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Guide PM 3.5 Mewtwo Video Guide by EmuKiller

EmuKiller

Smash Ace
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Sep 17, 2006
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EmuKiller?! More like... FREEmuKiller!!!!!!
Hi all,

I made a pretty basic guide for playing Mewtwo in Project M that you can check out here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e58wagkjRdQ

I kind of feel like I did a crappy job covering EVERYTHING, but hopefully this can get some other players to stick with the character.

Feel free to ask questions in this thread or on the youtube video, I'll do my best to respond!

Another guide I'd highly recommend is Tai's marth guide on MIOM. For me I was able to draw a lot of parallels and otherwise he just has a lot of good insight.
http://www.meleeitonme.com/sharpening-your-sword-tais-marth-guide/
 
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Sylnic

Smash Cadet
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Jun 3, 2014
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Eastern PA
Great guide EmuKiller. As someone who doesn't really play Mewtwo, I learned a lot about him from this, and there's a lot of great tips in here for smash in general. Thanks for the guide, I'll be sure to send this to my friend :)
 

Zoa

Smash Ace
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Mar 18, 2009
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787
Thanks man. This was really helpful. I've been struggling to work with Mewtwo because I play fast aggro characters far better than I do others. Now I have a place to begin.
 

Choice Scarf

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For the get out of hitstun thing, I'm pretty sure it's moving the control stick from side to side. Alternatively you can aerial but that's probably riskier.

Great guide btw. Even with your concerns about accuracy (and how long they will be accurate), you explain Mewtwo and smash tactics in a very digestible manner.
 

WildestSpade1

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Jan 12, 2014
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Thanks for the guide, I learned a lot! One thing you mentioned, however, was that you cannot hover after grabbing the ledge if you teleport to it. However, at least on final destination, I've found that sometimes I am able to hover after letting go of the ledge after teleport. I'm not able to do it very consistently, but it seems to be a matter of positioning before the teleport.
 

EmuKiller

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EmuKiller?! More like... FREEmuKiller!!!!!!
ah cool! I'll definitely look into it. Right now I can imagine being able to hover after up-B to the ledge if you up-B from the stage to the ledge, and you end up actually getting a noticeable/unnoticeable ledge cancel before grabbing it. Oh wait. What it PROBABLY is from is I play with tap jump on, so for me when I up-B to the ledge I probably end up using my double jump. Maybe with tap jump off (and not using 2nd jump before the up-B) you can hover after grabbing the ledge using teleport.
 

WildestSpade1

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I messed around with it for like an hour last night, and it does not work every time. However, it isn't random either. Using the cool new frame advance, I found that if I stay about a "3.0 tail length" from the ledge, full hop, and then start a 45 degree down teleport on the 6th frame (being sure to let go to grab the ledge), I can hover straight from the ledge. Also, it seems to be the perfect spacing if the new little white reappearance graphic appears just above the ledge. I'm sure other angles work too, just the spacing seems important. Watching the frame advance, it didn't really look like a ledge cancel, but I think it probably is. I already play without tap jump, so I don't think that was messing with it. I'll admit, if it turns out it works every time and I'm just that bad, I'm going to be a bit sad...
 

Plebiscuit

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Hey Emu, have you figured out any new tech since you put the guide up? Also, does the the fair -> float -> dair recovery extender work as efficiently with other aerials?
 

DARKcpu0

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May 20, 2014
Messages
114
Few notes.

You didn't touch on DJCs at all. FCs are better, but I find DJCs to be easier, and so might some other people, and you dont run the risk of getting gimped after getting hit if you get hit before your DJ comes out. Might be faster to throw out as well, but dont quote me on that.

Emu, on ALL stages you can horizonal up b and still be able to float and teleport, and on alot of them, there are nice little parts of the stages that you can use as visual to get consistent at it. Just a matter if you do it right. Atleast I think you can on all stages. Only play on like, 9 of them lol.

Should've noted up b as an option for out of shield, Its an easy get away, you can act out of it in the case of allowing for decent space, and if you do it right, free float dairs to reset you slightly further into the stage than you were. Mewtwo's up b on alot of stages covers about half, and its not hard to get used to. Also its an amazing gimping tool if you get a decent backthrow then just throw out an out of up b ledge cancelled float aerials. This is probably like the 20th time I'm bringing this up ever but god is it a tool that needs to be utilized.

To add on to the spacies+falcon chain situation, At around 50%, you can throw out a side b then regrab. I personally go with upthrow fair regrab upthrow uair (force a reset if I **** up) side b grab, and dependent on where I am on stage, back throw or up throw against the four. Maybe from side b then regrab you can down throw but I dont really ever touch that move ever unless I **** up.
 
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Apoc

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Emu, on ALL stages you can horizonal up b and still be able to float and teleport, and on alot of them, there are nice little parts of the stages that you can use as visual to get consistent at it. Just a matter if you do it right. Atleast I think you can on all stages. Only play on like, 9 of them lol.
^How do you do this? Is there a vid showing this?
 

