Meta On the Field of Battle: Link Stage Discussion Thread

Rizen

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Stage Discussion Thread


I'm taking over from Zane and borrowing his format with a few changes.
The format is as follows:
[Stage] The stage's name.
[Status] Neutral/Counter/Banned on the current stagelist.
[Score 1-5 (1 is terrible, 5 is great)] *****
[Counter against] Which characters Link is good against here.
[Ban against] Which characters Link is bad against here.
[General Info] Discussion info...
Please copy this for each stage you discuss. You can post about any stage at any time but please prioritize tournament legal ones. Remember the focus is on how Link fares. I'll quote everyone's posts and archive them in the 2nd (and maybe 3rd if I need more room) posts of this thread.

Let's do work!
 
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Rizen

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Discussion Archives

Neutral Stages:

Battlefield

Battlefield

[Link approved] Yes
[Counter against] :4littlemac:,:4falcon:,:4duckhunt:,:4samus:,:4wario2:,:4megaman:,:4bowserjr:,:4diddy:,:4sonic:,:4olimar:
[Ban against] :4ganondorf:,:4myfriends:,:4marth:,:4mario:,:4luigi:,:4drmario:,:4fox:,:4falco:,:4sheik:
[General Info] A strong pick against characters that are dependent on rushing in unabated. A fairly well balanced stage like battlefield has fairly large blast zones on the sides and below with an average upwards zone. The platforms uniquely influence how Link can utilize his bombs and provide him with options he would otherwise lack in stressful positions, including but not limited to bombs bouncing off shield and landing on the low platforms, planting bombs on any platform, platform camping with PC aerials and Link's advantage with playing a vertical aerial game grants him strong priority over characters that require land to approach. This stage is tougher against opponents with command grabs as they can utilize the space above them in tricky ways that cannot be blocked requiring you to evade. It also grants easier vertical kills to Link, but any of the characters who kill vertically better than him should be reckoned with.

At the end of the day, the advantages given by this stage outweigh most of the negatives in any matchup, but a good opponent will know how to close the gap even through platforms so pick BF at your own discretion. Link has a few better stages in most situations.

Final Destination

Final Destination 1
Final Destinaion and other Ω's
[Status] Neutral
[Link approved] Yes
[Counter against] :4dk:,:4ganondorf:,:4bowser:,:4charizard:,:4myfriends:,:rosalina:,:4dedede:,:4gaw:
[Ban against] :4fox:,:4falco:,:4falcon:,:4duckhunt:,:4pacman:,:4sonic:,:4sheik:,:4pikachu:,:4zss:,:4diddy:
[General Info] Final Destination is a fairly uneventful stage, and since it is flat and long, general procedure is to use the space of the stage to zone your opponent with projectiles and camp them out. Camp your opponent and force them to make mistakes chasing you down and rack up that % to kill. You'll want to bring enemies to FD that are slower, bigger, or have lesser camping abilities to allow you a wide breadth of options when throwing projectiles. You should avoid this stage against enemies who have better camping abilities, characters who can breakthrough your wave of projectiles, and those especially fast characters that are able to punish basically every landing.

All in all not bad for Link, but you can normally find a better alternate, so use discretion if FD is your stage of choice.

Smashville

Smashville

[Status] Neutral
[Link approved] Yes
[Counter against] :4bowser:,:4megaman:,:4wiifit:,TBA
[Ban against] :4pikachu:,:4fox:,:4falcon:,:4metaknight:,TBA

[General Info] Another great starting point for pretty much any playstyle of Link. The stage has enough wiggle room to engage in light to mid-range zoning, but plenty of your faster opponents will require you to keep on your toes in neutral as well. This is overall the most balanced stage, but it can tend to favor fast characters with good juggles, so be mindful to stay center stage and feet on the ground against said foes. Link has a fairly decent time against other zoners due to his ability to manipulate stage control with soft bombs planted on the ground or on the moving platform. The odd balloon here and there has the potential to eat one of your projectiles, which if use properly can cause bombs to go off midair, and improperly can leave you severely open with no coverage. Characters that have a seismic toss throw like :4charizard::4metaknight:and :4rob: to name a few, they are able to utilize the moving platform as leverage to set up for earlier kills, so be wary of those as well. The blastzones are pretty fair on all sides so it really comes down to your preference on kill moves.
At the end of the day if you didn't like Battlefield more, this is probably where your first round will take place, it's the most commonly picked starter in tournaments two games running, so anyone who has been playing long enough has an idea how to use this stage. Pick something else if you believe your opponent has a better conventional knowledge than you, and take caution against aggressive foes who fish for stage spikes, as the diagonal ledge is prime real-estate for it

Dreamland 64

...



