Okay, let's talk about Light Arrows

[Jotari]

So Quillion has certainly mentioned this enough in various threads talking about changing characters, but there doesn't seem to have been any proper, focused discussion on it. SImply put, Zelda, despite being a character that has been around since the 80s, really doesn't have a huge amount of potential canon inspiration for a moveset. As, aside from Hyrule Warriors, she's almost always featured in a non combat role. Yet the one thing that has been consistently associated with her throughout the years are Light Arrows. In almost all of her appearances since 1998 she either gives/creates Light arrows for Link or uses them herself at some point. They are pretty, inarguably, an integral part of her identity in her own series. And for Brawl and SSB4 they were represented in the form of her final smash. Ultimate removed that however with a final smash based around the Triforce. Which is fine and all, but where are the light arrows?

So, let's discuss two main things.

1. Does Zelda really need light arrows? Sure, they're iconic, but does that even matter? I can only speak for myself, but I actually like pretty much all of Zelda's moves in Smash. And I can't even say that about my mains. But they look good on her and all have well defined functions. And let's face it, her new Final Smash is kind of better than her old one, in fact I'd go as far as to say it's one of the best Final Smashes in the game. You just have to get close to the opponent and then watch them die. She already has a projectile in the form of Din's Fire (which yes, has ver variable quality form game to game, but is conceptually a very useful move), does she need another one?

2. Assuming that yes, she should get light arrows, where in her moveset should they be and how should they function? Replace a special move? A forward smash? An aerial? There are lots of choices depending on how you envision them working.

Personally I think yes, she should get light arrows some how. But honestly, other than bringing back custom specials (which I'm super in favor of), I don't really see how they can best be implemented without changing something that already works well for Zelda. Though I do have some loose, unsatisfactory ideas.

*Move Nayru's Love to neutral air. I think this will probably be unpopular as I think Nayru's Love is a well liked move for Zelda players as a quick get off me attack which it wouldn't really be able to do as an aerial, but personally it does look and feel like it would work really well as a neutral aerial too and it would be kind of cool and esoteric to have a reflector on a neutral aerial move. Having such a quick move on an aerial could considerably change Zelda's aerial game too, since right now it relies on very precise hits, so having a safe option could be most welcome. Plus, as it relates to this thread, it would open a Special Slot without outright removing something she could do before (current neutral aerial would be lost, but that's a pretty basic spinning attack so I don't think it'd be missed much).

*Move Nayru's Love to a shield special. Inkling and Steve have functionality by pressing Shield and Special at the same time. This is something that could theoretically be provided to more characters, but until it is and kind of becomes the standard then it's a bit weird to give it to Zelda. Especially since Steve and Inkling don't actually use their Shield Specials as an attack or even defensive move. It's purely gimmick related (to the extent I'm surprised they didn't put that stuff on their taunts, maybe they didn't because they knew they were removing taunts from online play).

*Make it a gimmick like KO Punch. Mac manages to have 5 specials utilizing a gimmick, why not Zelda? In fact, this is even how light arrows, kind of, work in Hyrule Warriors, wherein Zelda has to generate orbs before being able to use her more powerful light based moves. Such a mechanic could easily be ported over to Smash. The issue there would be how do you implement it when the is ready to use the attack? Mac works by replacing his neutral B, but for that to work as well for Zelda, light arrows would have to be so powerful that they justify losing temporary access to Nayru's Love (most likely, I guess you could put it on her side or down special either).

*Just add it to her throws. Make Zelda shoot a light arrow as a follow up to her throws like Fox and Falco do with their blaster. Only give it to all four of Zelda's throws to it's not a random one attack element. This might be the safest way to implement them as it would change the least. Zelda already has pretty good throws (at least for kill potential, I guess they're kind of hard to follow up on, but her grab is bad enough to the point you can't really rely on them for such at all, I think, I don't play Zelda a whole lot), so I don't think they exactly scream a need for a change, but so long as they remain good throws, this would mostly be an aesthetic thing (provided no one has a franklin badge).

