| Queensland Smash Meets | Meet @ Bob's house this weekend |

[Shaya]

Brawl is so good.

So is Cok.

 

[Bjay]

Not like that lol.

I meant, most of the stages that are or have been banned with the D3 rule in mind.

I.e Eldin.

I mean, imagine if Eldin was neutral stage.

EDIT: I say we unban stages that are helpful to us beating MK.

Eldin is counterpick/banned stage for other reasons as well, not just the D3 rule.

 

[CAOTIC]

A reason I find completely irrelevant to Australia. It apparently takes a long time, but I've had no such problems with the stage being selectable for so long.

 

[Yokai]

@ Moose: I knew it, your such a **** that you had to pick on my lack of smashing ability. people already know I suck, but im not trying to baw about that, im trying to HELP THE SMASH COMMUNITY in ways I see that would help.

IF YOU HADNT NOTICED I WASNT TRYING TO PUSH ANY IDEA. I WAS TRYING TO HELP NEW PEOPLE.

Learn to read.

Also, I was trying to just give this thread a little bit of direction, if you think that deserves to be flamed be my guest. The constant hate really makes me feel valued. BAW.


On to serious buisness.

SBR stage rules, we need a real chat and a lay down of some rule changes, with the ammount of people hating on metaknight. Maybe we need to do a run through of stages and make up our own minds? Im with nick on this, we cant just follow America blindly, it usually gets us into all sorts of ****.

Im all for an Australian stage discussion. Bridge of eldin ftw.


Cao: How exactly does a smash bank work?

If it means we pay like 1 dollar extra every month so that any big tourny thats hosted has alot more funds, i really think this would be an awesome idea.

 

[Amaterasu]

seeing MK die in a 1 hit-KO from 0% is like the seeing a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow... <3

Hmm Cao, all the other stuff in your post seems logical and raises some helpful points. However, that last comment seems more like one out of a hatred of MK more than anything. If we have characters dying from 1 hit, I would view that as an even more broken scenario than the one we have now.

Anyway, about Eldin, while it is true it is not great for MK, from my experience as BJay said it is banned for other reasons. People either camp in the middle, or wait on the sides for grabs which I doubt many people enjoy(including me), anyway discussion of stage choice is always welcome, so I do encourage that

I also still believe the views of MK are based off just 1 or 2 players. If someone like Kulla decided to not use MK and use snake instead, he would **** everyone silly still....

Edit: Also Nick, while I acknowledge your views, when you implicate that playing MK is not a challenge I have to say I meet that with incredulity. And on top of that, you lose credibility in my eyes when you start attacking others on the presumed basis of skill.

 

[CAOTIC]

Of course it is a statement of hate That's why it's a stand-alone and it's tone is not meant to be taken too seriously <3 I think you can generally tell when im joking around as opposed to being serious, - well I hope anyway.

In any case, I don't see the argument you put forward for one-hit kill cheapness, as it only increases people's options of dealing with tough characters, which I am all for. Heavies are better suited to a stage like Corneria and lights like MK are weaker. Every stage has its merits, to each their own.

Logically, MK's most significant weak attribute, is his weight. If we don't incorporate the stages that factor this, how can MK possibly be made fairer? Like I said, the way people have adopted starters have only exacurbated MK's positive attributes, as well as other top tiers like Snake and D3. (PS - My arguments are not exclusively directed at MK, but since I'm dealing with an anti-MK crowd it's easier to illistrate a point that way).

Eldin is banned for one primary reason alone, and it is the reason I stated about time extensions. It was the ONLY reason why Eldin was SBR banned. The fact it is a walk-off is irrelevant, as other stages like Mario Circuit and Green Hill Zone aren't auto-banned in the context of side-camping in walk-offs, which in itself is not considered illegitimate. Camping is considered illegitimate when it is viewed that it reduces the time limit to zero, which happens pretty much 0.1% of the time from what I have been seeing. If Eldin caused time limits to max out and delayed my tournament operations to a significant degree, then I would ban it.

Smash Bank - X% of all entry fee money goes into an account that is made transparent, so that when you need money to spend for whatever reason it'll be there to be disposed. In Melbourne it's $5 a head with 100% of that going to the CW Bank. It has it's own Treasury which communicates with all the fighting game communities to decide how to spend the money. The majority of it is being saved for the hiring out of a massive venue for a future annual.