...

Counterpick Stages:

Town and City

...

Banned Stages:



...
 
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Zane the pure

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"Do you see it my son? It is the glorious land of Hyrule, and she yearns for you to aid her"

Here we shall commence with the discussion of what stages benefit Link both individually and from the perspective of whatever matchup neccesary. As a general rule of thumb, please keep to the current stage in the thread title as we go, and when the discussion of a particular stage has been completed community vote can decide the next stage.

Rulesets change, and their stagelist are also subject to change, and as such we will refrain from discussing stages that are not tournament legal until they are added to the stagelist or we have run out of legal ones to discuss. Of course, if you do have something new to add to a past stage discussion, I'll do my best to filter through and add it too, but I would recommend PMing me the extra details. (that way it's easy for me to find and copypaste)

Henceforth, Final Destination will be divided into three categories. 1: FDs like the original that have lips of the ledge, 2: FDs that have walls, and 3: FDs that are flat
Example:
FD1= ΩBattlefield
FD2= ΩWoolly World
FD3= Ω Delfino Plaza

Now go my Link brethren, conquer the fields of battle so that we may reign supreme in favorable conditions!
The format is as follows:
[Stage] The stage's name.
*picture of stage/s*
[Status]
Neutral/Counter/Banned on the current stagelist.
[Link approved] Does Link do well here naturally?
[Counter against] Which characters Link is good against here.
[Ban against] Which characters Link is bad against here.
[General Info] Discussion info...
 
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Zane the pure

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Reserved for the Stages current info. All stages will be titled and held in spoiler tags for ease of access.

Final Destination 1
[Stage] Final Destinaion and other Ω's

[Status] Neutral
[Link approved] Yes
[Counter against] :4dk:,:4ganondorf:,:4bowser:,:4charizard:,:4myfriends:,:rosalina:,:4dedede:,:4gaw:
[Ban against] :4fox:,:4falco:,:4falcon:,:4duckhunt:,:4pacman:,:4sonic:,:4sheik:,:4pikachu:,:4zss:,:4diddy:
[General Info] Final Destination is a fairly uneventful stage, and since it is flat and long, general procedure is to use the space of the stage to zone your opponent with projectiles and camp them out. Camp your opponent and force them to make mistakes chasing you down and rack up that % to kill. You'll want to bring enemies to FD that are slower, bigger, or have lesser camping abilities to allow you a wide breadth of options when throwing projectiles. You should avoid this stage against enemies who have better camping abilities, characters who can breakthrough your wave of projectiles, and those especially fast characters that are able to punish basically every landing.

All in all not bad for Link, but you can normally find a better alternate, so use discretion if FD is your stage of choice.

Battlefield
[Stage] Battlefield

[Status] Neutral
[Link approved] Yes
[Counter against] :4littlemac:,:4falcon:,:4duckhunt:,:4samus:,:4wario2:,:4megaman:,:4bowserjr:,:4diddy:,:4sonic:,:4olimar:
[Ban against] :4ganondorf:,:4myfriends:,:4marth:,:4mario:,:4luigi:,:4drmario:,:4fox:,:4falco:,:4sheik:
[General Info] A strong pick against characters that are dependent on rushing in unabated. A fairly well balanced stage like battlefield has fairly large blast zones on the sides and below with an average upwards zone. The platforms uniquely influence how Link can utilize his bombs and provide him with options he would otherwise lack in stressful positions, including but not limited to bombs bouncing off shield and landing on the low platforms, planting bombs on any platform, platform camping with PC aerials and Link's advantage with playing a vertical aerial game grants him strong priority over characters that require land to approach. This stage is tougher against opponents with command grabs as they can utilize the space above them in tricky ways that cannot be blocked requiring you to evade. It also grants easier vertical kills to Link, but any of the characters who kill vertically better than him should be reckoned with.

At the end of the day, the advantages given by this stage outweigh most of the negatives in any matchup, but a good opponent will know how to close the gap even through platforms so pick BF at your own discretion. Link has a few better stages in most situations.