DARKcpu0

Smash Apprentice
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May 20, 2014
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114
^How do you do this? Is there a vid showing this?
If you clip ledge with up b, or ledge cancel it, you can hover out of up b. Also some guy named blu2 found a way to hover out of up b under any conditions except perfectly horizontal, although I've found the timing to be tighter than getting a perfect DJC Nair to only let off the bigger hitbox.

I'd make a video if I could manage better quality.
 

EmuKiller

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ah yeah DJCs are like.. in my opinion a thing of the past. MAYBE it still has its uses but hover cancelling is pretty paramount to learning mewtwo, it's just tough to stay safe on block otherwise (pretty sure djc f-air is minus on block but can't say for sure)

Yep I should definitely have mentioned the like.. "sliding off the stage" hover after up-B. Other small tricks I haven't mentioned are extending 2nd jump with back-air or shadowball, and also that you can hover after a short hop f-air finishes if you're borderline frame perfect, and I guess at a more beginner level how priority on shadowball increases with how long you charge it.

As far as up-B out of shield... hm. I guess I realistically don't know enough about how to utilize it to cover talking about it. I definitely practice up-B offstage, up-B back on but I wouldn't know how to talk about using it in a match, especially with the risk of killing yourself if your opponent's attack on shield pushes you the wrong way. So in theory it's definitely an option but on paper I wouldn't know when to recommend using it.

And yep everyone should check out blu2's video!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzlOU0Bh-yA
 

Garr

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Hey, Emukiller.

So about that part on chain-grabbing spacies? I tried doing it in debug mode, and I noticed that on the first U-throw, there's like 3-4 frames where they're out of hitstun (this was on Fox, by the way) before I can get the second grab. Any high level Fox knowing this could just shine out, so I'm not sure if the 2nd grab is guaranteed.
 

DARKcpu0

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ah yeah DJCs are like.. in my opinion a thing of the past. MAYBE it still has its uses but hover cancelling is pretty paramount to learning mewtwo, it's just tough to stay safe on block otherwise (pretty sure djc f-air is minus on block but can't say for sure)

Yep I should definitely have mentioned the like.. "sliding off the stage" hover after up-B. Other small tricks I haven't mentioned are extending 2nd jump with back-air or shadowball, and also that you can hover after a short hop f-air finishes if you're borderline frame perfect, and I guess at a more beginner level how priority on shadowball increases with how long you charge it.

As far as up-B out of shield... hm. I guess I realistically don't know enough about how to utilize it to cover talking about it. I definitely practice up-B offstage, up-B back on but I wouldn't know how to talk about using it in a match, especially with the risk of killing yourself if your opponent's attack on shield pushes you the wrong way. So in theory it's definitely an option but on paper I wouldn't know when to recommend using it.

And yep everyone should check out blu2's video!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzlOU0Bh-yA
Short hop to fair? Not all that hard.

Also DJC is pretty important as you get the massive hitbox on nair that you cannot access with float cancel, and its a good tool to push away pressure.

....Wait you can extend 2nd jump with shadowball?

what

I've been ****ing up my 2nd jump with shadowball.

As for Up B out of shield. I typically use it in cases where shield pressure is pushing me towards the ledge, and just pseudo-telehover with it. Works better on platforms as you can do the same. It's situational, but it's a pretty common situation, atleast against spacies.

Back on DJC, I mean, it pretty much gives us telehover.

Telehover from anywhere on stage mang.
Besides horizontal that is.
Its a DJC thing. Its tight, but its pretty much DJC.
 

EmuKiller

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For me I kind of just short hop n-air instead of djc it to get the full 20-ish%. Maybe getting the strong hit earlier has its uses but I dunno if I'll mix it into my playstyle.

And to clarify, after short hop f-air you can hover without having to touch the ground again. So short hop f-air > hover > n-air in one short hop without having to touch the ground. It's something I feel I should bring up as a way to test "how fast are you at f-air after jump".

And yep if you check out a lot of videos of me I'll 2nd jump, start charging shadowball, then cancel the shadowball charge. It gives you more height like how m2k uses back-air but I think shadowball even more so.

But yep this new "djc teleport > hover" is pretty big. I'll be impressed when a mewtwo can do it consistently in tournament.
 

DARKcpu0

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If Apex had PM, I'd try and be that mewtwo lol.

Maybe when a PM tourney is actually in my area, but philly isn't so ecstatic about it last time I checked. I'm pretty consistent with the DJC Telehovers, really isn't that hard. Not perfect of course but its pretty easy to throw out on a whim. If anything edge cancelling hover to get teleport via platforms will be the bigger thing. On very rare occasion I've done it horizontally, and just thinking about someone getting consistent with that on say, Fountain of Dreams, is somewhat horrifying.
Might as well play 3.02 mewtwo.

As for the hover > sh fair, again, really not all that hard. Well at least not for me given that I have L set to jump. Having a trigger set to jump really does help with those FC Aerials.
 

