Guide Pichu with DerfMW (Video Guide)

[DerfMidWest]

Pichu With Derf

As was mentioned recently in the Pichu discussion thread, I, DerfMW, am starting a short series of tutorial and technical demonstration videos.
So yeah, this is the official topic for that.

Overview:
The series is designed to take players all the way to advanced technical play with Pichu.
I am aware of the fact that many Pichu players are relatively new to the game, for many, Pichu is their first character and their introduction to more advanced and competitive play, as the character was for myself.
With this in mind, I will be creating episodes more or less in order of difficulty, starting out with beginner level techniques and working up to the more advanced stuff.
I expect players to have a fundamental grasp of basic techskill (wavedashing, SHFFLing, etc) which can be learned from Wak's Advanced How to Play
The series will follow this format (for the most part):
​

1. Basics (Beginner Level): SHFFLing, Wavedashes (and variations), JC Grabs, Perfect Agility (intro to advanced play)
   
   
2. Advanced Play (Intermediate Level): Shield and Ledge play, Edge Canceling, Teeter Canceling, Shield Dropping, Shai Dropping, etc.
   
   
3. Complex Tech ('Expert' Level): Doraki Jumps (and variations), PC Hogs, Pivots (LOL, I'll actually cover pivots with the beginner stuff, I just suck at them), etc.

But yeah, I still haven't figured everything out, and knowing myself, I'll deviate from any sort of set plan or schedule, so basically it's going to more like "whatever Derf feels like showing," but I'm gonna try to stick to these guidelines.
Nothing recorded yet, but I hope to have a video up tomorrow.

Stay Tuned.

Episode 1: Introduction

This episode is pretty much useless, just an introduction. Check back for more videos soon.

Episode 2: Perfect Agility

Helpful Link:
Grim Tuesday's Agility Guide

Episode 3: Break-down

In this episode I answer a lot of the frequently asked questions about pichu and explain the uses of each of his moves.
I cover approaching, basic combos, and general edgeguard strategies.​

 

[Kawaii-Kun]

I actually want to pick up Pichu competitively, I'd love to see what all he can do.

 

[Comet7]

(Insert supportive comment)

C'mooooon upload the next vid :O

 

[DerfMidWest]

Sorry guys, I've been sick for like a week xD
It'll be up soon.

 

[DerfMidWest]

Episode 2 added.
I decided to skip the basics, because you can just learn those from wak's videos.
audio is a little funky, but w/e.
I'm demonstrating perfect agility.

more stuff next week or something.

 

[proxibomb]

Dude, I'm thinking of make a new guide, since the other guides are basically really out of date. Also, nice videos.

 

[DerfMidWest]

After I finish this video series I'm going to write a more up to date pichu guide.
Made a new episode today that serves a similar purpose.

Basically broke down pichu's moveset and explained the common uses for each move.
Video is like 30 minutes long tho, so I'm going to upload it tonight. might break it down into two parts or something, iunno.

but new episode up tonight.

 

[Rotomatic]

After I finish this video series I'm going to write a more up to date pichu guide.
Made a new episode today that serves a similar purpose.

Basically broke down pichu's moveset and explained the common uses for each move.
Video is like 30 minutes long tho, so I'm going to upload it tonight. might break it down into two parts or something, iunno.

but new episode up tonight.

I was oddly thinking of writing up a MIOM character guide for Pichu just yesterday, this thread is super helpful so far!

 

[DerfMidWest]

I was oddly thinking of writing up a MIOM character guide for Pichu just yesterday, this thread is super helpful so far!

glad to hear that it's been helpful! There will be a lot more to come.
Hopefully soon I'll be able to just sit down and pump out a bunch of these I've just been busy a lot lately, so this is taking longer to finish than I intended.

 

[DerfMidWest]

Thread updated, new episode up.
This one is long as hell, but I covered a lot of information.

Next week I'll get back into techniques and stuff.

also rofl my webcam fell over.

 

[DerfMidWest]

I'll do **** soon, I promise.

 

[Rotomatic]

I'll do **** soon, I promise.

I'd hope so, man. Put your money where your mouth is and actually make a video.

I want to link some relavent info but no (Young) links allowed until I have 10 posts **** me for lurking

 

[Rotomatic]

I'd hope so, man. Put your money where your mouth is and actually make a video.

I want to link some relavent info but no (Young) links allowed until I have 10 posts **** me for lurking

Also, here's something odd to cover.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CN96NwVTOzk


Original leddit thread: http://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/2nr6nw/pichus_grab_range_is_higher_than_m2ks_inital/


Hopefully it works now. May want to cover that at some point, it's odd.