Last random thought more than a suggestion, her up tilt and up smash kind of look and feel too similar to me. So I could see one of them being removed, though Light Arrows don't exactly scream Up Smash material. They could work, but it'd probably feel quite contrived, especially if that's the only move that uses them.

Well anyway, tell me what your thoughts on Zelda and Light Arrows are. Do you think she should get them and if so, how should they be worked into her current moveset?

 

[ALongWistfulSquiggle]

So Quillion has certainly mentioned this enough in various threads talking about changing characters, but there doesn't seem to have been any proper, focused discussion on it. SImply put, Zelda, despite being a character that has been around since the 80s, really doesn't have a huge amount of potential canon inspiration for a moveset. As, aside from Hyrule Warriors, she's almost always featured in a non combat role. Yet the one thing that has been consistently associated with her throughout the years are Light Arrows. In almost all of her appearances since 1998 she either gives/creates Light arrows for Link or uses them herself at some point. They are pretty, inarguably, an integral part of her identity in her own series. And for Brawl and SSB4 they were represented in the form of her final smash. Ultimate removed that however with a final smash based around the Triforce. Which is fine and all, but where are the light arrows?

So, let's discuss two main things.

1. Does Zelda really need light arrows? Sure, they're iconic, but does that even matter? I can only speak for myself, but I actually like pretty much all of Zelda's moves in Smash. And I can't even say that about my mains. But they look good on her and all have well defined functions. And let's face it, her new Final Smash is kind of better than her old one, in fact I'd go as far as to say it's one of the best Final Smashes in the game. You just have to get close to the opponent and then watch them die. She already has a projectile in the form of Din's Fire (which yes, has ver variable quality form game to game, but is conceptually a very useful move), does she need another one?

2. Assuming that yes, she should get light arrows, where in her moveset should they be and how should they function? Replace a special move? A forward smash? An aerial? There are lots of choices depending on how you envision them working.

Personally I think yes, she should get light arrows some how. But honestly, other than bringing back custom specials (which I'm super in favor of), I don't really see how they can best be implemented without changing something that already works well for Zelda. Though I do have some loose, unsatisfactory ideas.

*Move Nayru's Love to neutral air. I think this will probably be unpopular as I think Nayru's Love is a well liked move for Zelda players as a quick get off me attack which it wouldn't really be able to do as an aerial, but personally it does look and feel like it would work really well as a neutral aerial too and it would be kind of cool and esoteric to have a reflector on a neutral aerial move. Having such a quick move on an aerial could considerably change Zelda's aerial game too, since right now it relies on very precise hits, so having a safe option could be most welcome. Plus, as it relates to this thread, it would open a Special Slot without outright removing something she could do before (current neutral aerial would be lost, but that's a pretty basic spinning attack so I don't think it'd be missed much).

*Move Nayru's Love to a shield special. Inkling and Steve have functionality by pressing Shield and Special at the same time. This is something that could theoretically be provided to more characters, but until it is and kind of becomes the standard then it's a bit weird to give it to Zelda. Especially since Steve and Inkling don't actually use their Shield Specials as an attack or even defensive move. It's purely gimmick related (to the extent I'm surprised they didn't put that stuff on their taunts, maybe they didn't because they knew they were removing taunts from online play).

*Make it a gimmick like KO Punch. Mac manages to have 5 specials utilizing a gimmick, why not Zelda? In fact, this is even how light arrows, kind of, work in Hyrule Warriors, wherein Zelda has to generate orbs before being able to use her more powerful light based moves. Such a mechanic could easily be ported over to Smash. The issue there would be how do you implement it when the is ready to use the attack? Mac works by replacing his neutral B, but for that to work as well for Zelda, light arrows would have to be so powerful that they justify losing temporary access to Nayru's Love (most likely, I guess you could put it on her side or down special either).

*Just add it to her throws. Make Zelda shoot a light arrow as a follow up to her throws like Fox and Falco do with their blaster. Only give it to all four of Zelda's throws to it's not a random one attack element. This might be the safest way to implement them as it would change the least. Zelda already has pretty good throws (at least for kill potential, I guess they're kind of hard to follow up on, but her grab is bad enough to the point you can't really rely on them for such at all, I think, I don't play Zelda a whole lot), so I don't think they exactly scream a need for a change, but so long as they remain good throws, this would mostly be an aesthetic thing (provided no one has a franklin badge).

