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Official: SSBPD unsupported; source code released.

FoxLisk

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,851
Find it here!

Let me know what you think and TOs start saving your tio files please!

Explanation on the ratings:

The ratings are normal Elo scores. They are calculated along with the tournaments as they are uploaded in most cases. This has the nasty side effect of ratings being incorrect at first, but I re run the processing from the beginning every night or two. For now, don't take them as gospel because tournaments are coming in so fast that ratings are in pretty constant flux.

UPDATE 2/27:

Have gotten tons of good feedback and a good amount of data. There's a lot of files uploaded that I just don't have time to scour through on my own, so I'm working on building moderator capabilities so I can slough the duty off on some of you :) So I apologize to anyone whose files are uploaded and who can't see them yet - if this takes too long I promise I'll do it myself within the next couple days.

UPDATE 3/05:

Still growing phenomenally. Regions now exist, please flag everyone who isn't labeled that you know and we'll get people labeled correctly.
We now have viewing by region:
Sweden

And by regions vs each other:
Sweden vs UK

If you haven't already, check out players' ELO graphs by clicking "Show Elo history" on their page:
Try it out with Armada

UPDATE 3/31:

Character support in its first form! So far you can flag players' mains and the mods can help clean it up, and you can go here to get a little info by player and character.

Sets can be updated to have different characters from the mains of the people who played in it (see, for example, Mango being tagged as a Falco main but having his sets at Pound 3 be assigned to Jigglypuff). There is no functionality for sets to be flagged as incorrect yet, but there will be eventually.

UPDATE 4/28:

Sets now can be assigned videos, and you can flag sets that you think have the wrong characters assigned.

UPDATE 4/19/2013:

I'm obviously not going to do anything else with this project. SO here's the source!
 

Zoler

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 30, 2009
Messages
991
Location
Sweden
This is awesome, I've been waiting for something like this really =)

Keep it up!
 

FoxLisk

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,851
huh apparently it went down while i was away... it's working for me now at least.
 

JPOBS

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 26, 2007
Messages
5,821
Location
Mos Eisley
Wow. This is magical. Any chance we could get the data from previous large scale tournaments in there? Even if it takes manual labor to enter everything because the TIO file is lost or something, I still think tournys like Pound, Apex and Genesis should be uploaded somehow.
 

LLDL

Smash Hero
Joined
Apr 27, 2007
Messages
7,128
Awesome. Someone go collect every tournament since like 2002. Lol shouldn't there be a cut off date so that the results will stay accurate within the past few years. Let's start with pound 3 and try to collectively find all the tio files.
 

FoxLisk

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,851
If there's some way to crawl or download or convince nealdt to send me all the data from old tournaments, since tons of them are up on AIB, that would be MAGICAL.

If anyone wants to manually recreate tournaments in tio format from uploaded results from old tournaments that would be sick but I can't really expect that of anyone.

@chain-ace if we get enough data uploaded for old scores not being adjusted for, I will handle it promptly - that is exactly the sort of problem I want to have.
 

hectohertz

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 20, 2006
Messages
800
Location
Brooklyn, NY
wow this is looking great, glad to see this project come to its potential,

someone should talk to ZivilynBane (probably mispelled that), as I think he had a collection of .tio files
 

Fregadero

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 6, 2011
Messages
389
Good stuff. Registered before I realized I'm not a TO. Hopefully this thing explodes after this weekend.
 

FoxLisk

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,851
Thanks for all the enthusiasm everyone!

Now go forth and talk your TOs into saving their results and uploading them :3

Also, yeah, absolutely no reason to register unless you're a TO and want to expedite things a little - nothing's gonna be behind a login screen.
 

Scar

#HarveyDent
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
6,066
Location
Sunnyvale, CA
@foxlisk would you be willing to have this as part of the smashboards site if possible? it makes no sense to me why smashboards itself doesn't have this functionality
 

FoxLisk

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,851
@foxlisk would you be willing to have this as part of the smashboards site if possible? it makes no sense to me why smashboards itself doesn't have this functionality
Yeah, that would be cool. I don't know how to go about getting that in motion but I'd definitely be open to it.

