Punishing People for ground releasing us. +9 on Release.

[1PokeMastr]

Alright, so, I know you have a thread on this, but, it's really out dated, and old. So I took the option of doing it myself.



Ground Release Follow Ups:

- The notes below are what will happen if they try to do anything besides shielding and spot dodging.

- If they try to roll after they ground release us, F-Tilt will hit before, if you get them right out of your 20 frame cool down.

- If they try to spot dodge/ roll/ Jab/ Jump, anything beisdes shield F-Tilt will hit everyone but ( 1 frame advantage over us ) and ( They can up B ).

- If they try to jump, Hyphen Up Smash ( Buffered out of our release, will hit them ), as well as down smash on most characters.

- Any character that can be Jabbed, can be down smashed if they opt to do anything but shield/ spot dodge.

- If Ganon tries to Jab, we can Donkey Punch him ( Full Charge ).

- If Ganon/ Snake try to Jump, we can Donkey Punch them ( Full Charge ).

- If Snake pummel releases us, he gets *****.

Follow ups after being ground released before they can do anything, Hyphen Smash is listed so you know who it will hit.
- Jab, D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- Nothing. Hyphen Smash

- F-Tilt, D-Tilt, Jab. Hyphen Smash.

- Nothing. Hyphen Smash.

- D-Tilt.

- Jab, D-Tilt. Hypehn Smash.

- Jab, D-Tilt.

- D-Tilt.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- Jab, D-Tilt.

- Nothing. Hyphen Smash.

- Jab, D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-Tilt.

- Jab, Grab, D-Tilt.

- Jab, D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- Nothing.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- Jab, D-Tilt.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- Jab, D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-Tilt.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- Nothing.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- Jab, D-Tilt.

- D-Tilt.

- Jab, D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- Grab, Jab, D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-Tilt.

- Jab, D-Tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- D-tilt. Hyphen Smash.

- F-Tilt, Grab, Jab, U-Tilt, D-Tilt, Jab. Hyphen Smash.

Time to start mashing, fellow Donkey Kongs.

 

[DtJ S2n]

What stops us from being able to f-tilt/d-tilt/jab every character? I've been under the impression that we have a flat 10 frame advantage on everybody, so our options should be same except in the case of range, which shouldn't matter for anything but u-tilt or maybe grab.

Ground releasing from Yoshi is weird. Are you counting ground releasing from his neutral-b? I'm fairly sure you can't even ground release off of his regular grab.

Why can't we do anything on ourselves? Excuse me for all these questions.

 

[1PokeMastr]

What stops us from being able to f-tilt/d-tilt/jab every character? I've been under the impression that we have a flat 10 frame advantage on everybody, so our options should be same except in the case of range, which shouldn't matter for anything but u-tilt or maybe grab.

Ground releasing from Yoshi is weird. Are you counting ground releasing from his neutral-b? I'm fairly sure you can't even ground release off of his regular grab.

Why can't we do anything on ourselves? Excuse me for all these questions.

Ah, my bad, I forgot about the Egglay, I test it when I can.
And Dk when he releases us, is in range for an F-Tilt, and that's about it.
Also, even in 1/4 motion, and me mashing F-Tilt as fast as possible, no matter what happens, it always gets power shielded, I might be a bit slow on the F-Tilt, I might not be, and I haven't tested this on slants yet, though, I should get testing this on slants, etc.
Though, it seems if they hold shield when they ground break us, it will power sheild Dsmash and F-Tilt, and if they try roll/ jump, they get hit.


I don't mind all these questions, but, the thread you had before this one in 2009 or so.. wasn't even close to being complete.

And, D-Tilt misses a few characters, and yes, F-Tilt can hit everyone, but all my tests have it getting power shielded after the release.

 

[DtJ S2n]

According to our frame data thread, which I assume is accurate, our F-tilt is fully extended on frame 9. If we get 10 frame advantage off of ground release, in theory we should be able to f-tilt them... you just have to be frame perfect. Not exactly plausible to react to the grab release and f-tilt in a match.

Not that f-tilt is even a better option than d-tilt in almost any situation. I'd only take f-tilt over d-tilt if they were at like 140%.

 

[1PokeMastr]

According to our frame data thread, which I assume is accurate, our F-tilt is fully extended on frame 9. If we get 10 frame advantage off of ground release, in theory we should be able to f-tilt them... you just have to be frame perfect. Not exactly plausible to react to the grab release and f-tilt in a match.

Not that f-tilt is even a better option than d-tilt in almost any situation. I'd only take f-tilt over d-tilt if they were at like 140%.

Read what happens if they input a jump.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Interesting thread here, Ernie.

Is DK's air release the same 10 frame advantage? And does this matter at all where an edge isn't concerned, i.e. can anyone aside from Yoshi air release DK?


Oh and ftr you can ground release from Yoshi's grab, to people doubting. You're just more likely to crash the game if you're mashing that fast and you just lost an enitre game in a set for that.

 

[1PokeMastr]

If it's on an Edge, Dk slides off or gets air released, and he probably does and or doesn't have that same advantages with the Air release.
As well Snake can Air release Donkey Kong as long as he doesn't pummel ( Snake Air releases everyone in the game ).

But if Snake Pummel releases.. he gets *****.

 

[infiniteV115]

As long as Puff can't punish me out of ground release I should be fine.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

you just have to be frame perfect. Not exactly plausible to react to the grab release and f-tilt in a match.

Buffering sez hai.

Or at least, I'd assume you can buffer out of a ground release. lol

Also I'm not totally sure about this, but since lots of characters have different ground release animation lengths, it seems reasonable to assume that some character's let go animation might be longer or shorter.

Maybe! I have no proof to back this up at all, it's just what's whirling around my mind atm.

Edit: Had a look at a few characters, and this doesn't seem likely.

Carry on then. =P

 

[DtJ S2n]

Buffering sez hai.

Or at least, I'd assume you can buffer out of a ground release. lol

Problem being that in a practical situation, you'll be mashing a lot more buttons than just holding forward and pressing A, and DK's grab release animation is extremely fast (which is why this works at all), too fast to react to and start buffering the f-tilt.

DK can air release by mashing jumping commands while being grabbed if he's not being pummeled. This includes up on the C-stick or analog stick. I don't think he gets the same 10 frame advantage and if he did he certainly has no way to "punish" people for it. Stick to ground release when possible, stick to d-tilt/jab.

I'll go ahead and say that when people ground release their grabs, unless it's intentional they almost always buffer a shieldgrab. Nobody who knows things will intentionally ground release DK. So essentially going for things like d-smash and hyphen u-smash feels really bad. Walk up grab would be a better mix-up, or maybe even one of our slow, long lasting attacks (up-b/down-b). Personally I'd just take the guaranteed d-tilt at lower percents or jab at higher percents on the characters it applies to.

 

[1PokeMastr]

We aren't in range to be grabbed by anyone when we're ground released. Unless they have a tether.

And hey, risks are worth a shot.
Donkey Kong's moves have enough shield push where you can't punish them on block unless you're in his frame, meaning if we space our moves properly, it's hard to get in.
Or have a tether grab.