Official Standard Custom Moveset Project: Samus

[Amazing Ampharos]

Welcome to the official Smashboards Standard Custom Set project. In brief, this project is designed to be a logistical solution to using custom movesets in tournaments by filling many of the in-game slots with the most popular and powerful sets for each character so they can be quickly selected without further 3ds import. This will allow tournaments with customizations on to save large amounts of time throughout the event. More details about the project's ideas and mission can be found here:

http://smashboards.com/threads/project-proposal-we-can-make-custom-moves-fast-easy-and-legal.379555/

Our goal here is to find out what the most popular and powerful sets are for your particular character the best way we know how: asking you the mains of this character. To be clear, we're not talking about disallowing any particular custom sets or even imposing any rules in general; we're talking about making sure the popular and powerful options are simply accessible quickly in a tournament environment as our sole mission. We need up to three critical sets that represent the best options your character has that have wide general utility and from there to fill up to slot 6 with supplemental movesets that will cover less mainstream, more match-up specific, or even teams sets. Slots 7 and 8 are reserved for 2222 and 3333 to allow all moves to be explored more easily in the new metagame, and slots 9 and 10 are left open for 3ds import of non-standard sets.

Please list all movesets in the order NSUD, that is neutral special, side special, up special, and down special. This four digit code will be the naming convention so players can quickly and easily identify which moveset is which.

I know for many characters the default moveset, 1111, is a powerful and useful option. However, it should not be included; the game allows default to be picked regardless of what custom options are prepared so including it does not add any additional options to players.

I further know that some characters may find six slots a large number to fill. Others may find six very limiting. Do your best to pick out the overall six most likely to be picked even if some good stuff has to be left on the table or if some more experimental sets have to be included to fill out six. Every set included is time saved in tournament when that set would be picked, and we want to make the best use we can of these slots.

I would ask that everyone please be respectful of each other's opinions; this game is young, and the metagame is still very much forming so we are likely to each perceive it differently. This project will be revisited throughout the game's lifespan and revised to properly include the most mainstream movesets at the time. What we want for now is what will be commonly selected for now, and don't worry, other options are not being discriminated against as those last two slots are left open for 3ds transfer for a reason. This first version of this project will be refined throughout the rest of the year, but I hope to have a very rough draft up and usable by December 5 so TOs who wish to use the results of this project will have something to plug in for that weekend's worth of events. Thank you for your cooperation in this project, and we look forward to making sure the most useful options are quickly available for your character under this system.

 

[IsmaR]

The general consensus is as follows:

Neutral Special 2 - Dense Charge Shot
Side Special 2 - Relentless Missile
Up Special 3 - Apex Screw Attack
Down Special 2 - Slip Bomb

Though most won't argue at all for the first three, I've seen some debate regarding Down Special being more effective as 3 - Mega Bomb.

 

[MaTT*xD]

I find the synergy between the Slip Bomb and Apex Screw Attack to be awesome, because it covers one of Samus main problems, which is getting the K.O. Apex is able to get kills pretty early, around 90, but it seems to be a lot harder to hit, both in the air and from the ground. So this is where the slip bomb enters, when you hit them on the ground they will trip, and than you can folow up with the Apex up-b to get the K.O. Your recovery suffers a little, but for me is totally worth it.
The Relentless Missile is the best one of the bunch, I find no reason not to use it.
I personally don't like the Dense Charge Shot with this other customs, it takes a lot of time to setup and the reward is often underwhelming, compared to the Apex Combo, so I stick to the standard Charge Shot
So, 1232 it is.

I would go 2213 for a space control/edgeguard focus, I find that regular Screw Attack has better recovery and combo potential.

And I would throw a more standard 1211 in there too.

 

[Dean Maloney]

And I would throw a more standard 1211 in there too.

Seconded. I prefer the reliability of 1X1X in many cases, since the default Charge Shot is more versatile with its extended range and faster charge time, and the default Screw Attack has more damage-dealing potential when preparing for a Charge Shot KO. It's an option that would be nice to have while playing competitive.

