San Antonio Smash 4 Thread

[Sinister Slush]

Not just a dream...
The Black American Dream.

 

[ProofByContrapositive]

So what is wrong with the point system ? Did you accidently give shade all my points for Los 7?

Also are we gonna do pat'obriens or something after sam for slushes bday?

 

[Espy Rose]

Apparently the old system never took into account point reduction gains/losses in loser's bracket, so essentially loser's bracket games had the same weight that winner's bracket games did, which they shouldn't. That in and of itself explains why so many major point gains were had by Slush/Whiteout.

I'm working on the rankings, but it'll take some time. Lots of stuff to tweak around.

Santi, do you happen to have the Challonge bracket for the LOS you hosted? I need that one.

 

[Sinister Slush]

I knew 134 was too many points from the get go, even if the wins were all in winners that weekly.

 

[ProofByContrapositive]

Yeah paw should probably be like ~35th for losing to fcf. Slush what day is your bday? Let's have a night on the town... I'll throw $$$ at it

 

[Espy Rose]

Nevermind Santi it's on the second post.

 

[ProofByContrapositive]

Just like animals
animals
Yeah

 

[Espy Rose]

I just finished the raw ELO setup using Zac's old system.
Keep in mind that it follow's Zac's old rules. The major ones being as follows from the old Brawl PR:

The list is extremely dynamic based on recent tournament results. It tries to stay as up-to-date as possible. The list can be updated after EVERY tournament.

• Players are rated based on head-to-head battles for any given tournament. They are not based off of placings (1st, 2nd, 3rd), as this is not necessary.
• Everyone starts at 1600 points. This is considered the average score.
• You gain points for beating someone in tournament. If they have more points than you, you'll gain more points. If they have less points, you'll gain fewer points.
• You lose points if you lose to someone in tournament. If they have more points than you, you'll lose fewer points. If they have less points, you'll lose more points.
• Not going to a tournament means you will not gain or lose points, you'll stay the same.
  
• Only Singles are counted for ratings. Teams, Low-Tier, etc will not be counted.
• Players must have participated in at least two tournaments to appear on the PR list.
• You gain less points in Loser's Bracket than in Winner's Bracket.

EDIT: Full Chart:

RANK | TAG | RATING | Movement
1 | Megafox | 1886 |
2 | Espy | 1750 |
3 | SnorlaxPie500 | 1734 |
4 | K Prime | 1721 |
5 | Jopan | 1699 |
6 | Paw | 1685 |
7 | Slush | 1681 |
8 | Incendiary | 1679 |
8 | Valdens | 1679 |
10 | Castro | 1649 |
===|===|===|===
11 | HeroMystic | 1630 |
12 | Sylveon | 1625 |
13 | Mindless | 1616 |
14 | RIP | 1608 |
15 | Whiteout | 1607 |
16 | KoN | 1606 |
17 | Geoberos | 1602 |
18 | Kyro | 1599 |
18 | Chewy | 1599 |
20 | Enigma | 1597 |
21 | Overdrive | 1595 |
22 | Azure | 1592 |
23 | Lan | 1591 |
23 | Kev | 1591 |
25 | Chazz | 1590 |
26 | Iam | 1587 |
27 | KM | 1583 |
28 | NinjaFish60 | 1582 |
28 | Babybwake | 1582 |
30 | JNasty | 1577 |
30 | Speedy | 1577 |
32 | Volume | 1575 |
33 | Psychoward | 1571 |
33 | Winds | 1571 |
35 | Vitamin | 1563 |
35 | Applepoe | 1563 |
37 | inTOXIC | 1558 |
38 | Haijynx | 1556 |
39 | CCCM | 1548 |
40 | Jaredgcom | 1528
41 | Mondy | 1523 |
42 | Crashman | 1521 |
43 | Gtimes | 1507 |

 

[ToferTheHuman]

That looks super cool.

 

[ProofByContrapositive]

Has jopan played slush????

 

[Jopan1026]

Has jopan played slush????

I have, we're 1-1 with him having the most recent victory.

With how well I did last LoS the rankings please me, but knowing how easy it'll be to fall out of top 10 now is pretty scary.