 

[Kawaii-Kun]

Also, here's something odd to cover.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CN96NwVTOzk


Original leddit thread: http://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/2nr6nw/pichus_grab_range_is_higher_than_m2ks_inital/


Hopefully it works now. May want to cover that at some point, it's odd.

Mate, that blew my mind.

 

[DerfMidWest]

lol yeah pichu's standing grab range isn't that bad.
If you look at the hitbox, it's actually like almost an entire pichu. But, if you look at the hitbox data, it's actually mostly disjointed since pichu is so small.
and characters hurtboxes are actually a little bigger than their graphic, so basically what's happening is that the very end of pichu's grab box is touching the very end of fox/pichu's hurtbox.
It just looks a lot bigger than it actually is since pichu is so tiny.
It's like an optical illusion.

I'm not gonna make an entire video covering that, but I'll definitely talk about grab stuff at some point.
I really want to start covering some ledge techniques in the next few episodes.
It'll take me a little while to really get the time to make a video, since my schedule has been so crazy with working holiday weeks lately, but it'll probably calm down a little more soon.

 

[Rotomatic]

lol yeah pichu's standing grab range isn't that bad.
If you look at the hitbox, it's actually like almost an entire pichu. But, if you look at the hitbox data, it's actually mostly disjointed since pichu is so small.
and characters hurtboxes are actually a little bigger than their graphic, so basically what's happening is that the very end of pichu's grab box is touching the very end of fox/pichu's hurtbox.
It just looks a lot bigger than it actually is since pichu is so tiny.
It's like an optical illusion.

Speaking of hitboxes, Pichu is one of many characters with missing framedata gifs. Someone should get on that, SSBwiki lookin barebones af

 

[Comet7]

Speaking of hitboxes, Pichu is one of many characters with missing framedata gifs. Someone should get on that, SSBwiki lookin barebones af

the only things that are missing are normal ftilt and nair, which can be found here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mQigEgREW-4

you should also look at the ice climbers section. they don't have anything lol.

 

[DerfMidWest]

totally forgot about this piece of **** again.
But I also broke my computer.
More videos eventually.

 

[PeachyBreeze]

Damn, I wish pichu was good but I love to see vids like these that show off his true potential.

 

[DerfMidWest]

Oh he's pretty garbage, but he's really cool and has a lot of dope things he can do.

 

[the muted smasher]

Pichu has a legit neutral game and never loses because he loses, it's just he loses the punishment side of basically every mu.

I've never felt lost on why I'm behind or that a match-up is just undo able. As ics I feel lost fighting luigi.

 

[kingPiano]

I'm finding that Marth is a near impossible match up, his disjointed sword hitboxes are longer and larger than pichu's entire body. so they render all of Pichu's aerials inert. All you can is hope for a chain grab to up smash or run away and thunder wall behind you.

It seem like if you play with any Marth on your skill level or even below they will obliterate you with tilts and aerials.

Any advice? He's really the only MU I have trouble with. Flippin' broken ass Fox/Falco/Marth tier, game's so unbalanced.

 

[Kawaii-Kun]

I'm finding that Marth is a near impossible match up, his disjointed sword hitboxes are longer and larger than pichu's entire body. so they render all of Pichu's aerials inert. All you can is hope for a chain grab to up smash or run away and thunder wall behind you.

It seem like if you play with any Marth on your skill level or even below they will obliterate you with tilts and aerials.

Any advice? He's really the only MU I have trouble with. Flippin' broken *** Fox/Falco/Marth tier, game's so unbalanced.

Most of the time when I play Pichu against Marth I tend to go for Thunder Shock zoning and baiting until the Marth is in a position for me to catch him, then from there I try to out race Marth's moves. I managed to do this successfully against a pretty solid Marth at my college.

 

[Comet7]

I'm finding that Marth is a near impossible match up, his disjointed sword hitboxes are longer and larger than pichu's entire body. so they render all of Pichu's aerials inert. All you can is hope for a chain grab to up smash or run away and thunder wall behind you.

It seem like if you play with any Marth on your skill level or even below they will obliterate you with tilts and aerials.

Any advice? He's really the only MU I have trouble with. Flippin' broken *** Fox/Falco/Marth tier, game's so unbalanced.

dash dance and look for an opening, then nair into followups. at low percents, nair > up throw > up air > nair is amazing. after that, you can reset the situation with up tilt or up air into whatever followups you want. marth can get really messed up in the air if he doesn't dair or counter you out of a combo which is really risky and be read and punished. you can also get an up smash instead of a grab most of the time, but i like that pseudo combo more since it's hard to get out of it and it leaves you in a better position because marth has less room to slap you when you're trying to convert to other stuff. at mid percents or higher it's basically the same strat in the neutral except nair chains sort of work and you just want to get him off stage and kill him because he pretty much sucks there.