 

[Yokai]

That smash bank idea has me very intrigued. I will look into its viability in QLD, thanks for the idea.

Stage discussion:

Bridge of Eldin, corneria are two id love.

I dont know why, but I find jungle japes rather neutral as well.

We need an aus list, I think we need to just give people options when it comes to countering metaknight, to bring the ratio up to a 50:50, then its all about players and less about characters.

 

[Amaterasu]

I just think a balance is needed if stages are going to be opened up to disadvantage MK more, and that the scenario of a 1 hit KO would make the game too imbalanced. If a character can 1 hit KO MK, then you have essentially destroyed the game of pikachu/jigglypuff and others who really don't need it

So all I'm saying is that yes fine, think about opening stages and what not to give other characters an advantage, but be careful that you don't go too far.

And my matches on FD take like 5 mins already, if there was a battle between samus and TL on Eldin it would take an age, so I'm still up in the air about that one

 

[undead_moose]

Chris with a our current crew system

Being better is the only way to get a spot in the crew battles ATM

Which is what i have been saying. I HAVE BEEN SAYING ATM

Doesnt mean it has to be all the time

Dont hate me because i point out facts

 

[Yokai]

Give eldin a special time clause? as in, make any eldin counterpick a 5 min match?

I dont know, im just tossing in ideas.

 

[undead_moose]

Corneria is banned for good reason

The roofs are just way too small anyone with a strong upsmash or any strong knockbacka ttack at low % would just dominate

Edit: With eldin i agree it can be camped to the **** house so a smaller time limit would be a good idea altho that could be a double edge sword seeming as the low time limit would make people try to stall if they are ahead

 

[Amaterasu]

Chris with a our current crew system

Being better is the only way to get a spot in the crew battles ATM

Which is what i have been saying. I HAVE BEEN SAYING ATM

Doesnt mean it has to be all the time

Dont hate me because i point out facts

I never hate you Nick(aslong as you aren't overly emo) =D

 

[Yokai]

Stalling only works depending on the skill of the staller, if your good enough to evade getting hit. well thats what the game is all about.


Though, having a lucario/toonlink/samus spamming to death would get annoying. still, maybe a meta-only counter pick?

we have specific rules for dedede, but not meta.

 

[CAOTIC]

I just think a balance is needed if stages are going to be opened up to disadvantage MK more, and that the scenario of a 1 hit KO would make the game too imbalanced. If a character can 1 hit KO MK, then you have essentially destroyed the game of pikachu/jigglypuff and others who really don't need it

So all I'm saying is that yes fine, think about opening stages and what not to give other characters an advantage, but be careful that you don't go too far.

And my matches on FD take like 5 mins already, if there was a battle between samus and TL on Eldin it would take an age, so I'm still up in the air about that one

Thanks for your input Chris

Opening up all of the stages, by the way, does not automatically disadvantage MK. He is an incredibly versatile character (top tier for good reason) that has options for almost any solution. Although introducing more stages tends to pick on the top tiers, the characters are versatile enough to forge their own victories within those specifications. Which is awesome and how Smash should be.

I very much doubt that opening up more stages will significantly change tournament results, but doing so creates new opportunities and complexities for dealing with characters. Melee is considered to be fairer than Brawl, but has plenty of one-hit kills, gimps and whatnot. However, it's trump card is the amount of options the whole cast has and with every gimp that exists is a possible creative solution away from it.

Lest you need to mention how Pikachu and Jigglypuff would suck on a stage like Corneria. There are possibilities for charactrers like Bowser and Ganon (both too on the lower end of the tier spectrum) to find opportunities for themselves. Looking at the bigger picutre is critical here. Maybe there's even a super saiyan hidden technique for Jigglypuff or Pika in Corneria or other underused stages that would put them back on the ladder.

The most important thing this will do is expand the visions and narrow playing cultures of the current Smash Community. New discoveries will keep things more dynamic and fresh and we as a community can easily decide to intervene when something is blatantly unfair (which we have already done with rules like D3 Rule, the MK infinite dimensional cape and the IC 300% max grab).