Last random thought more than a suggestion, her up tilt and up smash kind of look and feel too similar to me. So I could see one of them being removed, though Light Arrows don't exactly scream Up Smash material. They could work, but it'd probably feel quite contrived, especially if that's the only move that uses them.

Well anyway, tell me what your thoughts on Zelda and Light Arrows are. Do you think she should get them and if so, how should they be worked into her current moveset?

Some of your replacement options (specifically neutral-air and final smash) seem to be coming from a perspective of balance, and I'd argue that those moves are only finicky/good because they were balanced poorly. If neutral-air was given an upgrade to perform more like Falco's neutral air, there wouldn't be a need to change it. Her current final smash is probably too good, and I'd like to see a proper effort to balance final smashes across the cast.

That said, it would probably be a good idea to include light arrows in some way, even if I'm not as gung-ho about them as some probably are. My vote is to return light arrow to final smash, but also repurpose grabs to make them more advantageous to her zoning options. Let one of her throws combo into her final smash, basically.

Another option would appear if final smash was mapped to its on, separate button. That button would have no use in a non-final smash situation, so it could also be mapped to moves like KO Punch. Including a light gathering mechanic on Zelda akin to her Hyrule Warriors incarnations and then mapping that powerful move to that final smash button could be an option.

 

[Jotari]

Some of your replacement options (specifically neutral-air and final smash) seem to be coming from a perspective of balance, and I'd argue that those moves are only finicky/good because they were balanced poorly. If neutral-air was given an upgrade to perform more like Falco's neutral air, there wouldn't be a need to change it. Her current final smash is probably too good, and I'd like to see a proper effort to balance final smashes across the cast.

That said, it would probably be a good idea to include light arrows in some way, even if I'm not as gung-ho about them as some probably are. My vote is to return light arrow to final smash, but also repurpose grabs to make them more advantageous to her zoning options. Let one of her throws combo into her final smash, basically.

Another option would appear if final smash was mapped to its on, separate button. That button would have no use in a non-final smash situation, so it could also be mapped to moves like KO Punch. Including a light gathering mechanic on Zelda akin to her Hyrule Warriors incarnations and then mapping that powerful move to that final smash button could be an option.

Final Smash being mapped to neutral special is something that has long annoyed me. As it completely locks out actual neutral special while you have a Final Smash ready. What if I want to reflect a projectile with Zelda while she has her final smash ready? I'm going to instinctively use Nayru's love and waste it. Some characters like Olimar can't use their gimmicks while they have a final Smash stored. Shulk probably gets it the worse as his Monado arts would actually combo with his final smash rather well.

 

[Lenidem]

So Quillion has certainly mentioned this enough in various threads talking about changing characters, but there doesn't seem to have been any proper, focused discussion on it. SImply put, Zelda, despite being a character that has been around since the 80s, really doesn't have a huge amount of potential canon inspiration for a moveset. As, aside from Hyrule Warriors, she's almost always featured in a non combat role. Yet the one thing that has been consistently associated with her throughout the years are Light Arrows. In almost all of her appearances since 1998 she either gives/creates Light arrows for Link or uses them herself at some point. They are pretty, inarguably, an integral part of her identity in her own series. And for Brawl and SSB4 they were represented in the form of her final smash. Ultimate removed that however with a final smash based around the Triforce. Which is fine and all, but where are the light arrows?

So, let's discuss two main things.

1. Does Zelda really need light arrows? Sure, they're iconic, but does that even matter? I can only speak for myself, but I actually like pretty much all of Zelda's moves in Smash. And I can't even say that about my mains. But they look good on her and all have well defined functions. And let's face it, her new Final Smash is kind of better than her old one, in fact I'd go as far as to say it's one of the best Final Smashes in the game. You just have to get close to the opponent and then watch them die. She already has a projectile in the form of Din's Fire (which yes, has ver variable quality form game to game, but is conceptually a very useful move), does she need another one?

