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[Hxey]

Hxey submitted a new guide:

Basic but reliable Pacman setups and strings - Pacman,strategy,setups,traps,kill,options

Hello, all. I just wanted to share a few really easy-to-do tricks that I use with Pacman nearly every game with success. I'm gonna try to avoid mentioning any stuff that I've seen in other threads of this nature. These are things I came up with just by playing the game and understanding the basic options of my character, but sorry if I mention anyone else's tactic here. Let's begin.


Dash attack options - In my...

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[Direspect only!]

Side b is probably the worst thing you can go for off a dash attack, also, u tilt is kind of eh, I would recomend up b, because it's frame 1, also dash attack is by no means your best approach option. IMO fair or spaced nair, or a thrown fruit, if you always dash attack, you're going to get hit, and they can also hit you out of it before you even get to them.

 

[Hxey]

Eh, spaced nair is decent but fair is useless for approaching until high %. It has essentially no hitstun or knock back at the beginning of the stock. And side b is very useful out of dash attack. I get KOs with it fairly often and even if I miss it's good pressure with little risk. The higher the % you hit the dash attack, the easier it'll be to connect the side b. Basically at the beginning of the stock, you should be going for a lot of dash attack to bell because it's guaranteed. Then, at the later %s you should start going for the dash attack to side b kill. If you do it unexpectedly, your opponent will jump right into it if your aim is right.

Also, idk why you'd recommended something I clearly recommended doing (up b), but thanks for the "feedback".

 

[Direspect only!]

Your job is to punish them and not get hit. Aka bait and punish.dash attack is a hail Mary, which is safe ish, but you have to commit to it, which is bad. Nair and fair, you can pull back whenever you want, or you cross up shield and be completely safe

 

[dragontamer]

Fair is a bad option below 40% in my experience. After 40%, you can Fair -> Double jump or Fair->Hydrant relatively safely against a grounded opponent, and beat out most of your opponent's counter-attacks.

PacMan's best approach options are running shield, Foxtrot-dance'd Dash Attacks (mixup with Foxtrot Dance FSmashes for spacing lulz and kills, Foxtrot Dance Trampoline for shield punish, and foxtrot dance backwards charge fruit to "pressure" your opponent into charging into your traps), and shorthop Fairs (instantly executed so that you can autocancel properly, land into a jab-jab-jab).

That's my neutral strategy in a nutshell.

 

[Hxey]

That fair>hydrant thing seems really useful for getting one out safely. Thanks. I recently learned that if you run off a hydrant, hit a fair, then land in front of the hydrant and jab 3 your opponent, the water will push you in the same region as where they land, just before they exit hitstun. I've gotten really dope looking setups like jab 3>grab and jab 3>usmash. It's just a string, not a guarantee but it's reliable if you don't abuse it and if you use it at the right %s. I would say around 30-50 depending on the character is the optimal time to try to get a grab off of it.

If I combine fair>hydrant with that, it'll look awesome if done quickly and unexpectedly enough

It would be like -- fair>hydrant>run off fair>jab 3>water pushes you>usmash or bell or something

 

[PEPESPAIN]

DA to sideB is too risky. Don't use it

 

[Hxey]

Sorry to disagree with the guru of Pacman, but I hit it all the time haha The key is to let them fall a bit after the hitstun of dash attack and throw it out unexpectedly. A lot of people jump right into it. If they airdodge, of course you'll miss but you'll end up so high in the air you can respond before they can punish most times. I usually go with a fast falling nair, or a hydrant if I'm close enough to the ground to defend it.

 

[PEPESPAIN]

Can you show me a vine or video of this?

I tried it a lot when I started to play but I think that you can't use it at tournament level. I tried this once and Robin U-Air'ed me and I was killed with 70% gg, never tried again

 

[Hxey]

I don't really think I need a video to prove that it's possible to scare an opponent into making a stupid mistake that kills him. It happens in smash all the time. I believe they call it a mixup.

I'm not trying to say it's a guaranteed hit, or that you should use it every stock of every game -- just that it's a possible option that works if used properly. I explicitly explained that. And not all chars have a uair that kills even close to that early, so that Robin example is kind of weak. In most cases through my experience using this technique, you end up so high in the air it's extremely easy to respond. My guess is you probly could have dodged the uair easily if you reacted properly. Since we're asking for videos, do you happen to have that game recorded?

 

[xzx]

If an opponent can't punish PAC-MAN's side-b, then they are doing it wrong. PAC-MAN suffers a lot of endlag on that of a move that isn't even strong. The only time I see the opportunity to go for a Power Pellet KO is after a Bell or some off-stage jank.