Smashville
[Stage] Smashville

[Status] Neutral
[Link approved] Yes
[Counter against] :4bowser:,:4megaman:,:4wiifit:,TBA
[Ban against] :4pikachu:,:4fox:,:4falcon:,:4metaknight:,TBA

[General Info] Another great starting point for pretty much any playstyle of Link. The stage has enough wiggle room to engage in light to mid-range zoning, but plenty of your faster opponents will require you to keep on your toes in neutral as well. This is overall the most balanced stage, but it can tend to favor fast characters with good juggles, so be mindful to stay center stage and feet on the ground against said foes. Link has a fairly decent time against other zoners due to his ability to manipulate stage control with soft bombs planted on the ground or on the moving platform. The odd balloon here and there has the potential to eat one of your projectiles, which if use properly can cause bombs to go off midair, and improperly can leave you severely open with no coverage. Characters that have a seismic toss throw like :4charizard::4metaknight:and :4rob: to name a few, they are able to utilize the moving platform as leverage to set up for earlier kills, so be wary of those as well. The blastzones are pretty fair on all sides so it really comes down to your preference on kill moves.
At the end of the day if you didn't like Battlefield more, this is probably where your first round will take place, it's the most commonly picked starter in tournaments two games running, so anyone who has been playing long enough has an idea how to use this stage. Pick something else if you believe your opponent has a better conventional knowledge than you, and take caution against aggressive foes who fish for stage spikes, as the diagonal ledge is prime real-estate for it
 
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Rizen

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I see FD similar to how it was for Link in Brawl but less disadvantageous. It's big which is nice for Link but the lack of platforms makes it not ideal vs any opponent. Link should have a slight advantage vs characters who have to chase him down but a moderate disadvantage vs characters he has to chase that out-camp him on flat stages or have excellent mobility.
IMO FD isn't a good stage for Link but it's not terrible either. Maybe ban against someone like Sonic. I wouldn't CP it vs anyone.
 

Elessar

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[Stage] Final Destination.
[Status] Neutral.
[Link approved] I agree with Rizen in that Final Destination isn't as bad as it used to be in Brawl. However, I still see it as a slightly uphill battle, specially vs rush down chars like Fox, Sheik, Sonic, etc. However, this stage is actually a good counter imo vs the larger slower and heavier chars who don't have a natural way to deal with our spam and can thus be conditioned into a bad approach, like Bowser, Charizad, Ganondorf and DK.
[Counter against] As I said above, I believe this stage to favor us in MUs vs slowish, large, and pure melee chars who are easily juggled.
[Ban against] Sonic, Fox, Sheik, Diddy, Little Mac. Any fast, rush down char. Maybe Weegee could also fit in this category.
[General Info] I am a big fan of platforms, so in my mind, any stage without platforms put a dent on our performance. We need to control the stage and condition our opponents to approach poorly, which granted, can be done in FD. However, since Link is slow we also need to be able to sometimes run away from the rush down ultra aggressive chars, and that's where having no platforms affects us negatively. On a more positive side, the lack of platforms also means that we are able to juggle airborne opponents far easier. Considering how good of a KO move and juggler our Uair can be, I believe this stage to actually favor us in matches vs easily juggled chars, since landing can be a pain for them due to our ability to chase them with Uair as well as cover their landing options with soft thrown bombs or a well times gale.

As it is, I see the stage's neutrality as MU dependant.
 

KenMeister

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Interesting take on opinions for FD. Just out of curiosity, what would be the best stage for Link then? Town and City? It's big, with platforms to boot.
 

Elessar

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Interesting take on opinions for FD. Just out of curiosity, what would be the best stage for Link then? Town and City? It's big, with platforms to boot.
Personally, the best stages for Link based on how I perform in them are Battlefield, Smashville and Town and City in that order.
 

Drigo Toes

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I actually love FD since melee.

That said, I'm agree with you guys. FD is a perfect stage for juggling with or against, therefore char as Fox, C. Falcon and other chase chars can abuse us to death, but some others can be abused for us as Bowser, DK.

I would add, however, that FD is a perfect stage for FH + Bomb to down + prefered follow (footstood, Nair, Dair). I usually abuse this way to fight, therefore I feel more confortable in FD, Smashville and Town and City than BattleField; but i agree that BF is our best stage.

I use FD as a counter depending on the style of my opponent more than his/her char.