 

[SnorlaxPie500]

Looks good Espy. Thanks for getting the new one out so quick. I'm pretty bummed I probably won't make this coming weekly :/

 

[Sinister Slush]

Is beros going? Just wondering if we'll still be having set ups for recording and all that.

 

[ProofByContrapositive]

I'm ficking tanked and fow is playing feint

 

[Geoberos]

Eyy I got my place back from all the new players bumping me down. Though I'm pretty close to the default so it may happen again.

As for LoS1 Weekly 9, I plan on attending unless something comes up #jinxed

 

[Sinister Slush]

Man just realized since Zac's old thing, we went down from like 90 something people to 43. Does that also mean we got no point gain or loss from the people that only joined one tournament?

 

[Jopan1026]

Hey Nike, you know how you made everybody text you? Maybe instead you can have everybody when they sign up for a tournament also provide an email address and opt in or out of email updates. Emails can be once a month or something and have dates and info on upcoming tournaments. Just an idea.

 

[Nike.]

I rarely check/use my email as it is.

Imagine a level of Nike status beyond calls/text/Facebook.

 

[SnorlaxPie500]

Hey @ Nike.
I personally like Lylat, but I know it is a very common first strike and/or ban. Why don't we just replace PS2 with Lylat on the counterpicks and use 8player Smash PS2 (no transformations) as a neutral instead of Lylat?


Just a thought. Anyone else think it's a good idea?

 

[Sinister Slush]

Duck Hunt over Lylat.
Lylat moved to CP and add Wuhu island to CP as well. 2 stage bans now after game 1/2

 

[SnorlaxPie500]

Lylat is more neutral than Duck Hunt. Wuhu Island should die. 2 bans would be nice.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Most places in other regions prefer or even CP to Duck Hunt over any other neutral. Only problem I see with the stage is the tree for characters like Mac + Ganon and maybe ducks getting in way for projectiles. I'd imagine you'd want this stage since it benefits Diddy greatly.

Otherwise Lylat's wonky edges, the tilting and for some reason the two engines in this game messes with so much **** now as well. From cancelling dashes or Dash attacks, shielding on it and randomly falling/air tumble animation, to pikachu going through it with QA.
And god knows what else those engines can mess with in this game.

As for Wuhu most of us have seemed ok with it so far for Season 2.

 

[SnorlaxPie500]

Most places in other regions prefer or even CP to Duck Hunt over any other neutral. Only problem I see with the stage is the tree for characters like Mac + Ganon and maybe ducks getting in way for projectiles. I'd imagine you'd want this stage since it benefits Diddy greatly.

Slush, that's how counterpicks work. You are trying to gain a significant edge. So it doesn't surprise me that other regions CP to Duck Hunt over other neutrals. And like you mentioned, there are characters who absolutely suffer on this stage and characters who "benefit greatly".
I try not to let whether or not my character benefits be the logic for picking the neutral stages.

Otherwise Lylat's wonky edges, the tilting and for some reason the two engines in this game messes with so much **** now as well. From cancelling dashes or Dash attacks, shielding on it and randomly falling/air tumble animation, to pikachu going through it with QA.
And god knows what else those engines can mess with in this game.

Yes, the edges and tilting can be problematic. For every character. Still more neutral than Duck Hunt. I'm not arguing the stage doesn't have issues. But it doesn't have issues that destroy characters as much as Duck Hunt or benefit characters as much as Duck Hunt. That should be fairly obvious to you.

As for Wuhu most of us have seemed ok with it so far for Season 2.

That's fine. I still want that stage to die.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Slush, that's how counterpicks work. You are trying to gain a significant edge. So it doesn't surprise me that other regions CP to Duck Hunt over other neutrals.

Striking starters is basically counterpicking. For example whether projectile based characters or Little mac gets FD passed or not greatly favors them in even just striking the first 4 stages.

Yes, the edges and tilting can be problematic. For every character. Still more neutral than Duck Hunt. I'm not arguing the stage doesn't have issues. But it doesn't have issues that destroy characters as much as Duck Hunt or benefit characters as much as Duck Hunt. That should be fairly obvious to you.

Nah the more I look at Lylat the more I feel it's worse than Duck hunt. Saying Lylat doesn't **** over characters is wrong, especially since the ledge is a big factor for literally everyone except teleporting characters like Sheik Palutena etc.

