Media Ridley Match Analyses, Tips/Discussion

Gleam

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 7, 2008
Messages
508
Location
Burlington, NC
#41
The good thing is that pretty much anything Ridley does can counter Gordo, it is a double edged sword of things and something Dedede obviously has to be careful with using. When it comes to the far reaching Gordos, Nair is of course always a nice option to cover yourself but I find Fair to be a surprisingly nice action against Gordo. It may not cover as wide an area as say Nair but it's multi-hitting face means you've got more chances to actually hit the Gordo.

Another thing to try and utilize is a multi-hitting fireball, 3-4 blasts or so. Not only does one fireball alone reflect Gordo but multi-hitting fireballs cuts off Dedede's options and approach. I know many Dedede's like to do the whole "Gordo+Inhale" but again fireballs can cover the distance, priority and put pressure on Dedede from keeping from properly reacting.

The thing is, you take out Gordo and Dedede honestly doesn't have the tools to deal with Ridley. He can't beat him on the ground, he can't beat him in the air, he an arguably even worse comboed character than Ridley is. Gordo, much like K. Rool's Blunderbuss is a gimmick and without experience, can feel very forceful and pressuring. Take your time and be patience because when you get down to it, you have the tools to beat Dedede but if you get too aggressive you begin playing into Dedede's game.

Don't feel threatened to maybe make some space between you and Dedede if its getting to hectic.

Those are my suggestions when dealing with Dedede and specifically Gordo. If you're feeling pressured, make some distance and return that same pressure with multi-hitting fireballs. There's almost nothing Dedede can do about it because of his relatively poor movement and doesn't have the options to really deal with it. Fireballs are something I feel whose applicability outside of edge guarding has become more pronounced. This is still a projectile, a multi-hitting projectile that forces or cancels out different approaches, can lead to combos and essentially cuts off options.

I recently fought one of the Belmonts who went with the tried and classic, chuck everything at you from a distance to try and force your approach. Now in the past, I'd be trying to do all kinds of Nairs and Bairs. Until it hit me with the simplicity of a squeaky hammer. Why should I be forced to approach when I can make some distance and lob fireballs?

Suddenly, that Belmont Strategy fell completely apart. They didn't have the priority, number, distance, etc to deal with multiple fireballs at the same time. Now it was like, hey, I'm not the one who has to approach now, you are. I can make some nice distance and there's not one thing you can do that can force me over there Belmont. I could return equal to greater pressure on Belmont, using my own projectile to force him to approach and cut off options while adding pressure.

I think you'll see that Dedede is similar to that. The lack of experience+being too aggressive can make the match feel harder than it really is but once you learn, you realize it's not as hard you first believed. K-Rool and the already mentioned Belmonts were the same for me.

I got destroyed by things like Crown+Blunderbuss or "Throw your entire weapons collection" of the Belmonts. It took some time but I realized I had more options under my belt than just trying to approach something haphazardly. King K. Rool now I think is one of the easier matchups for Ridley and nowhere near as problematic as it might have felt in the past. Belmonts can still be troublesome in some ways too, I'd argue a lot more than K. Rool but being able to effectively cut off their options helped greatly.
 

ChrisMDB

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jan 6, 2019
Messages
8
#43
Shulk is... well he's an animu swordwaifu and like every other one in the game they're tough nuts to crack while using Ridley. Step one: Never approach them unless you know you can land a hit. Every move they have outranges everything we have (aside from Plasma Breath, but that's not advisable in neutral against quick opponents). Make them approach, and try to bait risky options out of them so you can get a punish. 'Cheesing' them by the ledge with Space Pirate Rush and dunking them for the great stage spike is a fantastic way to get easy kills on a ton of characters, all of the swordfighters included. It may feel cheap, but sometimes all a character has going for itself in a matchup is a cheap gimmick, and if you need to use it to win then you probably should.

Try to take advantage of poor Monado management if your opponent isn't great with it as well, Ridley is the king of punishment and you'll need to punish every mistake they make to win some of these bad matchups.