 

[dragontamer]

I find that Side-B to punish the landing-lag of opponents when I predict that they're going to land on a high-platform (ex: top of Battlefield) can be useful... although risky. If I mis-predict, I definitely have at least lost the neutral and often times am KOed.

A B-reversal or something which changes the landing position slightly harms the strategy for sure. And then comes the fact that a ton of top-tier characters simply don't have landing-lag... so... not too useful vs them.

But I can't imagine ever using Side-B after dash attack effectively.

 

[Hxey]

It's okay. If you guys think it's too risky, don't use it. Maybe try one of my other tactics. Unless those are too risky too.

In which case try playing pacman like everyone else and fair for no reason all the time, run away after hits and charge fruit instead of following up, drop the hydrant from really high up as your only landing option, oh and z drop a lot. That's been super effective, clearly I wish you all luck.

 

[Hxey]

It's hilarious because you're all acting like it's impossible for the enemy to jump into it under the pressure of something unfamiliar. It literally happens for me at least once every other game. AT LEAST. You guys are either over thinking it or have really bad aim with side b. Your opponent is not a robot. He'll make stupid mistakes all match, just like you do. The key is to use it as a mixup. I don't know how else to put it. Stop mentioning the dash attack>side b and give me some of your master techniques, please lol

Also, that move is very strong and has super armor if you get the pellet so what the hell are you talking about, guy?

 

[PEPESPAIN]

I don't really think I need a video to prove that it's possible to scare an opponent into making a stupid mistake that kills him. It happens in smash all the time. I believe they call it a mixup.

I'm not trying to say it's a guaranteed hit, or that you should use it every stock of every game -- just that it's a possible option that works if used properly. I explicitly explained that. And not all chars have a uair that kills even close to that early, so that Robin example is kind of weak. In most cases through my experience using this technique, you end up so high in the air it's extremely easy to respond. My guess is you probly could have dodged the uair easily if you reacted properly. Since we're asking for videos, do you happen to have that game recorded?

You don't need to prove anything, you need to add videos or vines to your guide because it will improve it a lot , we'll understand how do you use it and maybe it is useful. We need to talk it, understand it and we'll see if it work. I just said that PAC-MAN sideB has a lot of ending lag and it is too risky but I can change my mind. I want to belive that we can use sideB outside recovery

 

[Hxey]

Yeah. When I'm able, I'll add visuals. I'm just in no rush to provide them to people who are telling me something that I use nearly every game is too risky and outlandish to ever be hit. Stuff like "it's too risky, don't use it" is really dismissive.

Obviously I miss sometimes when I use this technique. Obviously occasionally you'll be in scenarios where doing it will get you KO'd or hit. These are unnecessary statements that I clearly tried to outline in my explanation.

So if you're that curious about a technique you dismissed in your FIRST comment, either go test it until you get it right or wait patiently for my visuals. But don't say "No, it doesn't work. Give me a video" and then expect me to jump on it. It's especially funny because some of the techniques you teach on your own channel are extremely situational but can still be useful if used and timed properly as a mixup. Open your minds and stop limiting a character that already has to work twice as hard than most of the cast.

 

[Epok]

I have been experimenting with side be for ledge trumps and edge guarding/ stage spikes. The super armor can come in handy in that situation. Plus with people that are unfamiliar with Pac it may cause people to hesitate.

 

[WackySpinachAgate]

I really like the tricks and traps you presented in this guide. A couple tricks I think you could add would be ( entirely up to you if they sound practical at all):

1. If you can grab the melon and have done the melon trampoline trick before, something you could do for a mixup is to toss the melon up near them because if they shield you can go for a grab and toss them into it, while not the most safe move its good for catching an opponent who back rolls when you approach him.

2. Another trick is with the bell, toss down a hydrant and stand in front of it. When the water comes out and hits you toss the bell down and it will fly in an arc above you as the water pushes you. If they shield you grab if they don't then react as necessary.

 

[Hxey]

Wow that second one with the bell sound especially useful. I'll have to go practice that in battle. Sounds like it could lead to some good pressure and nice setups.

Thanks for the tricks, dude. I like both! I've seen that melon trick hit before and it looks awesome. Anyway, I'll be sure to add them on, along with a few more a little later.

 

[Prometheus_98]

Hxey not trying to shoot you down at all man, but the start up and end lag of side b means there are a bunch of better options, does it work? yeah, to an extent, is it the best ever, possible, womboiest comboiest punish in history? probably not. However not as an escape option, but as a potential follow up out of dash attack, I have used it to secure some dumb kills in for glory haha. I'm making a guide atm as well because there really isnt a solid one out there right no because unless you main pacman, you cant just slap a guide out on his moveset and say this is how you play him lol

Yeah. When I'm able, I'll add visuals. I'm just in no rush to provide them to people who are telling me something that I use nearly every game is too risky and outlandish to ever be hit. Stuff like "it's too risky, don't use it" is really dismissive.