Also, MK is not a goner on Corneria. I'm pretty sure Kulla says Corneria is broken for MK because MK has his own set of gimps he can use on other characters on that stage. I would also argue that you would be very strong on Conreria given more experience on that stage.

Knowledge is power.

 

[Shaya]

For every stage people proclaim you can beat MK on, MK yet again is not completely at the diadvantage.

Think of Rainbow Ride, it's roof is extremely small towards the top, making it easy to kill MK early. However its a stage with a lot of moving platforms and is mostly a MK superior level due to his multi jumps/flight.

Corneria has a very low roof (disadvantage for Meta) but also has very small sides. MK's gimping/edge game will dominate if the game is played anywhere near an edge, and you'll die even earlier than you would on another stage.

PKMN Stadium 1, also a low roof is at least slightly more advantageous due to the stage changes (avoiding MK's fastness) while stll having a lowish roof that can kill MK at some early points.

Pretty much all of the stages above MK still has a solid standing point on the stage.
Any other stage besides Shadow of Moses and perhaps Eldin (Who says MK's can't camp/stall) is most likely a better stage for Meta than the character you are using on it (bar MK himself).

 

[Yokai]

Then its decided then. Shadow moses for all MK matches jkjk

 

[CAOTIC]

that does it, $100000000000000 MM against any MK on Flat Zone 2 XD

Thanks for mentioning the MK position on Corneria Shaya. Even though it seems bad for MK to die easily from the sides, he can just as easily destroy anyone using the same tactic. The stage just puts MK's vulnerabilities into effect unlike some other stages without really taking away the things that make MK great.

 

[Shaya]

I'll take the challenge CAO.

MK:
Up throw to the top part of flat zone if there is platforms to kill/punish.
Backthrow or forward throw into little black men to kill you easily.
Spam dsmash from the middle of the stage where it's safe and watch you squirm.

Downthrow to downthrow to fair, fair and you die.

roar.

 

[undead_moose]

Less chatting more crew battle editing / posting

 

[CAOTIC]

OK I'll employ my anti-Shaya strategy:

Peach:
Calm down and float (oh **** now he cant grab)
MK Spam downsmash in the middle of the stage? I FLOAT.
MK attack me in the air? Eat toad and die >=P

We'll use Monopoly currency, or Zimbawbe dollars, the latter I think is much cheaper

 

[undead_moose]

Cao i heard you can do something wave dash like with peach

Confirm?

 

[CAOTIC]

Yup

10 Woxys

 

[Sirias]

Hott. I want to use Peach now.
Gad **** I should probably post my messages 'while' reading rather than 'after'... =/

Zac, stop making me hornay. :C

Lol, actually, everything I read I honestly can't remember anything at all and I don't feel like reading through all of it again.

MK is god. :D Snake is a lesser god, and so is G&W.
I'm pretty sure if we 'banned' MK we'd be a lot happier, but I bet we'd also start hating the next in line to be top tier, is that Snake or G&W? Or someone else.
I like MK... he's sexy. <3
Just like Lucario, I wish less people used him. :C

 

[Hayzeus]

At least MK isnt spammed online by almost every single player... like sonic.

But surprisingly enough I played online this morning and had 3 matches in a row with me vsing 3 kirby's o.O

 

[undead_moose]

Rock is fine says paper

ban scissors

 

[Shaya]

I'll use my anti-peach strategy:

Short Hop fair, ftilt and tornado to punish the newb for trying to float near me.

 

[undead_moose]

Cao just use mario

and watch shaya rage

 

[Shaya]

I raged against Mario while I was using Snake.

 

[Vyse]

Listen up guys.

CAOTIC has raised a lot of good points.

Thanks Yokai. I'll see if I can put in my 2 cents in regards to some things.

A) If Smash was about money, there wouldn't be a Smash Scene in Australia. In my opinion, money is a form of corruption and an obsession that destroys the elements which people came to play Smash for in the first place. The American Smash scene is disgusting and nasty, and it appears as if many are not enjoying themselves, playing only to win money. Monetary rewards serve as a nice bonus, or a fund to attract those out of state (but for the purposes of having local tournaments, it's not relevant).