With that being said I think Shulk is one of the easier swordfighters to fight, certainly not as gross as Chrom or Lucina (mostly Chrom being actual garbage in the meta right now with his suicide-to-win strats).
 

Ridley_Prime

Proteus Geoform
Premium
Joined
Sep 18, 2007
Messages
7,706
3DS FC
0774-4845-6886
NNID
AlphaWarDragon87
Switch FC
SW-7888-8563-5773
#44
While I hate K. Rool’s nerfing and what it represents, suppose it should be pointed out now that his up B is more reliable to challenge with Wing Blitz as a result, rather than hoping you spike a recovering Rool with d-air by some miracle/lucky shot (not to mention safer since you can snap to the ledge after a Wing Blitz).
 
Joined
Dec 11, 2015
Messages
21
Location
CSTAT
#45
How should Ridley go about dealing with Dedede Gordo pressure? He's got a large frame and they travel in difficult trajectories and can juggle into itself, I played a few matches against a Dedede and it felt like I got turned into a magnet for the things. It especially made edge-guarding difficult since they were often able to shut down my approach off-stage.
The best way I have found to deal with Gordos is to simply nair or fair them. Fair is out of a long time and nair has a huge hitbox, so both are pretty good options. F-tilt is good at sending them back aswell in the neutral. However, the best thing to do would be to parry them. Honestly, you just have to play really patiently and punish when he throws one out with something like that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6mFNkJCKjUI&t=2s

I'd love some input on my play.
 

ChrisMDB

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jan 6, 2019
Messages
8
#46
Krakatoa:

First, fantastic job in that set. Yeah it may have not turned out the way you wanted it to, but you put up a great fight. I'm not very familiar with the Villager/Isabelle matchup myself; their recovery is near impossible to edgeguard in my experience (taking away one of our big strengths in most matchups) and Lloyd Rockets/slingshots are very oppressive. Parrying as you did in that set is a great way to deal with either when they aren't expecting you to but I'm not sure if it's a complete solution to the problem. F-Tilt looks like a great way to deal with rockets, and Nair may be a great way to deal with the slingshots while approaching (not totally sure about it, I'll try it later today). I do think there were a couple of times in the matchup where you could have gone for a Space Pirate Rush to nab some great damage and potentially a few kills, although judging by your play in the set reads don't really seem to be your thing.

I think this matchup really comes down to where it's played. On Lylat you seemed to have things under control, but once Smashville was brought into the equation things got a bit out of hand. If WarioWare or Castle Siege are legal in your tournaments ruleset I'd try them out, as they're too small for Visabelle to constantly run from you and you'll kill at insanely early percents. On larger stages, and even more medium ones like Smashville, it looks like the matchup just gets a little too oppressive. Having small plats allows you to apply consistent pressure which is likely why Lylat was a better venture than Smashville, although they can always camp off-stage like we saw in game three on Battlefield.

Overall I think you played very well though (certainly better than I've ever managed since Melee, lol) and this matchup may just be one of those ones that are super bad for Ridley.


On a side note: recently I've noticed that I'm having increasingly more issues when facing Wolf (possibly because everyone and their mother seems to be picking the space furries up). Any tips for the MU? I can combo and gimp him for days, but his laser is one of the most annoying things to deal with in any iteration of Smash (while probably being the best projectile in game tbh).
 

E.G.G.M.A.N.

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 14, 2007
Messages
300
#47
I'm not very familiar with the Villager/Isabelle matchup myself; their recovery is near impossible to edgeguard in my experience (taking away one of our big strengths in most matchups)
I always found theirs to be one of the easiest ones to edge guard; it follows a predictible flight path, has no hitbox, and grows weaker when used in succession. Is it because they're hugging the side of the stage? You can up-b spike them right through those balloons with the proper timing.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

ChrisMDB

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jan 6, 2019
Messages
8
#48
I always found theirs to be one of the easiest ones to edge guard; it follows a predictible flight path, has no hitbox, and grows weaker when used in succession. Is it because they're hugging the side of the stage? You can up-b spike them right through those balloons with the proper timing.
I'm not sure why exactly, every time I try to hit them I usually only manage to hit a single balloon. If I practice the matchup more I'll probably figure it out, I rarely see Villager/Isabelle players.
 

