Roy and Chrom Neutral B is stupid

[Draviex]

Does anyone else think being able to cancel out of neutral special is a stupid thing? I usually don't like calling for nerfs, but this seems more like a bug.

 

[Hayyner]

How do you cancel neutral B with them? I've never seen this before

 

[Draviex]

How do you cancel neutral B with them? I've never seen this before

You just press or hold any button right afterwards. If you save your replay. You can see frame by frame that it cancels right back into any attack. Even itself. I saw many players do this online and I have tried it out for myself.

 

[Seraphim.]

Flare Blade having low cooldown isn't a bug, that's how the move worked in Smash 4. Roy players usually use the move as a bait to get people to approach.

 

[Forblazen]

Flare blade is a bad move lol it only really works if your opponent has 0 patience

 

[Draviex]

Flare blade is a bad move lol it only really works if your opponent has 0 patience

Could you help me get around it? I saw a guy spam it online over and over again. I sat at the ledge for like 20 seconds waiting. He would also cancel it into upsmash or up tilt if i tried to jump. I don't know what to do. Also, I wouldn't call it low cooldown since the animation is being cancelled. I looked frame by frame.

 

[REZERO]

Its not too bad. people try to bait with it but it doesn't work if you know they're doing it. Its easy to punish if you prep while they're holding b.

 

[Forblazen]

Could you help me get around it? I saw a guy spam it online over and over again. I sat at the ledge for like 20 seconds waiting. He would also cancel it into upsmash or up tilt if i tried to jump. I don't know what to do. Also, I wouldn't call it low cooldown since the animation is being cancelled. I looked frame by frame.

If he's on range of being able to hit you, then you should have zero issue attacking from the ledge

in this game ledge attacks have full invulnerability through the whole attack (But has vulnerability on endlag), so if he hits you as you attack he wont be able to kill you and youll be able to hit him

otherwise they're the same as if they were standing waiting for your option

 

[GdspdUblkprzdnt]

If he's on range of being able to hit you, then you should have zero issue attacking from the ledge

in this game ledge attacks have full invulnerability through the whole attack (But has vulnerability on endlag), so if he hits you as you attack he wont be able to kill you and youll be able to hit him

otherwise they're the same as if they were standing waiting for your option

Unrelated to the topic but do you know where I can find all the info on ledge options like what you just shared

 

[Forblazen]

Unrelated to the topic but do you know where I can find all the info on ledge options like what you just shared

I did it out of my own testing, but I have no means of recording footage

but you can try for yourself! You will never trade when you attack from a ledge getup if you are in reach

 

[Deleted member]

You just press or hold any button right afterwards. If you save your replay. You can see frame by frame that it cancels right back into any attack. Even itself. I saw many players do this online and I have tried it out for myself.

I never knew this and Im trying to pick up Chrom as a new character. Thanks for the tip!

 

[Lanny]

You just press or hold any button right afterwards. If you save your replay. You can see frame by frame that it cancels right back into any attack. Even itself. I saw many players do this online and I have tried it out for myself.

I tried this and it doesn't seem to work? Like hitting A right after releasing B, before, before and holding, jumping, shielding, I just stay in the charge animation until I release B. Can you find or upload a video of this because I've never seen it before and it seems pretty useful if it's real.

 

[Koby_T]

It doesn't cancel. It has 21 frames of end lag after the final hitbox of the attack (hitboxes are active on frame 21-24). I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't totally go back to neutral position before being able to throw out another attack.

Given the range and lack of end lag, you definitely won't be able to whiff punish it. Only characters with the fastest movement and/or projectiles will be able to pull that off. You can shield, jump, or respect it in neutral.

On the ledge you can attack or roll if he's close, or jump if he's standing back. Double jump if he throws out another attack after your first jump.

This attack does not "cancel." It has 21 frames of endlag.

 

[Draviex]

I tried this and it doesn't seem to work? Like hitting A right after releasing B, before, before and holding, jumping, shielding, I just stay in the charge animation until I release B. Can you find or upload a video of this because I've never seen it before and it seems pretty useful if it's real.

I was mistaken. I mistook first active frame for the cancel. As Koby_T above me said it has 21 frames of end lag. I mistook the awkward animation as a cancel. Still a little difficult to punish as it is a good ledgetrap bait. But it does have a 21 frames of end lag.

 

[Fell God]

Speaking of cancelling, I sure wish we could shield cancel it

 

[MERPIS]

Its good for ledge and b reverse but thats about it. Its a little too slow to be used for anything else

 

[Lanny]

Its good for ledge and b reverse but thats about it. Its a little too slow to be used for anything else

b-reversed neutral b feels so sick but the payoff to difficultly of execution just isn't there IMO. I never find myself in a situation where it's better than just dash out then back in f-tilt or brair.

 

[AlaGORY]

Could you help me get around it? I saw a guy spam it online over and over again. I sat at the ledge for like 20 seconds waiting. He would also cancel it into upsmash or up tilt if i tried to jump. I don't know what to do. Also, I wouldn't call it low cooldown since the animation is being cancelled. I looked frame by frame.

Assuming youre on the ledge, either attack quickly, jump over it or space yourself just outside of its range and throw out a safe poking move/projectile. One way or another you have to respect it. Its a powerful move that can be released at any time with very little cool down. Respect it accordingly.

 

[SHIKI 屍鬼]

I use neutral b to get a reaction or psych them out a bit in hopes of punishing them.
Example: If someone approaches me mid-air, I charge my neutral b to intimidate them to use an air dodge or use one of their jumps to punish them.

 

[Oniperson]

While we're on the subject of Roy/Chrome neutral B there's something I'd been meaning to ask about for a while now. Around the time of release I was playing around with the skid canceling mechanic and found that with proper timing you could get Flare Blade to do this weird grounded wavebounce/wavedash looking kind of thing. I have not seen this performed or mentioned anywhere outside of my dark and lonely basement (granted I have not looked very hard) I don't know if this is old news or not so I figured I would bring it up now and ask about it. So, what is this?

gfy for reference.
https://gfycat.com/scarceaccomplishedhoverfly

i am not sorry for the potato quality

 

[Batzanova McMackin]

I actually would argue Flare Blade has a really nifty ledge trap use, in that if you stand just far enough away, so the opponent can't t reach you with a ledge getup attack, and charge it, you get 3 options if you read them right: if they try to jump from the ledge, you can release Flare Blade and go straight into a SH Fair, which should connect if you let FB go right as they jumped; if they try to wait you out and ledge hang, you just let FB reach full charge, and OHK them when the explosion Hitbox catches them on the ledge; of you read a roll-in from the ledge, you simply reverse FB, and let it go as they roll behind you. This last option can consistently kill at reasonable percents, and can also shield break if you've charged it enough and they shield it in time. You can also use FB as you fall to challenge certain air approaches, but this last use is pretty risky. Overall, I would say Flare Blade is best for mind games, and a bait move, as other have said, but it can defs be a devastating ledge trap tool when you use it right, and you've got a good psychological read on your opponent.