Social Pac IS Back! - Pac-Man Discussion Thread

[Deleted member]

I have to say that after playing around with him in Ultimate he feels amazingly fresh to play, especially compared to Smash 4. The increased speed of the fruit cycling took some getting used to but it's a welcome change.

 

[IsmaR]

I'm having trouble adjusting to things like not getting slow air momentum when jumping/charging fruit mid-air, but otherwise he feels fun.

 

[Almand]

I've been in Online for a solid 4 hours now, and I gotta say, Pac is FUN. Not good, God he's average, but he actually has some really cool stuff now!

-Nair combos now!
-Fair is a better combo tool!
-Dair is a combo tool!

He's actually a really good horizontal combo-er. Falling Nair to Fair to falling Nair to Fair, so on. And his Up Throw lightly combos into Up Air now! It's at specific percents, but can work.

That isn't to say he doesn't have flaws... He has a lot.

-Everyone is so fast that he has trouble pinning someone down to get his combos.
-When I say Up Throw lightly combos, I mean lightly. I faced a Young Link a few times, and he was consistently able to Dair me (and kill me, mind you) when I went for a followup. And this was at a myriad of percents.
-Now that Neutral Air can combo, he lost another safe kill option, really only leaving Bair, Hydrant, or Key, which brings me to another complaint.
-Bair isn't nearly strong enough to be his only non-situational/non-double edged sword kill move. It might be stronger, but I really doubt it. I've had middleweights live from a Bair at 150-180%. Pac really struggles to kill (I once had a K. Rool survive to 250% on FD, living through Melons, Bairs, Dairs, Up Airs, whatever).
-Dair can combo, but is also very specific. But it's still a great move. 13% is nothing to sneeze at.
-Fair almost has too much base knockback now. At 0%, it just barely sends the opponent close enough to you to combo into another Fair. And when your opponent is around 70% (on middleweights), it'll cease to combo into itself at all, only serving to confirm into Key (which is still obviously a good thing, but I digress).
-Pac just doesn't seem fast enough. Despite his buffs, he still can't quite keep up, which adds to his trouble getting in and punishing.
-Fruits. By God, are his Fruits a mixed bag... He now has Fruit Recycle, which gives him the ability to infinitely use any catchable Fruit (usually Melon or Galaga) by double tapping B with it in your hand. But it's at the cost of Fruit Cancel, the slow fall, easily recatching Fruits with the help of a wall (still possible, but harder), Z-Dropping... It almost feels like he falls faster when he's charging Fruit. I swear, charging it offstage is a death wish, and if you don't have a jump, whoops! You're dead unless Fruit finishes charging (can take a while depending on how much charge you already have), you have a jump, or are high enough to live through an airdodge, which gives your opponent a ton of time to regain stage control, edgeguard, set up, charge their own moves, so on.

He's better, but... Yeah, he needs more.

 

[xzx]

I think his bair has a sweetspot. The hitbox closest to him.

Yeah Pac-Man still sucks and needs more. He can't keep up.

 

[Almand]

I think his bair has a sweetspot. The hitbox closest to him.

Yeah Pac-Man still sucks and needs more. He can't keep up.

It doesn't; you might be confusing the shorthop multiplier (0.85x damage) with a sourspot. Shorthopped, Bair deals 10%, whereas it deals 11.8% fullhopped. Or at least I couldn't find a special hitbox.

So, it's still pretty mediocre damage, especially for a move you're likely gonna be shorthopping all the time for the autocancel, and especially for a move that's supposed to kill, even though it really doesn't; with a CPU Mario set to No Shuffling at Center FD, Fullhop Bair kills at 157%. For comparison, Mario's Bair, which is more of a combo tool due to its low damage and knockback, killed at 164%. For comparison, Smash 4's Pac-Bair killed at 159.7% with the same conditions (from the calculator on KuroganeHammer, made by Ruben). So they probably buffed its KBG by 1 or 2 units.