Predatoria

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 30, 2019
Messages
150
Location
Raleigh, North Carolina
#49
I was at a smash house party last night and was struggling to make Ridley proud against a friend of mine who plays Cloud. He's become quite good with Cloud. I used to beat him previous weeks but last night he had definitely stepped up his game and I was struggling near the end of the night to beat him.

I'll try and summarize some of the key points I was having the most difficulty with in hopes of some advice on the Ridley vs Cloud matchup:

I had a hard time maintaining the stage. As soon as he'd get me up in the air or off the edge of the stage, I had a difficult time getting my footing back.

For ledge guarding, he'd typically stand just far enough back such that a get up attack would miss him, and then would either punish my get up by hitting me off again (short hop forward / neutral, or a side B, I believe were his frequent choices), or would jump and forward air me, which seemed to beat out my neutral air if I jumped to climb back onto the stage. I ended up getting hit off the edge again many times just trying to get back onto the stage, where he'd rack up even more damage by either doing his green projectile thing or occasionally jumping off to forward-air me. If I tried to space pirate rush him while he stood near the stage ledge, he'd punish it with either a short hop forward air or his side B wall of sword slicing thing he does, and he was able to pick up on when I'd try this option and punish it. This brings a question I have. How do you get back on stage from a disadvantaged state against Cloud?

Against the others I was playing with last night, I was landing a whole lot of predictive side smashes by side smashing where I thought they'd land, roll, or approach into. With Cloud, however, he'd always approach me with a down air, and that sword thing he does with his down air seemed to hit me out of an attempt at side smashing. He'd nearly always have his down air active any time he was falling, taking away my ability to try to predict and punish his landing, or contest him while he was up in the air with up airs, up tilts, side smashes on his landing, or anything else I could think of. He seemed uncontestable while in the air to me and I wasn't really sure what to do about it. How do you contest cloud from below when he's falling? Is it doable? This was particularly problematic on platforms where his down aerial would even hit me if I stood below and tried to hit with up tilt or up smash.

Lastly, I had a hard time contesting him in neutral. I think I really need to work on my ground game, as I do tend to jump too often, but even still, I had a difficult time dealing with his side B, his projectile, and his hopping aerials he'd frequently do. He'd often get me up in the air and once I was there, I had a very rough time getting back down to the ground. He'd hit me from below, would punish my air dodges, and I felt like I didn't really have an option to get my feet back on the ground and would often result to fleeing to a ledge hang, which led to the problems I had in my first point. How do you typically maintain your ground and fight Cloud in neutral?


I unfortunately don't have any videos of the matches. I was at a friend's house and it wasn't on my Switch. I want to beat him next week, and want to train up some more.
 

Firox

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 7, 2019
Messages
225
#50
I was at a smash house party last night and was struggling to make Ridley proud against a friend of mine who plays Cloud. He's become quite good with Cloud. I used to beat him previous weeks but last night he had definitely stepped up his game and I was struggling near the end of the night to beat him.

I'll try and summarize some of the key points I was having the most difficulty with in hopes of some advice on the Ridley vs Cloud matchup:

I had a hard time maintaining the stage. As soon as he'd get me up in the air or off the edge of the stage, I had a difficult time getting my footing back.

For ledge guarding, he'd typically stand just far enough back such that a get up attack would miss him, and then would either punish my get up by hitting me off again (short hop forward / neutral, or a side B, I believe were his frequent choices), or would jump and forward air me, which seemed to beat out my neutral air if I jumped to climb back onto the stage. I ended up getting hit off the edge again many times just trying to get back onto the stage, where he'd rack up even more damage by either doing his green projectile thing or occasionally jumping off to forward-air me. If I tried to space pirate rush him while he stood near the stage ledge, he'd punish it with either a short hop forward air or his side B wall of sword slicing thing he does, and he was able to pick up on when I'd try this option and punish it. This brings a question I have. How do you get back on stage from a disadvantaged state against Cloud?