Otherwise only person who chooses that stage is Incendiary and everyone else bans it or Halberd and it's never picked anyways.
Depending who all eventually gets on an ihop table after one of the weekly's near the end of the season to talk about Season 2, maybe talk about 7 starters with DH and Delfino in it just like brawl having 7 at the time.

 

[Teshie U]

Why am I not ranked?

Pj beat everyone, why is he not ranked?

 

[Sinister Slush]

I wouldn't be surprised if DH would've been a Starter if NJ and other states that follow suit didn't wanna kill the scene and did 3 starters only.

Also need to enter two tournaments, rite now waiting for Espy to eventually answer if people that're ranked were still gaining/losing points to one time entrees so far.

 

[SnorlaxPie500]

Striking starters is basically counterpicking. For example whether projectile based characters or Little mac gets FD passed or not greatly favors them in even just striking the first 4 stages.


Nah the more I look at Lylat the more I feel it's worse than Duck hunt. Saying Lylat doesn't **** over characters is wrong, especially since the ledge is a big factor for literally everyone except teleporting characters like Sheik Palutena etc.

Yes you can look at it like counterpicking. And the goal should be to put the most neutral options on the table for the stage striking process. PS2(no transformations) > Lylat > Duck Hunt

I didnt didn't say Lylat doesn't **** over other characters. I said, " I'm not arguing the stage doesn't have issues. But it doesn't have issues that destroy characters as much as Duck Hunt or benefit characters as much as Duck Hunt."

I think you are letting personal preference get in the way of you understanding the logic behind the argument. Either way, I don't know how many people would consider DH over PS2 which no transformations as a more neutral choice and that should be the point. We can argue Lylat and DH at Ihop. I would be happy to partake in those conversations.

 

[Paw]

why doesn't everyone just play on smashville

 

[SnorlaxPie500]

Because I strike it

 

[Sinister Slush]

Well I mean, my previous points has been lylat gives no advantages to anyone which is a good reason to keep it as Starter, but it also gives disadvantages to every single character in the game because the three things I mentioned.
No hazards is one thing, but having three major things, especially one involving recovery problems and another with just the bottom of lylat possibly ****ing people up solely from the two engines is dreadful.

It also can't be personal Perference when I've never even played on Duck Hunt in tournament. I just find DH a better flat stage with a platform or two and a dog in the way that's easily noticable when you actually play the stage over Lylat's random engine shenanigans now in this game and crossing your fingers hoping your character will grab the tilting ledges.

Even with this thread with the tilting info and all, it's too much to memorize compared to most stages and it's about as silly to deal with than people pushing for Gamer to be a CP.

why doesn't everyone just play on smashville

We already do that tho

 

[Zajice]

Remove Smashville from the neutral stage list.

 

[Suspect]

Nike, does your gf still work at bjs? I'm here getting drunk.

 

[Jopan1026]

To the people that are talking about stage lists, I found this video pretty helpful.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQH_LUdkfkY

Now, I'm not saying the people discussing the stage lists are new, or don't know what they are doing, but just throwing this out there to maybe give a grounds for discussing and making sure everybody is on the same page.

It discusses why a stage nobody picks would ever be on the neutral stage list, why neutral stages aren't necessarily neutral, and the goals of a stage list. Whatever happens with the stage list, I believe a lot more thought than I am currently willing to put in to it is needed.

Anyways, hopefully that video can help people a little shy of having input for stage lists gather their thoughts.

 

[Espy Rose]

Are you ******** blind, Tesh?
Read the notes before the ELO chart. You need to have competed in at least two tournaments to be put on the rankings.
Everyone has an ELO that has entered a LOS thus far, but only the ones on the current chart have gone to more than one event.

Jesus christ.

 

[HeroMystic]

It's nice to know that losing match doesn't make me drop through rankings like a brick anymore.

 

[Zano]

hi guys

**** paw

 

[Espy Rose]

You know, all this stage crap wouldn't be a problem if we just used FLSS.

 

[Valdens]

You know, all this stage crap wouldn't be a problem if we just used FLSS.

I 10000000000000% support this

 

[Sinister Slush]

I strike Fire red and Leaf green and choose Soul Silver.

 

[SnorlaxPie500]

Paw advancing the meta. Look how fast this noob gets onstage.

Www.streamable.com/k6bo