt - TRASH! Never use this move!
Up Tilt - Good. Can setup rest, combo, and hit oppomemts behind her.
Dash Attack - Decent. Good for juggling but Puff's stats make this move worse than it should be.
Forward Smash - OK. A great kill move if setup well or if you make a hard read. Safe on shield.
Down Smash - Horrible! Has a lot of lag and is impossible to setup but it sends them at a good gimping angle.
Up Smash - Great. Hits hard, is pretty fast, good finisher, and DACUS makes it even better.
Forward Throw - TRASHish? Up Throw and Down Throw will be forever better options because of Rest, but it ain't bad at starting a combo.
Back Throw - Very nearly almost TRASH! Same thing as Forward Throw except this one is good for spacing, and there are alot of better options for that.
Down Throw - Awesome(tacular)! Sets up floaties for Rest fairly easy and start combos very well.
Up Throw - Great. Sets up fast fallers for Rest and can kill at high percents.
Nair - Great. Good for spacing, comboing, and setting up rest. Is a hero kick.
Fair - Good. Good for spacing and gimping but outclassed by bair. Is a hero kick.
Bair - GODLIKE. Jigglypuff's best move for whatever you need.
Dair - OK. Good for shield pressure and can setup a up tilt or up smash or something.
Up Air - Decent. Good for juggling and can kill at high percents.
Rollout - Decent. Good mixup, kill move, pressure and recovery but is easy to punish and whiff.
Pound - Good. Good mixup, kill move, and recovery but shouldn't be spammed.
Rest - GODLIKE. This move needs no introduction.
Sing - TRASH! Never use this move!

ADVANCED TECHNIQUES
Wall of Pain - an effective edgeguard with only bair
Rising Pound - input up when you Pound; how you should recover with pound
Rest setups - up tilt, down throw, weak nair, up throw, up air and a few more can connect into rest
NOTE: Her wavedash and CC aren't very good because her low traction and light weight.

STRATEGIES, COMBOS, AND THINGS

Jiggypuff is all about weaving in and out with your aerial mobility, poking and punishing, and Resting whenever you can. Stay in the air and avoid attacks coming your way. Yout goal is to try to get the opponent offstage or Rest them. Bait them with your aerial mobility and punish. Her crouch can help against projectile abusers such as Falco. You have to be very patient and force them to play your game. Be creative even if you don't have a lot to work with. Hungrybox is the prime example of this. He can do deep stage spike edgeguards, hard Rest reads, crazy combos, or just carry them to oblivion with only bair! Overall, you would only pick up Puff is you really like her. Let's see if she rises up the ranks!

While Jigglypuff's option besides bair in neutral aren't the best on their own, they are suddenly viable as you condition them more and more into expecting bairs. The other formidable options include dashdance, side-b, crouch, crossup fair/up-air etc...
Back- and forward-throw have zoning purposes.
Also the fact that the neutral game is mostly bair doesn't make it as easy as described above. Their are multiple timings and spacings on the move, that you can mix with different horizontal air movement and even mixups as you land. I find it a bit oversimplified, so to speak.

I feel like mixing soggy waffles with the sky. I am really starting to regret making this guide because I don't even like or play puff anymore. Feels like making an essay. Anybody, feel free to take over.

 

[leekslap]

Is the puff forum really this dead? No critiques or views or something? I guess I'll reserve this post for later.

 

[ZeroJanitor]

Fthrow and Bthrow are decent at starting combos and getting some space respectively, if not really the ideal way to do either (fthrow was great in Melee dunno why they nerfed it).

 

[leekslap]

Fthrow and Bthrow are decent at starting combos and getting some space respectively, if not really the ideal way to do either (fthrow was great in Melee dunno why they nerfed it).

I actually only put Trash for both of them because I never use them and Hungrybox negates it too (at least in Project M )so my logic was it was it wasn't good. You don't really want to combo with Puff; you just want to gimp or rest but if you can then go for it. I guess gimping has to be a combo because you can't really wait at the ledge and nair or bair like MK; you have to carry them with bairs and an occasional fair. Are you sure they nerfed it? The only change everyone's been saying she has is DACUS.

 

[Chesstiger2612]

While I like the idea, I think a guide should contain more subcategories like neutral game, combos, spacing, OoS, grab game etc etc and should go more into details. If you have any questions, feel free to ask them.

 

[leekslap]

While I like the idea, I think a guide should contain more subcategories like neutral game, combos, spacing, OoS, grab game etc etc and should go more into details. If you have any questions, feel free to ask them.

Puff doesn't really have a complex game. Her neutral is basically bair. Grab game is up/down throw rest and maybe a forward/back throw if you want to combo or get them off the stage, but it's not that effective and would you really trade a lame combo for a rest( main reason why they are trash )? A combo and OoS section might be worth writing. I don't have much time now so you can suggest any content you want me to put into this guide and I'll just quote you.

 

[Chesstiger2612]

While Jigglypuff's option besides bair in neutral aren't the best on their own, they are suddenly viable as you condition them more and more into expecting bairs. The other formidable options include dashdance, side-b, crouch, crossup fair/up-air etc...
Back- and forward-throw have zoning purposes.
Also the fact that the neutral game is mostly bair doesn't make it as easy as described above. Their are multiple timings and spacings on the move, that you can mix with different horizontal air movement and even mixups as you land. I find it a bit oversimplified, so to speak.

 

[Facading]

Would you want to go over the differences and adjustments you should make from a Melee puff to a PM puff?

 

[KrobbleGoo]

Anyone know specifically how to get rests? Just seems like luck when i get them. And with anyone but a fast faller it seems impossible

 

[Chesstiger2612]

Against non-fastfallers, it is hard to combo into them, but here are some methods to get some rests in:
- ledgecancelled (ledge-cancel the platform) aerial -> rest: situational and rare but effective
- rest OoS after a really slow move: just look a bit at the frame data and when the endlag is rather high and the shield pushback rather low, you can get it
- nair->rest: does work against many characters, here some examples: Hungrybox vs Oracle and from Melee
- hard reads: those really need experience, you can get them if you read an opponent's dash in, sometimes also a jump, or reading their OoS option, but they are very risky
- crouch, dodge a move of them, rest afterwards: works best against tall characters because some of their hitboxes are too high to hit Jigglypuff
- crouchcancel into rest: only at low %s against low knockback attacks
- jab reset -> rest: in the no-tech animation, if you hit them with a jab at rather low %s they are forced to stand up (if they don't SDI the jab up), and you can rest after it: opportunities can often occur in techchase situations
- punishing a recovery move: against some characters you can edgeguard by grabbing the ledge, and if they up-B onstage you rest them during their endlag (works best on Marth, but probably with slight variations on about 10 characters)
- catching their landing: being airborne is a disadvantage and you can punish a landing attempt, you mostly do this with up-air/tilt/smash, but the rest can work if they throw out an attack, you barely avoid it and are close enough to punish with a rest in the endlag of that move

Hope that helps.