B) It'll be handy to consider dates that don't conflict with other things and also planned way in advance so people can fly for cheaper. It's probably a good idea to ask Mic to set you up a poll to get an idea of preferred dates.

C) I'm on the fence about rotating the Gold Coast and Brisbane, because it would be more complicate to execute. Relying on another TO is a gamble, and I think local tournaments are better having a permanent home-base. If it's going to be the Gold Coast, people are going to trust that and not have to worry about other venues and other tournament organisers every month. It'll keep things more under control. Vyse wouldn't have to run it every single month either. Just adopt the lassiez-faire approach and let the bracket unfold itself; the regulars will step in and take control (such as the other Ward members + Chris) if necessary. It's meant to be relaxed. Spearding the load is important and everyone would be mature and responsible enough to know when they need to help out.

About crews - forcing people into crews is excellent, but a system to mix up everyone every month is probably something you'd want to persue. Unpopular people will still feel left out if crews are permanent, and local tournies should give people the chance to be under the wing of those they look up to and not have to worry about being excluded all the time.

More about money - If do decide to charge, perhaps consider starting a Smash Bank. Sydney and Melbourne have one, and the community can decide what to do with it when the time comes. It'll provide the community with extra mobility should you require it.

A) No, we don't want to play for money.
To that end, all monthlies will be strictly no-prize affairs.

Tournaments with cash prizes deter people. I've seen this happen. Players like K-0S not entering events because it is apparently a 'waste of money'.

B) We'll have to look at it long term. There are quite a few conventions and things happening in QLD every year, so we'll have to work around them.

C) It may be unnecessary.
But l3oOkeR has raised his hand for Brisbane.

l3oOkeR has spoken to me over MSN, and he's very interested in running bi-monthlies in Brisbane.

If we have alternating bi-monthlies between GC and Brisbane, then we have tournaments happening on a monthly basis. There are concerns. Yes. However, the advantage we are looking for here, is ease of access for other players.

The point is, given time, tournaments would begin to spring up in Brisbane anyway I'm sure.

Either way, this is all going to come to a head in the next few days. l3oOkeR is going to start looking at different potential venues, and we'll see what we can come up with.

In the end, if doing Brisbane events is a no-go, then we'll just have to continue on with things in Helensvale. To be honest, I'm leaning that way. But on the other side of things, if l3oOkeR wants to step up and host, then I'm not one to stand in his way

@Syke: What's your opinion on the parking at Valley's PCYC? That's going to be one of the first locations we're going to look at.

 

[xXArrowXx]

hurray i am cheering for u booker and u to vyse


and ofcoarse its a waste of money if u lose to chris.. XP

 

[Greenstreet]

My Two Cents

I would prefer some events being held in Brisbane. It's at least 100 less km for me, which for one, will save me fuel, and keep my engine from blowing up. If Brisbane events do occur, I'll be more likely to be able to pursue the level of smash I want to play at. So.... hopefully l3oOkeR can organise something in that aspect.

As for my view of the rest of the stuff.

@Smash Bank: This is an amazing concept, and I was thrilled when I heard about it. This will make securing venues alot easier at very least as well as making other smash-related activites possible. At very least it'll bring a sense of community further, with discussion over the funds being needed.

@Rotating Crews: I really like this concept, mostly for the reasons that Cao set out. Even though you may not be the most likable or skilled smasher out there, you will have the chance to play alongside (and hopefully learn from) a more experienced player. I would really look forward to that opportunity.

@Crews: Having said that I would enjoy rotating crews, I do hope that regular crews will stay in tact and possibly be separate from the Rotating Crew aspect of the scene. This is because as Rotating Crews is good for learning and socialisation, normal crews give friends an opportunity to team up...they have thier place here too obviously.

@Vyse: I'll say it again, you are a legend in my books and I'll gladly lend a hand where I can, although my location may prevent it. If the is anything e-related I can help with, consider it done.

@Toowoomba: I still would hope that one day, not matter how far in the future, Toowoomba will be visited by some of you guys so we can smash it up. It doesn't phase me at the moment, just saying it would be great at some point in the next year or so. Let me know...

To be honest, I like how this discussion is shaping up. I may only be new here, and definitely not as skilled as some of you smash veterans, but I can see this becoming a community and scene that I will want to be a part of in the future. So congrats so far.
Hope it all pans out well for us....