 

[Shog]

I find the synergy between the Slip Bomb and Apex Screw Attack to be awesome, because it covers one of Samus main problems, which is getting the K.O. Apex is able to get kills pretty early, around 90, but it seems to be a lot harder to hit, both in the air and from the ground. So this is where the slip bomb enters, when you hit them on the ground they will trip, and than you can folow up with the Apex up-b to get the K.O. Your recovery suffers a little, but for me is totally worth it.
The Relentless Missile is the best one of the bunch, I find no reason not to use it.
I personally don't like the Dense Charge Shot with this other customs, it takes a lot of time to setup and the reward is often underwhelming, compared to the Apex Combo, so I stick to the standard Charge Shot
So, 1232 it is.

I would go 2213 for a space control/edgeguard focus, I find that regular Screw Attack has better recovery and combo potential.

And I would throw a more standard 1211 in there too.

I agree with everything the fellow Fire Starter said, I can't believe how superior Slip Bomb is to the other Bombs (expect recovery obviously). I mean did someone check the blast radius of that thing ;D

Standard Shot is my favourite one because it travels some distance, Dense Charge Shot is actually way to laggy for a HEALTHY followup (the enemy can easily avoid it). Melee Charge Shot is really stupid and has way to low power...dumb move

I like Shinespark/Apex whatever and Screw Attack as custom moves...Rush is dumb. Shinespark for power, normal Screw Attack for chasing the enemy

And Missiles are last because slow Missiles are completly superior and there is literally no reason at all to use any other Missile form

1232 would be my go to set, with the first two being always the same while last two can be changed at will. My 4cents

 

[Davis-Lightheart]

From reddit, something to consider whenever.

Not enough variants using screw rush. Screw rush has some wicked horizontal kill potential, even while still on stage. Plus, I do believe that the screw rush has a janky OHKO hitbox like that one Mii Brawler up special. I pulled it off somehow on one of my friends and it was a side blastzone KO at less than FORTY percent. I think Screw Rush is very overlooked right now and should be implemented as a critical set at some point. Something like 2223 would work nicely.

 

[Waluigi is too big]

is there any use for melee charge shot? I was really excited to use it when I first saw it, but comparing it the Neutrals I can't really see the positives.

 

[Rashid]

is there any use for melee charge shot? I was really excited to use it when I first saw it, but comparing it the Neutrals I can't really see the positives.

It charges faster than the rest, and it can't be reflected, so there's that. But in general, the other two are better choices.

 

[MegaBlaster1234]

1211 and 1212 have to be my favorite sets. Relentless missile is too good to pass up, and Slip Bomb is interesting, but it sometimes causes me to go into Morph Ball accidentally due to how fast it explodes.
2231 is also a set I enjoy using a lot, but I'm having trouble landing Apex Screw Attack consistently OoS. Sometimes the opponent flies too far left and right to land the second hit.

 

[KayJay]

1211 must be one of the standards.
1212 is inferior. The missing air momentum from slip bombs doesn't help Samus at all.

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

Samus's current builds in the project are:

2232
1212
1232
2212
2233
1213

Samus was not a high discussion character last time, and she seems like one of the characters with more to gain from customs than most. There seems to be substantial support for default bombs at this point, and I've heard several claims that we need some Screw Rush sets. So far Relentless Missiles seem to be the clear favorite, but I don't get a sense Turbo Missiles have seen much exploration at all since Relentless Missiles are so good.

In any case, we have some time to sort this out (mid-March is when we need some sets locked in, up to 10 slots), but we definitely want to be super sure that we get the best Samus sets we can.

 

[ParanoidDrone]

I can't offer much insight on competitive validity of Turbo Missiles, but I can report that they don't kill at appreciably different percents compared to default or Relentless. (Although none of them kill until silly percents anyway so it's kind of moot.) Their sole perk seems to be speed and (I think) damage.

 

[Leonyx]

I figured I'd post the discussion/details that @Thinkaman had in the main Standard Customs thread, since there doesn't seem to be much talk here about the different Screw Attacks. I'd add to the discussion, but unfortunately do not have access to competitive fighters in my immediate area and would feel unqualified to do so.

@A2ZOMG did a good job of explaining to me why doc up-b 3 carries additional costs that may not be obvious vs. the default. I still like it, but it's tough to justify imo.



Screw Attack is frame-5, does 12% damage total (but as low as 6-8% in most ground-ground uses), does up to 45 total shield damage, and kills at 281% from ground level.

Screw Rush is frame-11, does 15% damage total (consistently), does up to 33 total shield damage, and kills at 167% from ground level.