 

[PEPESPAIN]

Yeah. When I'm able, I'll add visuals. I'm just in no rush to provide them to people who are telling me something that I use nearly every game is too risky and outlandish to ever be hit. Stuff like "it's too risky, don't use it" is really dismissive.

Obviously I miss sometimes when I use this technique. Obviously occasionally you'll be in scenarios where doing it will get you KO'd or hit. These are unnecessary statements that I clearly tried to outline in my explanation.

So if you're that curious about a technique you dismissed in your FIRST comment, either go test it until you get it right or wait patiently for my visuals. But don't say "No, it doesn't work. Give me a video" and then expect me to jump on it. It's especially funny because some of the techniques you teach on your own channel are extremely situational but can still be useful if used and timed properly as a mixup. Open your minds and stop limiting a character that already has to work twice as hard than most of the cast.

I say this because when I started to Main PAC-MAN I tried this A LOT (Really a lot), and finally the % of succes is not in our hand. That's why I say it. You can land this move once, but if you died 4 times doing this..... I won't use it.

About my techniques on my channel, I try to show everything I know , situational or not. Viewers will decide how to use it, when or who, I only show that exists.

I always talk about tournament level, and I asked about videos because maybe you do this on a different way I tried, maybe you jump before SideB or does a weird path that it is a true combo. My experience is if you miss a sideB in tournament level you are dead, or you will punish really, REALLY hard

But the answer is easy, do you see top level players like Zage, abadango (before leaving pac) , Tea, kool aid using sideB as an aggressive option?

 

[Hxey]

It seems to me like you're just arguing to argue now... I'm only trying to show what's possible too. It's the same thing as when you share a situational technique on your channel. It's up to the people to decide when this is okay to use. I NEVER MENTIONED TOURNAMENT LEVEL PLAY IN THIS GUIDE ONCE.

I simply am trying to share Pacman tactics, which may or may not work, depending on the situation. Same as you.

Also, no I don't see any Pacman mains at the high level using side b to kill off top. But I don't see any of those Pacman mains taking tournaments either. Probably because they all play the same safe-ass boring style Pacman. Sure Zage has good control of his character, but he has awful, repetitive habits and I hate watching him play.

I think Pacman has more potential than people have displayed at the "top" level. The best one was Abadango but even he was repetitive and struggled in certain MUs, due to the way he played.

Anyway, the point is I don't care how many times you tried and failed this tech and I don't care if no top players use it. It's worked MANY times for me and I even got top 8 at a local tourny last week using only Pacman. Used dash attack side-b at least 10 times that day, so it definitely can work at all levels of play. Maybe you just really suck at hitting it If you're getting punished to the point of death off a sibeb, you need to work on your common sense and not try to use a tech that was outlined as "risky" when you're close to KO percent.

Another example is I use Pacman's down A out of shield. THAT'S risky too, but I do it. And it works very well to catch inward rolls and rush ins. No top players use Pac's down a, but I still hit it every game. The point being, f*ck what they do, I'm developing my own playstyle with him. And it's working.

 

[Nu~]

It seems to me like you're just arguing to argue now... I'm only trying to show what's possible too. It's the same thing as when you share a situational technique on your channel. It's up to the people to decide when this is okay to use. I NEVER MENTIONED TOURNAMENT LEVEL PLAY IN THIS GUIDE ONCE.

I simply am trying to share Pacman tactics, which may or may not work, depending on the situation. Same as you.

Also, no I don't see any Pacman mains at the high level using side b to kill off top. But I don't see any of those Pacman mains taking tournaments either. Probably because they all play the same safe-*** boring style Pacman. Sure Zage has good control of his character, but he has awful, repetitive habits and I hate watching him play.

I think Pacman has more potential than people have displayed at the "top" level. The best one was Abadango but even he was repetitive and struggled in certain MUs, due to the way he played.

Anyway, the point is I don't care how many times you tried and failed this tech and I don't care if no top players use it. It's worked MANY times for me and I even got top 8 at a local tourny last week using only Pacman. Used dash attack side-b at least 10 times that day, so it definitely can work at all levels of play. Maybe you just really suck at hitting it If you're getting punished to the point of death off a sibeb, you need to work on your common sense and not try to use a tech that was outlined as "risky" when you're close to KO percent.

Another example is I use Pacman's down A out of shield. THAT'S risky too, but I do it. And it works very well to catch inward rolls and rush ins. No top players use Pac's down a, but I still hit it every game. The point being, f*ck what they do, I'm developing my own playstyle with him. And it's working.