Also - whoever uploaded Beast and Tampora: thanks! I found a bug that's preventing it from processing the Tampora file at the moment, should be fixed and live soon.
 

FoxLisk

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,851
cool, i'll see who's in charge and try to get this in motion
Cool :)


Unrelatedly: I have now seen 2 separate files that have duplicate player nicknames. Why and how is this happening? I can't add a player with the same name in my copy of Tio, but apparently it can happen somehow.

It makes it impossible to decide who to assign the records to if there are duplicate players at a single tournament.
 

Max?

Smash Champion
Joined
Mar 4, 2011
Messages
2,255
Location
Falco Bair
This is complicated for me because I go under different names at tournaments.... (max/max?/The OT/otg/w'e someone puts me down under at the time).

Tristate will NEVER be a part of this because our TOs are lazy, so get ready to see some lopsided information towards WC
 

FoxLisk

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,851
I get the feeling I'm the only one who isn't overly impressed by this.

Is there like, a list of players on the site or something? Because I'm not seeing anything.
There's no just universal list yet. At some point I'll add one, but I have other details to see to first. The real problem right now is that there's not much data, but I've already gotten almost a dozen uploads from people and I'm hoping it keeps up!

@Max:
1) People entering as different accounts is an issue that i"m aware of. There's a number of ways to solve it. In the short term, I'm just going to hand check uploaded files and do what correction I can for that kind of thing. I'm also going to add a way for myself (and potentially others in the future) to merge player accounts together.

The other way of doing it is to assign people some sort of unique ID that they're associated with. This is of course awesome in terms of consistency and reliability, but not something that I'm in a position to ask people to adhere to at this point.

Other than that, I just don't think it's that big an imposition to ask people to enter tournaments as their real tags, so hopefully that will happen.

2) If tristate TOs don't want to submit results, there's nothing I can do about that except hope that eventually there's enough valuable information up here that people want to be a part of it and help out the community by contributing.
 

s2j

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Messages
4,957
****ing gay lucky is above me 0813t2tha;hiht3nig3h3rw
 

ThatGuy

Smash Master
Joined
Jul 26, 2005
Messages
3,090
Location
Laval-Ouest, Quebec, Canada
I know it's an early startup project and I applaud your effort of starting one up, but there are a couple ideas I just want to toss into the hat for whenever you get a chance.

First thing, there seems to be a bug with the way the pools are parsed. The people who win the sets 2-0 are listed as winning them 3-0, which doesn't make sense in a Bo3.

I don't know if outputting a list of who faced who in each round is visually the best way to get the results across. TLPD does use this format, but isolates this data in a separate tab. It gets pretty cluttered when all the results are chunked into one block. A bracket image might be worth reconstructing, for visual appeal. In fact, the way AiB displays its results is really impressive, and I feel it outdoes TLPD in certain aspects.

Dates are extremely important. They add history and relevancy to the results.

Lots of smashers have the same nicknames. This may become an issue down the road that you may want to take into consideration.

TIO is used for Brawl tournaments as well, so it might be a good idea to display which game the results are for, make separate sections, or outright ban a playerbase lol. Then again, Brawl has AiB, which is a fantastic tournament database in its own right.

Ultimately, though, the problem I see with this SSPDB project is that TIO is too limited from a spectator point of view; it caters to the tournament organizer. It does not keep track of match counts in a set outside of pools, it does not track which characters were used during a set, it does not take note of important statistics such as stocks remaining after the match or match time length, the list goes on...what TIO does right is cut the fat and does the job for the TO as efficiently as possible (monetary calculations, quick bracket progression and quick manipulation for if something goes awry, automatic seeding and bracket generation, etc).