Apex Screw Attack is frame-15, does 11% damage total (consistently), does no extra shield damage, and kills at 131% from ground level.



I was originally a fan of Apex Screw Attack, but it's just a poor attack in every way outside of its kill power. Which, to be fair, Samus does really appreciate.

Remember:

• A frame 5 OoS option is really good.
• A frame-11 OoS option is not that good.
• But a frame-11 OoS option that covers the aerial space in front of you is fantastic.

Screw Rush is very similar to Crescent Slash. Also, note that the grounded version gives you way more helpless state control, and lets you always drift back to the stage.

 

[Swoops]

^ Looking over that post I would really like to experiment with screw rush more. Do we know if it's invincible at all like Screw Attack?
Personally I have a really tough time giving up default UpB, but having the option to cover immediately in front and above me sounds worth it.

The sets that are missing that should most definitely be included;
1211
2211
2231 (2221?)

I'm not a big fan of slip bombs. The morph ball trigger hit box is so much bigger, and you lose out on a lot of great shield damage. Not to mention you lose bomb stalling and maneuverability, and you can combo with neutral bomb with the right timing so I'm not sure the trip is necessary.

 

[Afro Smash]

Only thing I dislike about Screw Rush is stops Samus being able to go deep in the drop zone for kills, and generally stunts her off stage game a lot, and zair is already p good for horizontal recovery. Defo deserves a slot on one set though cuz ppl have their own playstyles

 

[Xygonn]

I think one issue is that people aren't giving turbo missiles a proper chance (myself included?). They don't lock on the sandbag so they don't seem to work in the "test" area. They do lock in on a target then zoom out super fast. This is actually not half bad against some characters. However, I still really prefer relentless missiles as they are just a massively good harassment tool offstage and in terms of setting up a projectile wall, missile, sh missile, sh super missile is a badass wall. You do lose your normal super missile charge shot combos and strings.

After much deliberation I prefer the stock screw attack. Apex screw attack I like a lot. Screw rush I'm pretty mixed about, maybe I just need more time with it?

I hate megabomb. Both bomb and slip bomb have good uses.

I prefer default charge shot. Dense charge shot is good especially depending on matchups as you can combo into it (especially rushing up behind it then grabbing your opponent into it).

Melee charge shot is a useful tool in a very matchup dependent way. It can't be reflected and has a lower launch angle of 35 degrees, overall though it's a pretty garbage move.

In a tournament it's unlikely I would want anything other than

1211
1212
2211
2212
2231
2232
1112
1132

 

[Chaineblood]

Hi, I frequently lurk these (and the RosaLuma Boards) but never post. But into the nitty gritty.
DISCLAIMER: I am not the greatest Smash 4 player in the world, and these are just my thoughts after a few weeks.
(Wall o' text incoming)

Last weekend we had a few friendlies, testing out and looking at possibilities for custom moves, as I just finished unlocking them all. I played exclusively Samus, however, many of my opponents diversified their character selection so I got a nice variety of opponents, mostly Villager, Mario, Fox, Falcon, Diddy, GW and Link.

(Charge Shot =? Dense Charge Shot) > Melee Charge Shot

Melee Charge Shot is only useful when fighting Fox, Falco, Mario, Dr. , Ness and Villager. Maybe GW but bucket isn't enough of a threat that I can't wall out with missiles.
HOWEVER. This usefulness is outweighed when the opponent knows that you can't strike them at range, therefore almost negating the advantage you just gained.
Dense Charge Shot is interesting, especially when combined with our Up-b Variants. It puts pressure on weak to average recoveries offstage, and can be used as a point blank killshot due to its massive size. The loss of the ranged kill from charge shot is quite noticeable, however. It allows opponents to camp outside the mid-range area that I like to keep opponents, and loses some hard read offstage opportunities for more measured setups from reading air-dodges.

Relentless Missile > Regular Missile > Turbo Missile

Relentless Missile is useful, especially against rushdown approaches. The second or so you get in breathing time allows you to react and punish with chargeshot or u-air combo strings. Especially useful against C.Falcon and the like. I still currently prefer regular missile, just to get the mid-range pressure out. However, the added advantage of having 3 simultaneous missiles out along with your Charge Shot makes it a veritable minefield.