:X
 
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Huggles828

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Personally, the best stages for Link based on how I perform in them are Battlefield, Smashville and Town and City in that order.
THIS. I agree 100% with this. I honestly really like BF for Link. Delfino is also a solid choice imo.

Like Rizen said, FD is pretty meh for Link. I think Link usually does much better when he has a few platforms to work with; if you get cornered on FD it can be trickier to get some space and you can't use your sword to hit opponents on the platforms, as there are none. Another thing to note is you should avoid it for characters that can outspam Link or have very strong long range games, like maybe Samus, Duck Hunt, or possibly Falco (not sure how good at camping he is in this one). I'd go for regular FD/omega levels with a lip over levels with walls. I like the lip because it lets me stagespike with bair. I don't think the walls really help us all that much; the only advantage I could see would be blowing yourself up against them to help recover but that sound awfully situational.

Personally I wouldn't really CP it against many characters, maybe like Bowser or DK like Elessar said.

One thing to note: it seems the general perception of Link is that he's super campy like Samus, so people are often quick to ban or strike FD against me. So I often let my opponent do the work for me and don't bother striking or banning it (i.e. in Brawl If I wanted BF I'd ban, say, Lylat and Yoshi's, figuring they'd ban FD for me and we'd go to SV or BF, my top two choices).
 
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Rizen

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For the Omega stages with walls and without walls thing, it doesn't seem to affect Link significantly. FD2 walls make gale guarding easier but FD1 ledge lips allow for stage spiking like Dr.Huggles said. Link's recovery isn't hindered by the lips.
Some characters have a harder time recovering on FD1 stages with lips. The main reason FD1 stages would benefit Link is they can hurt the opponent.

FD might be a good starter but CP stages like Delfino and Halberd will always outshine it when Link needs a big stage.
 

Zelkam

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First off, awesome stuff Zane. I've added this thread to the Index.

Secondly, it seems that we're all in agreement about FD. I would definitely say that it is a very character dependent stage. Like it has been mentioned, against speedy rush-down characters, characters with good stage control, or characters that can out spam Link FD is not an ideal stage choice. However, against larger, slower characters FD can be an excellent stage choice. The large size and lack of platform makes it difficult for them to escape our projectiles so we can play the long range spacing game quite well.

Characters I would counter pick FD against would be Bowser, Rosalina, DK, Ganon, Ike, D3, and Charizard.

Characters I would ban FD against would be Diddy, Little Mac, Sheik, ZZS, Robin, DHD, Fox, Falco, Pikachu, Falcon, Villager, Pac-Man, Megaman, and Sonic.

On the topic of omegas, it can be said that there are actually three variations: walled (i.e. duck hunt), sloped (i.e. FD), and flat (i.e. Lylat cruise). Of these three, I believe Link benefits the most from the sloped variations. Not only does the slope allow for stage spiking, it also aids Link's recovery. I'm sure many of you have noticed how you can sort of "ride" the slope up and seemingly gain a longer auto snap range from it. Of course, I think you should also take the opponent into consideration when choosing a variation as well. Characters with wall jumps are going to benefit from walled omega stages. Characters with vertical recoveries such as Sonic are going to benefit from sloped omega stages. The flat variation doesn't seem to benefit anyone in particular as far as recovery is concerned. As a matter of fact, I would say that it limits recovery options. On flat omega stages you either have to aim to sweetspot the ledge or try to recover back to the stage. Characters with a very linear recovery, such as Rosalina, are going to suffer slightly on flat omega stages.
 

Elessar

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One factor we haven't discussed yet when addressing omega stages are blast zones. Every stage has different blast zone distances, and that's really important when discussing stages. For example, LC has quite a high ceiling but relatively close side blast zones, so this stage would be a bad idea vs heavy chars since it'll take longer to KO them vertically. On the other hand, it might be great for lighter chars since we'll be able to kill them faster with a tipped fsmash.

That being said, what about FD's blast zones?
 

A_Phoenix_Down

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First off, awesome stuff Zane. I've added this thread to the Index.

Secondly, it seems that we're all in agreement about FD. I would definitely say that it is a very character dependent stage. Like it has been mentioned, against speedy rush-down characters, characters with good stage control, or characters that can out spam Link FD is not an ideal stage choice. However, against larger, slower characters FD can be an excellent stage choice. The large size and lack of platform makes it difficult for them to escape our projectiles so we can play the long range spacing game quite well.