2. Assuming that yes, she should get light arrows, where in her moveset should they be and how should they function? Replace a special move? A forward smash? An aerial? There are lots of choices depending on how you envision them working.

Personally I think yes, she should get light arrows some how. But honestly, other than bringing back custom specials (which I'm super in favor of), I don't really see how they can best be implemented without changing something that already works well for Zelda. Though I do have some loose, unsatisfactory ideas.

*Move Nayru's Love to neutral air. I think this will probably be unpopular as I think Nayru's Love is a well liked move for Zelda players as a quick get off me attack which it wouldn't really be able to do as an aerial, but personally it does look and feel like it would work really well as a neutral aerial too and it would be kind of cool and esoteric to have a reflector on a neutral aerial move. Having such a quick move on an aerial could considerably change Zelda's aerial game too, since right now it relies on very precise hits, so having a safe option could be most welcome. Plus, as it relates to this thread, it would open a Special Slot without outright removing something she could do before (current neutral aerial would be lost, but that's a pretty basic spinning attack so I don't think it'd be missed much).

*Move Nayru's Love to a shield special. Inkling and Steve have functionality by pressing Shield and Special at the same time. This is something that could theoretically be provided to more characters, but until it is and kind of becomes the standard then it's a bit weird to give it to Zelda. Especially since Steve and Inkling don't actually use their Shield Specials as an attack or even defensive move. It's purely gimmick related (to the extent I'm surprised they didn't put that stuff on their taunts, maybe they didn't because they knew they were removing taunts from online play).

*Make it a gimmick like KO Punch. Mac manages to have 5 specials utilizing a gimmick, why not Zelda? In fact, this is even how light arrows, kind of, work in Hyrule Warriors, wherein Zelda has to generate orbs before being able to use her more powerful light based moves. Such a mechanic could easily be ported over to Smash. The issue there would be how do you implement it when the is ready to use the attack? Mac works by replacing his neutral B, but for that to work as well for Zelda, light arrows would have to be so powerful that they justify losing temporary access to Nayru's Love (most likely, I guess you could put it on her side or down special either).

*Just add it to her throws. Make Zelda shoot a light arrow as a follow up to her throws like Fox and Falco do with their blaster. Only give it to all four of Zelda's throws to it's not a random one attack element. This might be the safest way to implement them as it would change the least. Zelda already has pretty good throws (at least for kill potential, I guess they're kind of hard to follow up on, but her grab is bad enough to the point you can't really rely on them for such at all, I think, I don't play Zelda a whole lot), so I don't think they exactly scream a need for a change, but so long as they remain good throws, this would mostly be an aesthetic thing (provided no one has a franklin badge).

Last random thought more than a suggestion, her up tilt and up smash kind of look and feel too similar to me. So I could see one of them being removed, though Light Arrows don't exactly scream Up Smash material. They could work, but it'd probably feel quite contrived, especially if that's the only move that uses them.

Well anyway, tell me what your thoughts on Zelda and Light Arrows are. Do you think she should get them and if so, how should they be worked into her current moveset?

You don't mention the possibility of getting rid of the Spectre, moving Nayru's Love to down-b, and put the Light Arrow as a new neutral b?

 

[Jotari]

You don't mention the possibility of getting rid of the Spectre, moving Nayru's Love to down-b, and put the Light Arrow as a new neutral b?

I'm guessing by Specrtre you mean her Down Special, which in English is called Phantom. It certainly would have seemed the obvious choice in Smash 4 where it was a pretty rubbish move, but now it's considered quite a useful and integral part of Zelda's moveset. Unlike her other attacks it is also, at least in a roundabout sense, something that's taken from her own games. So if the values judgement is "she should do more stuff from her own games, that is to say in some way use the weapon she is most associated with", then it'd be a bit counter productive to remove the singular attack she currently has that is based on one of her own games.

 

[Janx_uwu]

I'm fine with Zelda as she is but would be down for the Light Arrows becoming part of her moveset. Maybe she could shoot an arrow downwards for her down air? I think having a far-reaching downwards projectile that doesn't spike would be interesting.