Turbo Missiles, while useful at distance, stun you for too long. They have limited usage, and are easily dodged once the opponent gets used to the speed. As a long range pressure tool against campier characters (I see you, Megaman), it's quite useful.

Apex = Attack = Rush

Each of these attacks are very useful. Screw Attack is the most multipurpose of the 3; OOS Up-B saves your ass. Apex, although the startup is slow, has utility (especially combined with Dense Charge Shot and Relentless Missiles) in edgeguarding and hard-reading shield drops and air-dodges for (70%!) kills. Screw Rush, while putting a damper on vertical recovery, has utility for kills on stages such as smashville and duck hunt at almost 80%. These Up-B options are completely stylistic; each has their own utility within several playstyles, and I can't see a specific reason to choose one over the other (stage specific kills notwithstanding).

Slip Bomb > Bomb >>>>>>>>>>>> Mega Bomb

Rant time. Mega Bomb is TRASH. It puts you into situations where you cannot follow up and the opponent can simply avoid the bomb. The timer on Mega Bomb is simply too long and it removes the ability to bomb jump, as well as removing the ability to bomb stall multiple times. Its utility as a zoning tool is outclassed by your other options. I didn't get a chance to test its killing power; most of my opponents had the wherewithal to A) move or B) take the weak hitbox to avoid an incoming charge shot. If anyone can find utility for this, please let me know.

Slip Bomb. OMG this is great stuff. FF u-air strings into slip bombs = (90% of the time) free Fsmash , D-smash, UP-B or Charge shot. Only drawback is the speed of the explosion that sometimes puts you into morph ball prematurely. It's not as useful to use as a grab-escape tool, but it can save you from being F-smashed / U - Smashed from time to time.

So, In conclusion, or for the TL;DR set...

My personal choices for sets are:
1132
1112
2231
1232
1212
1221
2131
3112

 

[GeneralLedge]

Does anyone know if Melee Charge Shot kills earlier than the other charge shots? I was messing with it with friends a few nights ago, and they got really salty every time I got a kill with it, like they were blaming the move itself.

 

[RoachCake]

MCS kills at almost the same percent as Default CS, about 5% later I believe.
I could be wrong though.

 

[Xygonn]

Does anyone know if Melee Charge Shot kills earlier than the other charge shots? I was messing with it with friends a few nights ago, and they got really salty every time I got a kill with it, like they were blaming the move itself.

It has a lower launch angle but is technically a weaker KO move according to the frame data. IRL application of a lower angle might KO better especially if you hit with it offstage.

Frame data:

Regular Charge shot:

1. Frame 1- 2: 25%(+3) 30b/62g (KO@ 102%) 40° 0.7-Hitlag Electric

Melee charge shot

1. Frame 1- 2: 18%(+3) 65b/60g (KO@ 110%) 35° 2.2-Hitlag Electric

 

[Swoops]

So after revisiting Screw Rush, I'm pretty sure about the following sets.

1211
1221
2221
...
2211

I would typically want to run regular bombs with any Screw Rush set for the extra recovery. I'm actually thinking that 2221 could be a very strong stage control set. You would rack up tons of damage with missiles, charge shot, bombs and ZAir and eventually force them into a Screw Rush to put them of stage. Then with charged Dense Shot you really don't need to go deep.

 

[Hapajin]

Could someone post some videos with slip bomb drop applications? I've been really disappointed with them, I feel like the endlag afterwards really puts Samus in a bad spot. Bombs in general in SSB4 haven't impressed me very much, and the timer is really annoying.
But if I had to choose a bomb, I actually don't mind using the mega bomb. If I ever use bombs offensively, I use them not expecting them to actually connect, but more for space control. With the mega bombs, even though the timer is so long, if I get a long enough breather, I just drop one and fight normally. If it doesn't hit, that's fine, but the bomb usually does enough damage to deter opponents from getting hit by it, so there's a more threatening presence than the other two bombs.
If I could hit with the slip bomb, I feel like it would be more useful, but I get punished more often trying to use that bomb than the other two.
I think if Melee CS had the range of a max-aura Lucario forcepalm, that would be epic.