 

[the muted smasher]

XD you know pichu, s f tilt has less lag and hangs out longer than sheiks f tilt and if You upwards angle it all of marth's moves clank and it's super annoying for marth if he trys to grab. Also when You sh at him You don't have to nair You can pull back empty and space for his air moves in advance and 2nd jump back jolt can be a thing.

Really marth isn't to horrible other than on ys and sometimes fod unless they are amazing with their patience and spacing. But really nair chain throws are the best way to build percent also read jumps and thunder and force him off without a 2nd jump.

It's basic shield pressuring, amazing spacing, nair chains, some baiting and solid recovery to beat him

 

[kingPiano]

XD you know pichu, s f tilt has less lag and hangs out longer than sheiks f tilt and if You upwards angle it all of marth's moves clank and it's super annoying for marth if he trys to grab. Also when You sh at him You don't have to nair You can pull back empty and space for his air moves in advance and 2nd jump back jolt can be a thing.

Really marth isn't to horrible other than on ys and sometimes fod unless they are amazing with their patience and spacing. But really nair chain throws are the best way to build percent also read jumps and thunder and force him off without a 2nd jump.

It's basic shield pressuring, amazing spacing, nair chains, some baiting and solid recovery to beat him

hmm I'm going to have to disagree big time. In my experience Pichu's up-tilt has the best chance of clanking with Marth's advances and hitting him. The f tilt - even angled - gets easily overpowered by any sword attack (Pichu's foot hurtbox is extended very far). The Uptilt has less lag, has almost twice the range, and is completely disjointed.

 

[Comet7]

hmm I'm going to have to disagree big time. In my experience Pichu's up-tilt has the best chance of clanking with Marth's advances and hitting him. The f tilt - even angled - gets easily overpowered by any sword attack (Pichu's foot hurtbox is extended very far). The Uptilt has less lag, has almost twice the range, and is completely disjointed.

f tilt clanks with marth's f smash. it has ridiculous priority.

 

[kingPiano]

f tilt clanks with marth's f smash. it has ridiculous priority.

Uhh we might have different versions of the game then, because Pichu's F tilt in my game is terrible against marth, his regular attacks even penetrate to Pichu's foot hurtbox easily. Granted the hit boxes stay out longer than up tilt, but I see up-tilt clank almost every move from Marth (also the f tilt has so much more end lag). Pichu's Up-tilt and up air at the only moves that rival the disjointedness of Marth's Sword. The D air also seems to have generous hitboxes on the sides. But that move is so laggy and unwieldy, it does have great knock back and KO potential though.

 

[Comet7]

quotes from derf

It should also be noted that ftilt is the falco slayer. It'll smack him out of his recovery and lazy nair approaches. Use it wisely.

First things first; lets talk about missiles.
Pichu is tiny and has weird high priority moves that will cover his body, so he can actually weave through missiles pretty well.
When you're on the ground, ftilt and utilt.

What's really cool about ftilt is that it has a ton of priority for no reason. That basically just means it beats out other moves really well.
This lets you do some pretty cool things like ftilt through most projectiles, which really helps Pichu out in a few matchups like samus.
Not lasers though, because they have what is called transcendent priority, similar to moves like mario's cape, which just means they can't clank or be beaten out by any other moves.

Ftilt also has this great mechanic where you can angle it up or down, this is really helpful for edgeguarding or intercepting other moves.
For example, down-angled ftilt is often used to intercept falco's recovery to the ledge, whereas up-angled ftilt is often used to clank with marth's fsmash.

-----

up tilt is nice but f tilt has more priority and pretty much clanks with anything.

 

[kingPiano]

And I know this is probably in a guide on this site or maybe even DeRF's, but Pichu's F-smash. Is it just random or does the final hitbox never hit because of DI?

 

[Comet7]

And I know this is probably in a guide on this site or maybe even DeRF's, but Pichu's F-smash. Is it just random or does the final hitbox never hit because of DI?

http://smashboards.com/threads/derfmws-big-pichu-guide.369436/

that should have all the information you need for general purposes and properties of moves. also check out the vids in the OP of this since one is a break down on the moves as well. to answer your question, the final hitbox will hit if there is no sdi at all, but if the opponent sdi's in pretty much any direction, they will avoid the final hit.