Final Smash being mapped to neutral special is something that has long annoyed me. As it completely locks out actual neutral special while you have a Final Smash ready. What if I want to reflect a projectile with Zelda while she has her final smash ready? I'm going to instinctively use Nayru's love and waste it. Some characters like Olimar can't use their gimmicks while they have a final Smash stored. Shulk probably gets it the worse as his Monado arts would actually combo with his final smash rather well.

I think FS Meter Final Smashes were planned to use L+R in development (they mentioned it during E3) but it unfortunately got cut. I guess playtesters just weren't sure how to activate them and they didn't want anyone getting confused.

 

[Jotari]

I'm fine with Zelda as she is but would be down for the Light Arrows becoming part of her moveset. Maybe she could shoot an arrow downwards for her down air? I think having a far-reaching downwards projectile that doesn't spike would be interesting.

I think FS Meter Final Smashes were planned to use L+R in development (they mentioned it during E3) but it unfortunately got cut. I guess playtesters just weren't sure how to activate them and they didn't want anyone getting confused.

Down Air is indeed a rather underwhelming looking attack, and a long range down air would be fun (do we have that with any character currently? I can't think of any. Game and Watch, kind of, with his bomb aerial, though that's not his down air). I think it would be weird to just be on a single attack like that though. Maybe, if only for a visual thing, she could use the bow itself and copy Byleth for neutral air.

Quillion Still waiting to hear your opinions on the practical side of this matter.

 

[Oracle Link]

Make Light arrow the up and side Smash? Its not like she has any canon moves on them!
Also The MAin Problem with changing her specials is that Its weird to not have all three Godess Abilitys and Replacing the Phantom is dumb because thats the biggest Canonical combat thing she does!

 

[Jotari]

Make Light arrow the up and side Smash? Its not like she has any canon moves on them!
Also The MAin Problem with changing her specials is that Its weird to not have all three Godess Abilitys and Replacing the Phantom is dumb because thats the biggest Canonical combat thing she does!

I don't see that as much of an issue, mainly because the specials are only tangentially related to the Ocarina of Time abilities to begin with. In fact, even though I know they never would, I've wanted them to rename Din's Fire as Bombos. As visually it resembles Bombos more than Din's Fire (it'd also lend itself handily to SSB4 style customs as then you can have an ice variation called Ether).

 

[Codebox]

While Zelda is featured in non combatant or supportive roles, not only are Light Arrows her signature weapon, but so is light magic itself. That being said her specials based off Nayru, Dins and Farore aren't misrepresented because Zelda herself is connected to the Goddesses. However I think for the sake of redesigning her Light Arrows should replace Dins Fire due to how consistently useless the move is and doesn't work well for a character of her design. Besides she could have U-Air to represent Dins Fire, as Ult showed you don't need 3 elements from Zelda to be corresponding. Like making Link, Zelda and Ganondorf different designs instead of all having to correlate to each other based off the same game like before.

For design sake, if they aren't going to fix her mobility, give her a tool that slows down mobility. A property of Light Arrow is that it stuns/halts people in place. For a slow character this would work well with fast characters, while giving it the same potency in KO power as Byleth's Neutral B. Or if they don't give her that, make her Side Special Light Ball, as Zelda has had the ability to conjure balls of light energy, which in canon was used in Four Swords Adventures. It's also in Twilight Princess, Hyrule Warriors and Age of Calamity. In TP while she isn't seen in combat, Ganon is using HER magic to fight Link, since Ganondorf doesn't use Light Magic. Again having Light based moves make sense, plus it would correlate to her moves in terms of the sparkles that come out when she executes a move and having a chargable projectile akin to Samus charge shot that has the same effect as ZSS paralyzer would be super useful for Zelda.

 

[Jotari]

While Zelda is featured in non combatant or supportive roles, not only are Light Arrows her signature weapon, but so is light magic itself. That being said her specials based off Nayru, Dins and Farore aren't misrepresented because Zelda herself is connected to the Goddesses. However I think for the sake of redesigning her Light Arrows should replace Dins Fire due to how consistently useless the move is and doesn't work well for a character of her design. Besides she could have U-Air to represent Dins Fire, as Ult showed you don't need 3 elements from Zelda to be corresponding. Like making Link, Zelda and Ganondorf different designs instead of all having to correlate to each other based off the same game like before.