I entirely agree with your belief that our "top Pac-Men" are repetitive and rather boring in the grand scheme of things (they don't make up creative, "out there" tricks anymore and stick to the same gameplan)

We should be going out and forming our own playstyle with him. I have developed an aggressive Pacman style of my own that was at first shot down, but now many people on these boards agree with.
Also, Dair is a criminally underrated move. It beats pellets in the mega man matchup making it easier to approach him.

I think too many people dismissed it completely instead of accepting it as a risky mixup. I don't see it working more than once on an opponent, but it can work no doubt. Probably not more than once on an opponent that learns from the first death tho lol. And a local isn't exactly the best way to prove your point here since the strength of local players varies greatly.
Personally, I find it to be an ok mixup but there is a better option.
DA-> FH Bell -> side B. Guaranteed and kills early.


No one's attacking you dog lol. No need for the hostility and passive aggression.
Instead, ride on and show them that Pac-Man has much more to offer .


Edit: OH! I might as well show some of my tech to add to the guide.

http://youtu.be/U2xbwiHT6fo
http://youtu.be/JaCkYr67HOM
http://youtu.be/m3yN2QGl0TI (ledge tech at 1:20 - 1:30 and 2:30 - 2:43)

 

[dragontamer]

Hxey : Your post is overly hostile. Please be more polite around here. If you think your technique is solid, then continue using it. But this forum exists for discussion, and every discussion has the chance of disagreement.

Consider this post as an official warning: please be more polite or else official mod actions will start.

For everyone else in this discussion, feel free to criticize the post but please be polite about it as well.

 

[Hxey]

I apologize. I tried to let it be known that I don't mind if other people don't use the technique but I do agree I was rather passive aggressive and... "hostile". I'll chill out.

Edit: Yo some of those bell strings were really creative. I like how you respond to the stun by chasing and don't just don't go for an fsmash. Some of your battlefield tech was smart as hell too. I liked that up b onto the platform at the beginning. When he hits the trampoline you're standing there ready to fsmash or tilt. It's a nice mixup option for sure.

To add to your bell knowledge, I recently learned that if you ledge drop and throw the bell towards the stage, it'll go through any stage (even walled stages!) and come up from underneath, hitting anyone trying to zone out a ledge attack or ledge roll. The only way for them to avoid the bell is to cover the regular ledge getup option because the bell doesn't reach there. Sorry if it's worded poorly, but if you understand it really is helpful when you're in a tight spot on the ledge or you wanna surprise your opponent.

Basically you just let go of the ledge when you're hanging, then throw the bell towards the stage. Different timings on the throw will work in different ways but in my experience it's best to throw it as soon as you can

 

[Nu~]

I apologize. I tried to let it be known that I don't mind if other people don't use the technique but I do agree I was rather passive aggressive and... "hostile". I'll chill out.

Edit: Yo some of those bell strings were really creative. I like how you respond to the stun by chasing and don't just don't go for an fsmash. Some of your battlefield tech was smart as hell too. I liked that up b onto the platform at the beginning. When he hits the trampoline you're standing there ready to fsmash or tilt. It's a nice mixup option for sure.

To add to your bell knowledge, I recently learned that if you ledge drop and throw the bell towards the stage, it'll go through any stage (even walled stages!) and come up from underneath, hitting anyone trying to zone out a ledge attack or ledge roll. The only way for them to avoid the bell is to cover the regular ledge getup option because the bell doesn't reach there. Sorry if it's worded poorly, but if you understand it really is helpful when you're in a tight spot on the ledge or you wanna surprise your opponent.

Basically you just let go of the ledge when you're hanging, then throw the bell towards the stage. Different timings on the throw will work in different ways but in my experience it's best to throw it as soon as you can

Thanks dude. And ah, yes I'm aware of that trick. The bell ignores all surfaces until it reaches its apex. I like to use it after conditioning my opponent into thinking that I'll roll in from the ledge every time. After rolling in twice, they'll try to punish it the next time you touch the ledge but will be met with a bell. Unfortunately, they can shield and catch the bell if they see it coming.

 

[Hxey]

Dude, that up b thing on battlefield is working extremely well for me. If you set a trampoline ledge trap (when the enemy is offstage) and land on the edge of the nearest platform after doing the up b, when your opponent hits it, his options are really limited. It's not a guaranteed kill, but at KO% I been hitting fsmashes out of it like crazy. They bounce right into it. If they start airdodging the fsmashes, bait the next one out and drop through the platform then upsmash during the landlag. Works amazing, thank you for the idea

Another one that's super solid is dash attack>fullhop>bell. I never thought to extend it with a jump once they got out of reach. It's makes doing sideb to punish the stun even more viable

 

[Hxey]

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