 

[Yokai]

@ greenstreet: I will have to take you up on this offer I feel. sometime during this term ill come up for a night ( I have a chick who drives to wombat every weekend, so ill score lifts there and back) and we will smash it up for sure.


This community will be closely bound and very friendly, that is my intention.

 

[Greenstreet]

At least MK isnt spammed online by almost every single player... like sonic.

lol wut?

 

[Vyse]

The following people have failed:

undead_moose, K-0S

That is all.

Nintendo's Japanese and American press conferences have spawned a storm of craziness and announcements of hardware, software, and everything in between. It's still being sorted out as announcements continue rolling in, but here's what we know so far.
A BIG THANKS TO CHIEF MENDEZ FOR LETTING ME STEAL HIS AWESOME POST TO USE AS THE FIRST ONE HERE.


>Nintendo DSi
>Wii's storage solution
>They're now called "Nintendo Points", rather than just 'Wii Points'
>DS Ware online store
>The pedometer attachment's for a Wii Fit-esque DSi game
>1000 free Nintendo points for buying a DSi (before 2010)

Which takes care of the hardware side of things. Now, the games, in no particular order...

Legend:
Red = Wii Title
Blue = DS Title

>Punch-Out!!
>Sin & Punishment 2
>Taiko Drum Master (w/Drum Controller!)
>Let's Tap (obscure, but it's being developed by Yuji Naka's studio)
>Klonoa: Door to Phantomile (remake of the PSX original)
>Cosmic Walker (basically an outer space simulator, possibly along the lines of Endless Ocean?)
>Trace Memory
>Monster Hunter 3 tri~
>Tales of "Mothership" game
>Sonic and the Black Knight
>Samurai Warriors 3 (exercise game of the year--I'm calling it)
>Oboro Muramasa Yotoden
>Picross 3D
>Tatsunoko vs. Capcom
>Sky Crawlers: Innocent Aces
>Rune Factory Wii
>Rygar: The Battle of Argus
>Tenchu IV
>Harvest Moon Wii
>Wand of Magic (or something. Trace runs to cast magic)
>Endless Ocean 2
>An NHK game (I find this concept to be hilarious)
>FRAGILE
>Dynamic Action (not the real name, but it's a hack n' slash with GIANT enemies)
>Cave Story (Considered by some to be best example Metroidvania-style gameplay.)
>Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: Echoes of Time (for both DS and Wii!)
>Phantasy Star 0
>Family Athletic Lifestyle (the pedometer game)
>Mario & Luigi 3
>Stage Debut (YES!)
>New Wario Ware game
>Mega Man Starforce 3
>Valkyrie Profile: The Accused One
>Chocobo Fables 2
>Tales of Hearts
>Professor Layton 3 (has a subtitle, can't remember it)
>Gyakuten Kenji! (AKA Turnabout Prosecutor)
>Kingdom Hearts 358/2 Days
>The 7th Dragon

------------

EDIT - And the English conference hath begun! Of note/not already covered by the Japanese summit:

>Rygar in action: http://www.gametrailers.com/player/40691.html
>Punch-Out!! releases in North America during before Q3 of 2009
>Sin & Punishment 2 being published by Nintendo, out in "early 2009"
>CLUB NINTENDO'S COMING TO NORTH AMERICA!! (By year's end, no less!)
>Wii Speak Channel downloadable w/purchase of Wii Speak. Basically a simpler Wii-enabled VOIP client
>DSi Ware Shop's debut games are "DSi-specific" ports of Brain Age 1 & 2
>Other "Play on Wii" games (cheap ports of GCN games on Wii with maybe some updated controls or something) are DK Jungle Beat, both GCN Metroid titles, Chibi-Robo, Pikmin 2, and Mario Power Tennis
>DSi won't be out anywhere but Japan until "well into 2009" (Awwww....)
>Nintendo's publishing The Conduit!
>Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon officially announced for US and EU release (Yay!)

Keep in mind the event's still ongoing as of this time, so make sure and regularly check your gaming blog(s) of choice all throughout Friday!

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/n10/conference2008fall/mov/wii.html?n10 -- Gameplay videos from the conference. There's alot of awesomeness/quirkiness/Japanese-yness in there. The Wii suddenly perked up ALOT.