Pac-Man's Bair, meant to be a kill move, is only slightly better at killing than a combo tool. Sakurai, please. And this move used to be worse! It was buffed in a Smash 4 Patch to have a teeny-tiny bit more knockback (98 -> 100 KBG). Meaning it killed maybe 4-5% earlier from vanilla. *sigh*

 

[Almand]

Okay, so... Update 1.2 went live, and it said they updated Pac-Man. Hm. I hope they fixed some stuff we complained about. ^^

Updates: *sigh* I can't find anything different. Bair doesn't kill, Nair doesn't kill, Fair is the same, Up Throw still only sorta-combos, everything does the same damage, Up Tilt is still bad, he doesn't feel any faster... What did they change? They said he was one of the adjusted fighters, but I can't find a single thing different.

 

[xzx]

The only thing we know so far is that the Key doesn't get discarded when recycling it.

 

[Deleted member]

Co

Okay, so... Update 1.2 went live, and it said they updated Pac-Man. Hm. I hope they fixed some stuff we complained about. ^^

Updates: *sigh* I can't find anything different. Bair doesn't kill, Nair doesn't kill, Fair is the same, Up Throw still only sorta-combos, everything does the same damage, Up Tilt is still bad, he doesn't feel any faster... What did they change? They said he was one of the adjusted fighters, but I can't find a single thing different.

They could have adjusted the properties of one of (or some of) the fruits? I'm not able to test right now though.

 

[Almand]

The only thing we know so far is that the Key doesn't get discarded when recycling it.

Yeah, that may be the only change. I've checked all his Fruits, they do nothing different (Z-Dropped or no), so it seems to just be that little bug fix on Recycled Key. Disappointing, but hey, maybe next time.

I've been playing Pac in Elite Smash for the past few days, so hopefully they get something out of it? Pac-Man is so underplayed that he may be sorta overlooked, which is never fun. We can only hope.

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah, that may be the only change. I've checked all his Fruits, they do nothing different (Z-Dropped or no), so it seems to just be that little bug fix on Recycled Key. Disappointing, but hey, maybe next time.

I've been playing Pac in Elite Smash for the past few days, so hopefully they get something out of it? Pac-Man is so underplayed that he may be sorta overlooked, which is never fun. We can only hope.

Yup. No high level player is batting an eye to him. It's quite frustrating to see him consistently dismissed as low or bottom tier when almost no one is giving him the light of day in the first place.

 

[Almand]

Yup. No high level player is batting an eye to him. It's quite frustrating to see him consistently dismissed as low or bottom tier when almost no one is giving him the light of day in the first place.

Exactly. At this point, Pac exists to be part of those "10000 IQ Pac-Man plays" montages and YouTube comments that read "Pac-Man players aren't human" because of a Bell setup

 

[LanceStern]

Pacman was nerfed to hell. Like he really lost a LOT of tools. I'm not sure if I can main him anymore!

Gonna work through some ledge traps to see what still exists

 

[Almand]

Pacman was nerfed to hell. Like he really lost a LOT of tools. I'm not sure if I can main him anymore!

Gonna work through some ledge traps to see what still exists

Using Up B on Hydrant still works, and Bell still works. Melon to Up B sorta works, but the thrown Melon doesn't last as long.

Another thing I noticed that is very, very bad, is that your fruits barely last any time at all when you Z-Drop or throw them. For example, when you throw an Apple upward, it'll last quite a long time and create pressure in that small area. But now, it lasts maybe 2 bounces, then disappears. Barely any time for your opponent to hit it. Also, when you get hit out of a charge, your fruit only lasts a handful of frames before it poofs off. Which is good for your opponent not getting it, but bad if you, y'know, actually want to get your fruit in hand. Not that it's necessarily threatening to hold it with Z-Dropping gone, but I digress.