 

[Xygonn]

Could someone post some videos with slip bomb drop applications? I've been really disappointed with them, I feel like the endlag afterwards really puts Samus in a bad spot. Bombs in general in SSB4 haven't impressed me very much, and the timer is really annoying.
But if I had to choose a bomb, I actually don't mind using the mega bomb. If I ever use bombs offensively, I use them not expecting them to actually connect, but more for space control. With the mega bombs, even though the timer is so long, if I get a long enough breather, I just drop one and fight normally. If it doesn't hit, that's fine, but the bomb usually does enough damage to deter opponents from getting hit by it, so there's a more threatening presence than the other two bombs.
If I could hit with the slip bomb, I feel like it would be more useful, but I get punished more often trying to use that bomb than the other two.
I think if Melee CS had the range of a max-aura Lucario forcepalm, that would be epic.

Sorry no video, but slip bomb -> Fsmash isn't bad. Best use is as an edgeguard. It's a meteor hit against aerial opponents.

 

[John12346]

Take note, this part here's a copied and pasted message! But please read it anyway:
As we begin to approach the deadline for creating 10 custom sets for each character, we believe it's time to make sure that your conversations are staying on track, and that we evaluate the progress of your discussions. As such, we have prepared a preliminary lineup of custom sets based on what your conversations have led to. Feel free to adjust and update this list as necessary. After all, we want each character to be brought to their best potential!

We are going to begin to create the finalized sets on March 17th, so make sure you conclude any discussion you're having by then.

Preliminary Custom Sets:
2222 1222 2212 1212 2221 1221 2211 1211 2232 1232

Samus' custom sets seem to be pretty clear cut, so it wasn't too much of an issue here. A point of contention that needs to be touched on is which two UpBs out of three need to be represented more, with the last being relegated to niche slots. As it stands the original Screw Attack and Screw Rush are the essential ones, while Apex Screw Attack only has two sets. If you think this needs to be changed, make sure you bring it up now.

Also, Melee Charge Shot is absent from these sets. I seem to recall some buzz about it from this discussion, but they were quickly written off. If you think it needs some representation, speak up.

Spoiler: Notes taken during preliminary creation of sets

Samus:
1/2, 2, 1/2, 1/2 and niche XX3X sets
2222 1222 2212 1212 2221 1221 2211 1211
Niche: 2232 1232
Note: Do you want more Apex Screw Attack sets?

 

[Afro Smash]

I dont think Slip Bomb or Melee Charge Shot deserve a slot on any sets, Apex Screw Attack/Mega Bomb/Turbo Missiles/regular missiles maybe slotting on niche sets, then dense charge shot/charge shot and Screw Rush/Screw Attack appearing on every other set, and relentless missiles on nearly every set.

I'll be using 1211 personally, and what we have right now looks good to me

 

[RoachCake]

Spent some time messing around with customs recently.
These are the sets I use for now.

1211
1212
1231
2111
2211
3211

And some of my thoughts on each custom.
I'm not a huge fan of Screw Rush cause it really screws up the way I like to play offstage.
I like Apex Screw Attack, but haven't figured out more than one set that I think works good with it.
Mega Bombs are really weird for me, I haven't found a good way to implement them into my game just yet, I'll probably find a good set later.
Slip Bombs are pretty good, they have a weird spike when used on offstage opponents, I still prefer default bombs though.
Relentless Missiles are just so much better than the default missiles in alot of ways, you can setup walls of projectiles with them, and they can be really weird for enemies to handle offstage when recovering.
Turbo Missiles may have some gimping potential, I'm unsure about them though.
DCS is amazing, kills the earliest out of all the other beams, and sets up some really nasty ledge traps.
MCS is pretty good against characters with reflectors cause you don't have to be as careful with it like the others, the endlag on it is pretty bad though.

 

[ChoZoX]

Preliminary Custom Sets:
2222 1222 2212 1212 2221 1221 2211 1211 2232 1232
[/spoiler]

2232 and 2222 are garbage. Replace them with 1213 and 3211 so there's at least a mega bomb set and melee charge shot set.

Melee charge shot is essential in the Rosalina and Olimar match-up. Your beam will become usable. The hitbox will hit them both instead of just Luma/Pikmin. It can easily send Luma off stage and you won't have to worry about getting punished.

 

[Radius-86]

Pros of B 1
Good for catching landings at a distance. When edge-guarding it is good for baiting air dodges at stage level which you can follow up with a run off aerial.