 

[undead_moose]

Oh wow

Nintendo releases old franchises

the **** ones

yeah i can see how i failed hard

nintendo is dead to me

Klonoa: Door to Phantomile is the only thing that slightly interests me

 

[Vyse]

Bull crap, did you even read the list?

And you guys are the ones complaining about the lack of Zelda/Mario, THEY ARE OLD FRANCHISES.

I don't know what the heck is wrong with you people, look at all of those AWESOME games coming on the horizon. Don't be so freakin negative.

TATSUNOKO VS ****ING CAPCOM YOU DOUCHE.

Nintendo didn't give a **** about E3. Like I've been saying all along, they've been waiting for a time where they're not competing with other Consoles.

If you're too blind to see what is going to become of all this, then you sir, have failed epically.

>Punch-Out!!
>Sin & Punishment 2
>Klonoa: Door to Phantomile (remake of the PSX original)
>Monster Hunter 3 tri~
>Tales of "Mothership" game
>Tatsunoko vs. Capcom
>Harvest Moon Wii
>Cave Story (Considered by some to be best example Metroidvania-style gameplay.)
>Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: Echoes of Time (for both DS and Wii!)
>Phantasy Star 0
>Mario & Luigi 3
>Mega Man Starforce 3
>Valkyrie Profile: The Accused One
>Tales of Hearts
>Gyakuten Kenji! (AKA Turnabout Prosecutor)
>Kingdom Hearts 358/2 Days

Other "Play on Wii" games (cheap ports of GCN games on Wii with maybe some updated controls or something) are DK Jungle Beat, both GCN Metroid titles, Chibi-Robo, Pikmin 2, and Mario Power Tennis.

Don't be so freakin negative about it.

Look at the plethora of games and plans they have set for the future.
Stop listening to online critics. Read a magazine, a trustworthy source of criticism. Don't listen to *****y, whiney hard to please people who expect the world, and when it's not delivered straight away they're ready to abandon everything because everybody blows it out of proportion with their idiotic beliefs.

I guarantee that you would not have thought what you do now about nintendo if you didn't hopelessly believe in the critics you suscribe to. I guarantee that if Nintendo had made this announcement at E3 instead of now, there would never have been the uproar made by games critics that did after E3. Nobody would have said anything, and nobody would have blindly believed that Nintendo had all but abandoned everything. Prove me wrong.

Tell me, why do I still have faith? Because Nintendo's been in the game longer than Sony or Microsoft. As far as I'm concerned, they have yet to fail anything. Every choice they've made thusfar is well justified and otherwise the best for the continued growth of Nintendo and its ENTIRE customer base.

Nintendo is more alive than ever with this new announcement.

And if you can't see appreciation for the hardcore Nintendo fan market in the post I quoted, then you can't say you've ever been a hardcore fan of Nintendo.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=197028

Read the thread, tell me it doesn't revitalise your faith.
If it doesn't then you sir, have just joined the casual gaming crowd.

EDIT:

lol. Toad.

Anyway, don't be so stubborn.
And read that thread and post your opinion there.
You will be the only person complaining about anything.
/v/ is good for nothing except 'xxxx is coming out on xx/xx/xxxx'

And remember, this is an ongoing press release staged over 2 whole days.
The best is yet to come I'm sure. Wait until tommorow. It will be epic.

 

[Darkwing SykeDuk]

Tell me, why do I still have faith? Because Nintendo's been in the game longer than Sony or Microsoft. As far as I'm concerned, they have yet to fail anything. Every choice they've made thusfar is well justified and otherwise the best for the continued growth of Nintendo and its ENTIRE customer base.

Virtual Boy much?

Also pcyc is masspensive, upwards of $100 for the day. Plus there's only like 30 parking spaces.

 

[Vyse]

Virtual Boy much?

Also pcyc is masspensive, upwards of $100 for the day. Plus there's only like 30 parking spaces.

Lol, okay, but Virtual Boy is still too good.

Also, do you mean the room hire for PCYC is $100 for the day?
I thought it was double that.

 

[Darkwing SykeDuk]

That's the minimum >_>

 

[Shaya]

A hiring fee of $100 being expensive?

Dear god man.