Characters I would counter pick FD against would be Bowser, Rosalina, DK, Ganon, Ike, D3, and Charizard.

Characters I would ban FD against would be Diddy, Little Mac, Sheik, ZZS, Robin, DHD, Fox, Falco, Pikachu, Falcon, Villager, Pac-Man, Megaman, and Sonic.

On the topic of omegas, it can be said that there are actually three variations: walled (i.e. duck hunt), sloped (i.e. FD), and flat (i.e. Lylat cruise). Of these three, I believe Link benefits the most from the sloped variations. Not only does the slope allow for stage spiking, it also aids Link's recovery. I'm sure many of you have noticed how you can sort of "ride" the slope up and seemingly gain a longer auto snap range from it. Of course, I think you should also take the opponent into consideration when choosing a variation as well. Characters with wall jumps are going to benefit from walled omega stages. Characters with vertical recoveries such as Sonic are going to benefit from sloped omega stages. The flat variation doesn't seem to benefit anyone in particular as far as recovery is concerned. As a matter of fact, I would say that it limits recovery options. On flat omega stages you either have to aim to sweetspot the ledge or try to recover back to the stage. Characters with a very linear recovery, such as Rosalina, are going to suffer slightly on flat omega stages.
Agreed, however, the flat stages are good for showoffs that feel like flying underneath the stage from one side to the other.

I guess, in a sense, that makes flat stages the most even playing fields. Benefits no one, and tests each characters recovery.
 
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Zane the pure

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I believe we are all in fairly strong agreement on the nature of Final Destination, but I'll give you all the choice between adding a bit more, or voting on the next stage for discussion. If we do move on and you still have more to add, please PM me and I'll review the info and add whatever is applicable.

So, Anyone have anything else to add, or should we move on? and if we move on, what's next?
 

Zelkam

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One factor we haven't discussed yet when addressing omega stages are blast zones. Every stage has different blast zone distances, and that's really important when discussing stages. For example, LC has quite a high ceiling but relatively close side blast zones, so this stage would be a bad idea vs heavy chars since it'll take longer to KO them vertically. On the other hand, it might be great for lighter chars since we'll be able to kill them faster with a tipped fsmash.

That being said, what about FD's blast zones?
FD's blast zone are about middle of the road, really. About what you would expect from a "balanced" stage. They don't really seem to hurt nor hinder Link in any way. It should be noted that FD and all the omega variations have the same blast zone distances so you won't have to worry about taking that into consideration.

Personally, I think Link does better on a stage with a low ceiling. Being somewhat of a heavyweight and having a fast fall speed means he doesn't have to worry too much about being KOed over the top. Link's vertical KO potential with moves like Dsmash, dash attack, Utilt, Uair, and Dair also compliments low ceiling stages.

Here's the thread that lists stage ceiling heights btw: http://smashboards.com/threads/ceiling-height-research-thread.384187/#post-18463319


Oh and if we're voting for the next stage, battlefield seems like the obvious choice
 
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A_Phoenix_Down

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Zane just let the thread know when you're ready to move on to the next one. Least that way we know. Pretty sure FD's been in total agreement from the start.

Edit: you already asked above. My apologies. But yes, I'd say Battlefield should be next.
 
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Huggles828

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Guess I'll go ahead and start this off?
[Stage] Battlefield
[Status] Neutral
[Link approved] Yes
[Counter against] Most in general. Great against characters that outspam him (Duck Hunt, Samus, etc.)
[Ban against] Bowser, DK, Dedede, etc. (Not that this is a bad level per se but there are better choices like FD or SV)
[General Info] I really like BF. I think Link works well with the platforms to his advantage. We can now FH onto the platforms instead of having to double jump iirc.

The platforms work well for us in this stage. You can set bombs on the platform to mess up opponents. If you bounce them on the opponent's shield it will bounce up onto the platforms or you can z drop them. Throwing bombs down will hit taller characters with the explosion (which is more powerful than a direct hit iirc). You do lose out on throwing bombs up to dissuade opponents from approaching unless they're tall. Opponents on top of the platform can be hit with several attacks, like utilt, usmash, ftilt, full hop nair or bair. You can full hop a uair on an opponent on the edge of a platform then move away, which can be fairly safe. You can full hop a dair and have it cancel before hitting the ground.