For design sake, if they aren't going to fix her mobility, give her a tool that slows down mobility. A property of Light Arrow is that it stuns/halts people in place. For a slow character this would work well with fast characters, while giving it the same potency in KO power as Byleth's Neutral B. Or if they don't give her that, make her Side Special Light Ball, as Zelda has had the ability to conjure balls of light energy, which in canon was used in Four Swords Adventures. It's also in Twilight Princess, Hyrule Warriors and Age of Calamity. In TP while she isn't seen in combat, Ganon is using HER magic to fight Link, since Ganondorf doesn't use Light Magic. Again having Light based moves make sense, plus it would correlate to her moves in terms of the sparkles that come out when she executes a move and having a chargable projectile akin to Samus charge shot that has the same effect as ZSS paralyzer would be super useful for Zelda.

Saying Light Ball is a bit vague. You could reskin Din's Fire into a ball of light and call it a Light Ball, but as you think that's a bad move, it wouldn't really fix anything.

 

[Quillion]

Eh, whatever the case, I would say that Zelda's design would support a reworked Light Arrow regular special or projectile normal than say Ganondorf having his energy ball or DK having a barrel throw.

Zelda has the makings of a zoner, but her zoning is overly situational at best.

 

[Jotari]

Here's an idea that I think works best, based on Hyrule Warriors.

Light Arrows are now Zelda's gimmick. On her portrait there are there empty spots open for orbs. As you fight these orbs fill with light, similar to Little Mac's KO Punch or Cloud's Limit. If Zelda has a filled light orb, then her smash attacks become light arrows. Forward Smash is a large blast forward, similar to Mii Gunner. Up Smash is a narrow, vertical jet of light, similar to Palutena's and for down smash, she shoots at her own feet causing a pillar of light to appear on either side of her, similar to Mega Man's. Because these Smash Attacks are conditional, they are noticeably more powerful than most Smash Attacks. Using a Smash Attack consumes a light orb. If she has no light orbs, then she uses her regular old Smash Attacks (either that or the attack just fails). I think her Smash Attacks are good moves to overwrite. Her up smash, while looking pretty, is already very similar to her up tilt. Her down smash is likewise rather boring (and as I think has been pointed out, kind of forces Zelda to war a dress for it to look good, meaning we can't get costumes like Breath of the Wild Zelda). And her forward Smash, well that one is kind of fine, but a light arrow would just be a longer range version of the same thing.

So basically they'd work like Cloud's limit, only for Smash Attacks instead of Special Attacks. And you can charge up three at once. I think the charge would fill rather slow so you have a fair chance of using her old Smash Attacks too. This overall would integrate the light arrows into her moveset a lot more than just being on one attack or a special.

Alternatively, ignore the light orb gimmick and just take a leaf out of Ganondorf's book by having the weapon replace her old specials entirely.

 

[Quillion]

Here's an idea that I think works best, based on Hyrule Warriors.

Light Arrows are now Zelda's gimmick. On her portrait there are there empty spots open for orbs. As you fight these orbs fill with light, similar to Little Mac's KO Punch or Cloud's Limit. If Zelda has a filled light orb, then her smash attacks become light arrows. Forward Smash is a large blast forward, similar to Mii Gunner. Up Smash is a narrow, vertical jet of light, similar to Palutena's and for down smash, she shoots at her own feet causing a pillar of light to appear on either side of her, similar to Mega Man's. Because these Smash Attacks are conditional, they are noticeably more powerful than most Smash Attacks. Using a Smash Attack consumes a light orb. If she has no light orbs, then she uses her regular old Smash Attacks (either that or the attack just fails). I think her Smash Attacks are good moves to overwrite. Her up smash, while looking pretty, is already very similar to her up tilt. Her down smash is likewise rather boring (and as I think has been pointed out, kind of forces Zelda to war a dress for it to look good, meaning we can't get costumes like Breath of the Wild Zelda). And her forward Smash, well that one is kind of fine, but a light arrow would just be a longer range version of the same thing.