Against the others I was playing with last night, I was landing a whole lot of predictive side smashes by side smashing where I thought they'd land, roll, or approach into. With Cloud, however, he'd always approach me with a down air, and that sword thing he does with his down air seemed to hit me out of an attempt at side smashing. He'd nearly always have his down air active any time he was falling, taking away my ability to try to predict and punish his landing, or contest him while he was up in the air with up airs, up tilts, side smashes on his landing, or anything else I could think of. He seemed uncontestable while in the air to me and I wasn't really sure what to do about it. How do you contest cloud from below when he's falling? Is it doable? This was particularly problematic on platforms where his down aerial would even hit me if I stood below and tried to hit with up tilt or up smash.

Lastly, I had a hard time contesting him in neutral. I think I really need to work on my ground game, as I do tend to jump too often, but even still, I had a difficult time dealing with his side B, his projectile, and his hopping aerials he'd frequently do. He'd often get me up in the air and once I was there, I had a very rough time getting back down to the ground. He'd hit me from below, would punish my air dodges, and I felt like I didn't really have an option to get my feet back on the ground and would often result to fleeing to a ledge hang, which led to the problems I had in my first point. How do you typically maintain your ground and fight Cloud in neutral?


I unfortunately don't have any videos of the matches. I was at a friend's house and it wasn't on my Switch. I want to beat him next week, and want to train up some more.
I play both Cloud AND Ridley as secondaries, so let me weigh in on this. Due to Ridley's terrible Dair and lack of range on his Nair, I would unfortunately have to say that the worst place for Ridley is above Cloud. Cloud's up air has stupid range and priority. Few if any aerials can trump it without some serious disjoint. My best advice would be to use your extra jumps to fake out where you're going to land, then hit him with a Fair or Bair.

As for contesting his down air, again, you can't. It has some of the craziest disjoint in the game, hence why many experienced players will often cover their landings with it. The secret is to take advantage of its super long duration. Cloud is going to be locked into that position for a significant amount of time, especially if used early in his descent. Use foxtrots and dash dances to throw off his aim, then hit him with Fair or Bair from the side or punish the landing with pivot smash.

For neutral, DON'T FORGET about your plasma breath. If you have enough distance, it will tear through his blade beams all day. Also, you can cancel many of his approaches with either Dtilt or Fair. Learn his favorite approaches and counter accordingly. Your Ftilt and Dtilt can outrange him and are pretty quick so don't be shy about using them.

Lastly, how to deal with the edgeguarding. Unfortunately, you don't have a lot of options once you're hanging from the ledge, but if HE'S the one on the ledge...oh, baby. Ridley can absolutely destroy Cloud when it comes to edgeguarding. Plasma breath alone does the job easy due to how terrible his recovery is, but you can also spam Fair to catch his jump off stage. My favorite combo is to grab him near the ledge, down throw into Fair, then fast fall into another fair and then Up B backwards to the stage. Guaranteed kill. My last nugget of advice for trying to overcome his edgeguarding would be to feint a jump back onto the stage and then instead grab him with side B. This will ganoncide you under the stage but you can jump cancel at the last second and recover while he's left to die like a chump. Good luck to you, fellow space pirate.
 

Predatoria

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jan 30, 2019
Messages
150
Location
Raleigh, North Carolina
#51
I play both Cloud AND Ridley as secondaries, so let me weigh in on this. Due to Ridley's terrible Dair and lack of range on his Nair, I would unfortunately have to say that the worst place for Ridley is above Cloud. Cloud's up air has stupid range and priority. Few if any aerials can trump it without some serious disjoint. My best advice would be to use your extra jumps to fake out where you're going to land, then hit him with a Fair or Bair.

As for contesting his down air, again, you can't. It has some of the craziest disjoint in the game, hence why many experienced players will often cover their landings with it. The secret is to take advantage of its super long duration. Cloud is going to be locked into that position for a significant amount of time, especially if used early in his descent. Use foxtrots and dash dances to throw off his aim, then hit him with Fair or Bair from the side or punish the landing with pivot smash.