The edges are sloped so you can stage spike with bair and ride up the edge with upb.

Focusing on your short hop game and good spacing helps a lot here since this level can make matches pretty fast paced. Zair is good too.

Honestly I think this is among Link's best levels, and one of his better neutral stages too.
 

Zane the pure

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I like battlefield since Bombs can be utilized in much sneakier ways here and the chaos can frustrate the opponent into messing up.
I feel like :4ganondorf: has an advantage here simply because his command grabs get really tricky on platforms and he can juggle us kinda bad. I might have just been outplayed since the matches were fairly close, but I couldn't take a game off any of the Ganondorfs I fought here a while ago.

:4littlemac: get's wrecked by this stage soo bad it's not even funny. The most(only) threatening thing about him is neutralized by the platform layout, and the only real attack he can pursue with is Up-B, and that leaves him dreadfully open and steals his Double jump if you punish it.

I find that a lot of :4mario:,:4luigi:,:4drmario: like to extend their down throw combos due to the landing lag on the platforms and it gives them a chance for a hilariously painful read if you don't tech the landings. But the platforms don't especially help their projectiles and our's benefit a lot from them.

Perhaps I'll have more after school.
 
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Rizen

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BF is good because Link has a great vertical attack game with bombs, angled boomerang, falling arrows, little landing lag, and long reach with attacks like Utilt and Uair. Many characters have trouble when not facing the opponent from the side. Link has excellent stage control tools.
With that said BF puts Link at a disadvantage vs characters like Ganon.

I agree with what everyone has said.
 

A_Phoenix_Down

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The thing with Battlefield is it hinders pure rushdown guys like C. Falcon or Mac, who extremely benefit from flat stages (for example, the only reason Mac is even somewhat good is because of FD's flat stages).

Building on what others said, Link's vertical fighting can outperform a lot of characters, especially with his very free projectiles (bombs and boomerang). So in a sense, Link's actually benefitting from this stage against the characters he tends to have issues with.

Honestly, Battlefield is more balanced than FD in my opinion. Should have been an option in For Glory.
 

~Unknown~

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Guess I'll go ahead and start this off?
[Stage] Battlefield
[Status] Neutral
[Link approved] Yes
[Counter against] Most in general. Great against characters that outspam him (Duck Hunt, Samus, etc.)
[Ban against] Bowser, DK, Dedede, etc. (Not that this is a bad level per se but there are better choices like FD or SV)
[General Info] I really like BF. I think Link works well with the platforms to his advantage. We can now FH onto the platforms instead of having to double jump iirc.

The platforms work well for us in this stage. You can set bombs on the platform to mess up opponents. If you bounce them on the opponent's shield it will bounce up onto the platforms or you can z drop them. Throwing bombs down will hit taller characters with the explosion (which is more powerful than a direct hit iirc). You do lose out on throwing bombs up to dissuade opponents from approaching unless they're tall. Opponents on top of the platform can be hit with several attacks, like utilt, usmash, ftilt, full hop nair or bair. You can full hop a uair on an opponent on the edge of a platform then move away, which can be fairly safe. You can full hop a dair and have it cancel before hitting the ground.

The edges are sloped so you can stage spike with bair and ride up the edge with upb.

Focusing on your short hop game and good spacing helps a lot here since this level can make matches pretty fast paced. Zair is good too.

Honestly I think this is among Link's best levels, and one of his better neutral stages too.
Im curious as to why you feel this stage should be banned against heavier characters such as bowser, dk, dedede etc.
I like battlefield since Bombs can be utilized in much sneakier ways here and the chaos can frustrate the opponent into messing up.
I feel like :4ganondorf: has an advantage here simply because his command grabs get really tricky on platforms and he can juggle us kinda bad. I might have just been outplayed since the matches were fairly close, but I couldn't take a game off any of the Ganondorfs I fought here a while ago.

:4littlemac: get's wrecked by this stage soo bad it's not even funny. The most(only) threatening thing about him is neutralized by the platform layout, and the only real attack he can pursue with is Up-B, and that leaves him dreadfully open and steals his Double jump if you punish it.

I find that a lot of :4mario:,:4luigi:,:4drmario: like to extend their down throw combos due to the landing lag on the platforms and it gives them a chance for a hilariously painful read if you don't tech the landings. But the platforms don't especially help their projectiles and our's benefit a lot from them.