AND DERF MORE VIDS PLEASE, OR TELL ME ABOUT YOUR DORAKI TECH SENPAI

 

[kingPiano]

Well I'd like to see the use of F-tilt against Marth, I understand for edge-guarding it's good (even then D-tilt is a MUCH MUCH better choice if you have good reaction time). But F-Tilt on the ground, with all it's end lag....against a Marth? C'mon....you're gonna get creamed and combed to hell when it whiffs. I rarely ever see other Pichu player throw F-tilts out in the neutral against any opponent.

 

[Comet7]

Well I'd like to see the use of F-tilt against Marth, I understand for edge-guarding it's good (even then D-tilt is a MUCH MUCH better choice if you have good reaction time). But F-Tilt on the ground, with all it's end lag....against a Marth? C'mon....you're gonna get creamed and combed to hell when it whiffs. I rarely ever see other Pichu player throw F-tilts out in the neutral against any opponent.

it does have a few advantages over down tilt, which are that it comes out faster with a longer lasting hitbox and has That Priority (tm). i haven't used it too much in neutral myself, but from what i can tell, it's good if used at the right time. i don't think there are many marths that would expect you to throw out something that clanks with all their moves, especially from a pichu, so match up unawareness is also a big factor here. yeah, if you just throw it out, it'll get punished, but that can happen with any other move in the game, even shine.

 

[kingPiano]

Let's not compare the massively OP and combo-able shine to a really laggy F-tilt. Shine can be done in air, done twice in succession, can be jump cancelled, has set knock back protecting from retaliation even at low percents.

U tilt has 6 less frames end lag (15 for F-tilt you're vulnerable, as opposed to 9), and U tilt hits behind, above, in front. In my experiences it's just so much more effective and useful and seems to hit way further than it should. F-Tilt I never get that feeling and I feel exposed.

Against Marth I've also tried F-tilts and it just isn't worth it over all the other moves that could be done instead (after clanking you are left more prone, and Marth can hit faster you at the close recoiled distance than U-tilt). Even if F-tilt connects it sends them off in crappy trajectories leading to no set ups or combo opportunities. Same with using it to edgeguard, D-tilt is so much more superior since it send opponents down and away, and U-tilt pops them up for air juggling.

 

[the muted smasher]

I didn't mean to cause this much trouble xD I'm sorry no just vs marth's land locked it really messes with them and pichu in 1.0 is the same as pal :/ I went through the masterhand program and checked every hitbox, percent, kbg and etc. Everytime is the same unless they somehow changed a projectile which I couldn't look at.

Up f-tilt does 8% up-tilt does 6 you'll get ran over by f-smash

 

[kingPiano]

I didn't mean to cause this much trouble xD I'm sorry no just vs marth's land locked it really messes with them and pichu in 1.0 is the same as pal :/ I went through the masterhand program and checked every hitbox, percent, kbg and etc. Everytime is the same unless they somehow changed a projectile which I couldn't look at.

Up f-tilt does 8% up-tilt does 6 you'll get ran over by f-smash

I'll continue because this is relevant to helping Pichu players.

Up F-tilt does 8%....UpTilt + Up air + nair/bair does does 23. F-tilt leads to nothing, not even edgeguard opps until higher percents.

And why would you challenge Marth's F-smash with F-tilt? there are like 10 better options not to mention spot dodge grab (better to WD grab) or roll grab which leads to great combos and chains. The lag on Ftilt is terrible too, Marth can throw another attack if you ever whiff it, it's not a move you can spam or space with in neutral. The range on it is also laughable when you are facing a marth (his hurtboxes are weird for Pichu and never seem to connect at distance with an F-tilt, same with grabs)

Go actually try all this stuff you guys keep talking about, it doesn't work. I'm actually beginning to think you guys might even be trolling or joking right now. U-tilt has twice the range against Marths than F-tilt and it's great for defense and combos.

 

[the muted smasher]

F tilt clank and beats grab and is very fast. It's the only move in the game besides pika, s that has a niche of being really good at being a safe way to fight others ground game in the sense if it clank marth has to jump or keep clanking. I've done this myself and I speak of experience. When You're in a corner on ys what else can You do that is safe vs all of marth's spaced options that doesn't put You in a worse place.

Now if he doesn't attack yeah there's lag but what else covers all ground options cornered?