Having a program like TIO which is widely used makes things awfully convenient to compile, but it's not enough. I feel that TLPD succeeds because there are people willing to compile these statistics, and because these statistics are more readily available to compile through the distribution of replays and the publication of VODs. I feel that the smash community needs to take similar steps to make this data more readily available somehow, either through different software for collecting data, or having designated people compile more data. Imagine trying to handle all of this overhead in a national :urg:.

Without taking these extra steps, it sounds like a copy/paste from AiB. And if that's the case, what's the point? People should then just upload results to AiB.

Anyway, that's my 7 cents.
 

FoxLisk

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,851
First thing, there seems to be a bug with the way the pools are parsed. The people who win the sets 2-0 are listed as winning them 3-0, which doesn't make sense in a Bo3.
*facepalm* I'll fix that right away
I don't know if outputting a list of who faced who in each round is visually the best way to get the results across. TLPD does use this format, but isolates this data in a separate tab. It gets pretty cluttered when all the results are chunked into one block. A bracket image might be worth reconstructing, for visual appeal. In fact, the way AiB displays its results is really impressive, and I feel it outdoes TLPD in certain aspects.
You're absolutely right. However, displaying a tournament bracket in HTML is not easy. If people really want it I'll work something out. Alternatively, if anyone wants to help with that (design is not my forte), please get in touch

Dates are extremely important. They add history and relevancy to the results.
Oh, right, for some reason I thought I had already displayed those. I'll fix that pronto.
Lots of smashers have the same nicknames. This may become an issue down the road that you may want to take into consideration.
This is going to suck and require community participation to solve. Ideally people will have some sort of unique identifier that can be put in tio to solve this but I have no way to make everyone go through the effort of doing that yet.

TIO is used for Brawl tournaments as well, so it might be a good idea to display which game the results are for, make separate sections, or outright ban a playerbase lol. Then again, Brawl has AiB, which is a fantastic tournament database in its own right.
Yeah, AiB is good for brawl. So far I just throw away any data that isn't SSBM. If there's interest in the future I can handle other games but, obviously, this is a minimum viable product.
Ultimately, though, the problem I see with this SSPDB project is that TIO is too limited from a spectator point of view; it caters to the tournament organizer. It does not keep track of match counts in a set outside of pools, it does not track which characters were used during a set, it does not take note of important statistics such as stocks remaining after the match or match time length, the list goes on...what TIO does right is cut the fat and does the job for the TO as efficiently as possible (monetary calculations, quick bracket progression and quick manipulation for if something goes awry, automatic seeding and bracket generation, etc).
I'm workin with what I've got. I contacted nealdt about updating TIO to add that kind of extra detail to TIO results, so hopefully it will happen at some point.
Having a program like TIO which is widely used makes things awfully convenient to compile, but it's not enough. I feel that TLPD succeeds because there are people willing to compile these statistics, and because these statistics are more readily available to compile through the distribution of replays and the publication of VODs. I feel that the smash community needs to take similar steps to make this data more readily available somehow, either through different software for collecting data, or having designated people compile more data. Imagine trying to handle all of this overhead in a national :urg:.
There's nothing I can do to make people publish data except what I've just done: make a hopefully compelling pitch to the community that if you start publishing data here, it'll be cool and interesting before long. I think that the Tio software is well suited for this, it just needs to be fitted with the ability to add a little more data (victory margins in bracket, characters, stages) and it'll be even better.

Without taking these extra steps, it sounds like a copy/paste from AiB. And if that's the case, what's the point? People should then just upload results to AiB.
All is brawl is for brawl. It's also a community and a calendar and so on. I just wanted somewhere that this kind of historical data is organized cleanly and explicitly for melee, which I haven't found anywhere else.

Anyway, that's my 7 cents.
Thanks for the feedback. If you have any constructive ideas about how to get more data compiled and uploaded, speak up. In the meantime I'll go fix the errors you mentioned :)
 
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