Perhaps I'll have more after school.
I agree mostly with what you stated here. But contrary to popular belief. Battlefield is a great stage for LM. Not only does his usmash cover both bottom platforms. Which leaves you unsafe, but his upb will allow him to land(almost safely) on the top which is also a kill option for him. Pro macs love this stage. Also apologize if this is getting off topic
 

Zane the pure

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I agree mostly with what you stated here. But contrary to popular belief. Battlefield is a great stage for LM. Not only does his usmash cover both bottom platforms. Which leaves you unsafe, but his upb will allow him to land(almost safely) on the top which is also a kill option for him. Pro macs love this stage. Also apologize if this is getting off topic
I appreciate the input and it's not off topic since knowing the opponent's options on a stage are vitally important when striking and picking. Aside from that, I'm glad for the info since I have relatively little experience with LM as he is meant to be played (unlike FG LMs) I do feel in necessary to mention though that LMs trying to Up-smash Link through the platform will subject themselves to a myriad of bomb shenanigans. Corkscrew Uppercut landing on the top platform would alleviate the fear of stolen recovery, but it's not necessarily a safe option either, as Link can confirm any aerial off of bombs as long as he's in range.

But again thanks for the input, and I'd be delighted to hear more. ;)
 

~Unknown~

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I appreciate the input and it's not off topic since knowing the opponent's options on a stage are vitally important when striking and picking. Aside from that, I'm glad for the info since I have relatively little experience with LM as he is meant to be played (unlike FG LMs) I do feel in necessary to mention though that LMs trying to Up-smash Link through the platform will subject themselves to a myriad of bomb shenanigans. Corkscrew Uppercut landing on the top platform would alleviate the fear of stolen recovery, but it's not necessarily a safe option either, as Link can confirm any aerial off of bombs as long as he's in range.

But again thanks for the input, and I'd be delighted to hear more. ;)
Yes I agree with the bomb shenanigans option but with that super armor on the usmash of lm it can get bothersome. However, most of what I've said is from an article a little mac player wrote about bf. Which is also the same little mac player in my region lol so I'll post the article if anyone is interested.
http://berathen.com/learntosmash/little-mac-stage-choice-battlefield.php
 

A_Phoenix_Down

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Im curious as to why you feel this stage should be banned against heavier characters such as bowser, dk, dedede etc.

I agree mostly with what you stated here. But contrary to popular belief. Battlefield is a great stage for LM. Not only does his usmash cover both bottom platforms. Which leaves you unsafe, but his upb will allow him to land(almost safely) on the top which is also a kill option for him. Pro macs love this stage. Also apologize if this is getting off topic
Good to know, actually didn't think about that. I'm not experienced with LM's besides the smash attack fest I normally have to deal with in FG.

But very good to know, thanks!
 

Elessar

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Personally, I love BF. It's one of my favorite top 3 stages. It's hard to say who to bring here because this stage, in my opinion, is the true neutral. It favors everyone the same, and can hinder everyone the same. Even rush down chars can abuse of the stages platforms by abusing the wobbling to extend their combos, so even bringing them here is risky. As it is, I would say that using this stage as a counter is more a matter of preference than actual advantage in game.
 

Zane the pure

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Another really nice thing about Battlefield is that Link's Up-B goes through most of the stage's lip ledge. I can't tell you have many people I've scooped with the first few hits before confirming a safe recovery. I stall just long enough and drop the ledge to Up-B and hold down so Link doesn't snap the ledge and Up-B's priority takes over, and if angled right can shield poke people on the edge.
Doing so is not an absolute though, as any good player that sees it coming will be able to punish you hard for not having a double jump afterwards if you don't land onstage.
I usually try to have at least one bomb on the ground at any time while I'm on BF since the platform layout gives Link a couple of rare options to project his defense.

The blast zones on the sides are above average, the low blast zone is exceptionally large and the vertical blast zone is average making Link's more vertical nature shine well enough on this stage, but be wary of characters like :4luigi:,:4metaknight:,:4falco:, and :4fox: who also excel at killing vertically.
:4olimar:'s pikmin get hung up on the platforms here sometimes so it can help Link with that MU as well.

Overall I feel Link does well here natively, but there are more advantageous stages to keep in mind, so pick this one if you're comfortable here as even the tougher matchups on BF are workable with enough trickery.