It seems srcub y but things like rolls can be legit threats to marth xD

Up tilt is hard to work in it loses to f smash

 

[kingPiano]

F tilt clank and beats grab and is very fast. It's the only move in the game besides pika, s that has a niche of being really good at being a safe way to fight others ground game in the sense if it clank marth has to jump or keep clanking. I've done this myself and I speak of experience. When You're in a corner on ys what else can You do that is safe vs all of marth's spaced options that doesn't put You in a worse place.

Now if he doesn't attack yeah there's lag but what else covers all ground options cornered?

It seems srcub y but things like rolls can be legit threats to marth xD

Up tilt is hard to work in it loses to f smash

Alright I'm just going to stop, it seems like you don't actually have much experience using f tilt against any good marths. You'll be lucky to land 3 out of 100. I'm not asking about theories, I'm talking about practical use and experience.

And allow me to use pictures to explain yet another reason why F-tilt is useless against any good Marth.
MARTH'S MASSIVE GRAB HIT BOX RANGE OVERLAPS and overwhelms F TILT 100% of the time. You see that foot exposed and it's exposed as long as the move is out (retracts a bit but still grab-able). I've never seen it clank marth's grab before it gets Pichu. If you have it must have been some tiny frame window where the priority is same or better than Marth's grab (is that even possible?)

His grab can't penetrate U-tilt's crazy hitboxes to get to Pichu's hurtbox. Pichu's profile is also much smaller during the entire U-tilt, meaning Marth's grab completely whiffs 100% of the time and leaves him open to attack. The tail hit box has a substantial area due to the generous shapes and it's more disjointed than any of this other ground moves. F-tilt pichu stands up for the last 15 frames of end lag, his whole profile exposed and prone to easily getting grabbed or hit with any of Marth's ground moves (including F-smash)

Sorry I don't mean to come off brash, but I sense that your talking from a place of theory and not actually match-up knowledge against any good HUMAN Marths. I think it's irresponsible to throw out "tips" or "knowledge" if it's not been thoroughly tested.

 

[Comet7]

Alright I'm just going to stop, it seems like you don't actually have much experience using f tilt against any good marths. You'll be lucky to land 3 out of 100. I'm not asking about theories, I'm talking about practical use and experience.

yeah, you don't know who you're talking to, and have no proof of accomplishing anything yourself, so don't act like other people have less experience than you. i've also been trying to not play this card, but you joined less than a week ago and it's pretty obvious that you don't know what you talk about. it's nice that you're giving pichu a shot though.

And allow me to use pictures to explain yet another reason why F-tilt is useless against any good Marth.
MARTH'S MASSIVE GRAB HIT BOX RANGE OVERLAPS and overwhelms F TILT 100% of the time. You see that foot exposed and it's exposed as long as the move is out (retracts a bit but still grab-able). I've never seen it clank marth's grab before it gets Pichu. If you have it must have been some tiny frame window where the priority is same or better than Marth's grab (is that even possible?)

f tilt is faster than grab and if the hitbox meets (insert any move here), they will clank. if you still don't believe me, spam f tilt against marth cpus.

His grab can't penetrate U-tilt's crazy hitboxes to get to Pichu's hurtbox. Pichu's profile is also much smaller during the entire U-tilt, meaning Marth's grab completely whiffs 100% of the time and leaves him open to attack. The tail hit box has a substantial area due to the generous shapes and it's more disjointed than any of this other ground moves. F-tilt pichu stands up for the last 15 frames of end lag, his whole profile exposed and prone to easily getting grabbed or hit with any of Marth's ground moves (including F-smash)

up tilt comes out on frame 7 and won't be in front of pichu for another frame or two and DOES NOT HAVE THE PRIORITY OF F TILT which means it will lose to a lot of moves and be outranged a lot because we're talking about marth anyway, which also makes the point of f tilt being outranged somewhat moot. and yes pichu can be grabbed or anything else during those cooldown frames but whatever; nothing is purely safe anyway.

Sorry I don't mean to come off brash, but I sense that your talking from a place of theory and not actually match-up knowledge against any good HUMAN Marths. I think it's irresponsible to throw out "tips" or "knowledge" if it's not been thoroughly tested.

even with the barren pichu boards, i think we'd have some good info on what our moves are and how they can be used after 13 years.

i'm just going to put comments in bold

 

[the muted smasher]

XD I do this and the application is abusing a hitbox long that doesn't lose to f-smash, d tilt or grab. And it fills it even if it's very niche.

Also don't believe up-tilt ducks grab but get a gift and that'd be awesome.

But honestly if it ducks then d-smash would too and flip marth around in a bad way and has good Inv. Frames and will always tanka tipper f-smash.

But we don't know pichu as well as we think. XD so it's silly to sling mud at each other