For neutral, DON'T FORGET about your plasma breath. If you have enough distance, it will tear through his blade beams all day. Also, you can cancel many of his approaches with either Dtilt or Fair. Learn his favorite approaches and counter accordingly. Your Ftilt and Dtilt can outrange him and are pretty quick so don't be shy about using them.

Lastly, how to deal with the edgeguarding. Unfortunately, you don't have a lot of options once you're hanging from the ledge, but if HE'S the one on the ledge...oh, baby. Ridley can absolutely destroy Cloud when it comes to edgeguarding. Plasma breath alone does the job easy due to how terrible his recovery is, but you can also spam Fair to catch his jump off stage. My favorite combo is to grab him near the ledge, down throw into Fair, then fast fall into another fair and then Up B backwards to the stage. Guaranteed kill. My last nugget of advice for trying to overcome his edgeguarding would be to feint a jump back onto the stage and then instead grab him with side B. This will ganoncide you under the stage but you can jump cancel at the last second and recover while he's left to die like a chump. Good luck to you, fellow space pirate.
I appreciate the reply! I am, admittedly, glad to know my struggles against Cloud's aerials were legitimate.

It sounds like I'll just have to respect these options of his and work around it to the best I can and mix up my options or change a bit of my play around his, rather than challenging his aerials directly.

I've definitely gotten him off-stage many, many times, sometimes even from 0 with similar combos to what you describe here. I'm curious, though, why the fastfall on the second forward air? I do know that sometimes he's able to get out by air dodging after my first forward air, leaving me unable to follow up with a second forward (or neutral) air. Does it help with that?

He is legitimately scared of my Ridley when he's off the stage because he knows I'm going to chase after him and screw his recovery up. It's actually one of my favorite things about Ridley's playstyle, that he is so good at devouring swordsmen when they're off-stage. Sometimes the tricky part is merely getting them off-stage in the first place!
 

Firox

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 7, 2019
Messages
225
#52
I appreciate the reply! I am, admittedly, glad to know my struggles against Cloud's aerials were legitimate.

It sounds like I'll just have to respect these options of his and work around it to the best I can and mix up my options or change a bit of my play around his, rather than challenging his aerials directly.

I've definitely gotten him off-stage many, many times, sometimes even from 0 with similar combos to what you describe here. I'm curious, though, why the fastfall on the second forward air? I do know that sometimes he's able to get out by air dodging after my first forward air, leaving me unable to follow up with a second forward (or neutral) air. Does it help with that?

He is legitimately scared of my Ridley when he's off the stage because he knows I'm going to chase after him and screw his recovery up. It's actually one of my favorite things about Ridley's playstyle, that he is so good at devouring swordsmen when they're off-stage. Sometimes the tricky part is merely getting them off-stage in the first place!
Heck yeah he should be scared of Ridley off-stage. That space pirate is one of the most brutal edgeguarders in the game. Even if you don't have enough time to chase ppl offstage, one of my favorite kill moves is to space a down smash at the ledge. Ridley's wings have ABSURD reach and power, not to mention the hitbox can extend below the stage. Since Cloud can't snap the ledge without limit break, you can destroy him with a well timed down smash.

As for the fast fall Fair off-stage, I recommended it due to the fact that most characters will try to recover low because there's less chance you will pursue given your limited recovery options. Their only real option for survival would be a air dodge through you in hopes that the end lag would wear off in time for them to Up B back to the ledge. Also, when I say fast fall Fair, I mean that immediately after the first Fair you drop down and then Fair again with your second jump. By jumping into the second Fair, it effectively increases the sweep of your hit box because it adds a vertical element to it. This decreases the chances of your opponent escaping. Sorry if the reasoning sounds overly complicated but the technique basically makes it easier to wall off opponents. If you friend happens to always jump after the first Fair, then disregard the fast fall and just jump again into Fair. As always, adjust your strategy to your opponent.

P.S. Yeah, you were never alone in dealing with Cloud's aerials. In my experience, the only characters that can consistently challenge them are other swordies.
 
Top