Pros of B 2
It is good for covering options at the ledge. It covers get up, attack, and jump options. That leaves roll, stay on ledge, or ledge release. You can read the roll, utilt the ledge to spike, or run off aerial (maybe there are better options?) for ledge release. Probably also better for teams purely because of the increased power.

Not sure about B 3.

Pros of UpB 2
The move hits an area that no other move does so it improves zoning ability and foes have to respect the space it controls. The horizontal distance allows you to go farther out and edge-guard with bairs aggressively. Failing that, you can still go for a stage spike with this move by trying to hit your opponent during their recovery as you return to the stage. When you are recovering, edge-guarders need to respect you more than usual because the angle you recover from and the properties of this move will more than likely cause a stage spike.
When you intercept farther out, the enemy's altitude will be higher so lack of vertical is not really an issue. Far edge-guards are good because you might be able to knock them into the blast zone for a KO. Closer edge-guards at lower altitudes is not quite as good because with the strong recoveries in this game (especially with customs) people usually make it back. Also I think Up B 2 still lets you go low enough in most situations.

Pros of UpB 3
Great OoS KO potential, combos from dairs on grounded opponents, very rewarding to punish air dodges with. Probably also better for teams because it becomes easier to land via team combos and is very rewarding.

Up B 1 is the niche one I think. The best thing about it is the start-up speed but it offers little else to improve the character.

I'm in agreement with Side B 2 and Down B 2 so I'm not going to discuss those.

 

[Twin Rhapsody]

Good discussions on Samus, I'm glad that not everyone is as avidly anti-custom as a certain member. I'm not sure if anyone has noted it here, but if you land a footstool on a grounded opponent you can perform Apex Screw Attack and get both hits.
Have people started checking out Turbo Missile at all? It's hard to move away from Relentless I know but I wonder if there are enough benefits or matchups to warrant them. Also to those who really like Mega Bomb, can you tell me why?

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

I've been looking over this discussion, and it seems like we aren't in a position to make you guys happy right now. I have a proposed set of moves that might help. Let me know what you think:

1211, 1221, 1231, 1212, 1222, 1232
2211, 2221, 2231, 3211

My logic is this. In the long run, I think most Samus players will grow to prefer default Charge Shot over the other variations, Relentless Missiles are just "the best", up special is highly contentious between all three, and Mega Bombs are bad but the other two are nearly pure preference. The first six sets cover all of that. For additional Charge Shot variations, we mostly care about Dense but I find the position that Melee needs precisely one set for the Rosalina (and maybe Olimar and Villager) match-up highly compelling and logical. Up special variations are more meaningful than down special variations, and power bombs seem somewhat more popular so giving Dense every possible up special and only power bombs is logical. 3211 as the one Melee set was suggested by two different people; I'm going to assume that it's an optimum set in the handful of match-ups Melee Charge Shot makes sense.

Does this seem correct to you guys, or do we need to make some last minute adjustments?

 

[IsmaR]

The only thing missing was the synergy from Dense CS and Slip Bombs.

I would argue they also should take precedence over regular bombs in the Melee CS set due to the slightly quicker timer being more disruptive to AI controlled minions.

 

[Afro Smash]

I know this has been settled for evo, but are Relentless Missiles optimal with DCS? I feel like normal Missiles might compliment it better since it would offer some speedier projectiles to apply better pressure from a distance and uncharged DCS functions pretty much the same as a relentless super missile

 

[Balgorxz]

2222 is the optimal for me since the screw rush can connect after uair pretty much all the time

 

[IsmaR]

I find DCS and Relentless Missiles together to be a bit redundant, though stacking up wall of slow moving projectiles can be effective.

Basically Relentless Missiles were listed on all sets as "superior" to regular missiles. It still boils down to mostly preference.

This is also poor timing on my end, but I've found a lot of niche use out of Mega Bombs again. Nothing to really write home about.

 

[Macchiato]

I think people should try turbo missile including myself. In seems interesting. atm I think relentless still is better.

 

[Newlife]

My personal favorites are 2212, 2312, 1212, 1312. Also, I don't understand who decides to choose what customs sets are approved and what are not and who are they to decide?

 

[TRV]

I know this thread is probably dead by now, but I've been doing some custom testing and wanted to weigh in.