EmuKiller

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There's a philly tournament on the 21st I'll try and make it out to but no promises, depends how willing I am to make the drive or hopefully carpool with Easton.

and I don't mean hover > f-air I mean short hop, f-air, THEN hover before you touch the ground after doing a normal short hop f-air. If I make a followup video I'll include it, because it's just a sort of "Training mode trick" to make sure tech skill is on point.
 

DARKcpu0

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There's a philly tournament on the 21st I'll try and make it out to but no promises, depends how willing I am to make the drive or hopefully carpool with Easton.

and I don't mean hover > f-air I mean short hop, f-air, THEN hover before you touch the ground after doing a normal short hop f-air. If I make a followup video I'll include it, because it's just a sort of "Training mode trick" to make sure tech skill is on point.
Saw it on Philadelphia Melee's facebook page a month or two ago. I'd go to that tourney if my parent wasn't all "Oh its the weekend before christmas". Being in highschool is a pain in the ass sometimes lol.

I know you didnt mean hover -> Fair.

I jump with x, fair with c-stick and hold my L (Since its set to jump in my case) so I get the hover. In most cases I'll hold up and usually away from the opponent on the control stick so I don't hit the ground as I usually do.

I dont know why, but I throw out alot of retreating fairs as a bluff, unless I play against spacies.

(EDIT)

Just saw what I wrote prior to what you said a moment ago. Woops. My mistake.
 
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Apoc

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Wait so in order to do a hover cancelled aerial I shouldn't press jump -> hover -> fair? Am I doing this right or wrong? Not sure what my button inputs actually are my hands are just too used to the inputs...

Sorry about the quality, is that about how fast you guys do it though?
 
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DARKcpu0

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Wait so in order to do a hover cancelled aerial I shouldn't press jump -> hover -> fair? Am I doing this right or wrong? Not sure what my button inputs actually are my hands are just too used to the inputs...

Sorry about the quality, is that about how fast you guys do it though?
I don't really spam FC aerials. I DJC more than FC to be honest, but you to hover before you attack.

X, Down(Hold), Fair for example.
 

DARKcpu0

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Figured I throw this out since I haven't seen you do it yet, if you face away from the ledge when you go to edgegaurd with up b, its an instant ledgesnap.

Not sure if you knew that.

Also I seriously hope you can get to that tourney saturday. I've actually managed to be able to go, and being (assuming) the only mewtwo won't sit too well lol. Also my fundamentals are complete garbage so I'd like to see a mewtwo that functions make it further than me :p
 

InfinityCollision

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ah yeah DJCs are like.. in my opinion a thing of the past. MAYBE it still has its uses but hover cancelling is pretty paramount to learning mewtwo, it's just tough to stay safe on block otherwise (pretty sure djc f-air is minus on block but can't say for sure)
DJC fair is -0 on block. It's also worth noting that you can have fair's hitbox out for exactly one frame if you buffer the dj (or get it frame-perfect), input the fair on your second frame of airtime, then fastfall.

On that note... One thing I haven't seen discussed is the change to hover's drift acceleration and how it impacts HC aerials. In 3.02 a HC aerial committed to 5 frames jumpsquat, 2 frames hover startup, 12 frames hover time, and 5 frames landing lag if you started from the ground. In 3.5, minimum hover time has increased to 15 frames. So if you input the jump on frame 1, you can follow up the aerial starting on frame 29. Contrast with frame 23 on a DJC fair - and look at when you have to input the fair. You'd have to input the fair 7-9 frames into your total airtime (5-7 frames into your hover) for it to be -0 or better on block. Any sooner and you start losing safety, any later and it won't come out. That's 18-20 frames before you get a hitbox out vs 13 frames for the DJC timing I described above.

Regardless of any implications for DJC usage, it's something to consider when throwing out quick HC aerials and will affect the way we use hover in neutral. Lots of little things like this sprinkled throughout his changes... though they're really only small when you take the PR route and look at static values (tail nerf anyone?). In practice it's quite a different story.
 
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Plebiscuit

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Figured I throw this out since I haven't seen you do it yet, if you face away from the ledge when you go to edgeguard with up b, its an instant ledgesnap.
Instant, as in, teleport from where you'd want to ledge cancel (e.g. center stage on Yoshi's), but don't turn around, and you immediately ledgesnap? Please let this be real.
 

EmuKiller

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Hey, Emukiller.

So about that part on chain-grabbing spacies? I tried doing it in debug mode, and I noticed that on the first U-throw, there's like 3-4 frames where they're out of hitstun (this was on Fox, by the way) before I can get the second grab. Any high level Fox knowing this could just shine out, so I'm not sure if the 2nd grab is guaranteed.
Ah sorry I didn't respond to this before! Neutral DI you can do hc f-air, or anything really, to keep the combo going. If they DI to the side where hc f-air won't reach, pretty confident the grab IS guaranteed though. But thanks for pointing it out I definitely over simplified how combos work, mostly cause I definitely don't really know how combos work.
 
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