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Omni rates each smash game “objectively”

gogurtpeachy

Smash Rookie
Joined
Nov 24, 2018
Messages
11
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Clearfield, Utah
Slippi.gg
GOGU#750
Omni’s video

1. Melee 4.5/5
2. Brawl 3.5/5
2. 64 3.5/5
4. Smash 4 2.5/5

What do y’all think about this list

I’ve played both melee and smash 4 competitively and every game casually and I for the most part agree. I think smash 4 and brawl having the same competitive grade was a little wack though, but I also wouldn’t give smash 4 a higher grade, just simply drop brawl to a 2.5/5 on competitive.

Edit: fixed the link i uh... ****.
 
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#HBC | Red Ryu

Red Fox Warrior
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Jun 15, 2008
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27,486
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Milwaukee, Wisconsin
NNID
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3DS FC
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Objective is impossible in a medium like art, i consider games art, since taking the person out is impossible.

it’s why Let’s go Pikachu and Eevee have a split in user reviews. Some people like it some don’t neither are wrong.

My lists would be,

Casual:
Smash 4
brawl/pm
Melee
64

Compeditive:
Smash 4
PM
Melee
Brawl
64

it’s my list about key things I value in each title. A lot of people seem to be on the crap on smash 4 train now that it is out the door in 12 days but I found a lot of value in it and was not bothered by some things like Rage.

It’s his opinion but like he said people should maje their own and think about it.
 

Zapp Branniglenn

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 13, 2014
Messages
1,707
Location
Santa Ana, CA
lol, that is NOT a link to Omni's video. Here's the real link

Anyway, 64 is hard for me to rate on a competitive level despite my recent experience, so I'll just lay out some observations. It's braindead, but looks really cool to spectators. Stocks commonly end in one exchange because of the absurd amount of hitstun. You can combo any move into almost any other move because there's nothing the victim can do to stop you. DI does not exist. SDI does exist but only really matters for escaping Samus' Up B, and maybe a poorly aimed drill kick. And because the hitstun is so large, even the weakest of spikes are guaranteed kills. The lack of air dodging or good/safe recoveries (except Pikachu) means you typically don't have a disadvantage state where your choices will matter. Your aerials auto cancel at bizarre windows in which they're still active - just check out some U-airs in the game if you want some examples of stuff you don't actually need to Z-Cancel. Also your shield is useless except to shield drop (inability to spot dodge makes shield dropping platforms an easy, consistent movement option). Your grabs have almost no endlag which is absurd since most of them kill outright with the force of a smash attack, or combo into a kill. However, every character has tech unique to them which is fun to learn. Link and maybe Jigglypuff are the only characters that feel awful to play. But to the average, uneducated spectator, this is fun to watch. It's non stop combos, and edgeguarding and that's so much more exciting than watching people space the same aerials in never ending neutral states. Looks great, but god I can't imagine getting serious about a game that feels like rock paper scissors where rock (shield) loses to scissors in addition to paper. And choosing paper (grab) arbitrarily has a rule where you won't lose due to the unfairly low endlag.

As for the video's rankings, I don't know how you can justify giving Brawl a competitive score of 3 out of 5. Especially when giving Smash 4 the same rating for the same category. Smash 4 had marked improvements in pacing, toned down defensive options (though I'm sure most would agree they weren't toned down enough), and also balance patches made several characters more viable in addition to tweaking the game engine itself, which is something Brawl desperately could have used. The gap between Metaknight and Ganondorf in Brawl does not compare to the gap between Jigglypuff and Bayonetta in Smash 4. In fact I often say Ganon versus Cloud in 4 is like Ganon versus Fox in Melee, you're screwed, but if you're the better player you could probably win. I know Brawl has its defenders, and even I can find things to like about it from a competitive stand point, but I dare somebody to point to Smash 4 and say it makes the same mistakes and to the same degrees that Brawl did.
 
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lucasla

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 24, 2018
Messages
481
I only played Brawl and Smash4, and Smash4 is easily the best to me. I actually remember playing Melee at some point in my childhood, but I was too young, it was not my console, and it was just two times very casually, so I have no feelings about these previous games. Anyway, I just think the core gameplay is better in Smash4, the beautiful graphics helps a lot too, and despite I appreciate Brawl's Adventure Mode, I don't think it's good enough, and the entire package of the WiiU game, with a bigger weight on the core gameplay and less to the singleplayer, is still better.
 
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Zoa

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
788
I watched the video earlier today, and well, the Brawl competitive comments made by Omni weren't just questionable, but outright inaccurate going off memory here. It just...made no sense. I can see why Omni would give it top marks for single player content aside from the battles themselves, but there's a reason why Brawl is considered so bad, and this is coming from someone who started their local competitive play in Brawl (but now play PM almost exclusively). It's riddled with horrendous design decisions. Even the recent video with M2K and ZeRo, where they talk about transitioning from Melee to Ultimate, had M2K basically say the game punished him by landing an aerial, and he got punished with an aerial back. Hitstun can be cancelled on frame 13 with an aerial or air dodge. That alone prevents so many things like kill confirms or juggles that aren't true combos/chaingrabs. Tripping and movement being reduced significantly hurt it as well. Plus with how many characters were nerfed drastically, and how dominant multiple newcomers were, the overall cast viability was complete trash before the meta completely stagnated. I had heard Fox getting some results before the meta died, but otherwise, that's all I know about potential character performance.

Also I can see why he would give Smash 4 competitive a somewhat similar score. The game is largely just a more polished Brawl, but while it dials back defensive options somewhat, it makes recovering so easy. Also the game still doesn't have a good juggle system overall. Air dodge duration was decreased, thereby making them faster and safer overall in the air. Plus hitstun could be cancelled on frame 40 with an air dodge, and frame 45 with an aerial, so follow ups were still quite limited in a game with a slow engine that doesn't conserve momentum, most things are slow, and overall moves with high knockback. Which is why you see generally grab throws into a uair then reset to neutral, or just one or two hits in general before a reset to neutral in Smash 4. It is an improvement overall than Brawl, and doesn't make the same level of mistakes, but it's not that much of an improvement to change the underlying issues Brawl had: defensive, slow, does not reward aggression. Also with Bayonetta existing in Smash 4, it began to suffer the exact same problem Brawl had with Meta Knight. One character is so dominant in the meta that any character's MU versus them would very much determine tier placing, and in turn starts to stagnate the meta even more.
 

Fell God

Smash Ace
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Jul 26, 2018
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I guess I'll be 64. I'm already 64.
How about Melee? Nerf Melee!
You're right so Brawl. I wanna be Brawl.
Then I'll be Smash 4. I already choose Smash 4.
 
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xzx

Smash Lord
Joined
May 1, 2009
Messages
1,139
Location
Sweden
I like when many **** on Brawl despite never playing it competitively...

Smash 4 is a more defensive game than Brawl, like easily. It doesn't surprise me that it got a lower score than Brawl. Smash 4 sucked both casually and competitively.
 

TriforceBun

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jun 19, 2018
Messages
139
Maybe I'm alone on this, but I can't really imagine being a superfan of a series (to the point where I'm discussing it online regularly, making art/videos about it, etc) and not feeling that most of the series isn't great. Doubly so if someone dumps hundreds of hours into a game. If I'm putting that much time into any single game, there's no way I don't greatly enjoy it. I don't spend weeks of my life playing something I'd give a 7/10 to.

In my opinion, every Smash game is at least a 9/10. They're extremely fun, packed with content, highly polished and full of great details, even if I disagree with the odd design choice here and there.
 
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