Personally, I believe that Apex screw attack and regular bombs should be standard in all the sets due to apex screw attack having great kill potential, and the normal bombs being more versatile than the others.

On the other hand, the charge shot and missile types are dependent on each other, and I would go wth turbo missiles and DCS, or relentless and CS, as one projectile can be used to wall while the other can quickly come from behind to throw off opponents. My personal preference is to use DCS and turbo missiles as the relentless missiles tend to just drift off if an opponent manages to pass them, while turbos can just be rapid fire. DCS is also great in terms of stage control as you can force your opponent into really easily punishable options, making them either stand where they are and attempt to perfect shield, and probably break their shield, jump over the shot, which can be countered by a fair or dair (into the shot if you can get the timing right), or retreat back and force themselves into a corner.

At first I thought slip bombs would be useful, but they don't offer much since using them in the air pretty much guarantees that you're going to get sucked back into morph ball, and the tripping doesn't really last long enough to allow you to get a hard punish.

(The following stuff is going to involve equipment, so I'm gonna apologize in advance)

When equipment is involved, I use 2 unharmed attackers and an unharmed speed demon badge (all attack types) this greatly improves the utility of turbo missiles as a super can break most shields in a single hit, and makes the DCS absolutely terrifying, dishing out over 100% when full charged and can be used to punish shield breaks by shooting it directly at the opponent, or above the opponent and then throwing them into it. (Again, sorry for the mention of equipment, I'm new here and just wanted to share some ideas)

 

[Xygonn]

I know this thread is probably dead by now, but I've been doing some custom testing and wanted to weigh in.

Personally, I believe that Apex screw attack and regular bombs should be standard in all the sets due to apex screw attack having great kill potential, and the normal bombs being more versatile than the others.

Apex screw attack is fun, but losing frame 5 OoS is crippling...

On the other hand, the charge shot and missile types are dependent on each other, and I would go wth turbo missiles and DCS, or relentless and CS, as one projectile can be used to wall while the other can quickly come from behind to throw off opponents. My personal preference is to use DCS and turbo missiles as the relentless missiles tend to just drift off if an opponent manages to pass them, while turbos can just be rapid fire. DCS is also great in terms of stage control as you can force your opponent into really easily punishable options, making them either stand where they are and attempt to perfect shield, and probably break their shield, jump over the shot, which can be countered by a fair or dair (into the shot if you can get the timing right), or retreat back and force themselves into a corner.

DCS is garbage (you'll find other people agree with you though, I'm just anti-DCS). You can't tech chase with it, so you lose ftilt and zair kill confirms. Since samus has a hard time with stage control in the first place DCS doesn't do enough on it's own. It is good for forcing ledge options, but not way better than regular CS. Slow to set up traps are just not very effective in high level play IMO.

Relentless missiles are much better for offstage game, and relentless super missile combos better than regular super missile. Turbo missiles are relatively easy to avoid, and don't give you much off stage except against straight horizontal recoveries.

At first I thought slip bombs would be useful, but they don't offer much since using them in the air pretty much guarantees that you're going to get sucked back into morph ball, and the tripping doesn't really last long enough to allow you to get a hard punish.

It's actually great for setting up apex screw attack if I'm doing some sillier setups, but yeah, otherwise pretty useless.

(The following stuff is going to involve equipment, so I'm gonna apologize in advance)

When equipment is involved, I use 2 unharmed attackers and an unharmed speed demon badge (all attack types) this greatly improves the utility of turbo missiles as a super can break most shields in a single hit, and makes the DCS absolutely terrifying, dishing out over 100% when full charged and can be used to punish shield breaks by shooting it directly at the opponent, or above the opponent and then throwing them into it. (Again, sorry for the mention of equipment, I'm new here and just wanted to share some ideas)

Probably good for single player runs.

 

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When I was experimenting with customs I think I was preferring the 1212 setup - relentless missiles and slip bomb. While apex screw attack was good, I didn't like how it affected my recovery. Slip bombs I found a lot of uses for, and something I found incredibly useful that I haven't seen mentioned much is they actually spike midair opponents. You do sacrifice some shield pressure and some air maneuverability for them though so I can understand why some players dislike them for those reasons. But I found them quite useful. I kinda wish our standard bomb functioned exactly the same way as it currently does except with the slip property on it. One can dream I guess.