So basically they'd work like Cloud's limit, only for Smash Attacks instead of Special Attacks. And you can charge up three at once. I think the charge would fill rather slow so you have a fair chance of using her old Smash Attacks too. This overall would integrate the light arrows into her moveset a lot more than just being on one attack or a special.

Alternatively, ignore the light orb gimmick and just take a leaf out of Ganondorf's book by having the weapon replace her old specials entirely.

I really don't want any more stupid character-specific meter mechanics, especially if we're adding them to the 64/Melee veterans. Or at least make it a universal meter that lets ALL characters access more powerful specials. I actually want the latter.

Considering her Smashes are pretty dull to look at to begin with, I'd rather they just replace those Smashes outright. That way we have the Goddess Spells, Phantom, and Light Bow all at once.

If there's any reason we need to keep Zelda's old Smashes, I'd like to hear it.

 

[Jotari]

I really don't want any more stupid character-specific meter mechanics, especially if we're adding them to the 64/Melee veterans. Or at least make it a universal meter that lets ALL characters access more powerful specials. I actually want the latter.

Considering her Smashes are pretty dull to look at to begin with, I'd rather they just replace those Smashes outright. That way we have the Goddess Spells, Phantom, and Light Bow all at once.

If there's any reason we need to keep Zelda's old Smashes, I'd like to hear it.

I don't have much issue with giving gimmicks to older characters. It's not something they've actually done yet, but it could be a way to buff older movesets in an interesting way, as well as add in aspects from newer titles that older characters lack. This one specifically is inspired by how Zelda's light attacks work in Hyrule Warriors. Using a gimmick also just gives the advantage of making them more powerful than a regular Smash might be, and more fitting of the light arrows and their power in Zelda games. Of course I get just not complicating things and having them simply be in her regular smash attacks (like Ganondorf). Hence why I mentioned it at the end.

 

[Quillion]

I don't have much issue with giving gimmicks to older characters. It's not something they've actually done yet, but it could be a way to buff older movesets in an interesting way, as well as add in aspects from newer titles that older characters lack. This one specifically is inspired by how Zelda's light attacks work in Hyrule Warriors. Using a gimmick also just gives the advantage of making them more powerful than a regular Smash might be, and more fitting of the light arrows and their power in Zelda games. Of course I get just not complicating things and having them simply be in her regular smash attacks (like Ganondorf). Hence why I mentioned it at the end.

I just enjoy the less-frills design of the 64-Brawl characters a lot more than the "frilly" designs of the newer characters with tons of projectile normals (as opposed to just one or two), meters, super modes, command inputs, and the like. I'd personally consolidate all of these mechanics into one super meter system, THEN we can consider those new stuff into the older characters. I'd say that's a good way to add stuff without going overboard.

So is there really no one here who likes Zelda's magic sprinkling and would hate to see them go? Replacing Smashes it is then.

 

[Jotari]

So is there really no one here who likes Zelda's magic sprinkling and would hate to see them go? Replacing Smashes it is then.

Course the magic sprinkles would still be there on her jab and tilts. Best of both worlds.

 

[Oracle Link]

I just enjoy the less-frills design of the 64-Brawl characters a lot more than the "frilly" designs of the newer characters with tons of projectile normals (as opposed to just one or two), meters, super modes, command inputs, and the like. I'd personally consolidate all of these mechanics into one super meter system, THEN we can consider those new stuff into the older characters. I'd say that's a good way to add stuff without going overboard.

So is there really no one here who likes Zelda's magic sprinkling and would hate to see them go? Replacing Smashes it is then.

Yup her Magic Sprinkling is Smash Original after all so of it goes to the Cornfields!

 

[Champion of Hyrule]

Her having light arrows was a pretty interesting move but the idea of her sealing away ganon/evil is way more common so I think it’s a fine change

 

[Quillion]

Her having light arrows was a pretty interesting move but the idea of her sealing away ganon/evil is way more common so I think it’s a fine change

What if she gets Light Arrows as a non-Final Smash? That's what we're talking about.

Also, Zelda only directly sealed evil twice but used Light Arrows three times if we're talking main series.