Once again, it is up to you all whether or not to move on, and if so to decide what comes next.
As always, if the verdict is to move on, but you still have input for the stage discussion, please PM the info to me, and I'll put it to the test and edit the synopsis forthwith.
 
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Zelkam

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Alright, I'm bored at work and the boards are slow so I decided to revive the stage discussion thread. I'm going to make an executive decision and say that the battlefield discussion is over and we should move on to smashville.

Smashville is my personal favorite stage to play on and imo its probably the most neutral stage in the game. It's the perfect length - not too long to promote camping/stalling, but not so short that things get cramped. The single floating platform is enough to help characters with good platform pressure without letting them dominate the match. If ever you're not sure where to take an opponent in a match, smashville is almost always a safe bet.

Smashville's blastzones are identical to FD's which is a plus if you ask me. Players will live long enough to make the match interesting without living so long that it gets boring.

The floating platform is what really makes this stage. It can lead to earlier kills, both off the top and the sides. It can also potentially aid your recovery (which is great for a character with below average recovery like ours) or even your edge guarding. It should also be noted that it's almost the same height off the stage as the lower battlefield platforms (its a bit higher) so most the shenanigans that apply for those will apply here. All in all it pays off to keep a mental note of where the floating platform is at all times. It could potentially save your life...or help you kill theirs.

Link approved? Yes

Counter pick against? Everyone?

Ban against? Personally I feel like you shouldn't waste your stage strike on smashville. Then again, I'm not a tourney goer so take that statement with a grain of salt.
 
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Rizen

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I think since Link lost his jab cancel Smashville is a worse stage for him. It isn't terrible but there are always better stages. The platform doesn't help Link as much as others on BF, the stage is small enough that Link can be caught easily by characters who have to chase him down but big enough that it's difficult to chase down characters with good mobility. Characters can also travel under the stage to the other ledge for easy recoveries.

IMO SV is bad vs characters who zone Link at mid range well like Mega Man, Olimar, Rosalina, etc. I might ban it vs Villager. Lylat is probably more ban worthy in most situations. SV is usually not terrible for Link though.
SV could be a good CP vs Little Mac and Fox, maybe DH.

tl;dr SV isn't as good as other stages but isn't the worst.
 

DUKEL

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Pikachu is dominant on Smashville. The small stage, his quick speed and his excellent edge guarding make this a stage I would ban against him. Just watch this video to see what I mean. it should also be noted that the pikachu in this video doesn't even use a good number of his tools - most Pikachus go for a stage spike on this stage with their aerials.
 

Fox Is Openly Deceptive

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You know what bothers me most about SV? It's the fact that you can't FH onto it, and it's sooo close. Then you do a FH Nair and it looks even more silly. Link would have ridiculous platform games on this stage if he just jumped a little higher.
 

FierceGaiety

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I missed Battlefield chat but someone probably said what I feel about it. Smashville is the best Link stage to play but only between 8pm and 12am on Saturdays. For real though I kind of don't like it since that one platform gives a few too many options for my opponents recovery, especially when its fully off the stage. On almost any other normal stage I can cover most of my bases and make getting back to the stage really stressful. It doesn't happen all the time but when it does happen I really notice it.
 

Siledh

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I like Smashville precisely because it's a half-way house between FD and BF. The platform may be a bit too high, but it can aid in Link's recovery and it helps shake things up. I've had a good run on there against Ganondorf, although I actually prefer to take him to BF.

Plus that platform's height can really help stop Link being juggled. Or that's been my experience. Although it does prevent Utilts and Usmashes from being too effective as well.
 

Drigo Toes

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Since Dash Attack HitBubble buff, BF is Imo better stage for Link than SV.

That being said, SV is great for Link in some cases. Projectiles gameplay is way too good taking into account the movil platform. We already have a good stage control, so the platform could be used very well for us.

I think, however, for the general Link's Gameplay, BF > Town&City > SV >= Lylat > FD.
 

FooltheFlames

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Bottom platforms are lower on Battlefield than in Smashville, which is a great asset to Link. You can get many dash attacks on those who arent familiar with the matchup, the platforms are like at the perfect placement for Links jumps, and I find it much easier her to land Uairs than anywhere else. (but this last one is prolly just a mental quirk lol)
 

KenMeister

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On the topic of platform games, I now have a reason to hate 3DS even more because they took away the potential for Yoshi's Island to be a good stage for Link. :(
 
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