 

[WarioJim]

Edited: wrong post

 

[Tycon]

Pac-Man looks like he has some tricks and hope for the future. I'm sure people have known about some of his weird tech options but I was blown away by Tibs play when i saw the weird mix up of options compared to other Pac-Man mains I've seen the last month. Sinji has also been making waves with the character.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqGxrF-04cA

Full Looped Side Bs and reversed side Bs as mix ups, side B into hydrant for cover. Sharking with bells on recovery. Using getup attack to make hydrant launch at a 45 degree angle and that clip at the end of bell into aerial side B for a finish when the opponent is out of up smash range. His opponent missed some punishes but Tibs played phenomenally well.

 

[dragontamer]

Its been over a month, and no one else has figured out that PacMan can jump out of Fruit Charge?

Fruit-charge -> Nair == great defensive option now. The PacMain community has been looking for buffs in the wrong location.

PacMan's BAir -> Jab1 (close hitbox) or Jab1(far hitbox) are among the best edge-guarding tools in the game. It sets up a very easy DSmash KO option, or just straight up KOs opponents who stay on the ledge too long.

Hydrant setup Bair -> USmash has been buffed: USmash's first hitbox is now 3%, so it is far more reliable (even if BAir is slightly stale). You can launch hydrants to cover practically the entirety of battlefield, no matter where the opponent is.

Hydrant Jab1 (close), Jab1 (far) , DAir, Fair, Nair, USmash, FSmash, and Apple covers the entire stage, both in front of PacMan, and behind (Jab1 far, USmash). No location is safe. PacMan's Hydrant camp is far stronger in Ultimate than it has ever been before IMO.

 

[xzx]

His current damage output. We can use this for future patch notes. Only thing it doesn't have is the middle hits of up-b and every damage value for side b and some late hits here and there.

Jab: 2,2,4 >
F.tilt: 8 >
Up-tilt: 6.5 >
D.tilt: 6 >
Dash: 2,2,2,4 >

Upsmash: 3,14 >
Dsmash: 13 >
Fsmash: 15/16 >

Dair: 2,2,2,7
Nair: 10 >
Fair: 7.6 >
Uair: 10 >
Bair: 11.8 >

Pummel: 1.3 >
Upthrow: 5 >
Fthrow: 8 >
Dthrow: 1.5,1.5,6 >
Bthrow: 11 >

UpB: 5, 6, 7.2 (early) / 7, 8.4, 8.6 (late) >

SideB: 12 (full), 6 (press), 4 (full initial), 4.2 (press initial) >

DownB: 9 (dropped), 13 (launched), 13 (tumbling) >

Cherry: 4.3 >
Strawberry: 6 >
Orange: 7.5 >
Apple: 9.5 >
Melon: 12 >
Galaxian: 9 >
Bell: 7.5 >
Key: 16 >

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Hey guys, what’s new with Pac-Man?

 

[chocolatejr9]

Hey guys, what’s new with Pac-Man?

I hear they added Minecraft DLC, so that's cool.

By the way, does anybody here know about that weird AtGames situation?

 

[MrGameguycolor]

40 years of pellet chomping, ghost evading, venturing the three worlds, and throwing fruit while planting hydrant traps.

Good work Pac-man.

 

[Deleted member]

Really looking forward to playing that new Pac-Man Twitch online game.

 

[Oracle Link]

Wakawakawakawakawakawakawakawakawaka

Would you guys want a new Pacman Jumpnrun game?

 

[MrGameguycolor]

Wakawakawakawakawakawakawakawakawaka

Would you guys want a new Pacman Jumpnrun game?

Pacman World 4 yo!?

 

[Oracle Link]

Pacman World 4 yo!?

here i copy my idea for it here:

Pacman sorta needs new Stuff

I think about a Jumpnrun Series With a Bunch of Mazes Ala Pac World

I would design the Ghosts Diffrently giving Blinky angry eyebrows, inky would look bored, Clyde getting a open drooling Mouth and Pinky getting Eyelashes they do keep their Shapes identical Tho

A lot of Classic Npc would return together with some redesigned Ghostly Adventures ones

The Main Baddy would be the Devil Ghost Dinky with a lot of old obscour Pacman Baddys like Tok Man the Witch and this one Bearded Ghost from GA BUT IN CUTE ARCARDE STYLE

Pacman himself would use his Pacman World look!